[Spoiler Alert] About the endings

[Motsie]

If you insist on referencing philosophical problems by name in this, stick to the teletransportation paradox, it's more accurate. The Ship of Theseus might be more relevant in a conversation about Johnny overwriting V's mind.

The game can move forward with it because it is, frankly, written poorly with respect to Soulkiller. If Soulkiller kills and copies, then the ending is functionally identical to one where you walk into the server room and are immediately shot in the face, roll credits.

It does not matter. It's fundamentally tackling the same, core question - is V still V. Anyone claiming to know the answer to this is simplifying it. It's mostly up to how people interpret it. and butting heads over it is entirely pointless and completely exhausting.

The bones of what we're left with, in this story, is how it's going to be and how it's going to remain. They either ignore the dissonance in the main story and shove in some mid-game side show, or they continue the story with the endings that give them the most breathing room (Aldecaldos, Arasaka, Casino).

 

[Buckadoz]

It does not matter. It's fundamentally tackling the same, core question - is V still V. Anyone claiming to know the answer to this is simplifying it. It's mostly up to how people interpret it. and butting heads over it is entirely pointless and completely exhausting.

Fiction has the luxury of assuming answers to philosophical problems for the sake of storytelling. In Star Trek, they're clearly meant to be the same people after they teleport. In Cyberpunk, the warnings from Alt and use of phrases like "copy" shows that it assumes the opposite.

The bones of what we're left with, in this story, is how it's going to be and how it's going to remain. They either ignore the dissonance in the main story and shove in some mid-game side show, or they continue the story with the endings that give them the most breathing room (Aldecaldos, Arasaka, Casino).

I'd actually be fine with the continuation from those, since I could just choose the Arasaka one, even though the game clearly thinks less of you for doing so.

 

[JC_of_Cintra]

The Witcher was more balanced regarding the types of endings we could obtain. Remember Blood and Wine?

 

[pEestino]

I'd actually be fine with the continuation from those, since I could just choose the Arasaka one, even though the game clearly thinks less of you for doing so.

It's down to moral highground (nomad) or background/survival instincts (siding with Arasaka, starting as corpo which makes it even more likely) but I feel the game is a street kid game.

 

[tRYSIS3]

I think they will but there's no way they can fix the story, they can alter endings, they can add new endings, add new sides, new side char contents but the cut main story will remain as is even though they could definetly slip things in as you decide your fate 2 hours before the end anyway

We can only hope, like I would have hoped to save Jackie (even if he never shows up again after the heist), but as it stands right now you can't even save yourself, which is what the game is about.

 

[pEestino]

We can only hope, like I would have hoped to save Jackie (even if he never shows up again after the heist), but as it stands right now you can't even save yourself, which is what the game is about.

Same, with Evelyn, if there was anything, like give her to Viktor or something I would've done it, it doesn't even drive the plot -that- much because she's in shock so killing her off wouldn't have impacted the story that much but it played out for shock effect I guess and for Judy's sidestory.

 

[MeinChurro]

I think they will but there's no way they can fix the story, they can alter endings, they can add new endings, add new sides, new side char contents but the cut main story will remain as is even though they could definetly slip things in as you decide your fate 2 hours before the end anyway

This game will never be a good RPG, or an RPG in general. Too far gone. Best we can hope for is a good resolution to the ending(s).

 

[Buckadoz]

It's down to moral highground (nomad) or background/survival instincts (siding with Arasaka, starting as corpo which makes it even more likely) but I feel the game is a street kid game.

No, all of the endings clearly moralize and judge you, dishing out punishments in the form of V's QOL in the epilogue.

If you do the Arasaka ending, you're a bad person. You've undone the whole game, Saburo is back, Arasaka is stronger than ever, and you go back to Earth to live out your last months in the wake of all the relationships you destroyed by siding with Arasaka.

If you do the space heist ending, you're okay, but not good enough. You get to take down Arasaka, but since you don't want to leave the city, you're still a bad person; you care so much about your legacy that you ruin your romantic relationship for yet another heist.

