Gold Giant in Frost

[GenLiu]

Yes the current text is (still) wrong, The ability has not changed since the text was "updated" in a recent patch. it still behaves by the old rules:

"When affected by frost gain 7 strength."

Which was the original text on the card before they tried to make it "clearer" as that text seemed to indicate it would have 8 total strength not 14.

In fact, The problem here is not the wording of the Giant but the wording of Shani.
The way the card is explained, the Ice giant should indeed get the buff.

Shani : Resurrect a non-gold non permadeath unit AND convert it to gold until removed from the battlefield or the round ends.

So, if I follow the card step by step, the Giant should be resurrected (therefore get the +7str buff) and only then should he be converted to gold but this is just not the way Shani works.

The correct wording should be : Convert a non-gold non permadeath unit from your graveyard into gold and resurrect it until removed from the battlefield or the round ends.

 

[Treamayne]

The correct wording should be : Convert a non-gold non-permadeath unit from your graveyard into gold and resurrect it until removed from the battlefield or the round ends

True. The change was made last patch, but the wording wasn't changed with it. but regardless of Shani's or Frost Giant's wording, it should receive the buff. That it doesn't is a bug that should be reported. (link in my signature, should you need it).

 

[bleagh]

I don't see why the player should be up punished for making this play when they were lucky enough to snag a Shani then resurrect an ice giant into frost. Its not even as strong as resurrecting a semi buffed pfi.

like others have said, I believe that the problem with this situation is that Gwent in its current state has no defined rule or logical order for card effects and interaction. Every tabletop game or card game has an order of phases or specific rules that dictate how card interactions work and when they are applied. Gwent instead has set each card to its own priority level and is made to operate as the devs intend through brute force instead of having a strict rule set that cards and effects can naturally fall into.

This problem becomes more obvious every time a new effect is added. No one knows how a card will interact with any given board state until they experiment and see it with their own eyes.

I can only imagine what a nightmare it will be for the devs to constantly tweak this current priority system after a year when many more cards and effects are added. Imo, they are making their job more difficult than it has to be.

 

[GenLiu]

I don't see why the player should be up punished for making this play when they were lucky enough to snag a Shani then resurrect an ice giant into frost. Its not even as strong as resurrecting a semi buffed pfi.

like others have said, I believe that the problem with this situation is that Gwent in its current state has no defined rule or logical order for card effects and interaction. Every tabletop game or card game has an order of phases or specific rules that dictate how card interactions work and when they are applied. Gwent instead has set each card to its own priority level and is made to operate as the devs intend through brute force instead of having a strict rule set that cards and effects can naturally fall into.

This problem becomes more obvious every time a new effect is added. No one knows how a card will interact with any given board state until they experiment and see it with their own eyes.

I can only imagine what a nightmare it will be for the devs to constantly tweak this current priority system after a year when many more cards and effects are added. Imo, they are making their job more difficult than it has to be.

I have to admit it's kinda true. I think it's mainly the enter the battlefield effect that is a bit obscure by time to time. Let's take the giant toad for example, If you play it into a row affected by rain it get the buff before entering the battlefield (which always seems strange to me but okay, that's the rules I respect them) however if you play it into a fireball trap it will get the buff and then get shot by the trap.

So of course you could argue that the fireball trap has a delay before he hits (so basically units come into play and then the fireball trap triggers) but this is not the case since Nekker warriors, for instance, are not even triggering their effect and get shot immediately.

It's not a huge deal at the end of the day because we will get use to the different interactions but it's clearly strange and I think dev would indeed make their life easier if they set some clear rules about how a units come into play.

 

[pallywal]

We can try a similar thing.
Foglets.
Foglets gain strength in a row with Fog.
If we get a foglet and make it golden, I'm 100% sure it won't gain strength.
Or the ancient foglet.

I'm going to try this (A bit hard, since I'll have to do it against the AI and the golem is not very cooperative).

