Can't make myself play Order path without risk of getting ulcers. Am I missing interesting things?

[Lytha]

Can't make myself play Order path without risk of getting ulcers. Am I missing interesting things?

I'm currently approaching the end of my second TW1 playthrough.

First one was fully Scoiatel/Shani. I was quite happy with that.

Then came a failed attempt at a "worst choices ever", in which I wanted to try the Order path. I made Order choices up until the start of chapter 3, feeling nauseous whenever I walked past the well-used gallows in temple quarter or interacting with anyone who reacted to the political decisions. This playthrough ended right after I witnessed Triss' interaction with Philippa-Keira, when she did the Big Lie about why she wouldn't help Geralt recover his memories. So, I blame both the Order nausea and the "I also should go for Triss instead of Shani this time"-nausea for this full stop of the playthrough. Several other choices I did were also not helping (Abigail dead, "Kalkstein is guilty!", and more.) Anyway, that playthrough ended early and does not count.

So, the one I am currently doing is "Scoiatel up until end of chapter 4; then neutral." And Triss, but no sex with her to avoid overwhelming nausea because of that. Works relatively okay, but I felt like a scumbag for killing some scoiatel who were in my way in chapter 4. They were mixed with the order guys, I swear! Aldersberg in the swamp cemetary seemed to say a lot more than when I met him with Yaevinn in tow, or maybe I am mistaken. Seemed quite interesting, anyway.


Now here's the problem: I am quite curious. So I really wouldn't mind at all to see what Siegfried & Aldersberg have to say, for instance when they meet in the swamp cemetary in chapter 5. But I've read up and spoilered myself already a bit and I know that I would rather eat my foot than do a merry "hunt some squirrel tails" race with that psychopath Rayla, amongst other things. I guess I could do a "Scoiatel up until Gold Rush, then do a 180° turn and go with Siegfried" to at least avoid early ulcers at the sight of the gallows or dead dwarves/elves to minimize the anguish, but I am not sure that this would help all that much. I predict rage and futile attempts to try and kill green circled order guys in chapter 5 after psychopath told me what they did with Toruviel. And then another ragequit.


So. Would an Order playthrough be worth the mental torment? Am I missing some very interesting additional information? Is there some Order-oriented Let's Play somewhere on youtube?

 

[dragonbird]

If you feel that strongly about it, I think that the easiest way to "make" yourself to play Order is to view it as "Being friends with Siegfried", as he is a good guy. That tends to be more acceptable than "Supporting the Order" as a motive.

If it's not enough, then yes, there's plenty of Youtube videos. The main difference is that:

Spoiler

Siegfried survives and becomes the new head of the Order

Which, incidentally, gives additional content and options in TW2, if you're going on to that. For me, that's the strongest gaming reason (as opposed to role-play) for picking Order.

 

[Lytha]

Yes, I am aware of the slight change in TW2 at the start of Loc Muinne. Should only be noticeable if going with Iorveth, I think? There could also be an awkward chat with Iorveth about Yaevinn in Verden. ("I knew an elf named Yaevinn once. I butchered him, together with my Order buddies.")

What interests me would be any sort of Aldersberg / Siegfried interactions:

"Mwahaha, I fooled you all, including you, Siegfried! Look at My New Order!"
"Oh my goodness. He has turned my precious Order into a whorehouse. I shall join you, Geralt, and kill all the traitors and then I shall restore it!"

.... anything of that sort would be of interest to me. Let's Plays often skip the deep digging in the dialogue lines in favour for faster progression, so I think it might be difficult to find just what I am looking for.


Playing it as "my friend Siegfried asks for help, so he gets it" might somewhat work. Only that my good friend Zoltan got really upset really fast when I did Order path in that failed 1st and a half playthrough. It did hurt me to hurt him. And when my friend Siegfried asked me for help in the swamp of chapter 2, and I helped him and killed non humans, I felt really, really bad.

It does not help that I developed an unhealthy enthusiasm about killing Witchhunters and Order deserters in TW3/HoS, or that I am quite emotionally invested in the Iorveth/non humans path in TW2.


Hm... Curiosity vs. abnormally high amount of dislike of what I am curious about. So silly.

 

[dragonbird]

Only that my good friend Zoltan got really upset really fas

Yup. That *is* the problem.

I know how you feel. I've done every possible combination of choices in TW1 and TW2, but I had to really stretch to come up with "justifications" for some of them. The ones that I won't say out loud because I *know* they wouldn't stand up to any critical assessment.

I can't remember if there's an Aldersberg/Siegfied confrontation or not. Hopefully someone else will know.

 

[GuyNwah]

Jacques never interacted with Siegfried. As to Siegfried being a "good guy",

Spoiler

he asks you to lead a bloodbath at the Bank and gave the orders for the ambush at Murky Waters.

One of the dubious pleasures of siding with the Order is

Spoiler

the interaction of Siegfried with Rayla. Rayla's language is a little hard on Siegfried's ears.

The advantage of having sided with the Order is a little greater, though:

Spoiler

At the Kaedweni camp, the knight Tybalt will give you a gift, not attack you. And after you rescue Anais, Siegfried will look the other way when you decide not to take her to Radovid.

 

[Lytha]

@GuyNwah I'll respond to your spoiler tags without spoiler tags, since I think that we're in the spoiler section of the TW1 forum, if that is alright.

No interaction between Siegfried and Aldersberg is disappointing.

