Plot Questions

[dejavu619]

Plot Questions

1. In Iorveth's path, why is Dethmold executed? I know Phillipa is controlling Saskia, but what "war-crimes" of Dethmold are being spoken of? I believe the motive behind executing him is because Sile detests him and Phillipa and Sile are good friends?

2. Why does Radovid have Phillipa arrested in Loc Muinne? Is it because Nilfgaard's representative tells him that the Lodge is behind the regicides?

3. If you choose to rescue Triss, the guard says that he made Triss confess that the Lodge was behind the murders by showing her the confessions of the other Lodge sorceresses. But whose confessions exactly did they show her?

 

[Lytha]

1.) Dethmold knew that Saskia was a dragon. At that time, this was top secret information and neither Phil nor Saskia wanted an enemy to know of this. Also, taking the head off of the court sorceror of Henselt could have meant that Sila could have been in a position to replace Dethmold.

2.) Philippa and Radovid have a history. For one thing, Philippa assassinated the father of Radovid. For another thing, she then was in a position as his legal guardian and regent, and she apparently has really low parental skills, so Radovid spent the rest of his late teen years in misery, and he wants revenge. Sure, him getting off so much about torturing her is disturbing, but he has reasons for his warped sense of justice and revenge.

3.) Assire and Fringilla were in the hands of Nilfgaard and thus potential sources for information. Francesca and Ida might have contributed information as well, given that Dol Blathanna wants to keep the happy vassal status with Nilfgaard and not upset this relationship. Yennefer is also a likely source for information, given that she was in a Nilfgaardian prison cell for quite some time then, though she never was actually part of the Lodge and so had only very limited information to spare. She was one time brought along to one meeting by Francesca, but fled quickly.

 

[dejavu619]

1.) Dethmold knew that Saskia was a dragon. At that time, this was top secret information and neither Phil nor Saskia wanted an enemy to know of this. Also, taking the head off of the court sorceror of Henselt could have meant that Sila could have been in a position to replace Dethmold.

2.) Philippa and Radovid have a history. For one thing, Philippa assassinated the father of Radovid. For another thing, she then was in a position as his legal guardian and regent, and she apparently has really low parental skills, so Radovid spent the rest of his late teen years in misery, and he wants revenge. Sure, him getting off so much about torturing her is disturbing, but he has reasons for his warped sense of justice and revenge.

3.) Assire and Fringilla were in the hands of Nilfgaard and thus potential sources for information. Francesca and Ida might have contributed information as well, given that Dol Blathanna wants to keep the happy vassal status with Nilfgaard and not upset this relationship. Yennefer is also a likely source for information, given that she was in a Nilfgaardian prison cell for quite some time then, though she never was actually part of the Lodge and so had only very limited information to spare. She was one time brought along to one meeting by Francesca, but fled quickly.

Thanks for the informative reply. Also, in this cinematic (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ob8TQD5fcM), at 16:15 who are the people being killed by Knights of the Order? The cinematic is played when rescuing Triss instead of helping Phillipa or Roche.

Also, is there a way for Aedirn to control upper Aedirn, not independent Vergen?

Secondly, if Sile and Saskia knew all along that Letho was a pawn of Nilfgaard, why didn't either of them say so during the meeting at the amphitheatre, rather than talking about it later with Geralt?

 

[dragonbird]

Thanks for the informative reply. Also, in this cinematic (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ob8TQD5fcM), at 16:15 who are the people being killed by Knights of the Order? The cinematic is played when rescuing Triss instead of helping Phillipa or Roche.

Absolutely no idea. Maybe someone else knows? I don't remember that scene.

Also, is there a way for Aedirn to control upper Aedirn, not independent Vergen?

Assuming you mean an independent Aedirn, no. On the Roche path, Stennis always dies, so Aedirn is leaderless and Kaedwen takes Upper Aedirn (even if Henselt is dead) . On the Iorveth path, Vergen always gets independence.

Secondly, if Sile and Saskia knew all along that Letho was a pawn of Nilfgaard, why didn't either of them say so during the meeting at the amphitheatre, rather than talking about it later with Geralt?

Revealing this information would also have revealed that the Lodge was behind Demavend's killing, so it wouldn't have helped much, and after Letho's own "confession" Sile needed to get out fast.
I'm not sure that Saskia knew. Sile's conversation with Geralt indicates that she'd only just worked it out, based presumably on Letho's fake confession and the news about the Nilfgaard attack.

 

[dejavu619]

On the Iorveth path, Vergen always gets independence

Even if Stennis is alive? Does Stennis attend the meeting at Loc Muinne? Yet to see a video of him at the meeting...

 

[dragonbird]

Even if Stennis is alive? Does Stennis attend the meeting at Loc Muinne? Yet to see a video of him at the meeting...

If Stennis is alive, he rushes back to the Aedirnian capital in order to claim credit for the victory, and claim the throne. He doesn't attempt to keep control of Vergen, or go to Loc Muinne.

