thank you for your quick response, too bad for me, so this game is not for me, good day
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He is talking about level-gating areas. There was info that the game wouldn't feature level-scaling. This + the fact that there are character levels basically says that certain areas are near impossible to access at the start of the game due to high level of the enemies. Not only is this immersionbreaking af, but also goes against free exploration. CDPR is going mainstream in a bad way, I'm afraid. I will be bringing this topic up constantly the upcoming year. And probably write a wall of text when I have time to explain why this is bad.
ps. Of course, level-scaling is not an answer since its basically same as not having levels AT ALL since all combat is going to be equally difficult at all times.
I am REALLY torn at these news and half of my enthusiasm is gone. Why can't devs simply go for a level-less system? All the benefits, none of the cons, all the same character progression?
In the demo, the point is not "gating" things. Its to show that a different build of V (strength-enhanced cyborg) can open a route that a squishy hacker-V cannot. Different ways to build a character allow different solutions to problems. In the demo the devs kept switching between different character builds (with dev tools) to showcase this. This is awesome in its own way.
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The two designs are mutually exclusive to a great degree.
CDPR, I feel we can agree, has a knack for telling stories, and they lean on it. For crying out loud, they managed to tell a pretty good one for a card game.The crux is that if I intend to build an RPG that paces its dramatic action on a story (as opposed to pacing its dramatic action on emergent, sandbox gameplay)...then I need to build the RPG mechanics to work hand-in-hand with the story.
That means gating.
I completely disagree. You can have good narrative in an open world setting. All that is necessary is that you spawn the characters involved in the narrative ONLY WHEN it is time for that narrative. Example: Old spiderman games and GTA5. The world in both was entirely open and you could go anywhere at the very start. When its time for the story elements, they appear in the world where they weren't before.
This makes total sense immersion-wise btw, since its not like these characters EXIST SOLELY FOR THE PLAYER, is it? They got lives in-world, they do stuff elsewhere. They are not standing there, hands in their pockets, for 100 hours waiting for the player to grind his/her way thru the level-gated areas like this is the 90s or something. GTA even goes the extra mile in some cases by having the characters spawn at their homes and drive a car to the rendezvous.
This approach does not only have the same kind of narrative you are pinning on CDPR, but a dynamic, lifelike world where things happen, appear, disappear, while you are not looking. Your approach is, Im afraid, old-fashioned. This is stark contrast to a static, level-gated world where nothing happens unless the player happens to stroll by.
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And just what makes anyone think CDPR isn't using this sort of system in CP2077?
We have insufficient info to know one way or the other at present.
I must say I view a classic approach to levels for a game like this with a few reservations. It implies "hard gates" and "unrealistic" scenarios of potentially a level 30 basic street thug or bum being stronger than a level 15 NCPD detective or Corpo black ops agent. Simple example that gets the point across.
It implies some areas might later turn into a shooting gallery if NPCs have a cap there while other areas will almost be locked out to you unless you are high enough in level.
Not sure how they will do it but on average I personally favor a slightly more scaling system or a hybrid version.
I will see in 10 months I guess, assuming no release delays.
It implies some areas might later turn into a shooting gallery if NPCs have a cap there while other areas will almost be locked out to you unless you are high enough in level.
Not sure how they will do it but on average I personally favor a slightly more scaling system or a hybrid version.
I will see in 10 months I guess, assuming no release delays.
Personally, I HATE any kind of level-syncing with a passion!
What's even the point of levelling up, of becoming stronger, faster, smarter, if all the enemies are being synced to you and thus you never ever actually feel stronger, faster, smarter?
To me, a great part of the fun is not having the story tell me that I'm now infnitely more powerful than I had ever been, only to still be forced to even deal with low level trash mobs -- the real fun, for me at least, is eventually finally becoming powerful enough so that I could destroy lesser enemies with the flick of a wrist.
There are other, far better ways of keeping the player engaged and challenged at their max level, other than just suddenly telling him that the low level trash mobs are all of a sudden capable of killing the player, thus negating the entire hard-earned progression.
What's even the point of levelling up, of becoming stronger, faster, smarter, if all the enemies are being synced to you and thus you never ever actually feel stronger, faster, smarter?
