Third Instalment of the impressions and journey of a New person in gwent

[X_Blaze_X]

Third Instalment of the impressions and journey of a New person in gwent

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* FYI This is a consolidation of a previous thread because the other was getting to cluttered for the new up date please see below**********

Just got my key on friday Thanks CDPR Here is my first impressions

TL/DR I think you have taken a great game and made it vastly better. I have completely enjoyed the experience

Where the in game version is predictable. This version is dynamic the added RNG mechanics and single board changing cards make this much more exciting and enjoyable to play than the in game one .

I spent $25 at the start and then did not add any more cards to my collection in any way just to see how things would go.The rewards you see in the picture is everything I have collected in the last 10 or so hours of play. BTW that troll is great ... I was tempted to buy more kegs just to watch him smash them again lol. The card drop /rarity seem to be in acceptable range as well.

I am pleased with the result. I was able to make decent deck for all the factions.

The fact that you have to win to progress and be rewarded is a good thing it will hopefully encourage people to support the game instead of trying to play exclusively for free. I hope this is one of the things you will keep when the game goes live.

The rewards I able to get through winning and GG was generous but not excessive. I would keep a watch on it though as you dont want to make it too easy for people who are not supporting you financially.

FTP should be bare minimum a "test drive" of what the game has to offer.

There are a lot of post talking about "PTW" I would assume that these are created by those who are probably not supporting at all or dont understand how collectable card games work and think they should have everything for a miniscule fraction of what it takes. The simple fact is collectable card games can be one of the most expensive gaming hobbies out there.

Another big topic on the form is Matchmaking Personally i have not had an issues with this as I have won enough games to reach level for in my first few hours of playing again these complaints probably tie into the above people thinking they should be entitled to be on equal footing of those that support you and also carry the the Anti-PTW banner

When looking at your player # I believe you should focus not on the total number of player but the total number of players that are supporting you if you see a drop in "FTP" player accounts it should not cause any alerts or red flags as these players are fickle and simply jump ship to whatever game is giving what they consider the best "free ride" .

If I had to rate my enjoyment of each faction would be 1) M 2) SK 3) SCO 4) NR at least right now of course that is subject to change.

Other thoughts

The fact that you didn't include that annoying emote system form hearthstone is greatly appreciated please dont ever do that this is not a game that needs " communication".

Needs Better music - the soundtracks from the games would be nice if there was a way to actually pick the music would be amazing

Sone sort of campaign where you play against the women of witcher interacting with "you" would be amazing

repeatable cutscenes with the women as well being sexy flirty lol....yea i know that is along shot but hey had to ask lol


Well that s it for now just wanted to stop fora bit and let you know my first impressions will update this again in a while when i have accumulated some more play time.


UPDATE: just to continue my little experiment I spent the weekend also playing without any additional cards in any way other than what i have stated above . Or spending any of my winnings.
I managed to get up to level 10 with no problem and have won over 1100 ore that's close to the value of a 15 pack that i bought I think that is very generous border line excessive to get for free.and close to 600 scraps as shown by the picture attached,

I think I have proven that the "new player experience is perfectly manageable and have proven everything in my original post .


All the posts that say that

• X faction is "cheap"
• X cards make it impossible for me to win
• " matchmaking is broken for new player "
• "Card X should is op and unfair"

Were not issues for me at all and did not stop me getting enough wins to get to level 10 in around 20 hours

Are a result I believe its the players that are trying to play for free who are having all the above issues due to lack of enough of a card base to make the journey a little easier which is a result ofthier choice and not really a problem for the devs or a reason that things need to be adjusted

Again I speak as a player who has only played around 20 hours.

If i can get to level 10 with no problems after only buying an additional 15 kegs at the start and added 0 cards after that if you are having trouble maybe stop asking for a free and easy ride and support the game.

Anyways I just wanted to give a differnt perspective on the "new player" experience hope you found it informative.

I stand behind everything i said in my original post and hope CDPR keeps the only rewards for wins and hope they keep an eye on how much they are giving away for free.


Update 04 22 17


I have returned after a long break I was not a fan of the first wave of nerfs. After playing a few rounds I have noticed you have nerfed the original vision not just into the ground complete buried it.

