No it's not. As with TW3 you play a character not yourself.
even if it might be hard to play exactly like a PnP RPG (because it's 90% dialogues and yes, in that case the story actually changes and GMs have to imrpovise all the time and very often trash everything they planned) I still feel other games captured the essence of RPG in a much better way, much closer to PnP.
I actually feel that CP77 has nothing to do with PnP RPGs at all. If it wasn't called Cyberpunk we might not even have this conversation.
Maybe I am wrong and if so please correct me, but I've suspected for awhile that even my beloved JRPG's are called as such because they are the Japanese take on RPG's, not simply because they are RPG's that happen to be from Japan. By the standard of PnP RPG's which CP2077 was supposedly based on, even games I call my favorite RPG's of all time wouldn't be considered RPG's such as FFVII and Xenogears etc. Would you say that is accurate?
From what I am able to gather, CDPR took the lore and source material of an RPG and made a something else of out it. Some kind of cross between an action game, looter shooter and interactive movie.
JRPG's are generally their own thing. True, they're not really RPGs in the traditional sense as you rarely have any real choices, and character building is mostly just maxing out stats, not really any choice in how to build a character. At max level everyone will basically have the same characters.
But that's why they tend to have the JRPG description, as it's become its own thing.
I very much disagree. You have no real control over the story, your choices are pretty much meaningless as the game is linear and "on rails" as others have put it. Character building doesn't account for much. Yes, you can be better at things, but player skill trumps out character building every time. Even if you put nothing into weapons, you can grab a gun and slaughter an army.
The definition you give is far too broad. Games like Zelda, Batman, Halo even, would all be RPG's by that explanation. Any game with stats and a narrative... which is most games.
And your last point is where it really falls apart. The actions being based on a system of rules and such. In a proper RPG, it's your character's stats that would determine if something can succeed. If you have the points, you can do a thing, if not it's impossible. But in Cyberpunk, even without the points, you can do things simply based on PLAYER skill, completely ignoring CHARACTER skill. Again, that's why countless people argue that the new Fallout games and Elder Scrolls games aren't really RPG's, because success is based entirely on the player's skill. It's up to you to hit and dodge and do everything else. Meanwhile in earlier Elder Scrolls titles, hitting enemies was based on your character's stats, so you could walk up and swing away, but if your skill was crap, you would miss constantly. THOSE were more RPG than the newer games that have gone all twitch based. That's why they're being called Action-RPG's. Because they're action games FIRST, with some RPG elements sprinkled in. But the RPG elements take a back seat to the player's action skills.
Hello, I had many discussions about it with many people and I wanted to know your opinion. I understand that the industry today tends more towards hybrids than pure genre games.
Personally, I consider that it has rpg characteristics but is more focused on an action / looter sandbox.
Yeah if you don't play the game like an RPG you'd end up complaining about being 1 shot or enemies being bullet sponges. Guess how many people didn't play it like an RPG.
Yeah if you don't play the game like an RPG you'd end up complaining about being 1 shot or enemies being bullet sponges. Guess how many people didn't play it like an RPG.
What are you talking about? You get better weapons, you murder guys. That's about it.
Sure, putting stats in some stats/skills makes you better at it, but you can do it just fine without them. And that's the problem.
JRPG's are generally their own thing. True, they're not really RPGs in the traditional sense as you rarely have any real choices, and character building is mostly just maxing out stats, not really any choice in how to build a character. At max level everyone will basically have the same characters.
But that's why they tend to have the JRPG description, as it's become its own thing.
Right. From an RPG purist standpoint I wonder how JRPG's are viewed and if they're considered actual RPG's or not. Based on the standard of significant choice and character development beyond defined progression, it seems pretty difficult to imagine they would be considered RPG's by that standard. I've never read it anywhere that JRPG's are called as such in order to distinguish them from traditional RPG's more so simply because they're from Japan but I suspect it originally may be so.
If people asks themselves the question, then there is a problem.
My opinion is just this : the game is not yet a RPG. Yeah, you can call it a JRPG, which are in fact narative games by essence.
Calling this a RPG depends if CDPR fix their gamedesign or not (on top of their bugs).
Very cool platform though. Waiting for them or mods.
What are you talking about? You get better weapons, you murder guys. That's about it.
