FPP only cutscenes might be a deal-breaker for me

[Thanatoskaras]

Because they create a new type dialogue system no one has ever done before.

In 2018 demo,if you move your camera look at the spider robot ，a new dialogue will add，it's about the spider robot，you can choose that.

When I ask devs，they also make a example,you and me are talking ,if you look down at my shoe, it's a Nike,you get the information of the shoes ,then a new dialogue about the shoes will add,"you like Nike?",then you will have advantage in the talking.

This also in the 2019 demo,but it's not abotut item ,it's about people ,when you talk to Placide ,a man break in the room and talk to Placide very hurry. if you look at him,you you will have a dialogue like "you can continue talk,I can wait"

So other rpg's dialogue system is you choose a dialogue,then your character say something or do something.but in cyberpunk 2077,they add a new type of dialogue, you interact with environment（look at items，NPCs），then you will get new dialogue or change your dialogue options already have.

Of course FPP is fit the dialogue system perfectly，because in TPP，you own character will cover you view，like look down at NPC‘s shoes ，you probably only see your back side of head ，you need to adjustment your camera to see his shoes.

 

[Itsdacisco]

Just a point of clarification, arent the missions from the E3 2018 gameplay trailer and the mission V and Jackie screwed the pooch on in the 2019 CGI trailer two different missions? I thought the goal of the mission in the 2018 trailer was to acquire the spider-bot while in the 2019 trailer, it was the chip? Plus, the individuals shooting at V in the 2019 trailer don't look to be the gang from the 2018 trailer, and the building V and Jackie are running from in the latest trailer doesn't look to be the same as the one from the previous trailer, either. I think the chip mission is a different job that comes after the spider-bot one.

You are correct! I speak after only i've done the research and this one I got the research wrong. My apologies.

 

[Gaijin01]

So I'm guess'n, at this point, that all the BS that the company was putting out about how much
it cares about it's TPS Fans and their business was just alot of BS.

And...truth is, when one of your main selling points is "Customization": Clothes, Skin, Hair and Eye Color, etc., etc...it's a given that you'd want to see it. That makes sense.

And now they're yanking all the 3rd Person Views out and using "immersion" as the excuse.
I think, these guys don't have the talent to pull off the kind of game they bragged about...
A case of a crocodile mouth writing a check a humming bird ass can't cash.

If the only things I'm going to see during the whole F'n game are my hands?
Then you guys better have the Glove, Rings and Nail Polish system from Hell.

I've mulled it over. I'm not buying your game.
Too Bad.....Poopoo

 

[Rasuka]

That most of the game will be in FPP was clear after the E3 presentation last year.
Especially scenes that can be influenced by different answers.
But it's not about these scenes, it's about scenes like the ones in the elevator, scenes the player can't influence.
And I don't see how in this scene a change from TPP to FPP is a win for the game.

 

[kirell]

That most of the game will be in FPP was clear after the E3 presentation last year.
Especially scenes that can be influenced by different answers.
But it's not about these scenes, it's about scenes like the ones in the elevator, scenes the player can't influence.
And I don't see how in this scene a change from TPP to FPP is a win for the game.

Well, i can easily imagine the banter in the elevator in first person, maybe even with some influence by the player setting the tone & general direction of the mission. Kinda whether V wants to act super professional, or joke around, or tell him to keep casualties at a minimum etc. I imagine the elevator scene is like the trailer with dex betrayal: One way it can go - in the actual game you get options.

Same for the scene in the appartement. Not fixed preset about whom V had in her appartement, maybe decide whether she throws him out, have breakfast, how she starts the day, which music is actually on the radio & whether its on. The scene has a movie intro feel: "and now we join V after her last successful run" and only later jump in to being V. But in the actual game, you would be able decide yourself how you want to celebrate, whom to have over (if any)... There would be no switch to "no influence" cutscenes...

 

[-Naver-]

Well, i can easily imagine the banter in the elevator in first person, maybe even with some influence by the player setting the tone & general direction of the mission. Kinda whether V wants to act super professional, or joke around, or tell him to keep casualties at a minimum etc. I imagine the elevator scene is like the trailer with dex betrayal: One way it can go - in the actual game you get options.

Same for the scene in the appartement. Not fixed preset about whom V had in her appartement, maybe decide whether she throws him out, have breakfast, how she starts the day, which music is actually on the radio & whether its on. The scene has a movie intro feel: "and now we join V after her last successful run" and only later jump in to being V. But in the actual game, you would be able decide yourself how you want to celebrate, whom to have over (if any)... There would be no switch to "no influence" cutscenes...