If you do Nomad, you're a good boy/girl who gets to leave NC behind with Misty's tarot strongly suggesting you manage to find a way to avoid dying after 6 months. Congratulations, you played the way they wanted you to.

 

[pEestino]

This game will never be a good RPG, or an RPG in general. Too far gone. Best we can hope for is a good resolution to the ending(s).

It won't be a fully fledged rpg no but I wouldn't botch it just because of it when it can definetly have an arch of redemption, NMS was BARREN of content, after 10 hours you had seen everything but now it's quite pleasing.
Will it be what was promised? No.
Will it be up to par with TW3? No.
Atleast they can do small things like QoL and immersive things such as strip clubs, poker games, races, random events, a fucking walk button for PC players, simple shit, some of this stuff we already have like animations to drink and eat but aside from the missions we can't see those.
Either way this is off topic entirely.

 

[tRYSIS3]

Same, with Evelyn, if there was anything, like give her to Viktor or something I would've done it, it doesn't even drive the plot -that- much because she's in shock so killing her off wouldn't have impacted the story that much but it played out for shock effect I guess and for Judy's sidestory.

That's another good example. This game could have easily become one of the greatest games ever made, if they had delivered on what they promised. Unfortunately, what have now is a decent game with limited replayability, one that will be forgotten in the matter of a couple years.

 

[pEestino]

If you do Nomad, you're a good boy/girl who gets to leave NC behind with Misty's tarot strongly suggesting you manage to find a way to avoid dying after 6 months. Congratulations, you played the way they wanted you to.

But you're still copy V, not V, then again, she also says that you're not there so her cards might be affected, furthermore we don't know anything for certain which is mind boggling and I think nomad would be among the most unlikely to be canon.

Also don't you die in space heist because of your suit losing oxygen? I keep seeing clips of it and that's what it looks like anyway but I might be wrong, also because oxygen leak like that would propell you like a rocket.

 

[tavellone]

If the writers had bothered to put more of a philosophical and moral issue about whether V's neural consciousness was the same as V and whether a data copy of a person is that person and all the complex arguments and thoughts that go with that then I would have put a lot more thought into the decision I made of how to proceed. They didn't though, beyond Alt saying soulkiller will literally kill the soul halfway through the story then never saying anything like that again, and this is ignoring the idea that surely an AI even with human origins probably wouldn't make a distinction about metaphysical concepts such as the soul.

I like this story, don't get me wrong, but I feel like the world of cyberpunk has complexities way beyond the abilities of the writers of this game to grasp. I've never considered CD Projekt Red's writing to be very 'deep' or thoughtful, but I really feel like they didn't even try to address any of the issues about the concepts of self or conciousness or corporate power or power structures or any of the themes that permeate through this world and opted to go for a very straightforward story with relationship aspects thrown in and a simple veneer of the world thrown over. This isn't a terrible thing, but it is how it is so I treated the game and these concepts the same way, with very little consideration.

For that reason in my mind the real V is chilling in Arizona with Panam looking for a way to prolong his life. I am happy with this, its simple.

 

[Cyber.D.G.]

But you're still copy V, not V, then again, she also says that you're not there so her cards might be affected, furthermore we don't know anything for certain which is mind boggling and I think nomad would be among the most unlikely to be canon.

Also don't you die in space heist because of your suit losing oxygen? I keep seeing clips of it and that's what it looks like anyway but I might be wrong, also because oxygen leak like that would propell you like a rocket.

Pretty much. Its a one way flight.

 

[pEestino]

Also, on the matter of the poll, I think 1 and 3 are one and the same basically.
Clearly someone that misses happy ending would definetly vote "They should be available for those that want them."

 

[Buckadoz]

But you're still copy V, not V, then again, she also says that you're not there so her cards might be affected, furthermore we don't know anything for certain which is mind boggling and I think nomad would be among the most unlikely to be canon.