Sure, putting stats in some stats/skills makes you better at it, but you can do it just fine without them. And that's the problem.
No, no no. This doesn't work against higher level enemies that most players accidentally encounter once they leave the Watson district. Getting better weapons require reaching higher levels.
Right. From an RPG purist standpoint I wonder how JRPG's are viewed and if they're considered actual RPG's or not. Based on the standard of significant choice and character development beyond defined progression, it seems pretty difficult to imagine they would be considered RPG's by that standard. I've never read it anywhere that JRPG's are called as such in order to distinguish them from traditional RPG's more so simply because they're from Japan but I suspect it originally may be so.
I can't talk about JRPGs because I always saw them as for what they are, either novel stories or hack and slash games as Diablo or FF8 with turns (which I liked btw, I mean FF8, I just can0t stand the over anime look as I stop at Akira, Hokuto no Ken and Maison Ikkoku as for character style besides more modern stuff that was also good, like Cowboy beebop and others, Idk serial experiment Lain etc).
I grew up with RPGs in the form of Dungeons&Dragons (when it was still D&D back in the days), Warhammer Fantasy RPG, CP2020, Vampire the Masquerade (which I played exstensively along with CP2020 as a player, never been a GM, you need talent to do that lol which I lack) and others like Kata Kumbas, an italian RPG game system that I have to say was very cool.
After that our GM decided it was time to develop our own RPG game and world (but in a fantasy setting), and we went from there, getting the best of D&D and others.
I can't think of anything else when we speak of RPG than that. It just doesn't fit. Still I find some Bethesda games and other older games on D&D and similar very spot on to what an RPG represented on a monitor should do, and a good enough compromise.
CP77 doesn't give me this at all, not even a hint of it.
Btw I gladly remember the multiplayer part of Vampire the Masquerade: redemption as a great RPG experience, especially for the editor and the fact that it was in the end an open world with all players in different rooms or scense where they could even move at pleasure if they wanted (if the session was not private) and every session was a map made with the real time in game editor by the GM. and character progress was permanent. I had a huge amount of fun out if , with Npcs and loot, and social elements..that was very nice.
This is an RPG. If Mass Effect is an RPG, this is absolutely an RPG.
There is a certain dissonance between the main-storyline V and the side-storyline V.
Main storyline V has the clock ticking and isn't as nuanced and player-driven as my side-storyline V.
Customizing is my personal key to immersion, so I'm looking forward to whatever options CDPR
will give us in future updates and DLCs. Cosmetics are just a big thing for me.
I want style over substance. And It would be great to have the NPCs react to my style choices.
No, no no. This doesn't work against higher level enemies that most players accidentally encounter once they leave the Watson district. Getting better weapons require reaching higher levels.
No, it doesn't. You get pretty random loot. Sometimes you'll get just damn powerful weapons. Once I left Watson, I was finding powerful gun all over the place, and was slaughtering my way through every zone. It was only once I hit max level, when the enemies suddenly got a massive stat boost that made their armor insane that I started having problems (and just had to use a gun with a really high single shot damage). But character stats were never important.
It really depends how you define an RPG. I would classify it as an Action RPG similar to the Elder Scrolls and Fallout 3+. It will take multiple playthroughs or a lot of save scuming to see just how impactful your decisions really are, It will be harder to tell if you don't find out the implications of some of your actions till later on. It isn't a Simulation RPG even though the Pen and Paper game can be ran that way, though every Shadowrun game and Cyberpunk game I have been in focuses more on the same stuff CP2077 focuses on.
No, it doesn't. You get pretty random loot. Sometimes you'll get just damn powerful weapons. Once I left Watson, I was finding powerful gun all over the place, and was slaughtering my way through every zone. It was only once I hit max level, when the enemies suddenly got a massive stat boost that made their armor insane that I started having problems (and just had to use a gun with a really high single shot damage). But character stats were never important.
You ever fought Trauma Team at level 15? You clearly haven't. Also you're literally lying about slaughtering your way through every zone. High level enemies are located at City Center and Heywood. There is no way you'd easily slaughter them with low leveled gear, and then find and equip gear from those zones because they have level requirements. Character stats ARE important. Oh wait you must've been playing Easy or Normal, in which case your opinion is disregarded.
