Limit Sweers to a Maximum Number of Copies

[partci]

Wonder if Sweers "needs" to be limited to put only "X" number of cards in the GY, shouldn't Nekker Warriors be limited to put just "Y" number of the same unit in their deck? :hmm:

 

[Mancoon1980]

Sweers is fine to me.. I don't even have the card because
​​​​play NG. Anyway I do play consume from time to time I just dont use nekker warriors nekkers. I only run 3. nekkers early on is too risky. Nothing is more annoying than watching someone create 9 op nekkers.

 

[Yykkla]

To reiterate my point: being able to play around Sweers is irrelevant to this argument. The argument is Sweers effectively renders the Nekker Warrior, a core monsters card, redundant. I said it before and I'll say it again now, changes should revolve around the archetype, not vice versa.

 

[Klushluck]

Sweers is only good if you fill your deck with Nekkers, and if you play against NG you have to assume they will use it and tread carefully. Against most other decks Sweers is just bad.

 

[Paris155]

pthieu1986. I already listed several cards that can destroy nekkers (btw I agree that we need more destroy and doom cards) but even without destroying them, resetting the cards that consume them is a good plan. I have defeated nekkers many times with good ST deck and with henslet deck. You can also play nekkers properly and force them to use most or all of the nekkers in the first 2 rounds thus giving you a win in round 3. It is a good deck, not an instant win (especially when you need nekker warriors in your hand to make it work. Plenty of people don't get one early enough to make a difference.)

Exactly, nerfing their deathwish to not giving next round carryover, is more than enough nerf. There are plenty of cards that can beat them. Sweers decks, Reveal decks, Henselt and Eithne decks always give my consume deck a very hard time. Actually the only deck that is very easy for me are the so called OP dwarves lol. Its instant win against them.

 

[Khreygond]

does the fact that there is literally a thread for almost every annoying card in the game with a user behind it asking that it gets nerfed/reworked even give you people a hint?


Long story short, that's not how it works. And forgive me but my single most satisfying moment in Gwent EVER has been using Sweers on 7 Nekkers before the update and clicking on every single one.

 

[senatormolotov]

If Sweers gets limited then Nekker Warrior and similarly designed cards in the future need to have a weaker effect.

 

[Bleach25]

does the fact that there is literally a thread for almost every annoying card in the game with a user behind it asking that it gets nerfed/reworked even give you people a hint?


Long story short, that's not how it works. And forgive me but my single most satisfying moment in Gwent EVER has been using Sweers on 7 Nekkers before the update and clicking on every single one.

You earned yourself a RedPoint sir. Personally sweers has always been one of my favourites cards and destroying oppo's decks (nekkers especially) is hella funny. Anyway I don't understand all the complaints considering it can easily brick (and is useless against decks that resurrect)

 

[iamthedave]

To reiterate my point: being able to play around Sweers is irrelevant to this argument. The argument is Sweers effectively renders the Nekker Warrior, a core monsters card, redundant. I said it before and I'll say it again now, changes should revolve around the archetype, not vice versa.

Oooo, a silver negates a BRONZE. Whatever will we do about this dreadful imbalance?

Your argument fails to carry water. The archetype can - and DOES - play around Sweers, and has been doing so since this game was a thing. There's nothing else to say. Sweers will destroy a nekker deck if you play it badly. Sweers forces nekker players to play smarter.

How is that not a good thing?

 

[Void_Singer]

player of powerful archetype seeks nerf of the one (faction specific) card that can really shut it down?

Imma go with:
Bwahahahahahahaha..... No.

 

[Wonderboy8700]

Void_Singer. I respect your position, but I think you are missing the point. If you feel there needs to be a sweers, then why only give it to 1 faction. Never mind the fact that it is more powerful than half the golds in the game when used correctly. nevermind that it can be used with a draw deck to gain a massive advantage. nevermind all the other reasons people hate the card. Why is there no other card with the same or similar power in any other faction. There are dozens of ways to beat any archetype, (nekker, henslet, dwarf, etc...) If you honestly believe (and I assume you do) that you need a card this powerful to defend against them, then every faction needs something as powerful as well (except maybe ST as they have 3 golds worth more than 30.)

 

[Karfuss]

If you feel there needs to be a sweers, then why only give it to 1 faction

Because if it's available to every faction, Monsters would be a 100% DEAD faction. Your Wild Hunt archetype is f'ing abysmal. Regardless, there are factionless cards that perform a similar role, such as Villentrentenmeth and G: Igni. Obviously they're not as effective, for good reason.

My advice? Learn to dodge Sweers. NG is your hardest match up if you think you can steamroll them down like everyone else. Keep a Nekker Warrior in hand, and go deep into Round 1. Bait out Sweers, then proceed to add more into your deck. All you need do is lengthen your Nekker engine process over Round 1.