Just a few examples

Monster Talent - DOA -

DBomb -DOA-

Triss not affecting gold

various other things not affecting gold cards that used to because of " positioning"

commanders horn -DOA

turning golds into silvers

the locked mechhanic

no downside to putting anit weather cards in your deck anymore. clear skies is still useful even if no weather is cast

there is a ton more but i am not going to list any more .These are the just the ones off the top of my head.

You have taken an exiting game that could drastically change with the play of single card no matter how "skillful" you have played or how " good" your deck is and boiled it down to a dull game of chess with moves and counter moves.

Not only that but according to one of your moderators @4RM3D the whole end game revolves around 2 deck archetypes

Monster Consume is strong, yes. But it can always be countered in a number of ways. That's the reason why it's in a good place right now, unlike Brouver's Ambush or Henselt's Gold. The latter two are just very difficult to counter and sometimes cannot be countered at all.

On a side note, considering you are discussing Monster Consume I assume you are playing casual or mid-rank because once you've reached rank 14+, it's all Brouver's Ambush and Henselt's Gold.

You have several factions and a ton of cards already and it comes down to that ? really?

The one thing I have found is is that i dont have the same felling of excitement and enjoyment as i had when i first started its hard to describe it jsut feel like a duller experience


Another thing i see is that people are still complain about the "new player experience " and losing - this is a solution for that - buy kegs get more cards.

If you don't want to do that then realise that until you grind out enough ore you are going to lose. Just enjoy PLAYING the game and don't worry about the outcome.


Regarding that i have found that you are actually being more generous with the ore and scraps. I still have not had to buy any more packs either with ore or money I now have 1385 and 570 scaps ( i used to have over 1600 but used alot to craft some new cards Triss <3 butterfly was none of them of course

So if a dev is reading this I hope you can answer this specific question

What are your plans to make me want to spend more money than I already have ?

I have no problems spend money to support game devs I have supported WOTC paper MTG for the last decade or so.

OMG the amount of money i have given them in the last decade would probably make me question my own sanity lol its most likely in the thousands Not bad for "just a game" as some people put it.

the difference is WOTC . does not give their product away. Everyone pays so that is fair.

What I don't think is fair is I personally am more than half way to "grinding" my original purchase amount of packs for free.

If i can do it others have so the question is Why would I pay you for something I can get for free now ?

You have already stated that when you go live all real money spent will have the packs refunded when the live wipe happens.

So right now I have $25 worth of packs when you go live. And seeing what I have accomplished with that goes back to my question.

if your going to give the rest of the packs away for free.

What are your plans to make me want to spend more money than I already have ?

simple question just want to know what i am going to be able to buy that cant be grinded for by "FTP" players.

For people that cry that you are being too hard on "newplayer" "P2W" or "RNG" ...these are jsut some of the "realities" of playing CCG at least in the past.

I guess only time will tell what CDProject Red Gwent project will look like when it finally goes live

I hope at some pont you will answer it

 

[Flowneppets]

FTP should be bare minimum a "test drive" of what the game has to offer.

There are a lot of post talking about "PTW" I would assume that these are created by those who are probably not supporting at all or dont understand how collectable card games work and think they should have everything for a miniscule fraction of what it takes. The simple fact is collectable card games can be one of the most expensive gaming hobbies out there. Another big topic on the form is Matchmaking Personally i have not had an issues with this as I have won enough games to reach level for in my first few hours of playing again these complaints probably tie into the above people thinking they should be entitled to be on equal footing of those that support you and also carry the the Anti-PTW banner

I disagree with this notion. In a f2p game the free players support the game in their own way by keeping it alive and flourishing and that in turn brings in more paying players. To keep free players happy should not be underestimated. I've witnessed it as a player of Trackmania. As soon as someone at Ubisoft thought it would be a good idea to get rid of f2p the game died within a couple months.

 

[sardanapalos_qq]

I believe that we won't see a balance patch before the challenger finals. Would be really messy if they changed the meta 3 weeks before that.

So for now, side in your venoms and Dbombs!

 

[X_Blaze_X]

I disagree with this notion. In a f2p game the free players support the game in their own way by keeping it alive and flourishing and that in turn brings in more paying players. To keep free players happy should not be underestimated. I've witnessed it as a player of Trackmania. As soon as someone at Ubisoft thought it would be a good idea to get rid of f2p the game died within a couple months.

All i can say within this forum environment as stated abiove is I disagree with your opinion as well concerning the value of "ftp" players.

