An analysis of reward expectations

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This Thread is about reward structure not FTP structure. Please stay on topic . Thank you.

There have been topics regarding the current journey here is what I have determined actually the base of all all of it and what the people ranting about it actually want

*Edit Update with option to adjust The reward structure by eliminating the need for a seasons pass fee altogether as suggested by 4RM3D

I think the fairest way to players (not necessarily the best for CDPR), is to remove the season pass and premium content altogether from the Journey.The content should be available to all for those that can spend a reasonable amount of time. For the rest, all the Journey content should also become available for purchase in the store as a bundle. Players will receive a discount based on the completion rate of the Journey. This means that for those that weren't able to finish the Journey in time, they will still be able to purchase the missing cosmetics for a discounted price in the store. This removes the pressure and makes it fair to everyone.

But the rewards still are not fair to people who can't afford to buy the rewards if they don't get them they will be mad and the game will die so lets adjust the reward structure suggestions to prevent anyone being mad.

- You pay your fee for access then everyone gets a daily login reward and no one missing out on anything then everyone will buy the journey because hey for $12 I get all this free of effort stuff. I just log in and I get all the prizes.

or

- You pay your fee and you only have finish 1 match per day . then people who finished the journey at any point > 100 are not left out happy and the ones who want a "contract after the event ends " don't need to worry about that anymore.

The above is determined by what i have observed in rants.

- significant exclusive content for paying people not allowed

( p2w - not really an issue here but its still a very popular rant)

- significant exclusive content for players that spend a lot of time in game not allowed

(as per rants regarding the current journey)

- new players /free players / casuals /small payers having any sort of acquisition / collection /deck disadvantage not allowed

( as seen in the opposition to the pack change)

Conclusion

Someone who plays 10 games in a month should get the same Prize in a event as someone who plays 500 and that is considered fair .

as some have said You can just give the 500 game player a bunch of currency and well that is good enough for them

You must make collection acquisition as easy, efficient and rng free new players/ free players / everyone can make the most competitive decks quickly

If you have awesome prize you must make sure you give it to everyone in some manner or method even if the event has ended its not fair if you don't

IMO I disagree with all of the above as it would make the event meaningless and the prizes worthless as something everyone has is not "special:"
 
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Yeah, I don't really agree with it either. I mean, if it was that easy and they just gave stuff away so freely like that, then this game wouldn't be an esport. Personally I like the climb. It makes getting my rewards that much sweeter, and I feel good as a player when I put in the work and get the desired outcomes. I mean honestly games like Gwent just aren't for everyone, and that's okay. To each their own. But I wouldn't want the devs dumbing everything down for us, and making it so easy to get rewards or currency because then they're not special or valued as highly to the players that will stick around for more than just a month or two.
 
Conclusion

Someone who plays 10 games in a month should get the same Prize in a event as someone who plays 500 and that is considered fair .

This why i made a whole post bout your opinions mate, you like to exaggerate to get your point across.

Comparing a player who barely played in a month (10 games) with someone who played 500 games... HARDCORE af as far as examples go.
No one would say that that's fair the way you "frame it".

...t's your right to believe whatever ya want to believe and yes , players like you who play a lot should be rewarded something special, enjoy.
That doesn't mean though that the monetization system of the game is "perfect" for every one and maybe it will never be.
Thats why people voice their opinions and go against what the game designers do some times, to find some semblance of balance, be it monetization or even game balance.

So.. like @4RM3D said, "when FTP players have to play 3 hours per day" to even have a chance and that without counting the time they have to spend creating a deck which is half the fun of the game, well they just end up being just "wheels" in the grinding machine which it is "bad design", that's my humble opinion.

Anyways, it's your opinions you can have em as me and a lot of other people have theirs.
I won't comment any further on the matter, i leave you to your own.

Take care .
 
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This Thread is about reward structure not FTP structure. Please stay on topic . Thank you.

There have been topics regarding the current journey here is what I have determined actually the base of all all of it and what the people ranting about it actually want

*Edit Update with option to adjust The reward structure by eliminating the need for a seasons pass fee altogether as suggested by 4RM3D



But the rewards still are not fair to people who can't afford to buy the rewards if they don't get them they will be mad and the game will die so lets adjust the reward structure suggestions to prevent anyone being mad.

