It was about the "niche market part" which can say it's too costly to do, when for some kind of VR adaptation in the end the only things you have to do is add headtracking and disable automated head movement during kinematics.
It was about the "niche market part" which can say it's too costly to do, when for some kind of VR adaptation in the end the only things you have to do is add headtracking and disable automated head movement during kinematics.
That's not what you quoted. And in general, you're trying to disprove a point I never made.
----------
The thread already started to become a general discussion about VR, rather than the question of whether Cyberpunk 2077 should have VR, so merged with an older thread. Incidentally, the same thing happened with said older thread, hence Community.
(The new, merged thread's poll is still intact, as you can see.)
That's a good part of it.
There's also cost and the fact that many ... most ??? game types aren't suited to 3D.
I play a LOT of tactical/strategic simulation games and VR would add absolutely nothing to them. It's GREAT for shooters, but totally worthless when you're game is about producing divisions and fighting on the Russian Front. There's also the whole motion sickness and eye strain issue, can you (the player) spend more then an hour or two at a time in VR? This makes the Classic WoW 40-man raid virtually (
) impossible as it takes 4+ hours to accomplish.Sorry to say this but VR will ALWAYS be a niche market, probably a larger niche then it currently is, but still niche.
That's a good part of it.
There's also cost and the fact that many ... most ??? game types aren't suited to 3D.
I play a LOT of tactical/strategic simulation games and VR would add absolutely nothing to them. It's GREAT for shooters, but totally worthless when you're game is about producing divisions and fighting on the Russian Front. There's also the whole motion sickness and eye strain issue, can you (the player) spend more then an hour or two at a time in VR? This makes the Classic WoW 40-man raid virtually (
Sorry to say this but VR will ALWAYS be a niche market, probably a larger niche then it currently is, but still niche.
I don't agree with this at all. I'm very fond of tactical/strategic simulation games as well. I'm also fond of a large variety of board games and card games. All would benefit in VR. Even if you could play all the above with people in person watching the games come to life is thrilling. Take the TV series Yu-Gi-Oh watching the cards come to life excited kids everywhere if you could take your cards and play them in VR you'd get a similar experience. It's all very exciting.
That's a good part of it.
There's also cost and the fact that many ... most ??? game types aren't suited to 3D.
I play a LOT of tactical/strategic simulation games and VR would add absolutely nothing to them. It's GREAT for shooters, but totally worthless when you're game is about producing divisions and fighting on the Russian Front. There's also the whole motion sickness and eye strain issue, can you (the player) spend more then an hour or two at a time in VR? This makes the Classic WoW 40-man raid virtually (
Sorry to say this but VR will ALWAYS be a niche market, probably a larger niche then it currently is, but still niche.
We will have to agree to disagree but I do love healthy discussions.
I cannot disagree with "VR sickness" it is a real thing, my first experience was a 4 hour migraine, but it is also something you can gain a tolerance to the longer you spend inside virtual, ultimately prolonging your stay. 4 hours in VR is a breeze now.
The tech being implemented in the next gen VR systems are incredible. Wireless headsets, augmented reality, ray tracing, eye tracking and haptic feedback come readily to mind. Most gamers AND designers talk about a more immersive experience. How much more immersive could it get than virtual reality or augmented reality? If you've ever been driving or flying in VR and a breeze hits your skin, it adds tons more depth and realism. There is a huge difference between playing a game and being inside the game, ask any VR user.
Time is the biggest foe.
Who will be the first to build a VR specific server and build or sell cyberspace inside the program?
How long before VR is so immersive we wont be able to tell the difference between being jacked in or not?
How much will the majority of people be willing to pay for it? Personally, I spend a good chunk of money on entertainment. I've been hooked on gaming since atari 2600 and cant imagine the small fortune I've invested in gaming over the decades.
The future possibilities for VR are limitless!
Creation of a personal avatar
Gaming
Any and all kinds of training. Driving, flying, building, fighting...you get the idea
Education/school
Shopping, trying on clothes before you buy them
These are just a few....what do you think?
