Workaround preload for physical/retail copies?

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I have refunded games via gog. To refund, they will ask you why.
Sure, why wouldn’t they? It’s free data collection which I don’t doubt can help them improve their services. The question is whether you have to answer. Can you leave it blank? Or choose something like “other”?

I dont know about you, but most consumer protection laws only entitle you to refunds if things are defective or falsly advertised etc.
Well, in my country online sellers (as opposed to local retailers, say) are compelled by law to offer at a minimum a two-week return period for ANY reason. Feel like the product’s chakra doesn’t fit your home? Your daily astrology chart advises against using the product? Doesn’t matter. No matter how ridiculous the reason (including not providing one at all), you are guaranteed the right to return the product within the first 14 days after purchase.

Once more: I do not care to debate whether or not this would be endorsed and cheered on by GOG or if you think GOG is morally (rather than legally) obliged to allow this, I care about whether or not this is technically feasible in the way I outlined. I hope this is the last time I have to repeat this.
 

Madae

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I get that you want to play the game asap, many of us do, but it's not really the end of the world if you have to wait a few hours, or a day.
 
Not sure what the point of this thread is, honestly. This is clearly an abuse of the refund system (no amount of self-entitlement is going to change that), so nobody official is going to give a definitive answer, and nobody unofficial has the information.
 
Sure, why wouldn’t they? It’s free data collection which I don’t doubt can help them improve their services. The question is whether you have to answer. Can you leave it blank? Or choose something like “other”?


Well, in my country online sellers (as opposed to local retailers, say) are compelled by law to offer at a minimum a two-week return period for ANY reason. Feel like the product’s chakra doesn’t fit your home? Your daily astrology chart advises against using the product? Doesn’t matter. No matter how ridiculous the reason (including not providing one at all), you are guaranteed the right to return the product within the first 14 days after purchase.

Once more: I do not care to debate whether or not this would be endorsed and cheered on by GOG or if you think GOG is morally (rather than legally) obliged to allow this, I care about whether or not this is technically feasible in the way I outlined. I hope this is the last time I have to repeat this.

So one, yes you have to answer. You have to send an email to support and someone gets in contact with you in response.

And what country? I know a few that have laws that only mention what I have said. Anyway im sure there would be something in there about being allowed to deny one if the customer never intended to own the thing they bought.
 
Germany. And no, there is no such clause thankfully. Corporations might get to fuck over customers elsewhere in the world but here the consumer has some semblance of rights left.

@ReptilePZ: Why would they not comment on this? And it’s hardly entitled to not be treated like a second-class customer by a company when you spend more than four times the regular amount on a product and get worse service than someone who paid a quarter that price. As outlined previously, it’s not like there aren’t technical solutions to this problem (e.g. allowing preloading of the encrypted game for everyone and decrypting it upon entering one’s code on GOG). Quite silly that this still is not commonplace in 2020, really. All the infrastructure is already in place anyway.

@Madae: I basically only get to play video games on the weekend and given my connection it’s not guaranteed that I even get to do that. If I start the download on Friday morning and it drops while I’m at work for example I can’t do anything about that. Same for downloading over night. Great to hear that this is a total non-issue for you but for me it’s different. Try having some empathy instead of telling people “LOL, what’s the big deal?”.
 
Germany. And no, there is no such clause thankfully. Corporations might get to fuck over customers elsewhere in the world but here the consumer has some semblance of rights left.

@ReptilePZ: Why would they not comment on this? And it’s hardly entitled to not be treated like a second-class customer by a company when you spend more than four times the regular amount on a product and get worse service than someone who paid a quarter that price. As outlined previously, it’s not like there aren’t technical solutions to this problem (e.g. allowing preloading of the encrypted game for everyone and decrypting it upon entering one’s code on GOG). Quite silly that this still is not commonplace in 2020, really. All the infrastructure is already in place anyway.

@Madae: I basically only get to play video games on the weekend and given my connection it’s not guaranteed that I even get to do that. If it drops while I’m at work for example I can’t do anything about that.


Nope, sorry just read the law. The 14 day period doesn't apply if you have started downloading.

Also @ your worse service comment, dude lol. It's just the reality of buying physical vs online. And the whole "paid more" - do you not think you got your money worth? You bought the ce.

There isn't a work around to this. You could have retailers sending you codes but then people are 100 going to be stealing them and they are at risk of being stolen by hackers.
 
You don’t know what you are talking about. Read §355 of the Bürgerliches Gesetzbuch (BGB) or check what the Verbraucherschutz has said on this matter. This has already been litigated in the past.