- You pay your fee for access then everyone gets a daily login reward and no one missing out on anything then everyone will buy the journey because hey for $12 I get all this free of effort stuff. I just log in and I get all the prizes.

or

- You pay your fee and you only have finish 1 match per day . then people who finished the journey at any point > 100 are not left out happy and the ones who want a "contract after the event ends " don't need to worry about that anymore.

The above is determined by what i have observed in rants.

- significant exclusive content for paying people not allowed

( p2w - not really an issue here but its still a very popular rant)

- significant exclusive content for players that spend a lot of time in game not allowed

(as per rants regarding the current journey)

- new players /free players / casuals /small payers having any sort of acquisition / collection /deck disadvantage not allowed

( as seen in the opposition to the pack change)

Conclusion

Someone who plays 10 games in a month should get the same Prize in a event as someone who plays 500 and that is considered fair .

as some have said You can just give the 500 game player a bunch of currency and well that is good enough for them

You must make collection acquisition as easy, efficient and rng free new players/ free players / everyone can make the most competitive decks quickly

If you have awesome prize you must make sure you give it to everyone in some manner or method even if the event has ended its not fair if you don't

IMO I disagree with all of the above as it would make the event meaningless and the prizes worthless as something everyone has is not "special:"


1. Lets define the parameters of our discussion. Journey has 3 options. The first is free to play. The second, is premium pass. The third is fast travel. For our discussion free to play is off the table and I would like to agree to take fast pass off the table as well. Is this ok with you?

2. Let’s clarify our positions. My position is that the 10$ does not buy the cosmetics, it simply buys the opportunity to claim them. Can we agree on this?

3. Let’s define our goals. Our first goal is to give players a reason to play on a regular (perhaps daily, or multi day per week) basis. Our second goal is to give players unique rewards they cannot get in free too play. Our final goal is to raise revenue to make the game profitable.

4. How do we achieve our goals? This is where we disagree. I believe that you need a system that is neither too easy or too hard to accomplish. I said this in the other thread and I think you missed it. If it is too easy their is no sense of accomplishment. If it is too hard people might fail or rage quit. Your position is that failure is a good thing. If everyone succeeds then the value of the accomplishment is diminished for the people who achieved it. My position is this is not a contest. If it were a contest their would be no fast pass and the total number of prizes would be limited. What you have never understood is that the customers spending the money to get the exclusives are the players who actually want the exclusives. I am F2P, I don’t care about cosmetics and I don’t pay for them. In fact I wish there were fewer cosmetics in the free journey. That said, the people who do care don’t want to a significant chance of not getting them.

5. Business model. You want CDPR to tell it’s customers don’t buy premium pass. That is literally what you are advocating. You want them to say you only get what you have time to earn and if you don’t have the time don’t spend the money. You also want them to tell the customers who bought the pass and found the grind to difficult, tough luck now you know what you are getting into next time. Your argument is that to satisfy the smallest and most aggressive of your fan base you should discourage the larger more casual fan base from spending money on their product. How in gods name is CDPR supposed to take this seriously? This is literally the anti CCG model. The only time your suggestion makes sense is in competitive tournaments. For seasonal content the last thing you want is a competition not based on success but time invested and grinding.
 
Gwent seems super friendly to F2P players. The journey system with the keys is legit. As long as you do one faction at a time and craft the cards you need you can get a decent deck pretty quick.
 

rrc

Forum veteran
This Thread is about reward structure not FTP structure. Please stay on topic . Thank you.

There have been topics regarding the current journey here is what I have determined actually the base of all all of it and what the people ranting about it actually want

*Edit Update with option to adjust The reward structure by eliminating the need for a seasons pass fee altogether as suggested by 4RM3D



But the rewards still are not fair to people who can't afford to buy the rewards if they don't get them they will be mad and the game will die so lets adjust the reward structure suggestions to prevent anyone being mad.

- You pay your fee for access then everyone gets a daily login reward and no one missing out on anything then everyone will buy the journey because hey for $12 I get all this free of effort stuff. I just log in and I get all the prizes.

or

- You pay your fee and you only have finish 1 match per day . then people who finished the journey at any point > 100 are not left out happy and the ones who want a "contract after the event ends " don't need to worry about that anymore.

