You do see your character at times (not to mention there is photomode), and there is no harm in having customization.
I was in favour of FPP long before E3 2018 -- it's on this forum somewhere, in an old and now locked thread -- based on personal preferences (first person is definitely more immersive to me). So what if the character isn't visible for most of the time? I personally don't care, or wouldn't care rather.
Many people do, which is perfectly fine and understandable, but not everyone does.
The developers had a clear vision, which they shared and underlined many, many times. Their vision doesn't please everyone, but no vision ever does.
I've had more than enough of these threads in the past two years, so I'll say no more on this topic.
I know what you mean, I've been on a Beth Forum of one type or another ever since I got the Internet, this same discussion comes up regularly as clockwork. Yes some like First and some like Third, the Dev decided First was their preferred way to go and they announced that very early in the process. So why did some players buy it if they hate First Person, if it was announced it was Third Person like the Witcher 3 (which I honestly can not play) I would never have purchased Cyberpunk.
I can not see the immersion in third because it is so unnatural, playing as the 'character' needs to be done from the characters perspective (from their eyes) not the players watching a character from behind. Fine if you enjoy it but I do find the reason given for it to be better to be rather weak, mostly it feels like Third is as I've said before like watching a video of a game you can control, or a film, that's what it makes me feel when I do try to play a Third Person Game.
Why wouldn't they make another 3rd person game? This is new territory for them going first person and people are shitting on them for it and it's absolutely disgusting how they are being treated.
Because it's not just about First Person only. They removed cut scenes. They did both at the same time. This a problem for a lot of people. It's why people hate Johnny and feel V is under utilized. I don't have a problem with FP mode. But what did it really acomplish? The character sits down. Or we have to do our own camera work. When people talk back and forth. It's not dynamic in anyway. It's not like we are solving a puzzle, or doing other things. We are sitting, and just staring most of the time.
The game needed cinematic cutscenes to fill in this problem. A perfect example is when Takemura is watching the monitor in the diner. His face is away from us. And we have a crap view of the TV. That should have been a cutscene. So we can see reactions of Takemura, V's reactions, and close ups of the monitor. The game is basically us playing out cut scenes. Without a camera and editor. The way the characters walk around in rooms as they talk. The way V sits in chairs and changes positions. Which we don't even see most of the time. It all screams, directing cinematic cutscene at one point. But just cut out the camera work.
If I had access to the in game camera. I would go into one of the sitting dialog scenes and edit a cutscene together myself. What the game has now, is basically a blocking cut scene.
Because it's not just about First Person only. They removed cut scenes. They did both at the same time. This a problem for a lot of people. It's why people hate Johnny and feel V is under utilized. I don't have a problem with FP mode. But what did it really acomplish? The character sits down. Or we have to do our own camera work. When people talk back and forth. It's not dynamic in anyway. It's not like we are solving a puzzle, or doing other things. We are sitting, and just staring most of the time.
The game needed cinematic cutscenes to fill in this problem. A perfect example is when Takemura is watching the monitor in the diner. His face is away from us. And we have a crap view of the TV. That should have been a cutscene. So we can see reactions of Takemura, V's reactions, and close ups of the monitor. The game is basically us playing out cut scenes. Without a camera and editor. The way the characters walk around in rooms as they talk. The way V sits in chairs and changes positions. Which we don't even see most of the time. It all screams, directing cinematic cutscene at one point. But just cut out the camera work.
If I had access to the in game camera. I would go into one of the sitting dialog scenes and edit a cutscene together myself.
Knowing it for two years is not the point. There's a lot of immersion lost in doing away with everything. VS being in first person only. But also having cutscenes to flesh and or fix issues that the story didn't correct over the variations. I don't have to be a game maker to talk about cinematography. I'm a professional editor.
I think as the Moderator mentioned this is a thread about preferring First Person or Third Person, they did not stuff up as such by using First Person and removing cut scenes together as suggested here.