Do you not think the items you are recieving in the collectors edition is worth the money you are spending? Or extra items in the standard physical? Do you think games should cost less when you buy it from the store simply because you can not pre-load when you happen to pre-order? Should the physical be cheaper pre order and then raised once the game releases since you cant preload? This is non-sensicle.
I think that in the year of our lord 2020 companies selling digital products should not disadvantage their retail customers. For the third time now: This whole issue could be easily avoided by them. Not sure why you asked the rest of those question as I implied none of these things and strike me as “non-sensicle”.
 
Also, I dont think not being able to buy products with the intent to refund them is getting fucked over by corporations. -And I thought you didnt want to bring morals/ehthics into this like you said, but what you are discussing definitly isnt a moral good/ethical.
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14 day cooling off period

In the EU you have the right to return purchases made online or through other types of distance selling, such as by phone, mail order or from a door-to-door salesperson, within 14 days for a full refund. You can do so for any reason – even if you simply changed your mind.


The 14-day cooling off period does not apply to all purchases. Some of the exemptions are:


  • plane and train tickets, as well as concert tickets, hotel bookings, car rental reservations and catering services for specific dates
  • goods and drinks delivered to you by regular delivery – for example delivery by a milkman
  • goods made to order or clearly personalised – such as a tailor-made suit
  • sealed audio, video or computer software, such as DVDs, which you have unsealed upon receipt
  • online digital content, if you have already started downloading or streaming it and you agreed that you would lose your right of withdrawal by starting the performance
  • goods bought from a private individual rather than a company/trader
  • urgent repairs and maintenance contracts – if you call a plumber to repair a leaking shower, you can't cancel the work once you have agreed on the price of the service
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I think that in the year of our lord 2020 companies selling digital products should not disadvantage their retail customers. For the third time now: This whole issue could be easily avoided by them. Not sure why you asked the rest of those question as I implied none of these things and strike me as “non-sensicle”.

Not in a realistic way that doesnt open up to vunrabilities. (espicially since gog doesnt do drm)

Also - yeah you implied all the questions I asked. You say that "why am I paying the same/more for worse service" This clearly implies you think if you dont get pre-load you should pay less. So I ask - what happens after release?
 
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Maybe you do not understand how EU law works. Let me enlighten you: National law supersedes it. In this case, the EU laws specify the MINIMUM whereas the German law I cited goes beyond what it outlines and guarantees additional rights. Same way, for example, how in Japan prefectures can have laws of their own that get overridden by federal Japanese law which has precedence.

Not in a realistic way that doesnt open up to vunrabilities. (espicially since gog doesnt do drm)
What is unrealistic about what I proposed? The preload is already encrypted for everyone anyway, all this would change is that retail customers of theirs would not get discriminated against. The only change they would even have to make is who gets to download it, the rest would work as usual: Don’t have the game in your library come launch? No decryption for you. This is the entire reason the concept I introduced in the OP would work in the first place.

And if anything GOG not having DRM only further proves my point. People who would illegally download the game can already do so on launch anyway since anyone can just share the GOG installation files.

Anyway, I’m done with this. Go look somewhere else for someone to argue with.

If I can’t get anyone official to comment on this and no one else has a clue if this would work then I guess that’s the end of that. Suppose I’ll just have to try.
 
Maybe you do not understand how EU law works. Let me enlighten you: National law supersedes it. In this case, the EU laws specify the MINIMUM whereas the German law I cited goes beyond what it outlines and guarantees additional rights. Same way, for example, how in Japan prefectures can have laws of their own that get overridden by federal Japanese law which has precedence.


What is unrealistic about what I proposed? The preload is already encrypted for everyone anyway, all this would change is that retail customers of theirs would not get discriminated against. The only change they would even have to make is who gets to download it, the rest would work as usual: Don’t have the game in your library come launch? No decryption for you. This is the entire reason the concept I introduced in the OP would work in the first place.

And if anything GOG not having DRM only further proves my point. People who would illegally download the game can already do so on launch anyway since anyone can just share the GOG installation files.

Anyway, I’m done with this. Go look somewhere else for someone to argue with.

If I can’t get anyone official to comment on this and no one else has a clue if this would work then I guess that’s the end of that. Suppose I’ll just have to try.

The german law you quoted to me does not do that. I read it.
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What is unrealistic about what I proposed? The preload is already encrypted for everyone anyway, all this would change is that retail customers of theirs would not get discriminated against. The only change they would even have to make is who gets to download it, the rest would work as usual: Don’t have the game in your library come launch? No decryption for you. This is the entire reason the concept I introduced in the OP would work in the first place.

And if anything GOG not having DRM only further proves my point. People who would illegally download the game can already do so on launch anyway since anyone can just share the GOG installation files.

Anyway, I’m done with this. Go look somewhere else for someone to argue with.

If I can’t get anyone official to comment on this and no one else has a clue if this would work then I guess that’s the end of that. Suppose I’ll just have to try.