The above is determined by what i have observed in rants.

- significant exclusive content for paying people not allowed

( p2w - not really an issue here but its still a very popular rant)

- significant exclusive content for players that spend a lot of time in game not allowed

(as per rants regarding the current journey)

- new players /free players / casuals /small payers having any sort of acquisition / collection /deck disadvantage not allowed

( as seen in the opposition to the pack change)

Conclusion

Someone who plays 10 games in a month should get the same Prize in a event as someone who plays 500 and that is considered fair .

as some have said You can just give the 500 game player a bunch of currency and well that is good enough for them

You must make collection acquisition as easy, efficient and rng free new players/ free players / everyone can make the most competitive decks quickly

If you have awesome prize you must make sure you give it to everyone in some manner or method even if the event has ended its not fair if you don't

IMO I disagree with all of the above as it would make the event meaningless and the prizes worthless as something everyone has is not "special:"
You keep repeating in your constant and consistent rants in all over the forum that people want to get everything very easy. Can you please define "easy" in your terms? Because without that definition, all your rants are meaningless. No one who paid for the Premium Journey wants to get all the rewards without playing any games. You keep repeating this kind of rants too, that people want to get everything without doing anything. No one said that. So, most of your rants are moot.

In my definition, easy is "just login every day for three months failing to do so rarely and play a game or two max (30 to 40 mins) a days". That is easy and no one is expecting all rewards by doing that.

In my definition, reasonable is "play 5 to 6 games a day for every day for 3 months" playing around 1.5 to 2 hours a day. Even if you get sick (or your near and dear ones get sick) or you have a very tight deadline and you miss a few days, you can compensate it on your good day. This is also hard, but reasonable. If this is the case, I believe 90% of the people who complaint wouldn't have done that.

In my definition, insane grind is "play 10+ games every day all day for 3 months" playing 3 to 4 hours all days. Even if you miss a single day you are pretty much screwed. This is bloody insane.

Now you will jump and say "That is why they have Fast Travel. Buy Fast Travel if you can't grind 3+ hours everyday". I would say that Fast Travel should be for the players who want things "easy", like people who can only play 30 or 45 mins a day max. Not for people who are enjoying the game and playing acceptable max reasonable time.

You can argue that "how can you say what is the reasonable amount of time?" for that there is no solid answer, but I can 100% surely say that even Slama will not say 3+ hours a day all day is the reasonable amount of time they expect players to put in the game. That is for Streamers and Pro players who anyhow don't need these fast travels.

You want to have a feeling that "I am elite top 1%" who can put 3+ hours a day all day or who can spend $100s into each journey and want a special trinklet/collectible to prove that, and for that every other regular paying customers should suffer? You are just considering every other paying customers useless and not worthy unless they put "insane grind" or shove 100s of dollars each journey. All your posts reflect this sentiment and I actually consider that as toxic for the community and it will only have negative effect for CDPR.
 
Honestly I am tired of responding to three of you on this subject. whatever you feel about me /or my opinions believe me its mutual in fact it's highly likely my opinion is probably more negative than yours.

This will be my last response to any of you.

I disagree with everyone of your posts and all your interpretations about how things work / generate revenue.

ALL IMO Context:
- I stand behind everything I said in all my posts including all of the above .
- I approve of the current journey structure 100% and hope they keep it .
- The best rewards should be extremely hard and time consuming get for free.
- someone who plays 10 rounds should NEVER get the same reward as 500
- If you miss time for ANY REASON and fall behind too bad that not the devs or the events problem.
- If people buy the pass and have an expectation to get all the prizes . yes again the players problem
-if the player refused to buy the pass because they cant get All the prize again that's the players problem
- If you want continue to below the "omg players mad game will die" theory based on how much "social media mad" /polls go ahead.
- if you want to continue to think ftp/ casuals generate the most money and that your ideas will make CDPR the most money go ahead.

IMO Personally I hope CDPR does not listen to any of you and keeps everything the way it is put something even better at top of the next journey.

If they change like MTGA did . Well then I guess it will be reversed them and my turn to do the mad ranty posts and you'll be the one defending the event /reward structure and I probably still wont respond to you on that subject either.
 