I can imagine those aforementioned scenes in FPP too, but i don't think they'll be better because of it. It's all very subjective, but it sounds rather boring. And it's not like all the stuff you mentioned would be impossible to do in TPP, it just takes more work.

But it's pointless to argue, CDPR won't and can't change their stance on this now.
I would've prefered TPP in Cyberpunk(apart from motion sickness problems) because, I don't want to be V. I want to experience V's story, but I don't imagine myself being V. They're their own person whose story i plan play and shape. FPP gives such a feeling of self-insert, which i dislike. And as I don't particularly share any fascination with body modification (e.g.), I remain very skeptical.

I just hope the game will be interesting enough that I'll be able to overlook it being FPP.

 

[imitenotbecrazy]

True artists must go their own way. They cannot listen to Internet outrage. If every artist throughout history bent to social pressure we'd have a grey and boring world indeed.

Let's trust CDPR and give them the opportunity to prove us wrong.

I'm not one to buy into the "trust CDPR" phrase I see a lot on the forums and their fb page but I do think this was a good route to go. Different games of course but I think FPP gameplay and cutscenes works really well with the Far Cry series. I've never liked FPP games that switch to TPP for a cutscene. I may be in the minority there but it breaks the experience for me

Post automatically merged: Sep 13, 2019

Because they create a new type dialogue system no one has ever done before.

In 2018 demo,if you move your camera look at the spider robot ，a new dialogue will add，it's about the spider robot，you can choose that.

When I ask devs，they also make a example,you and me are talking ,if you look down at my shoe, it's a Nike,you get the information of the shoes ,then a new dialogue about the shoes will add,"you like Nike?",then you will have advantage in the talking.

This also in the 2019 demo,but it's not abotut item ,it's about people ,when you talk to Placide ,a man break in the room and talk to Placide very hurry. if you look at him,you you will have a dialogue like "you can continue talk,I can wait"

So other rpg's dialogue system is you choose a dialogue,then your character say something or do something.but in cyberpunk 2077,they add a new type of dialogue, you interact with environment（look at items，NPCs），then you will get new dialogue or change your dialogue options already have.

Of course FPP is fit the dialogue system perfectly，because in TPP，you own character will cover you view，like look down at NPC‘s shoes ，you probably only see your back side of head ，you need to adjustment your camera to see his shoes.

Not new, contextual dialogue scenes have been done before. Definitely a good use case for FPP dialogue scenes though

 

[BooteeSpooter]

I definitely like where they're going with this. I think it'd be smart for them to add a 3rd person perspective cybermod of some kind. Like buying a set of eyes that would give you the option to put you in 3rd person.

EDIT: To clarify, a set of eyes that float behind and above you. Something simulating 3rd person mode but still staying authentic to the whole "Immersion" while catering to player wants.

 

[fuse00]

"It's immersive" = "we've spent too much money on Keanu Reeves and now we're out of budget to make animations and models for 3rd person cut scenes"

Post automatically merged: Sep 13, 2019

Btw as far as I can see they keep TP for driving. If they insist that 3rd person camera is not immersive enough and 1st person allows us to associate ourselves with our character, then who we should make associations with while we driving? With a flying drone?

 

[evilhippo]

Just do whatever you want CD.

Our voices won’t be heard anyways.

The way 'our' voices get heard is not via forums or social media, it is by how many people purchase or do not purchase the game. All the rest, like this post I am making, is just background street noise. I actually cancelled my pre-order because I dislike the way the game seems to be going, with FPP cut scenes being the final straw.

I might buy the game at a discount long after release if modders make it more to my spec, but frankly I am already looking for the next thing from someone else. I just make the occasional remark here only because I liked Witcher 3 so much.

 

[Syware]

I don't mind this

Its good when you need to zoom on the little details in this game using player owned optic scanner.

Also, something that came across my mind while typing this, I wonder if we will be able to zoom while in a cutscene. I think I saw this in a trailer but I'm not sure.

 

[Guest 3573786]

The way 'our' voices get heard is not via forums or social media, it is by how many people purchase or do not purchase the game.

How exactly does that work? Not only is then too late to fix anything but cdpr wont know what the reason of a lost sale is. From what I can tell, the only way to provide feedback is over twitter and maybe reddit or something, where mods arent making it difficult to have any sort of back and forth.