To me, a great part of the fun is not having the story tell me that I'm now infnitely more powerful than I had ever been, only to still be forced to even deal with low level trash mobs -- the real fun, for me at least, is eventually finally becoming powerful enough so that I could destroy lesser enemies with the flick of a wrist.
There are other, far better ways of keeping the player engaged and challenged at their max level, other than just suddenly telling him that the low level trash mobs are all of a sudden capable of killing the player, thus negating the entire hard-earned progression.
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I believe the term is "level scaling". It was said in the info that the journalists got that it didn't exist in CP2077. Yes, it is inherently bad because it destroys any feeling of actual progression.
I suppose having levels without scaling is a "lesser evil", but I still think that we should make do without either.
Merely improving individual attributes, skills, perks etc with XP would allow for a lesser difficulty incline (improving game balance), while giving the player lot to do (when he/she has to improve each stat and skill individually, instead of one all-encompassing character level).
Will the game be mod supported? Any chance for an Exotic dlc down the road? Will corps be these super tough enemies? How will the level system work? Am I going be barred off from content and gear because of my level. Honestly that was on of this things I hated about Witcher 3 and one reason why it the only Witcher game I have not finish.
Note I am not asking to be like Corps and know gang hide outs be near my level. No those need to be higher level. Yet basic enemy I find on the street shot not have some magic power spike like in Witcher 3. Where I walk across the fields and this level 5 wolf magicily becomes a level 25 wolf.
Enemies power levels should make sense. If they are in an organization then they have resources to make them self strong. Some lone wolf thug is not suddenly going go from using auto pistols to Military grade assault mech because I walk across a level line.
Though hopefully if they have mods support we can be like Skyrim and have modders improve the game.
Note I am not asking to be like Corps and know gang hide outs be near my level. No those need to be higher level. Yet basic enemy I find on the street shot not have some magic power spike like in Witcher 3. Where I walk across the fields and this level 5 wolf magicily becomes a level 25 wolf.
Enemies power levels should make sense. If they are in an organization then they have resources to make them self strong. Some lone wolf thug is not suddenly going go from using auto pistols to Military grade assault mech because I walk across a level line.
Though hopefully if they have mods support we can be like Skyrim and have modders improve the game.
ok. So their a possibility post launch that we might get mod support.
Hi lovely humans from CDPR
I was wondering, Is the gun play still in early phase of development? because from what i've seen so far the gun play is for sure the weakest part of the game from gameplay demos that you guys already presented to us... and also becasue it's one of the main pillars of FPS games i want you guys to get it right
I have already pre ordered the game and cant wait to get my hands on it
LOVE YOU
I was wondering, Is the gun play still in early phase of development? because from what i've seen so far the gun play is for sure the weakest part of the game from gameplay demos that you guys already presented to us... and also becasue it's one of the main pillars of FPS games i want you guys to get it right
I have already pre ordered the game and cant wait to get my hands on it
LOVE YOU
It's not. But this take is a bit diversionary. It does have FPS combat. So let's do it right. I could name maybe four things that would have made TW3 combat superb, despite it not being a 'hack and slash' focused game. They were so close. They don't have to be Fallout 3 here. They can do something that melds great action combat with RPG stats.
Sure, but it's not a priority in terms of game design. Heck, you might do minimal to no shooting in the game.
Fallout 4 shooting combat was fine, for example.
Also I loved TW3 combat. It may not have been perfect, but it was a lot of fun. Only looks weak compared to the rest of the perfection.
Heh, well... it *is* an FPS game, technically, to play devil's advocate, as you do run around in 1st person and you do shoot weapons doing it.
But it's obviously important to point out that it's not an "FPS" in the sense of Call of Duty or Doom... it's an RPG taking place almost entirely in 1st person, where you also happen to be able to shoot guns.
What if you never shoot someone. Is it a FPCBS?
First Person Could Be Shooter?
Do we have FPH?
FPW?
FPMB?
No, that would just be called F"Grow a pair, sissy" game... :lol:
SCNR.
Either way, no matter the semantics, there is one thing 2077 is most definitely going to be:
GLORIOUS!
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