 

[X_Blaze_X]

I believe that we won't see a balance patch before the challenger finals. Would be really messy if they changed the meta 3 weeks before that.

So for now, side in your venoms and Dbombs!

Honestly I think the balance patch should be a nerf reversion in a lot of cases .

If a mod reads this can you please take out "of gwent" from my title....My title needs a big nerf...i didn't proof read. i cant seem to edit it.

 

[Sunsibar]

If a mod reads this can you please take out "of gwent" from my title....My title needs a big nerf...i didn't proof read. i cant seem to edit it.

Title fixed

 

[IAxiiYourMother]

There are a lot of post talking about "PTW" I would assume that these are created by those who are probably not supporting at all or dont understand how collectable card games work and think they should have everything for a miniscule fraction of what it takes. The simple fact is collectable card games can be one of the most expensive gaming hobbies out there.

It doesn't have to be expensive, especially when a company is selling digital goods. A high cost game will scare a lot of the community away and make it harder for new players to catch up to those who have been playing for years.

Are a result I believe its the players that are trying to play for free who are having all the above issues due to lack of enough of a card base to make the journey a little easier which is a result ofthier choice and not really a problem for the devs or a reason that things need to be adjusted

Expecting to repeatedly lose games because you don't hemorrhage money to the developer is ludicrous. The beauty of a well balanced FTP game is that it attracts a huge crowd because it is possible to have fun and be successful without spending money. The advantage to the developer is that there is still a large portion of that huge player base that will still spend money. If the expectation was that everyone spent $50 dollars to play the game they would make a lot less money because there would be less people willing to pay that entry fee.

What are your plans to make me want to spend more money than I already have ?

CDPR isn't that type of developer, they are respected by their customers because they respect us. If you want your eyes gouged out to win, Blizzards HS is always an option.

 

[Norinoo]

There are a lot of post talking about "PTW" I would assume that these are created by those who are probably not supporting at all or dont understand how collectable card games work and think they should have everything for a miniscule fraction of what it takes.

Hi. You, assume, so you are your basis for this thought process is not facts. Example, i am a F2P player, not because i want to, but because i simply cannot afford to be paying all the time. I can support a game i like with tiny amounts per month, or so. Am i to blame then?



Secondly, "how a CCG works" (this is a very well thought and comprehensive article about CCG, not just the specific one it mentions. I would otherwise call them, inherently flawed, but, investment in time can level up the field) : Article about CCG's at Polygon site

 

[X_Blaze_X]

Title fixed

Thanks you much appreciated

 

[X_Blaze_X]

Hi. You, assume, so you are your basis for this thought process is not facts. Example, i am a F2P player, not because i want to, but because i simply cannot afford to be paying all the time. I can support a game i like with tiny amounts per month, or so. Am i to blame then?



Secondly, "how a CCG works" (this is a very well thought and comprehensive article about CCG, not just the specific one it mentions. I would otherwise call them, inherently flawed, but, investment in time can level up the field) : Article about CCG's at Polygon site

I don't need that article .. as i mentioned earlier i have over 10 years playing what i consider the best ccg on the market even to this day Magic the gathering and MTG online ..MTG blows HS out of the water in soo many ways. I know how ccg work probably better than alot of the people here.

And no your not to blame at all.

you actually you personally have my respect for at least attempting to do what you can and not freeloading on the communities back. Your reply was worth the time to respond to.

If you keep putting in little bits you'll probably end up spending more than me and if its over $25 you already have . Unless the devs actually give me a logical reason why i should spend more.

Even if its a just a general announcement and not something directly.... Though i would appreciate a Dev coming inhere and at least acknowledging my concern.

Personally it the people who deliberately try to beat the system or have the " ewww omg its a digital product that not worth anything"

 

[X_Blaze_X]

Fyi I am not going to response to any posts defending or commenting on the value or benefits of "ftp players"i have made my opinion known and that is all I have to say about that subject.

 

[X_Blaze_X]

Final thoughts on the Closed beta of Gwent . .

I started out having a great time on Gwent but looking how my posts have changed as it passed that same excitement and enjoyment seem to change .

Gwent even as it now at the end of the closed beta is alreadya completely different game as it was when it first started and it will be a completely different game again when it reopens on Wednesday.