Sweers doesn't act continually. Once it's gone, it's dead. It won't be taking any new Nekkers out. Be proactive about it, and run something like Operator. In any case, Nekkers in your graveyard are safe too. Throwing all your Nekkers on Round 1, saving Brewess:Ritual for a short Round 2 and finally Pheonix for your finisher, is another way to skirt around it.

 

[Wonderboy8700]

Dodging sweers is a great plan that is only possible under ideal circumstances. I will give three examples but my point is valid beyond them. 1. Nekkers can only avoid sweers if multiple nekker warriors are in hand (otherwise a smart opponent will use sweers on the nekker warrior and possibly replay on nekkers if they plan properly.) 2. Dwarves can only Dodge sweers if they use 2 types of dwarves (radically dilutes effect,) or if they have a base dwarf in hand to shuffle back (so aggitators are not dead cards.) Also it is worth noting that if sweers is played twice both base dwarves are zeroed and a draw deck auto wins.) 3. Henslet can dodge if you have an extra copy of the siege weapon on hand, but that reduces effectiveness and is less likely the case if you use a wench approach.

I have made this same point before and I know the response I always get (sweers is more often then not useless unless used against a bronze focused meta which is likely overpowered.) The advice then becomes suck it up or play better. We can agree to disagree, but the point remains valid.

Karfuss, surely you see the flaw in your argument. If nekkers are the only valid monster deck (and nekkers are severely hindered by sweers) then NG vs MO will always be unfair to MO. Your solution is play past it, my solution is for developers to fix MO and fix sweers (who happens to be he most overpowered silver in the game. When played properly he can effect 30 to 50 points of value.)

 

[Rawls]

Nothing makes me chuckle to myself in Gwent like when somebody plays Sweers against my Shupe deck.

 

[Karfuss]

then NG vs MO will always be unfair to MO

https://gwentup.com/report/18/2

Throughout the MMRs, Consume only has ONE faction that it struggles against. NG. The entirety of the NG faction is the only one where you have a below 50% win rate. You beat everyone else that isn't Eithne.

So nerf Sweers, the only thing stopping you from having a positive win rate against everyone. The only thing, I can genuinely think of, as to why Eithne beats you is that she works very similarly to you, but out tempos you Round 1, and has a helluva lot more control.

So I guess it's make your choice. MO vs Everyone but NG is unfair too, so accept it, or be nerfed into the ground.

 

[Wonderboy8700]

Karfuss, first let me thank you for that link (it is kinda awesome to have those numbers broken down.) Second, I have said in other threads that I want more cards that can fight against nekker decks. For example if you could doom a nekker warrior then he could not be resurrected (one of many solutions to the problem.) Also I think the nekker base power should be reverted back to 3 so mushrooms can destroy them.

​​​​​​A double scorch against nekkers tends to win me most matches against monsters (especially if I also have a duel gold.) Henselt towers with wench works wonders. Cursed bear can be effective but you need to run 2 artifact compressions. Believe me when I say you are right that nekkers are problem, but sweers is not a good answer. Sweers works on a lot more than monsters and in a way that generally is not fun (because most of the synergy decks are messed up by it.)

Again thank you for the link.

 

[Karfuss]

Sweers works on a lot more than monsters and in a way that generally is not fun (because most of the synergy decks are messed up by it.)

That's a bit of a moot point.

Sweers bricks against most match ups, but he does royally screw Spell'tael, Alchemy, Nekkers and even Dwarves (Rarely, can happen, if Brouver throws out his Skirmisher as an early play. Let's you bleed out Brouver and Hattori Round 2, since his Agitators are more than likely bricked, giving you a smooth ride Round 3 with your own finisher, since Paulie won't beat an NG finisher).

 

[Wonderboy8700]

Karfuss, how is it a moot point when the topic of the thread is limiting the card to 2 kills.

 

[Karfuss]

Karfuss, how is it a moot point when the topic of the thread is limiting the card to 2 kills.

Because you made the claim that Sweers works on a lot more than Monsters. This isn't strictly true.

It only works on decks that get their power from single cards. Nekkers, being a prime example. Spell'tael decks using Protector. So on, so on. If anything Sweers is its most devastating against Protectors, for ST has no way of playing around it. Once they're gone, no win condition, nothing. And a dozen cards designed to pull them out of deck get bricked.

 

[niroz]

Also, if the player uses Sweers on the wrong target, they can accidentally unbrick someone's hand if they've got resurrection cards.

I think I should also point out that earlier in this patch people were running nekker decks without nekker warriors and doing quite well, they just made use of other consume cards and used nekkers as a r3 finisher.