Don't take streamers predictions on card changes very seriously

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This isn't a knock on streamers. I like to watch their videos. I've just noticed over the years that streamers tend to make big claims about how good a card is going to be and a lot of the time they are way off. I first noticed this watching Swim talk about card changes. I would remember him saying a card would be bad and then it turns out to be really good and I was a bit surprised since one might think that a very high level player wouldn't be so far off.

Here is the latest one that I noticed. Here is Pumpkn talking about Koranthi Heatwave before the patch. I had thought that heatwave looked pretty strong. I listened to his prediction and wasn't sure what to think. He kind of threw water on my initial hype for this buff. Then during this season I was looking through my deck and thinking I should switch out one of my high provision cards to combat the meta. I decided heatwave would be a more flexible counter card that would fit my deck well. I put this card in my deck completely on my own without having heard anyone say a single good thing about it. I was very happy with the results of this card and thought about what pumpkn had said about it. It's just a reminder to try cards out yourself. Don't just listen to streamers.


I then heard Pumpkn say this on commanders horn and thought it was kind of funny. BTW I'll say again that I am a fan of Pumpkn. He is a really good player.

 

Payus

Forum regular
I don't know about you but I have my own opinion. If someone says "x card is good or bad" it matters not. The explanation of why the card is good or bad is the important bit.

And yes, even pros have flawed reasoning. They just can't judge accurately without a meta developed. Nobody can really know, but they try.
 

rrc

Forum veteran
@StrykerxS77x Pumpkn didn't change his opinion, right? Even in his original observation, he said almost the same thing he said in the next video. That, it is still costly for a tall removal tool and that it would see more play than before and that if SK becomes too dominant, it can be used to banish certain cards. Also, the context of the Commander's Horn is, what would people bring for the tournament, and he was saying that people will bring tall removal and destructive tools and Heatwave is good against SK, MO, NG, and SY.

He is not being hypocritical and he didn't say something exactly opposite of what he said first. It is the same thing and the second statement is on a different context. I am sorry, but I am HUGE FAN of Pumpkn (for obvious reasons, one, he is THE best Gwent player and also because he is the Master of ST. Even when ST is in its shittiest state, he would still play ST and win games consistently) and these two references show him in a wrong unjustified spot.

When Phillipa was introduced, SirPumpkn said it would see huge play and FreddyBabes said it is a meh card and that it is too costly that it would rarely see play. Exact opposite statements. Then in the stream people asked Pumpkn about Freddy's opinion and he was still confident that Phillipa would be nuts and in almost every single SY deck.

I am not saying his guess and judgement will never err. There may be cases in which he might have accessed a card wrongly. But here, he hasn't. Or more importantly he didn't change his opinion in those two videos.
 
@StrykerxS77x Pumpkn didn't change his opinion, right? Even in his original observation, he said almost the same thing he said in the next video. That, it is still costly for a tall removal tool and that it would see more play than before and that if SK becomes too dominant, it can be used to banish certain cards. Also, the context of the Commander's Horn is, what would people bring for the tournament, and he was saying that people will bring tall removal and destructive tools and Heatwave is good against SK, MO, NG, and SY.

He is not being hypocritical and he didn't say something exactly opposite of what he said first. It is the same thing and the second statement is on a different context. I am sorry, but I am HUGE FAN of Pumpkn (for obvious reasons, one, he is THE best Gwent player and also because he is the Master of ST. Even when ST is in its shittiest state, he would still play ST and win games consistently) and these two references show him in a wrong unjustified spot.

When Phillipa was introduced, SirPumpkn said it would see huge play and FreddyBabes said it is a meh card and that it is too costly that it would rarely see play. Exact opposite statements. Then in the stream people asked Pumpkn about Freddy's opinion and he was still confident that Phillipa would be nuts and in almost every single SY deck.

I am not saying his guess and judgement will never err. There may be cases in which he might have accessed a card wrongly. But here, he hasn't. Or more importantly he didn't change his opinion in those two videos.

I never said anything about being hypocritical. His initial opinion of the card was just not correct. Again that isn't a knock on him or anything. He's a fantastic player.

His prediction of the card was negative and now the card has shown to be very strong and he only had positive things to say about it.

Also I messed up and didn't include all of his new comments on heatwave. Here watch this part

"I love the card, it's so powerful"
 
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rrc

Forum veteran
I never said anything about being hypocritical. His initial opinion of the card was just not correct. Again that isn't a knock on him or anything. He's a fantastic player.

His prediction of the card was negative and now the card has shown to be very strong and he only had positive things to say about it.

Also I messed up and didn't include all of his new comments on heatwave. Here watch this part

"I love the card, it's so powerful"
His initial opinion about the card is not completely wrong. He said it would see more play than before, but still it is costly. He didn't say it is garbage and no one would use it. In the second video he was telling in the context of Challenger, what would player bring. The decks for challenger (or any tournament) is very very different than meta decks (I hope you know this).

In the latest clip (location) you sent, yes, he says he runs Heatwave and says it is powerful. That is in the context of comparison to Muzzle and the provision in comparison to Muzzle. There is a change in his tone about the card, but I still think it is unfair to put those clips and kind of indicating he was completely wrong and he had changed his opinion completely.

[If you really wanted to create a post indicating Pumpkn was wrong in his opinion, you could have linked to the time in which he sees the buff to Dana (16P) and saying something like "who cares? she still sucks" and in the second video he saying Dana is good :p;). But don't do that. Pumpkn is awesome.]
 
His initial opinion about the card is not completely wrong. He said it would see more play than before, but still it is costly. He didn't say it is garbage and no one would use it. In the second video he was telling in the context of Challenger, what would player bring. The decks for challenger (or any tournament) is very very different than meta decks (I hope you know this).

In the latest clip (location) you sent, yes, he says he runs Heatwave and says it is powerful. That is in the context of comparison to Muzzle and the provision in comparison to Muzzle. There is a change in his tone about the card, but I still think it is unfair to put those clips and kind of indicating he was completely wrong and he had changed his opinion completely.

[If you really wanted to create a post indicating Pumpkn was wrong in his opinion, you could have linked to the time in which he sees the buff to Dana (16P) and saying something like "who cares? she still sucks" and in the second video he saying Dana is good :p;). But don't do that. Pumpkn is awesome.]

Well it sounds like you agree with my overall point about streamers being wrong on predictions a lot of times, and that Pumpkn is awesome. I do still think it's very clear that he thought the card was bad and now thinks the card is very good. It's very clear.
 
Pumpkin sounds like a mouse.
Mr Swim didn't predict his own departure from the game...actually my favourite deck any youtuber made was his. The Ocvist(strengthen) deck. Great fun. Bit of an "All in" player that one. But at least it's fun!
 
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