Is it for the better, who is to say I guess that is like asking is one pizza better than the other. It’s a purely subjective thing. For me personally IDK they have nerfed it and changed itso much for its original form and added so many ways to counter every aspect of the game that it already felt like the game is going to boil down to move and counter move like a game of chess... and chess imo is the ultimate cure for insomnia. Its too balanced and predictable... likeplaying tic tac toe .

I don’t see any really "game changing" cards ones where you could be virtually losing but that round you top deck the perfect card and suddenly you pull victory from jaws of defeat like there was when the game first launched but then again I haven't played on the PTR so that remains to be seen I guess.

I originally started doing this journal because while waiting for my invite I was amazed by the sheer amount of salt on the forums. My goal when I started was not just to see how far I could get … but to see how far I could get with as little resources as possible and well it turns out not by original design in as little time as possible.

I say that because I ended up taking a very long break after the first nerfs were published So really compared to W3 at ( 339 hours ?) I have spent only 89 hours on gwent. Most of that being in the first part.

So I only used 15 paid kegs,scraps and actual "prize kegs" to expand my inventory.

I also did not "mill" any factions as you can see I STILL ended up with over ½ of all the cards in the game. 152/294

I did it this way because I wanted to eliminate 2 possible responses " P2W" and "well not everyone has the time to spend to grind all day."

I have posted an image of my final stats and wish to point out several things to disprove the below complaints.

"OMG this is too hard for new players"

"OMG this is going to be P2w"

"OMG I keep losing their is no point in playing"

"omg no one gg's me and I am losing out on stuff"

Really it reminded me of a moba forum....IMO if you feel you need to rant about "losing" on any game forum... its most likely not the games fault and secondly if you are letting a video game affect your emotional states to the point where you feel you need to rant on a video game form ...that'snot the games fault either. The true fault is in your nearest mirror.

I gave this advice to another poster but feel really it goes for any game that has a pvp element.

Also stop worrying about the outcome and rank losses happen just have fun "playing the game" regardless of the outcome.

this goes for so called "not fair (rng etc etc etc) losses to.

I have no idea how / why the reds are imo shooting them self in the foot. Personally speaking I personally consider Gwent to be even Less than a CCG than HS is. Gwent is more of a gated card game where they give you all the cards the more you play.

As you see in just 89 hours I collected 6000 ore that works out to 67.4 ore per game hour. 67.4 I was almost making 1 KEG per Hour played. That is completely ludicrous IMO.

With the above there is even more benefits,

On top of even that the rarity system is useless when you can just craft any rare you feel like.

On top of that they made it easier to both level and gain resources when they introduced "round prizes" and the new progression system

And again on top of that when they go to open beta they make it even easier by improving starter decks and allowing you to win all the leaders in challenges.

I remember when you had to win a Match to get xp or resources. That’s why I started with $25 because it made sense to do so, and I made it to level 25.

When I came back after the new progression system and ranked had been added I was knocked down to level 10. Without buying anything I made it up to level 26 rank 7 in howeverlong it took me to grind 16 levels.( I don’t know the time length because I didn’t check how much of the 89 hours was spend during the first part.

At the speed and ease I was progressing I felt no need to buy any more kegs or use my ore.

Why would anyone ever buy packs when you are giving them away like water. That is on top of the "Prize kegs" and scraps and everything I mentioned above.

"To make it easier and faster to improve your inventory" well speed is important to you and you don’t mind that others are getting the same results a bit slower but for free go ahead.

To me that is not good value. If you are going to give something of that value for free It would not in any way be logical to buy it.

Its for the above reason I consider Gwent even less than a "ccg" than HS.

The only true CCG I have played Is MTG simply because other than winning /placing in actual tourneys. There is no way to get cards free so your collection actually has value.

Which why in some cases a single MTG card can run you even well over $100

With all the packs I will be getting, the ease of getting more packs, being able to craft any card I want, and let's just say for the sake of this discussion I am not interested in cosmetic or single player campaigns, I cannot see myself EVER spending money on this game again.

So essentially in my case the CDPR put a $25 price tag on the game .

Then you have the people that are proud of the fact they have not spent a dime on this game. Look on the forums . " hey I made it to rank 15 without spending any money.

That’swhere I am different this is not a rant saying I don’t want to give CDPR money this is a rant saying CDPR why are you not making me WANT to give you money.