I couldn't find a video with a quick seach on this, but if you find a video showing just BEFORE the Loc Muinne meeting for this scenario, you meet an Aedirnian Nobleman on the way into the auditorium, who gives you the update.

 

[Lytha]

Thanks for the informative reply. Also, in this cinematic (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ob8TQD5fcM), at 16:15 who are the people being killed by Knights of the Order? The cinematic is played when rescuing Triss instead of helping Phillipa or Roche.

I also do not remember that scene at all, but it's the most unlikely combination for me to play. (I strongly prefer the Iorveth path and I hold a massive grudge against that Triss... )

Of the 4 murdered people, I can identify the two soldiers as in Temerian colours. The two civilians... well, one is all in black and white, which looks Nilfgaardian. The other could be anything.

The armored body being dragged towards the pile of other bodies later on is clad in black+yellow/brown. Could be either Kaedweni or Nilfgaard. There's also a blue gloved hand in the background, which would indicate Temeria once more.


Roche + Triss = Anais was not rescued from the Kaedweni, right? What does the ending cutscene state about the fate of Anais in this event? Is she captured by Radovid or just not mentioned at all? What does Radovid do?

Also, it might be important if this playthrough there had Roche become a kingslayer or not (that destabilizes the northern balance of power quite a bit in favour for Redania.) (And that would make it even less likely that I actually ever saw this cutscene before, lol.) - oh, nevermind that, I just watched the earlier parts of this ending. Henselt lives.

Lovely how that redheaded bitch uses the situation immediately to decapitate the current leadership of the mages so that she herself can take that spot. So adept at the Game of Thrones. I wish I could hand her over to Radovid in TW3.


Anyway! It could be a case of: "And Radovid's Redania started to become the strongest force in the north, by killing Kaedweni and Temerians troups, and Nilfgaardian spies."

 

[dejavu619]

Roche + Triss = Anais was not rescued from the Kaedweni, right? What does the ending cutscene state about the fate of Anais in this event? Is she captured by Radovid or just not mentioned at all? What does Radovid do?

No. If you opt for Roche + Triss, then Roche rescues Anais on his own and flees with her, neither handing her over to John Natalis, nor Radovid. If you help him rescue Anais, you can tell him who to hand her over to.

I also don't understand why all soldiers are against you in Loc Muinne if you choose Iorveth's path.

---------- Updated at 07:47 AM ----------

Lovely how that redheaded bitch uses the situation immediately to decapitate the current leadership of the mages so that she herself can take that spot. So adept at the Game of Thrones. I wish I could hand her over to Radovid in TW3.

What are you talking about? Who does she decapitate?

 

[sv3672]

Thanks for the informative reply. Also, in this cinematic (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ob8TQD5fcM), at 16:15 who are the people being killed by Knights of the Order? The cinematic is played when rescuing Triss instead of helping Phillipa or Roche.

That cutscene is described in the game as "Part of the Temerian delegation to Loc Muinne is executed". Although I could not find out who they are or exactly why they are executed. Is that cutscene shown also if you side with Iorveth and rescue Triss (I did that, but it has been a long time since I last played the game, so I do not remember the details of the ending) ? Perhaps they are spies or traitors or there is some other story explanation (possibly related to Lilies and Vipers, or the short conversation with Carduin shown before they are killed ?), but apparently not all the people killed are Temerians (edit: the armored soldier who is dragged after the Temerians are killed is from Aedirn, just like the other one dragging him). It is also possible that it is related to this conversation:

Spoiler

Carduin: This is no place for witchers, though I know you, and you appear wherever something important happens.
Geralt: True, though sometimes by accident.
Carduin: And this time? Also a coincidence?
Geralt: Let's say I have something to take care of.
Carduin: In that case, hurry. Once we're done cleaning up this mess created by the royal soldiery, Loc Muinne will be magically sealed.
Geralt: Getting out of here?
Carduin: Temporarily. We shall return soon enough to rebuild the city. Loc Muinne will regain its former glory. Until that time, we need to keep the treasure hunters and troublemakers out.
Geralt: So Radovid trusts you?
Carduin: We shall win His Royal Majesty's trust by delivering Síle de Tansarville and the other traitoresses from the Lodge.
...
Carduin: Forgive me, I must attend to some matters. And don't dawdle - the city will be sealed in one hour.

Since everyone had to leave Loc Muinne within one hour, maybe the people killed by the Order knights just refused to do that and were looting the place or did some other crime ?

What are you talking about? Who does she decapitate?

Just ignore what that poster says about anything Triss related.

 

[Lytha]

What are you talking about? Who does she decapitate?

Cute little Miss Merigold has one goal in TW3: Power.

She utilizes the persecution of the mages and the fact that the Lodge has been disbanded and outlawed to establish herself as the new leader of the mages. Once in Korvir, she'll be the new shadow queen, court sorceress and all the other good stuff. She may do it under the disguise of a whiny martyr saviour of the wold Jesus, but she's doing it anyway.

