Overpowered silvers that need to be gold

[StrykerxS77x]

I really don't agree in regards to Odrin or Sweers.

I'm shocked Odrin was even brought up. I never see anyone using it because it's so easily controlled. Maybe in a different meta it would be really good but definitely not now.

Sweers is only amazing when it shuts down a big strategy. People who go all in on Nekkers deserve that to happen to them sometimes. A lot of times Sweers is weaker than a bronze. No way it should be gold.

 

[DanielXTC]

Restore should be a gold card for sure. To easy to abuse.

 

[Wonderboy8700]

I kept a running tally. 25 out of 25 of my last matches against NG I faced sweers. I saw people use silvers to call him from the deck, I saw him created with Runestone, I saw him decoyed and replayed, and I saw him come straight from the deck. Any synergy deck can be disrupted by this card unless you are lucky enough to have all the cards in your hand. It is true that it is hit or miss, but when it can be played 2 or 3 times per match the odds of a hit are quite high. When the dwarves for dwarven agitator are taken from the hand, when the neckers and towers are sent to the graveyard, when the priestess of Freya are destroyed, when the mangonel or sentries are banished from the deck, or when just about any key bronze is denied the match is unbalanced. Add to this the draw strategy where both players are forced to play 20 to 25 cards and the disadvantage is magnified.

Reasonable people can agree to disagree, but the truth is this card is unique in the game and should cost more than one silver slot, and should not be replayable for anything less than another gold.

For people who disagree please answer these questions.

1. Name 3 other cards that can change the balance of the game in the same way.

2. Name a way to defend against this card without adding more cards to the deck (undesirable with just about any synergy approach.) Also nenneke is unacceptable as an answer as she is limited to NR and this problem effects all 5 factions.

3. Name 3 synergy decks that don't get disrupted by this card.
​​​​​

 

[Draconifors]

Sweers is only popular because of the abundance of Nekkers, dwarves and Henselt.

He has literally never been changed ability-wise, except for the brief period during which he lost one STR for each discarded card.

Once the meta shifts to something else, Sweers will lose his popularity outside of mill decks. There's zero need to make him a Gold.

 

[Lyserus]

Sweers: Punishment for you using one kind of card as ultimate core

Odrin/Harald: You need to have at least a bit of ability to damage opponent deck...if you are dwarfing and don't want to spare a card to make sure to deny opponent strategy, shame on you

 

[Wonderboy8700]

First no one addressed my questions. Second, how many times do I have to say it gets used more than once. Lyserus, if he kills all of one type in one play then the other in the second, then agitators are useless. Moreover, no other faction has a card that does this, which is why on casual when I play NG a lot of people auto resign (especially consume and henselt decks.)

 

[Lyserus]

First no one addressed my questions. Second, how many times do I have to say it gets used more than once. Lyserus, if he kills all of one type in one play then the other in the second, then agitators are useless. Moreover, no other faction has a card that does this, which is why on casual when I play NG a lot of people auto resign (especially consume and henselt decks.)

There are no other consume other than monster deck, no sabina other than NR, no axeman other than SK...you want all unique gold? Or any cards that “use more than once”?

You wouldn't even have problem with agitator if you
1.Have more than 1 type of dwarf in your deck other than agitator
2.Keep 1 dwarf in your hand and muligen it afterwards, if not in round start, SC has cards to do that as well

 

[4RM3D]

but the truth is this card is unique in the game and should cost more than one silver slot, and should not be replayable for anything less than another gold.​​​​​

Sweers is a meta card that's popular because it can deal with Nekkers and Dwarfs. Both of those decks are already very strong and them having an Achilles' Heel is only fair. If Sweers would be turned into a gold, no one is going to use him. That's a simple fact. Instead, Sweers could be limited in another way by making him stubborn, doomed or unique.

1. Name 3 other cards that can change the balance of the game in the same way.​​​​​

Any tech card that hits a critical spot, like a well aligned Scorch, can lay waste to the opponent.

2. Name a way to defend against this card without adding more cards to the deck (undesirable with just about any synergy approach.)

That's being unreasonable. When the meta shifts, you adjust your deck accordinly. Is it worth running a anti-Sweers card, just for those match-ups? That depends on how popular NG is on the ladder. Some Consume decks started running Mandrake to counter the mirror match as well having a decent effect against dwarfs.

3. Name 3 synergy decks that don't get disrupted by this card.​​​​​

Pretty much any deck besides Nekkers and dwarfs. Anything that doesn't rely on one trick to win.

 

[Pruny]

He can disrupt eredin by removing hounds or drowners.

 

[Wonderboy8700]

4RM3D, most synergy decks utilize one or two bronze cards. Damage boosting decks for SK, wild hunt decks, to some degree moonlight monster decks (depending on how the deck is built,) cursed NR deck, reveal deck, return deck (a little more difficult as it needs to be used twice but still disruptive used once, the list goes on. Saying don't use a deck built around specific bronze cards is like saying don't play with a strategy deck, just get the highest cards you can find together and overpower an opponent. More to my point, if this is intended then make it available to all factions and if it is not intended then make it a gold. In any event it seems people disagree with me which is fine, but the lack of acknowledgment of my point is a bit silly (especially because no one has given a few examples of decks that don't mind having multiple cards sent to the graveyard, especially against an opponent running a game where they force you to draw cards.)