Believe me friend, I have a long history in this thread of saying the endings after Mikoshi don't matter because you die at Mikoshi. Anything I say about those endings come with the note *Assuming we ignore Soulkiller, just for the sake of talking about the endings with people who don't seem to think Soulkiller matters at all.

Also don't you die in space heist because of your suit losing oxygen? I keep seeing clips of it and that's what it looks like anyway but I might be wrong, also because oxygen leak like that would propell you like a rocket.

Talking about this game's endings has made me realize there are a whole lot of people that don't realize that that's the space suit's propulsion system. Those bursts of air are just how astronauts get around during spacewalks.

 

[pEestino]

They didn't though, beyond Alt saying soulkiller will literally kill the soul halfway through the story then never saying anything like that again, and this is ignoring the idea that surely an AI even with human origins probably wouldn't make a distinction about metaphysical concepts such as the soul.

I agree, she completely disregards bodies and realspace, for an AI such as her the only real goal is immortality and progress beyond the blackwall.
Why would she even talk about souls? Even by our standards irl people debate whether souls are a thing or not, did she find a way to prove souls exist? It's why I think the "soul" in soulkiller isn't exactly -literal-.

Post automatically merged: Dec 22, 2020

Talking about this game's endings has made me realize there are a whole lot of people that don't realize that that's the space suit's propulsion system. Those bursts of air are just how astronauts get around during spacewalks.

Well our astronauts don't have them in the helmets and it looked a pretty standard suit real-life like, you might be right but it's just odd that it seems to come from the helmet is all.

 

[SaulTuk]

All endings are just like CHOOSE HOW YOU WANT TO DIE.
And I'm ok with no happy ending, but it this case it doesn't feel like your decisions affect something.
For example, in case if you complete all Jonny's quests he won't take over your body and add option to merge V and Jonny minds (since they both became digital), so the shard wouldn't destroy V because now it's not just V.
And with that ending where V dies if few month after... it's just sounds silly in a world where Smasher exists with like full body replacement and V is dying cause his own immune system attacks him???

Smasher has Arasaka money to buy the best available trearment and had access to its resources and tech. V has only Vic or, possibly, a bunchvof nomads(

 

[checkboxpoll]

So, i want to know if you think the Cyberpunk endings or mass effect endings are worst?

Spoiler: ME spoilers

The unspoken agreement among Bioware fans is that everything seen through Shepard's POV after he gets hit by Harbinger death beam and is grievously wounded is a hallucination caused by the months of indoctrination he had to endure and resist surging forth through a broken Shepard. The real silver lining is Shepard's actions throughout the trilogy had consequences that were very clearly visible in the last mission and he managed to unite a fragmented galaxy and bring reapers to the brink of defeat in one last hurrah.

IMO the real clincher is that players didn't have to endure a half baked early access game for over 100 hours to experience a badly written ending.

 

[pEestino]

Smasher has Arasaka money to buy the best available trearment and had access to its resources and tech. V has only Vic or, possibly, a bunchvof nomads(

Not quite, Arasaka literally offers you to work for them when you decide to go back to Earth in the Arasaka ending, clearly someone that can beat smasher deserves to become smasher 2.0, not to mention Takemura could've said how you beat Oda (and Hanako would probably know anyway) so yeah, you'd have a full chrome suit for yourself, infact there's a room at the docks where you can find smasher's suit or a spare possibly? Because I can't imagine that Smasher goes all the way to Ebunike to get his gear everytime he is needed, considering he's full chrome anyway.. It's probably just a spare that came right from Tokyo Arasaka HQ.

 

[Arkei1]

The Witcher was more balanced regarding the types of endings we could obtain. Remember Blood and Wine?

When we are already bringing up Witcher (3):

Spoiler: maybe some people see this is a spoiler for the books, making this a spoiler just in case:

Has anyone here read the books? And how sad they end? How come CDPR can make happy and grey endings in that game possible, but people who defend the endings of Cyberpunk 2077 claim V has to die because it is the genre?