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rrc

Forum veteran
Honestly I am tired of responding to three of you on this subject. whatever you feel about me /or my opinions believe me its mutual in fact it's highly likely my opinion is probably more negative than yours.

This will be my last response to any of you.

I disagree with everyone of your posts and all your interpretations about how things work / generate revenue.

ALL IMO Context:
- I approve of the current journey structure 100% and hope they keep it .
- The best rewards should be extremely hard and time consuming get for free.
- someone who plays 10 rounds should NEVER get the same reward as 500
- If you miss time for ANY REASON and fall behind too bad that not the devs or the events problem.
- If people buy the pass and have an expectation to get all the prizes . yes again the players problem
-if the player refused to buy the pass because they cant get All the prize again that's the players problem
- If you want continue to below the "omg players mad game will die" theory based on how much "social media mad" /polls go ahead.
- if you want to continue to think ftp/ casuals generate the most money and that your ideas will make CDPR the most money go ahead.

IMO Personally I hope CDPR does not listen to any of you and keeps everything the way it is put something even better at top of the next journey.

If they change like MTGA did . Well then I guess it will be reversed them and my turn to do the mad ranty posts and you'll be the one defending the event /reward structure and I probably still wont respond to you on that subject either.
But @luvCiriTrissYen you still haven't defined what you mean by "easy"? No one wants things easily. So, what is your definition of "reasonable amount of time to spend per day all day" to get the highest reward? If you tell that, then it will put all your opinions in correct perspective.
 
But @luvCiriTrissYen you still haven't defined what you mean by "easy"? No one wants things easily. So, what is your definition of "reasonable amount of time to spend per day all day" to get the highest reward? If you tell that, then it will put all your opinions in correct perspective.

Based on all the posts I have read i disagree no one wants it easy.

Fine one more post since that was a reasonable request .

you are trying to define something that is subjective what is easy for one could be hard for another.

reasonable time I can spare without it changing my life or affecting my responsibilities. other than that I also don't think in those terms I just do what needs to be done to achieve a goal whatever it takes.

According to reddit I am still on track for getting to 175 and I don't play 3 hours a day I don't have that kind of time since I work full time.

At best I can tell you how I would define an event as easy,

How many of the total player population get top prize
100 - 70% - Easy event
60 - 50% - Reasonable event
40 - 30% - Hard event
20 - 10% - Hardcore event
0 - 10% - Near impossible ( you will always get some players that find a way to do the near impossible)
 
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Based on all the posts I have read i disagree no one wants it easy.

Fine one more post since that was a reasonable request .

you are trying to define something that is subjective what is easy for one could be hard for another.

reasonable time I can spare without it changing my life or affecting my responsibilities. other than that I also don't think in those terms I just do what needs to be done to achieve a goal whatever it takes.

According to reddit I am still on track for getting to 175 and I don't play 3 hours a day I don't have that kind of time since I work full time.

At best I can tell you how I would define an event as easy,

How many of the total player population get top prize
100 - 70% - Easy event
60 - 50% - Reasonable event
40 - 30% - Hard event
20 - 10% - Hardcore event
0 - 10% - Near impossible ( you will always get some players that find a way to do the near impossible)

You literally didn’t respond to even a single of my points. Not one. Thankfully your definitions just made my point for me. Your ideal for journey is that between 40%-70% percent of all premium pass purchasers not get all the prizes. You could even go beyond that number if you take the position it should be hardcore event. Premium pass is not meant to be a hardcore event. It is an incentive driven system. The key is to optimize the time investment with enough flexibility to make it reasonable without being too easy or to hard.

P.S, I agree it does not take 3 hours a day to get on track for 175. I am on track for 150 and I don’t really play at all beyond getting my daily bonus crowns. Moreover, the extra 36 quests from PP would be worth 60 x 12 = 720 crowns. 720/24 = 30 levels. This is coming from a guy who skipped the first couple weeks of journey because I was bored with Gwent. We actually agree on the fact that the current journey is quasi reasonable. Where we disagree is that I believe faction challenge should still be a thing and should offer some bonus crowns as a shortcut for casual players to get more rewards (not necessarily all, but more.)
 
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