 

[Erect_Cactus]

"It's immersive" = "we've spent too much money on Keanu Reeves and now we're out of budget to make animations and models for 3rd person cut scenes"

Personally I’m all for FPP exclusive game but I agree that hiring a celebrity takes valueable and finite finances and is basically throwing it down the drain. I love Reeves in his most popular roles but I can’t see him as anyone other than himself in a game. He’s certainly no Daniel Day Lewis.

 

[Bloodartist]

Also, something that came across my mind while typing this, I wonder if we will be able to zoom while in a cutscene. I think I saw this in a trailer but I'm not sure.

Considering Kiroshi cybernetic eyes are confirmed to be one of the couple "obligatory" augments (so we can see Johnny), I'd assume zooming depends on how they are upgraded.

 

[Nefla]

I haven't ever tried modern VR but maybe this game will be awesome in that. Sadly if it's just on a tv or computer screen it's not "immersive" to me at all to be staring at some disembodied hands and hear a voice out of nowhere. I don't really understand how people can think FPP is "immersive" since to me it's jarring and distracting and takes away from the story, characters, and interactions. Do fans of this play in the dark so they can't see their own real hands (and legs and keyboard and whatever else) clearly not connected to the ones on the screen? "Floating hands" is not a character and I can't become attached to it or concerned for it or care about what happens to it. Why is "immersion" constantly thrown out there as if it's a given?

 

[atomowyturysta]

There were discussions, here and there, about FPP/TPP (stopped following them beacuse last thing in life I need is a chemotherapy...) And a lot of people favoured the FPP because "Immersion". A lot of those people now hating CP2077 because their wishes came through...

 

[Bloodartist]

And a lot of people favoured the FPP because "Immersion". A lot of those people now hating CP2077 because their wishes came through...

No. There were always two camps of players. CDPR decided on their own to make the game focus on FPP. The other camp has been against this always.

I personally am in the third person camp.

 

[evilhippo]

How exactly does that work? Not only is then too late to fix anything but cdpr wont know what the reason of a lost sale is. From what I can tell, the only way to provide feedback is over twitter and maybe reddit or something, where mods arent making it difficult to have any sort of back and forth.

Because most requests for 'feedback' are PR, to put it bluntly. Not all, but most. It is an illusion of customer influence & engagement. Many people were either neutral or supportive of CP2077 going FPP, but face it, that decision also caused a great deal of negative push back in the forum & vastly more on un-moderated third party social media. Yet far from adding a TPP option, CDPR decided to double down & even eliminate TPP from cut-scenes.

Well, that is their prerogative as it is their time and money being expended. It is a creative decision (a very bad one in my view, but whatever), married to a business decision (that going FPP all-the-way will not seriously diminish a lot of people's willingness to buy the game).

I cancelled my pre-order (not purely on the basis of the FPP even-in-cut-scenes issue, but it was the final straw). But for all I know, CDPR may be correct and the majority of people who dislike FPP-only will nevertheless still purchase the game. Not true for me, but I am just one person.

And I might indeed eventually buy the game, probably long after release & much discounted, but only if someone mods the hell out of CP2077 to make it more to my spec. I am not cost sensitive at all, so it is not about money for me, but I value the quality of my game playing hours.

Only time will tell if I am representative or CDPR can safely ignore folks like me, but it does indicate the influence of non-monetary feedback is much overrated.

 

[JMB96815]

I'll just share an anecdotal story that by no means should be read as anything beyond only what is being described, but this did really happen recently -- I was on a very busy livestream for another announced game, and there were probably about 20ishk people on there at the time. Cyberpunk came up and I was genuinely shocked at how many people were trashing the game because of both all FPP and no TPP cutscenes. It was pretty pervasive and it wasn't by just a select minority of people but quite a bit of people. Granted, these might not the target audience of CP2077 and it could even be anomalous to that specific situation, but I was genuinely shocked how aggressive this stream was against the game and how many people were as a third prong joking about "V on mirrors" TPP and the fourth prong I was seeing a lot too was about how terrible the dev reveal was with them sitting around, etc. I'm pretty open minded about FPP and like it for gunplay, but I worry the FPP won't' really show V's actual body all the time 100% of the time and you will be stuck with invisible head with no torso, legs, feet, etc all the time.

 

[kofeiiniturpa]

you will be stuck with invisible head with no torso, legs, feet, etc

I think they’ve already confirmed you can see V’s body when you look down.

And anyways, people tend to complain about vanity features more than the actual substance. I wouldn’t pay too much attention to it. I’d echo the choir if it had anything to do with how the game works mechanically, but since it’s mostly about what’s on the screen in detail... meh.