In conclusion, you are right, there is something wrong here, but is the text, not the effect.
Golden cards exist inside a bubble, where very little things can interact with them.

trust me dude a NR deck turned all my foglets gold with promote and i couldn't buff them and lost, gold foglets dont get buffs from the weather even though it states the row has fog is what buffs it

 

[Ellianis]

trust me dude a NR deck turned all my foglets gold with promote and i couldn't buff them and lost, gold foglets dont get buffs from the weather even though it states the row has fog is what buffs it

Promote doesnt affect enemy units, your story is in question here.

 

[pallywal]

Promote doesnt affect enemy units, your story is in question here.

to be honest i promoted my own guys, was trying to leave that out but made myself look more like an ass

edit: and before you go monsters dont have promote they do get johnny

 

[Marcin Momot]

The card is working as intended but we will look into it as quite a few folks are having problems with it.

 

[pl91]

if it works as intended then the wording is wrong.nowhere does the wording specify that the giant has to be affected,only the row.

 

[KasumiGoto]

I guess I'd be the only one who wouldn't even question Giant not being buffed in these circumstances then. It seems natural to me.

 

[Treamayne]

I guess I'd be the only one who wouldn't even question Giant not being buffed in these circumstances then. It seems natural to me.

It would seem natural if it were not so different than how similar cards function.

The card is working as intended but we will look into it as quite a few folks are having problems with it.

Sir,

Could you please elaborate on "working as intended?" Do you mean a how it buffs and debuffs as a Silver in Weather, or how it reacts to weather as a Gold card? Why would a gold-resurrected Dudu self-buff, but a gold-resurrected Frost giant would not? Does it make a difference if the Gold Giant is there before weather is played or after frost is already affecting the row?

Thank you for your time and have a great day.

 

[Monalba]

Sir,

Could you please elaborate on "working as intended?" Do you mean a how it buffs and debuffs as a Silver in Weather, or how it reacts to weather as a Gold card? Why would a gold-resurrected Dudu self-buff, but a gold-resurrected Frost giant would not? Does it make a difference if the Gold Giant is there before weather is played or after frost is already affecting the row?

Thank you for your time and have a great day.

I think it was already been stated.

Frost giant gains the buff when the frost touches him. If he becomes gold, he is into a ''bubble'', where a lot of things don't affect him, for example, weather. So he can't gain the buff.

Is not about golden cards not been able to gain a buff, they do, as you can see in Dudu, Madman Lugos, Siege towers, etc.
But in this case, he needs to be affected by weather, but he isn't when he becomes golden.

I imagine they might change the text to ''When affected by Frost''.

But yeah, sorry for interrupting, let's see what they say.

 

[ManwichTuesday]

The card is working as intended but we will look into it as quite a few folks are having problems with it.

I wish I could deduct a Redpoint from you. Nothing about the text or any other game factors indicate a Gold-ed Giant shouldn't also receive the buff. I don't even play Monsters and this is just poor. Not poor like the ironically named Poor Infantry. Poor as in just broke.

Not even the "Gold cards are immune to Weather" argument has any ground in the case of Ice Giant. Ice Giant is naturally immune to Frost in the first place, so he didn't receive the bonus because Frost was affecting him - he received the bonus because the row he was in had Frost active. There are zero variables changed when he becomes Gold that factor into those points.

If this is "working as intended" then you need to change the card text to something completely different. Because you just created completely unique set of rules for this card that give it irrelevant text.

 

[TheShift]

I wish I could deduct a Redpoint from you. Nothing about the text or any other game factors indicate a Gold-ed Giant shouldn't also receive the buff. I don't even play Monsters and this is just poor. Not poor like the ironically named Poor Infantry. Poor as in just broke.

Not even the "Gold cards are immune to Weather" argument has any ground in the case of Ice Giant. Ice Giant is naturally immune to Frost in the first place, so he didn't receive the bonus because Frost was affecting him - he received the bonus because the row he was in had Frost active. There are zero variables changed when he becomes Gold that factor into those points.

