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Cyberpunk 2077 versus Watch Dogs, GTA and Mafia

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Avalonica

Avalonica

Fresh user
#1
Cyberpunk 2077 had eight years of development and these games are still way more advanced:

Watch Dogs 1 (2014)
Watch Dogs 2 (2016)
Watch Dogs 3 (2020)
Grand Theft Auto 4 (2008)
Grand Theft Auto 5 (2013)
Mafia II: Classic (2011)
Mafia III: Classic (2016)
Where did it go wrong?
 
insaneprimate

insaneprimate

Forum regular
#4
Avalonica said:
Cyberpunk 2077 had eight years of development and these games are still way more advanced:

Watch Dogs 1 (2014)
Watch Dogs 2 (2016)
Watch Dogs 3 (2020)
Grand Theft Auto 4 (2008)
Grand Theft Auto 5 (2013)
Mafia II: Classic (2011)
Mafia III: Classic (2016)
Where did it go wrong?
Click to expand...

Well... it could be that... after they became a publicly traded company they treated all their talented and experienced employees even more like disposable/exchangeable assets and in doing so lost many of the talented people that created The Witcher 3... and therefore simply lost the ability to create masterpieces! You know... like all the other game studios that got too big... at some point the delusion sets in that only the brand and its IPs are of value... the fact that this value had to be created through talent, skill, creativity and hard work is somehow always totally lost on those suits at the top... i wonder if this is some kind of inherent flaw in the human mind... i mean... it happens every god damn time... without fail!
Post automatically merged:

rednhax said:
Pretty soon, people will be comparing CP2077 to NHL and Need for speed.

How about you compare it to other open world RPG's instead of comparing it to action games.
Click to expand...

Wouldn't change much i am afraid...
 
Last edited:
Avalonica

Avalonica

Fresh user
#7
insaneprimate said:
Well... it could be that... after they became a publicly traded company they treated all their talented and experienced employees even more like disposable/exchangeable assets and in doing so lost many of the talented people that created The Witcher 3... and therefore simply lost the ability to create masterpieces! You know... like all the other game studios that got to big... at some point the delusion sets in that only the brand its IPs are of value... the fact that this value had to be created through talent, skill, creativity and hard work is somehow always a total lost on those suits at the top... i wonder if this is some kind of inherent flaw in the human mind... i mean... it happens every god damn time... without fail!
Post automatically merged:



Wouldn't change much i am afraid...
Click to expand...

I think you explained it perfectly for me.
Post automatically merged:

rednhax said:
Maybe they should tell Steam, Epic and GOG, and all the media who classify it as an RPG.
Also, I play it, and it has a lot more in common with RPG then action adventure games.

The closest game experience to CP2077 IMO is Fallout 4
Click to expand...

Absolutely not! Fallout 4 is a breathing and living world excluding working cars and bikes (unless you use mods from Nexus). Cyberpunk 2077 fails miserably if we compare this game versus the ones I presented in the list. Just look on the videos and then start up Cyberpunk 2077 and experience the mess.
 
Neurojack

Neurojack

Fresh user
#8
If 2077 isn't your cup of tea, there are still zillions of GTA clones out there, all playing roughly the same. Rockstar itself has recycled and remade, endless times, the same game over the years. Personally I didn't bought this game to play car robbery, civilian shooting or police chases. Some common elements can be seen between the games and are also here for flavor, that is, to make the city seem more lively and/or "realistic"... but they sure aren't what this game is about.
 

Guest 3847602

Guest
#9
Car theft simulator having more advanced driving, police chase mechanics and traffic behaviour than Cyberpunk? Big WOW...
Let's compare tennis in GTA 5 (2013 game) to Top Spin 4 (2011 game) and see how clunky it is:



Embarrassing, riiight?
 
insaneprimate

insaneprimate

Forum regular
#10
ooodrin said:
Car theft simulator having more advanced driving, police chase mechanics and traffic behaviour than Cyberpunk? Big WOW...
Let's compare tennis in GTA 5 (2013 game) to Top Spin 4 (2011 game) and see how clunky it is:



Embarrassing, riiight?
Click to expand...

Ouch...
 
R

rednhax

Forum regular
#11
Avalonica said:
I think you explained it perfectly for me.
Post automatically merged:



Absolutely not! Fallout 4 is a breathing and living world excluding working cars and bikes (unless you use mods from Nexus). Cyberpunk 2077 fails miserably if we compare this game versus the ones I presented in the list. Just look on the videos and then start up Cyberpunk 2077 and experience the mess.
Click to expand...

Let's agree to disagree!
I spent over 300 hours in Fallout 4 and loved it, but CP2077 beats it by a very long shot.(At least for my taste)

But if you are gonna compare both, you need to compare them both at the state they were in at launch, excluding all the patches, DLC and expansion for Fallout. Fallout 4 was also a mess when it launched, especially if you had an Nvidia card.
 
insaneprimate

insaneprimate

Forum regular
#12
rednhax said:
Let's agree to disagree!
I spent over 300 hours in Fallout 4 and loved it, but CP2077 beats it by a very long shot.(At least for my taste)

But if you are gonna compare both, you need to compare them both at the state they were in at launch, excluding all the patches, DLC and expansion for Fallout. Fallout 4 was also a mess when it launched, especially if you had an Nvidia card.
Click to expand...