There is a certain dissonance between the main-storyline V and the side-storyline V.
Main storyline V has the clock ticking and isn't as nuanced and player-driven as my side-storyline V.
Hello, I had many discussions about it with many people and I wanted to know your opinion. I understand that the industry today tends more towards hybrids than pure genre games.
Personally, I consider that it has rpg characteristics but is more focused on an action / looter sandbox.
I wouldn't call CP a deep RPG, in the sense of D&D where you have to roll for checks and so forth. But it has RPG elements, but I would agree that they are secondary and it is action/looter first.
I can't think of an easy way to solve this problem. It's a ludonarrative dissonance created by the freedom to intermingle side quests with main quests. They could throttle down on the urgency to solve the chip problem? Add more Johnny Silverhand to more gigs and side activities? No idea. The side stories give me the freedom to act the way I want to act as V. The main story does not have that luxury and can't really reflect on the choices that I make throughout the game. How is the main quest supposed to know, if I'm a Pacifist Hacker with a mean streak, or a horny blood-thirsty Solo with a heart of gold?
I can't think of an easy way to solve this problem. It's a ludonarrative dissonance created by the freedom to intermingle side quests with main quests. They could throttle down on the urgency to solve the chip problem? Add more Johnny Silverhand to more gigs and side activities? No idea. The side stories give me the freedom to act the way I want to act as V. The main story does not have that luxury and can't really reflect on the choices that I make throughout the game. How is the main quest supposed to know, if I'm a Pacifist Hacker with a mean streak, or a horny blood-thirsty Solo with a heart of gold?
Take away the 6 months forward. let me seamlessy enter Night City and experience the characters that are a but cut cinematic for real now.
Don't give me all the map discovered immediatly in the form of activities and contacts, Let them come out little by little, to also promote exploration.
Make exploration and travel time meaningful by having random events or even quests that trigger or appear as an opportunity without even showing them to me on the map from MILES AWAY. This killed totally interest and killed the only functioning part this game has (the Structure of the City from a 3d model perspective).
Don't threat V as the next big thing from hour 0, let us get there little by little.
And actually make use of the fact that you wasted AN ENTIRE NCW episode flexing about how you put names in the streets of NC, like we would even care in this game since it has no reason for us to remember them.
Even with these just few tweaks, the game would have been a MUCH better experience.
After that you start touching and refining systems like AI, traffic , enemies and so on that currently aren't even implemented at an APHA stage. (yes the UI as well).
Hello, I had many discussions about it with many people and I wanted to know your opinion. I understand that the industry today tends more towards hybrids than pure genre games.
Personally, I consider that it has rpg characteristics but is more focused on an action / looter sandbox.
It is, definitely. Of course, it depends on what an RPG is for you. Going back to old SNES times, I think the main characteristics were:
- A great story with a lot of twists and unexpected moments (CP2077 clearly has this)
- A leveling system where you gathered XP by killing mobs. Pretty simple compared to the possibilites cyberpunk offers. We have "normal" levelling, and there is the cred
- Fighting was related to different attack modes and tactics that could be chosen from. CP2077 has no magic, but we have the very new aspects of cyberware and the cyberdeck. Both options havent been used in a lot of games. You can also choose from a lot of different weapon styles and everything can be updated
- Typically, you had a party on old SNES games. This is not the case in CP, but on the other hand, the main characters are well drawn and at least I build up some kind of relationship to them.
Honestly, I cannot understand people who say that it is not an RPG because they cannot interact with all the inhabitants of night city. Was this possible in Gothic 2, Final Fantasy and so on? No. And here, we have lots of NPCs which create an amazing atmosphere as long as you do not expect a jackie-like character behind everyone.
I also wonder about people who think that it is not an RPG because a barber is missing. Of course, such possibilites would have been fun, but these are really minor things.
Hello, I had many discussions about it with many people and I wanted to know your opinion. I understand that the industry today tends more towards hybrids than pure genre games.
Personally, I consider that it has rpg characteristics but is more focused on an action / looter sandbox.
As a person with 80 hrs in.. no, not really.. It looks like you have a choice in story missions but either you kill them guns blazing or you kill them softly xD .. but still love the game.