If this is "working as intended" then you need to change the card text to something completely different. Because you just created completely unique set of rules for this card that give it completely irrelevant text.

Thats kinda harsh,lol

This is not a finished game,[obviously] things like wording,bugs,issues are why we are here.. this was an open discussion in which no one was for sure about.. Sure gold cards can get buffs and points taken off by other cards/kings ...but name one circumstance where weather does either effect to a gold card? There is not,to my knowledge.

You are already getting to resurrect a high value card,and turn it gold.. as some one said before you cant have it all..

So if anything.. the wording could be altered... but it should already be common knowledge that gold cards are not effected by weather
That is how i understood it.

 

[ManwichTuesday]

I am being harsh, I know

I would be saying it for like 4th time in this post if I mentioned that Ice Giant isn't affected by Frost to begin with, so I won't say that being Gold has no impact on his immunity to Frost again. Oops!

Marcin_Momot isn't confirming that Gold cards aren't affected by weather. He's confirming that they will consider this particular card to not be eligible for his own buff the same way other cards are eligible for their own buffs when they are Gold. For some odd reason. That's what he's saying.

 

[Sardukhar]

I am being harsh, I know
For some odd reason. That's what he's saying.

And you are right to take issue with that, if you have an issue. Politely, courteously and with a certain amount of respect, of course. As we expect from and towards all posters.

 

[RickMelethron]

Golden cards are not affected by weather. Frost Giant gains +7 points when affected by weather Golden Frost Giant = Not affected by weather, therefore no +7 points gain.

ice giant says "while on a row affected by frost"
the giant itself is immune to frost, so being a gold card makes no difference.

 

[Treamayne]

No Title

Well, just spent some time in the practice room, and managed to resurrect Sarah with Shani. She continues to gain buffs from weather after returning as Gold. (See Screenshots)

I wonder if Immunity with a buff effect should just have a different keyword to imply the unit is "Affected" by weather, but positively instead of negatively.

So you could have:

Immune to X - means weather has no affect at all
- or -
"Temperate" (or some other keyword) to indicate that a unit is affected positively by weather instead of negatively.

 

[pl91]

Well, just spent some time in the practice room, and managed to resurrect Sarah with Shani. She continues to gain buffs from weather after returning as Gold. (See Screenshots)

i believe sarah works more like isengrim,does something when cards are played.the problem isnt that gold cards can get buffed or use their abilities,even when promoted(i think this is pretty obvious with the NR and PFI).

since the developers said that he is working as intended,i think it is reasonable to expect his wording to be changed to something like "when affected by frost gain 7 attack" instead of "when his row is affected by frost".at the same time its clear to me that the ability "immune to weather",doesnt mean that the card is not affected by weather,but instead that the card is affected by weather ,yet the effect is neutralised.

 

[Monalba]

ice giant says "while on a row affected by frost"
the giant itself is immune to frost, so being a gold card makes no difference.

The wording is wrong.

Ice giant gains +7 points when Frost touches him.
That's how it really works.

If the giant is golden, the Frost can't touch him, therefore he doesn't gain anything.

Well, just spent some time in the practice room, and managed to resurrect Sarah with Shani. She continues to gain buffs from weather after returning as Gold. (See Screenshots)
I wonder if Immunity with a buff effect should just have a different keyword to imply the unit is "Affected" by weather, but positively instead of negatively.
/QUOTE]

Yeah, cause gold ''plating'' does not stop buffing in any way. Also Sarah gains strength every time X card is played.
If she were to gain strength every time she is affected by weather, she wouldn't gain anything while in gold form.

"Temperate" (or some other keyword) to indicate that a unit is affected positively by weather instead of negatively.

This is what makes most sense. Not a fan of including new wording and stuff, but that's how it works right now.
Ice giant is not immune to Frost, he simply gains strength when affected by it.