Rayla is a whole chapter in the book of reasons why I do not want to play TW1 on the Order's side. I actually cheered this time, when Yaevinn made her ready for the mutation experiments last evening. I actually thought that she was the reason for the situation's escalation in Murky Waters, didn't think our good friend Siegfried was involved there at all.

It's Siegfried who's all like "Hand that child over to us or die!" in Loc Muinne? I didn't even know that. Interesting. So I could kill him twice if I do a regular, non-Order TW1 and import it into TW2 and actually play along with Roche? This gives me some ideas that might be better left unsaid, but that are obvious, given my enthusiasm about how to interact with Witchhunters and ex-Orders people in TW3.

I do not think that I could stomach a full "these are really not my choices at all"-run through the entire trilogy, so some minor dialogue additions for an Order-specific Roche-path are quite unlikely for me to witness. While I do not have these big issues with the Roche-path, I do tend to avoid that in TW2.


Something to ponder about some more.


When I did a TW3 "path of total destruction, everything goes wrong" playthrough, I was somewhat astonished that some things were actually not that bad at all. But I think in TW1, I would get just what I expect. No idea if I could do that at all. Some things are too icky to put out of my mind with the "it's just a game" argument.

 

[GuyNwah]

Since we're posting spoilers openly: If you talk to Rayla before leaving Murky Waters, she will tell you that the order for the ambush came directly from Siegfried. Not that she would have held her troops back unless the Scoia'tael had surrendered. But she had promised she would not act before Geralt returned, and she is rather upset at having been overruled. Even without her backstory, she's one of two "did I really go to bed with her" characters.

No, you don't get to kill Siegfried twice; only if you side with the Order is he in command at Loc Muinne. And then you can talk him out of taking Anais, or fight him.

I did a full "Geralt the heel" run through TW1 once. It was pretty off-putting. Many of Geralt's self-justifications for his conduct are less than courageous.

 

[Lytha]

"Geralt the heel" would be your personal version of how I attempted my 1.5th playthrough?"That is not what I would ever chose to do or to say, so let's see what happens?"

I missed that part about Siegfried in my chat with Rayla both times then. But maybe that was because I was too deep in with the Scoiatel both times? Or I was just inattentive. I thought I had gone through all her dialogue options though.


Hm. So it seems that if not trying the opposite path of my preference, I would be missing some vaguely interesting things, but also many things that put other people in a quite bad mood when they did it, too. Curious that TW1 apparently excels at causing emotional responses, maybe even more so than TW2 or TW3 did.

Still not sure if I'd want to go for a 2.5th attempt that would probably end because I just couldn't bear it again. Time will tell.


Thanks for the feedback and input!



By the way, it is weird that both of you seem to be in the "not Order" camp for TW1. I read an early thread in this forum about "Order or Squirrels" while I was still lurking but already witchering, and it seemed to be more of a 50:50 split, if not even a small majority in favour of the Order. That thread was way before TW2, so people lacked more information, maybe. Or maybe the topic of this thread drives the more Order-friendly readers instantly away (in addition to the forum not being very frequently visited anymore, I know.)

 

[Ortwyn]

So, the one I am currently doing is "Scoiatel up until end of chapter 4; then neutral."

If you want to go neutral, I suggest to go for Order in the bank and then become neutral. It is very important to do "Six feet under" quest for Siegfried as this one is the most anti-Scoiatael quest in TW1. Leaving the civilians including women and children at the mercy of the ghouls - even the Order must try hard to do something equally despicable.

I usually go to the bank without Siegfried and Yaevinn threatens me that if I do not hep him, I will become his arch-enemy. It is not so difficult to reject him just after the Six feet under...

Personally, I find it more difficult to choose Rayla over Toruviel in Chapter 4. I am just playing this chapter and even though I want to continue with TW2 and see Siegfried in Loc Muinne, I am not sure I can do it.

I usually end up as neutral, Zoltan is not sad and it has a proper witcher feeling. Then in the hospital you kill both the Order and Scoiatael soldiers who explicitly show that all of them are low and despicable murderers.

 

[Lytha]

Six Feet Under I would always do. By delaying the banquet for a while, it's possible to do both quests.

I was honestly very surprised that Siegfried seemed to be the most happy if I saved the civilians. I had expected some scorn for letting the "terrorists" go.


So far, I would be curious if it's always Triss who shows the neutral Geralt the entrance of the mansion. Or if that happened because I had a slightly higher score on her scale than I had with Shani (all because of Alvin, apparently). Shani's AI seemed to be in "follow mode" whenever I entered the Druid cave, so I had expected her at the mansion. But that did not happen.

Maybe I will go for another attempt at "everything goes wrong": a dead Abigail, longer active Coleman, handing over Yaevinn's letter to the authorities than to Vivaldi, killing Vincent, another attempt at a variation of "Kalkstein or Ramsmeat must be guilty!", helping Julian instead of Lady of the Lake (because Julian is a human! Kill the fishpeople!), dead Adda, and so on. It will be hard to stomach once more.

But I am so awfully curious....

 

[GuyNwah]

It is always the case: Neutral - Triss at the manor, Scoia'tael - Yaevinn, Order - Siegfried. The entrances they use will also differ. The ending cutscene is affected the same way: the faction that these allies represent (Triss - sorceresses) is the one that is promoted in the cutscene.

In the Ice Plains, it is different: either Triss or Shani will accompany you, depending on who you chose.