I have both in a deck and I think they are great (Tibor and Vilgefortz). I don't have roach for Vilgefortz and I typically kill a medic, although it is flexible depending on the opponent. As Tibor, unless the opponent plays Monsters, I try to use in the first round as the fist card and pass. They got card advantage but you get 22 solid gold points, that most factions cannot reach with one card (except Crones). If they want to reach 22 they have to throw 2 or 3 cards or pass and give you the first round. Most of the people is not willing to give free CA to the opponent so I guess that is the reason I don't see the card too much (or as much as Vilgefortz), but it works for me.