Exactly.
Also, you mentioned quite a few uses for VR and that's not even taking into account socialising or the more, ahem, 'adult' activities that future tech could bring.
This VR negativity is an age-old thing that is quite often, though not exclusively, linked to 'senior' people. Some used to slag off TV compared to radio, then colour TV compared to black and white. There were those who used to say video games were a fad, a niche hobby or would only ever be for children.
VR, in its many forms, is only going to snowball and gain momentum, even if its real popularity and true potential is only achieved in generations to come. It's just a natural progression in our attempts to experience as many things as possible, especially from the comfort of our homes
Post automatically merged:
And? Sorry if this sounds abrupt but, with all due respect, that's completely irrelevant. I don't think anyone here is suggesting VR will/should be the future for all game genres, nor do I think it needs to be.
Yes, it is, and shooters are very popular, as are competitive shooters. VR is also great for flight sims (space or otherwise), horror, stealth, adventure/RPG, drving and, well, any game where being 'in' the world and immersed enhances the experience.
Yes I can, as can my friends and some of my family. People can actually get their 'VR legs' in the same way people get used to being at sea, not to mention not all games or movement methods induce it. Besides, motion sickness is an issue they are constantly working on, VR is still in its infancy and will remain there for a long time, imho.
Nah. It might be a niche market for many decades to come but it's just a question of time before it's common place.
I loved video games as a child because it was 'better' than simply watching the TV. I love VR because being 'in' the game is an entirely different experience to looking at a flat screen. They'll always be a place for games as we know them now, just like we still love and play board games of old. However, in the future VR will be something people look back on and say, just like we do with video games now, 'Can you believe some people thought it wouldn't catch on?'.
I'm happy to agree to disagree though, especially as the definitive answer is probably due late this century
Last edited:
It was an example of the tyes of games where VR would add nothing to them.
Some people are.
As with anything it's a matter of individual taste/perspective. VR doesn't automatically make the game world "more immersive" as many claim.
Having spent a few years at sea I can assure you there are people that NEVER get their "sea legs" and need to be transferred to shore duty. Are they a minority, yes, but please let's avoid sweeping claims.
Until they can invent Star Treks halo deck it'll remain niche because many people don't want to be roped to their console/PC by wires. Or be blind to the outside world while wearing a headset. Or can afford to spend more on a VR rig then their console cost.
Will VR become more common?
DEFINITELY.
But look at audio and videopad books ... have they replaced paper? No. Will they? No.
Same here!
See the above reply on this subject.
All these are GREAT innovations, but they all come at a cost, in many cases a very steep one in terms of price and performance. The computer illiterate (i.e. 95% of people) have no clue what all these wonderful things require for implementation.
Computers can do everything instantly ... right?
*ROFL*
I suppose you could hook a dozen or so supercomputers together today and create a VR MMO. Should only cost the players a few hundred an hour to play on it.
Probably never.
We have multiple senses besides the 5 most people think of. A sense of balance (the cause of VR sickness). A sense of motion that we have no way at all to replicate outside of real motion. A sense of gravity, or lack thereof. The VERY real sense of knowing where your various body parts are in relation to each other (why we can close out eyes and still touch our nose with our finger ... if we're not drunk/high). Etc. etc. etc.
Most people not that much. No more then say 10-25% of their monthly income.
The like the people that buy a Ferrari, Porsche, or Rolls Royce you can ... and should definitely be able to ... enjoy something us mere mortals can only dream about.
Yeah ... so was the paperless office we heard so much about a couple decades ago.
And the airplane was going to make ground cars obsolete.
Let's not forget the A Bomb making war a thing of the past!
I think VR has some excellent and damn useful applications.
I don't expect it to have the same effect say electricity, radio, internal combustion engines, and a host of other things did in transforming life and society as we know it.
Last edited:
@Suhiira Many of your quotes have my name associated with it and those aren't my quotes.