So basically I am a disgruntled F2P player now who really does not want toone.
My views on Game longevity,

When you take into account everything I mentioned above along with the deck building limitations ( silver and gold caps ) I think within a couple months this game is just going to come down to who can play the "pro power net deck" the best. Even if they add new cards ..with the ease of crafting any card you want all that going to happen is the net decks are going toevolve and people will craft the appropriate cards and evolve as quickly as they do.

You will see the same thing that happen in closed beta where you are seeing the same decks over and over and over again and it's just going to come down to the same dull characteristics and the insomnia curing game of chess and will get as stake as it has in close beta

So to recap

I got to level 25 with a progression system in which you had to win a MATCH in order to get xp and resources

I saved 6000 ore and 1100 scraps

I was able to gain 16 levels and 7 rank points in a new progression and rewards system

I was able to get over ½ of all available cards without spending said ore

I did this all in only 89 hours of play time and with only spending $25 at the start . I spent 329 hours and counting on W3 I wonder what I would have accomplished if I spent a similar time in closed beta of Gwent.

Really IMO this proves at least for me, everything I set out to prove

This game

Was not hard on a new person even during its most difficult state

CDPR is being overly generous with their rewards to the point where not in anyway logical to buy kegs as a result I think it will eventually hurt their bottom line and the playability of the game itself.

They have converted at least 1 person who would have gladly spent a lot of money on this game to one who begrudgingly is now a " ftp" player.

The fact that not everyone GG did not affect me in the least.

Spoiler

 

[X_Blaze_X]

I screwed up my font and formatting some how ....tried to fix it ..forum beat me .

 

[4RM3D]

I screwed up my font and formatting some how ....tried to fix it ..forum beat me .

ROUND 1:

Forum 1 - NovaBlast 0

*NovaBlast summons 4RM3D*

ROUND 2:

Forum 0 - 4RM3D 1

 

[zhiphius]

I don't understand people claiming gwent is P2W either, a friend of mine won 60% of his 30 first matches when he just got into closed beta, he didnt scrap anything nor buy any kegs. He didnt netdeck and built his own deck. He played with monsters and skellige.

The good thing about gwent is that its generous, more so in open beta.

-6 won rounds (not matches) = 1 card pack and 2 additional small rewards.
-18 won rounds a day = 2 card packs and 4 additional small rewards.
-Ore and packs rewarded for doing the challenges (the new tutorial).
-You get 4 golds and 6 silvers in the starter decks.
-Levels gives rewards
-Ranking gives rewards
-Challenges unlocks all 3 leader cards.

Thats already much better than CCG's like hearthstone (which is notoriously known for how hard it is to get into, HS rewards a pack every 2-3 days compared to gwents "as much rewards as you got time for limited at 66 won rounds".)

The challenge gwent may present is its complexity and all the new things to learn for beginners.

But I agree that it is a good game. I just hope it doesn't go down the route of "These 2-4 decks are the only viable top game decks" but allows for tweaks, experimentation and a slew of competetive decks

 

[X_Blaze_X]

ROUND 1:

Forum 1 - NovaBlast 0

*NovaBlast summons 4RM3D*

ROUND 2:

Forum 0 - 4RM3D 1

Thank You I have been avenged

The good thing about gwent is that its generous, more so in open beta.

-6 won rounds (not matches) = 1 card pack and 2 additional small rewards.
-18 won rounds a day = 2 card packs and 4 additional small rewards.
-Ore and packs rewarded for doing the challenges (the new tutorial).
-You get 4 golds and 6 silvers in the starter decks.
-Levels gives rewards
-Ranking gives rewards
-Challenges unlocks all 3 leader cards.

As stated above I don't think their " generosity" is a good thing. I did this all to prove just how overly generous and how easy it was to progress even with very limited resources.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this point. CDPR "generosity" is one of the main reasons why i think the game is going to be stale.

Everyone eventually will have access to exactly the same card pool either by owning or crafting.

a best "deck"/(s) will emerge within the next month or 2 maybe even sooner considering the people playing on the ptr and it is highly possible they will be "netdecked" that /those deck/(s) either buy owning or crafting and you will end up having a ton of annoying boring encounters of the same deck archetype/mirror matches as happened by the end of the close beta.

also as mentioned above adding new cards won't help because people will just craft the cards they need to update however the net deck evolve..