Of course, this only works if the previous leader figures are removed. Which conveniently happens as she's stepping on stage there, blaming the Lodge.

So, this all works out really well in one person's favour. That person is that red nightmare.


It's very similar to her activities in TW1, neutral path, actually. Only that she worked together with the Lodge back then. Back in the books, she was also all for the game of power and even slept with Philippa to get there.

Oh well.

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No. If you opt for Roche + Triss, then Roche rescues Anais on his own and flees with her, neither handing her over to John Natalis, nor Radovid. If you help him rescue Anais, you can tell him who to hand her over to.

I also don't understand why all soldiers are against you in Loc Muinne if you choose Iorveth's path.

If Roche and Anais are in hiding, then Radovid is indeed establishing Redania as the new leaders by killing some Temerians, Kaedweni and others.

Soldiers are all against you if you're with Iorveth, because Iorveth is a wanted man and you're associated with him.

 

[sv3672]

She utilizes the persecution of the ma=ages and the fact that the Lodge has been disbanded and outlawed to establish herself as the new leader of the mages. Once in Korvir, she'll be the new shadow queen, court sorceress and all the other good stuff.

Of course, this only works if the previous leader figures are removed. Which conveniently happens as she's stepping on stage there, blaming the Lodge.

Realistically, there is no way she would be able to plan all this already at the time of the second game, and foresee all the later events that lead to the escape to Kovir. You are just twisting every random bit of information you find to support your hatred of the character. But the fact remains that you have no evidence that this is all part of some grand plan. The explanation she gives after she is rescued (scene q304_08 in this file) makes sense and it is consistent with information that is available from elsewhere, so there is no particular reason not to believe it.

 

[dejavu619]

Cute little Miss Merigold has one goal in TW3: Power.

She utilizes the persecution of the mages and the fact that the Lodge has been disbanded and outlawed to establish herself as the new leader of the mages. Once in Korvir, she'll be the new shadow queen, court sorceress and all the other good stuff. She may do it under the disguise of a whiny martyr saviour of the wold Jesus, but she's doing it anyway.

Of course, this only works if the previous leader figures are removed. Which conveniently happens as she's stepping on stage there, blaming the Lodge.

So, this all works out really well in one person's favour. That person is that red nightmare.


It's very similar to her activities in TW1, neutral path, actually. Only that she worked together with the Lodge back then. Back in the books, she was also all for the game of power and even slept with Philippa to get there.

Oh well.

Well as long as she's putting her position as the new leader of mages to good use, what's the problem? It's not as if she trampled over innocents to get what she wants. And she's much better than Sile or Phillipa. If Triss was really as lusty for power, she would've gone along with their plan to assassinate Devamend...

 

[Lytha]

Well as long as she's putting her position as the new leader of mages to good use, what's the problem? It's not as if she trampled over innocents to get what she wants. And she's much better than Sile or Phillipa. If Triss was really as lusty for power, she would've gone along with their plan to assassinate Devamend...

Who's to say if she's putting her power to "good use"? Back at the start of TW2, wasn't she the one who arranged for Shilard Fitz-Oesterlin's presence in Foltest's camp, or at least was doing her best to keep their negotiations on good terms? But oh well, discussions about that red queen of deceit never lead to anything good and I can already see that the usual background noises already arrived.



I put my response to your other two topics (who was killed by Radovid's troups and why the hostility on Iorveth's path) in the posting before, edited it in while you wrote your response.

 

[sv3672]

Who's to say if she's putting her power to "good use"?

The ending of TW3 and the epilogue of Blood and Wine ? What evidence do you have to prove that it will be put to bad use, other than speculation ?

Back at the start of TW2, wasn't she the one who arranged for Shilard Fitz-Oesterlin's presence in Foltest's camp, or at least was doing her best to keep their negotiations on good terms?

Quoting from the game:

Foltest: Black Ones in my camp before a battle - what has the world come to? Nothing would make me happier than returning his shriveled head to Emhyr in a sack... But Triss Merigold insisted I be patient and courteous. Was I?

Obviously, giving the advice to the king not to just murder the Nilfgaardian ambassador must have been motivated by some Machiavellian plan, rather than just common sense and not knowing what the Nilfgaardians are plotting ? :

But oh well, discussions about that red queen of deceit never lead to anything good

There is plenty of room for interesting discussions, in fact, there were some in the past, but when they are only about having to refute theories of similar quality to this one (or worse) that are driven by an agenda to "prove" that the character is Satan personified, then they indeed do not lead to much good.

 

[Rawls]

This forum and thread are not about the Witcher 3. Please stay on topic.

 

[e6chan]

here's the problem for us folks playing W2 after first playing W3: you quickly realize that any political decision you make in W2 is pretty much meaningless one way or another.