Well, a minority not being able to develop VR-legs (assuming they don't manage to eliminate motion sickness, which is doubtful) wouldn't stop VR from being more than niche - which is the point of my writing. Speaking of which, it was the somewhat sweeping statement that 'VR will ALWAYS be niche' that prompted me to reply in the first place
Again, this is an opinion based on current tech. Wires won't always be there. I think there's already a wireless headset from Oculus. The price? Again, that'll change over time. These issues are irrelevant when discussing whether VR will ever be something more than niche in the future. In a funny way, the fact you even mention the holo-deck shows that you understand the potential/desire for 'being in' the game world.
I'm not arguing for VR to replace anything. I'm simply saying that, probably far off in the future, people with VR headsets will be commonplace and not at all niche.
Given the myriad ways people interpret that word, I'm not even gonna go there
I would say though, by way of a small example, that I had some of my older family members, who don't give a crap about gaming, give VR a try. Previously, I'd made them play a horror game or too with little effect. That all changes in VR though.....oh, the delicious cries of fear The point I'm making is that VR offers such a unique experience that there's no way it'll remain niche and suggestions that it will, based on current tech/issues, are shortsighted, imho. Again though, I'm not suggesting VR will reach maturity anytime soon.
If someone says they don't like VR, I'm fine with that. If they say VR will remain niche if it can't improve and stays as is, then I agree. If they say that VR will not replace all gaming genres then I agree with that too, in fact, I not only agree but I sincerely hope it won't.
However, I strongly disagree and cannot understand anyone saying VR will always remain niche when the potential is just so huge. Even a fairly bog-standard game can be elevated to far greater heights just through VR. Arizona Sunshine for example; a game that probably wouldn't interest someone for more than 10 minutes in traditional form suddenly becomes a game they play for hours. Horror games reach an entirely new level. Walking through a forest or along mountain path become totally different experiences.
Some would say that the first true 'AAA' game will arrive shortly, in the form of Half-Life: Alyx. It'll be interesting to see what they've achieved but even so, it's worth remembering that VR is still in its infancy.
Last edited:
My apologies ... blame it on the forum's quote system!
OR ... my own stupidity.
Actually there is a wireless VR console. It's called Oculus Quest. I literally ordered one a few days ago. It costs about $500 so it's not outside of the price range for your average person.
The $1500 price tag is a bit steep but achievable after saving for a year. That aside, a great example of what's coming sooner than we think.
They could do what Ninja Theory have done with Hellblade. Release the game and then work on VR version for it.
I know, Hellblade is a smaller game but who says they have to rush...
Not intending to counter my own prerogative, but time is money. Development requires people and to take some people off one project and put them on another has a cost. Say you take some of their programs that are dedicated to bug fixes after Cyberpunk 2077's release and put them on a project to modify the game for VR. Bug fixes come out more slowly or aren't tested as thoroughly and this in turn hurts sales depending on the number and severity of bugs. Can they recoup that lost revenue with a VR version of their game? Or say they hire people specifically for a VR project that puts a strain on the budget they may have to cut certain features from the game now in order to make it work out.
These are the things game creators need to consider. So it's not about getting it done quickly or taking their time it has to do with money and demand. I believe after release should they have made the game I'm very hyped for that the sales will be incredible and with those profits I hope they might be willing to invest into a VR version like Fallout and Skyrim.
Well said!
Most people have no clue why it takes years for developers to make a game and think adding features is as simple as flipping a switch. Or that fixing a bug is as simple as finding it, which in an of itself isn't always simple because many require a very specific set of preconditions and circumstances to even discover. This is why so many, hell almost all, games are eventually exploited sooner or later. Thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, of dedicated exploiters searching for ways to do things the game was never intended to permit. Take 10 seconds and consider the amount of man hours that represents and think of how many paid QA and developers hours it would translate to.
It depends. Modders have put VR in games that did not have it all by themselves.
Alone.
Not to get off topic but exploitation of the system is what humans are best at. I could give myriads of examples but humans do it to EVERYTHING not just games.