Well... if i compare let's say... the perk systems of both games... CP77 falls waaay short (at least for me).
 
Kalfear

Kalfear

Forum veteran
#13
rednhax said:
Pretty soon, people will be comparing CP2077 to NHL and Need for speed.

How about you compare it to other open world RPG's instead of comparing it to action games.
Click to expand...

LOL or they stop whining all together
Man that would be super :D LOL

Its pretty easy to see where CDPR got their influences from and while some might have done better. They completely different games and thus face completely different issues

The biggest influence on CP2077 were clearly Deus Ex Human Revolution and DE Mankind Divided
However the DE games were not open world, were not remotely as large as CP2077, and at no time came even close to onscreen polygon counts you find in CP2077.

Conceptually you see the massive influence DE had on CP2077
But practically you can not compare the games

But what can we do
Haters going to hate
We saw the online hate for this game ramping up BEFORE it released and we see it continuing now after release
 
insaneprimate

insaneprimate

Forum regular
#14
Kalfear said:
LOL or they stop whining all together
Man that would be super :D LOL

Its pretty easy to see where CDPR got their influences from and while some might have done better. They completely different games and thus face completely different issues

The biggest influence on CP2077 were clearly Deus Ex Human Revolution and DE Mankind Divided
However the DE games were not open world, were not remotely as large as CP2077, and at no time came even close to onscreen polygon counts you find in CP2077.

Conceptually you see the massive influence DE had on CP2077
But practically you can not compare the games

But what can we do
Haters going to hate
We saw the online hate for this game ramping up BEFORE it released and we see it continuing now after release
Click to expand...

Criticism is not hate! There are legitimate criticisms to be made about this game and reducing those down to "haters gonna hate" is intellectually dishonest.
 
R

rednhax

Forum regular
#17
insaneprimate said:
Criticism is not hate! There are legitimate criticisms to be made about this game and reducing those down to "haters gonna hate" is intellectually dishonest.
Click to expand...

The difference is how the message is delivered: Haters attack, are biased and strongly opinionated, point out only negatives, and completely disregard the positives.

I am all for constructive criticism that points out action points, supported by facts that follows logic and structure and help build an idea.

But a lot of post here on the forum are just complaints instead of suggesting improvements.

Here is a nice post that contains constructive criticism:
forums.cdprojektred.com

[Suggestions] List of features to Add/ Improve/ Expected/ Missing. Feel free to add your own.

NOTE: MIGHT CONTAIN SPOILERS! IMPORTANT: Guys, lets strictly keep this thread only for Suggestions without delving into Politics or any off topic matter. We don't want this to be deleted. I love the game! Thank you so much for a great game CDPR! However, these are my concerns and suggestions...
forums.cdprojektred.com forums.cdprojektred.com
 
insaneprimate

insaneprimate

Forum regular
#18
rednhax said:
The difference is how the message is delivered: Haters attack, are biased and strongly opinionated, point out only negatives, and completely disregard the positives.

I am all for constructive criticism that points out action points, supported by facts that follows logic and structure and help build an idea.

But a lot of post here on the forum are just complaints instead of suggesting improvements.

Here is a nice post that contains constructive criticism:
forums.cdprojektred.com

[Suggestions] List of features to Add/ Improve/ Expected/ Missing. Feel free to add your own.

NOTE: MIGHT CONTAIN SPOILERS! IMPORTANT: Guys, lets strictly keep this thread only for Suggestions without delving into Politics or any off topic matter. We don't want this to be deleted. I love the game! Thank you so much for a great game CDPR! However, these are my concerns and suggestions...
forums.cdprojektred.com forums.cdprojektred.com
Click to expand...

I would say the difference is mostly in the intent... haters are hating for the sake of hating (man that sounds dumb) while actual fans rage because they desperately wanted this game to be as good as advertised and still do! (i count myself among the latter).
 
zeemanefekti

zeemanefekti

Fresh user
#20
ooodrin said:
Car theft simulator having more advanced driving, police chase mechanics and traffic behaviour than Cyberpunk? Big WOW...
Let's compare tennis in GTA 5 (2013 game) to Top Spin 4 (2011 game) and see how clunky it is:



Embarrassing, riiight?
Click to expand...

Thank you for this in all its sarcastic glory. It is unbelievable that people are hard-comparing CP2077 to games that have similar elements but are clearly not of the same cloth.

CP2077 should be compared to (the new and inferior) Fallout games, DeusEx titles and System Shock and its derivatives. As there is no real agreed on academic definition for rpg games and their subgenres (CP2077 would in my opinion be a modern action adventure rpg with FPS and stealth mechanics), we can only really agree or bicker (yes, not debate but bicker) on this theme. There is no real "truth" to this matter, just mostly subjective opinions.

One should also remember that Rockstar has remade and perfected their sandbox adventure concept for a decade and over multiple different games. CDPR has just released their first ever 1st person action rpg with a living and breathing scifi setting. TW3 did not come out of nowhere to be as successful as it was and is, CDPR made two games before it and had around 10 years for honing their concept. Rockstar has made their own journey with sandbox titles and naturally will be more refined in all things related to the sandbox mechanics in a straight comparison. It is just insane to compare CDPRs first modern setting games sandbox elements to titles like GTAV or RDR2 and demand the same and even higher level of polish straight out of the box. No matter what their marketing department has been saying. CDPR made this game from scratch.
 

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