 

[4RM3D]

especially because no one has given a few examples of decks that don't mind having multiple cards sent to the graveyard, especially against an opponent running a game where they force you to draw cards.

Hold on, time out. Mill is a completely different story. Sweers (potentially) gains double the value there. Besides that one archetype, let's see...

First of all, like I've said, you have to hit the opponent were it hurts. Aligning units and then using Scorch, can be far more devastating. Sweers doesn't require a setup, that's a big bonus, but at the same time, his value is not guaranteed against certain match-ups where he is just a 9 strength unit. Next, Sweers had been pretty much unchanged since day one and no one ever ''complained'' except when the old greedy Nekker consume was born and players were complaining that their OP carry-over got killed by one card.

Sweers only works so well because the meta allows it. Dwarfs and Nekkers are easy and obvious targets. However, in other decks it's more difficult to find a good target, especially when the opponent is holding multiple copies in hand. Wild Hunt decks laugh at Sweers. Hounds gone? Doesn't kill the deck. Drowners gone? Not a big deal. Skellige can just ress units. And other decks have ways to deal with Sweers too, rarely leading to a lethal blow.

But we are going around in circles, so I'll end this discussion with two examples of good Sweers plays and still being countered.

Vs Henselt machines, third round, few cards left including Henselt, the opponent plays a machine (Henselt's target). So, you have no choice but to counter it with Sweers. Heck, you were waiting for that single moment. First counter: Nenneke, Second counter: opponent had another machine to Henselt.

Vs Nekkers, third round, opponent plays Nekker and you Sweers it. But the opponent being smart (or unlucky with his draws), had another Nekker Warrior in hand which can be used on a (resurrected) Nekker.

Sweers can be a mind game on its own. When to use it for maximum effect.

TL;DR Sweers = meta, that's all

 

[DRK3]

I absolutely hate Nekkers, so i never used them. Maybe because of that, i feel relieved when i see Sweers played against me, because not once has it disrupted my strategies, of the dozens of times i saw him.

Also, OP said you dont need to time Sweers right against Nekkers but you do - use it too soon and the enemy can still use Nekker Warriors to make more. Besides now you can even revive 2 Nekkers with that Gold Crone, Nekkers have more possibilities and counters than ever.

On Harald Houndsnout, he recently became one of my favourite cards. Yes, he has won me several games, but dont say its hard to counter because all you have to do to stop that 11 pt bear from spawning is destroy the skull on your turn, or dont let it be destroyed.

On Odrin im not sure. I think he provides similar value as Triss Butt, but the problem is Triss Butt that is too weak for a Gold, not the other way around.

 

[Guest_4248742]

The way i see it it"s simple .I pray that GOD himself OH YEA baby mr Kripparrian starts playing gwent then he loves the game so much that he will give buffing/nerfing tips to the dev team and yea you got one hell of a game ready !!!!!One can only dream .

 

[iamthedave]

I'll tackle your questions directly, Wonders.

1. Name 3 other cards that can change the balance of the game in the same way.

Vicovaro Medic, Scorch, any silver spy (can literally win or lose games via CA), any runestone (same reason).

That's limited to things that screw with the other deck as opposed to things that make yours strong, such as Hattori or Barclay Els, as the list would be much longer if you include them.

2. Name a way to defend against this card without adding more cards to the deck (undesirable with just about any synergy approach.) Also nenneke is unacceptable as an answer as she is limited to NR and this problem effects all 5 factions.

Keep multiples in your hand. If you expect a Sweers, all you need is two in hand and he's taken a whopping one bronze off you. If you're playing Nekker consume and he gets you after multi-warrior, the gold witch can resurrect two of them for you. Or you can just play one warrior to bait him out.

3. Name 3 synergy decks that don't get disrupted by this card.
​​​​​

Foltest Swarm and Henselt Machines. I've Sweersed both so hard you'd think Sweers was a card in their deck but they've still recovered comfortably. So that's two. Radovid armour's fine as it has multiple different engines and doesn't require multiples of anything on the board. Moonlight doesn't really care, since Sweers can't even target its main power card, and if you sweers the siren they can just draw moonlight and hardcast it, or get it out via nekurat. Frost doesn't care because it runs redundant frost creators, though sweersing the hounds does make it likely you can wear them out if you have weather clears as well. Most Dagon decks don't care as Dagon generates weather all on his own. Dorfs can do just fine no matter what you hit, as I've seen. Hardest blow is on Skirmisher but they don't need him.

So that's seven across two factions.

I think you're not being clear enough on your terminology, or picking too broad a term for it to be meaningful. Sweers does 'disrupt' the strategy, provided he lands a hit. Of course he does. That's the point. But he doesn't shut down anything barring a specific brand of consume. Noting that there's more than one way to eat an egg, and beast consume is practically immune to sweers since it doesn't rely on replaying much of anything.

Sweers as a gold is absurd. He's a 9pt swing that wins games against exactly one deck in the format, and even then that deck can play around him. He's just right as a silver. In order to use him more than once the NG player has to aim to do so and go out of their way to do so. That's entirely reasonable.