The code part. The reason you can pre-load is because you havbe proved you bought the game. I think it should be obvious allowing literally anyone to downloading the game is a bad idea.
 
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Sure, why wouldn’t they? It’s free data collection which I don’t doubt can help them improve their services. The question is whether you have to answer. Can you leave it blank? Or choose something like “other”?
You do realize that your forum account and GOG account are connected right? Maybe the developer's official forums isn't the right place to theorize on how to deceive the developer.
 
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How would that work? Are preloads only possible via Galaxy? Because if not I don’t see how GOG would delete anything on my side. On the server/account side the game would obviously get deleted but that has no bearing on my local files. And even if it does require Galaxy and there did exist some deletion mechanism like that, I could just copy the preload files to another medium beforehand and move them back once I redeemed my retail GOG code, no?

As I stated before I am not 100%, the info I have is taken from the GOG refund policy. You are probably right that after refunding the GOG version your game files should be on your PC still but if my understanding is correct you can't use them without a legit copy of the game. So buying a GOG copy preloading that and then refunding it serves no purpose but to waste time, because then you would have to install the game again when you get your preordered copy right? Again this is my understanding. If i am in any way wrong I apologize.
 
online digital content, if you have already started downloading or streaming it and you agreed that you would lose your right of withdrawal by starting the performance

The important part here is that...
and you agreed that you would lose your right of withdrawal by starting the performance

the right of withdrawal only expires if the customer clearly agrees.(§ 356 Abs5 BGH)
If this is not the case, the 14-day right of withdrawal still applies.


However, I assume that most online retailers have such a query.
 
You do realize that your forum account and GOG account are connected right? Maybe the developer's official forums isn't the right place to theorize on how to deceive the developer.
What deception? What are you talking about? Nothing I am doing here is done in a concealed manner. If anything, I WANT someone at GOG to see this so they can tell me whether or not this would work. Do you know of anyone there that I could ping here on the forums?
Besides, I really, really do not understand what about this gets you people so upset. The reason I am coming up with these roundabout methods of preloading in the first place is because of a failure on the part of GOG/CDPR to properly take their retail customers into account.

As discussed previously, the solutions to this are fairly obvious and simple. Superpunked seems to thinks it obvious that it would be a “bad idea” but gives no explanation whatsoever, presumably because he cannot actually formulate any reason why it would be. Those who do not own the game in their GOG library could not decrypt it so what is the issue? Illegal downloads will be available on day 1 anyway and illegally unlocking those files, assuming it is even possible (which would presumably involve hacking GOG’s servers to get the keys as cracking the encryption itself ought to be impossible), is already a potential — albeit in my eyes minuscule — risk since someone could upload the preload files to the Internet anyways. Nothing about my proposal of allowing anyone access to the encrypted preload files would change anything about these ridiculous scenarios.

You are probably right that after refunding the GOG version your game files should be on your PC still but if my understanding is correct you can't use them without a legit copy of the game. So buying a GOG copy preloading that and then refunding it serves no purpose but to waste time, because then you would have to install the game again when you get your preordered copy right?
That is the question I am trying to have answered. The way I see it I would not have to redownload the preload seeing how I would (again) have the game in my GOG library via the included retail code. In other words, after redeeming that code it would be once more as if I did not refund it in the first place and decrypting the preloaded files should work normally. Maybe there is something that I am missing, however, which is why I opened this topic in the first place.[/B]
 
How is it scummy? It results in the exact same outcome as if I didn’t do it — except I get to preload like everyone else with a GOG copy. No harm, no foul. Also, who asked your opinion? I opened this thread to find out whether or this was viable, not what random people thought about its ethicality. Stick to the topic or don’t comment.
 
I don't really see much point in keeping this open, not when it's starting to heat up and the question would really need to be answered by a GOG representative anyway.

But for now, a reminder that:
1. This is a forum, a place for discussion. Don't post a topic if you don't want people discussing it.
2. This forum has rules requiring all users to treat others with kindness and respect. Both of which are missing from most recent posts.
 
What deception?
Deceive - verb - to cause to accept as true or valid what is false or invalid

You said in the OP

Since all of the above come with GOG codes anyway, could we — in order to be able to preload — purchase a digital copy on GOG, preload, refund the digital version and once we get our codes from the physical version, use our code to then get it back so to speak? That way we would have the game already downloaded and get it to play immediately like everyone else.

When asked what your going to say when they asked why you want a refund, you said:

The question is whether you have to answer. Can you leave it blank? Or choose something like “other”?

What you are suggesting to do is deceiving because by being intentionally vague, you are attempting to get a benefit you would not otherwise be able to get. Getting them to accept you have a valid reason for a refund when you do not.

Also, as mentioned above, I think everyone has had their fair say about the potential work around, and without a GOG representative randomly dropping in ... no official answer is likely to come, so closing.
 
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