First Person has always been what this game was going to be, unless anyone here has never read anything online about Cyberpunk being First Person in the last two years then you have a right to complain.
Cut Scenes were removed as late as maybe even the day before release and added into the day one update?
The two issues are totally independent of each other and its unfair using them as a joint attack on the dev. They thought it would be more immersive this way and for my playing I 100% agree but after Witcher I'll be honest it totally threw me.
I will say again and keep repeating it every couple of days, IF anyone complaining about First Person knew in advance that is what the Dev decided then WHY did you even buy it? I have said I normally will not buy 3rd Person games, someone else said they always look for games that are not 1st Person.
Voicing our preference is something we have done since 3rd Person started to creep into some games. Actually rubbishing the Dev for their decision because YOU do not like 1st Person but you still went ahead and bought the game sounds totally hypocritical IMO.
it takes very little effort to give people a third person option and it is just dickery to suggest otherwise. Oh no cut scenes. I dunno... like it's so hard to force perspective during a cut scene.... like... I dunno... it already does.
A number of people have posted in this thread that they can't play 1PP games because they get nauseated, though it seems like most other people just skip on by those posts without comment. But imo this is perhaps the most significant reason for a future update to provide the option for 3PP. 3PP gives people with inner ear issues, vertigo, etc. a point of focus that allows them to play the game.
That's weird as I have suffered from quite severe inner ear problems for some 15 years, actually put me in hospital on occasions. 3PP I find harder to follow visually/mentally when the view swings around from the 'behind you' aspect as that's just like what inner ear issues can cause. Sudden unexpected vision changes (and movements) can cause problems with the inner ear, apart from anything else that can disorientate you enough to lose your feeling of balance. That dizziness you get when you stand up too quickly is inner ear catching up, that can easily be duplicated by some cameras following a 3PP.
1PP has the cross hair (normally to focus on) or the centre of the screen (the direction you are going) were I would suggest most 1PP players keep their eyes on. 3PP of those I have played some have the nauseating thing with what feels like the camera spinning around the screen to keep behind you. You see far more of the world around for a moment than your brain would be expecting until you get back into running a fairly straight line. That's where I struggle, keeping sight on the were I am going focussed in my brain, while the screen itself can be moving all over the place.
For those who can play 3PP well and I mean keep up with a mouse and keyboard in like a 1PP game I have nothing but praise for. Especially those who can do it with a console type controller, I feel (and look) drunk watching myself on screen with one of those things.
it takes very little effort to give people a third person option and it is just dickery to suggest otherwise. Oh no cut scenes. I dunno... like it's so hard to force perspective during a cut scene.... like... I dunno... it already does.
If you know it's that easy I assume your a professional animator, if the Dev does not add a 3PP but does add modding utilities maybe you could do it for everyone, I'm sure they would appreciate it. Cheers
it takes very little effort to give people a third person option and it is just dickery to suggest otherwise. Oh no cut scenes. I dunno... like it's so hard to force perspective during a cut scene.... like... I dunno... it already does.
Funnily enough, yeah I am, but it doesn't take a pro to point out that 3pp is already supported whilst driving a motorcycle in-game. It's also irrelevant what the Dev's "want". The Dev's lied their pants off about how good this game would be. The AI... garbage. The list goes on and on. add a damn 3pp option. It's not rocket science.
Funnily enough, yeah I am, but it doesn't take a pro to point out that 3pp is already supported whilst driving a motorcycle in-game. It's also irrelevant what the Dev's "want". The Dev's lied their pants off about how good this game would be. The AI... garbage. The list goes on and on. add a damn 3pp option. It's not rocket science.
I mean, on the point of vehicles, is there a game that is first person based that forces you to also do first person when you are in vehicles? That would almost certainly make almost every players mad. Also there is a difference in doing vehicles in third person and basing a whole game in third person. I am not saying that it would necessarily be bad, however certain gameplay aspects would certainly be impacted if you are able to play both in third person and first person.
It's also irrelevant what the Dev's "want". The Dev's lied their pants off about how good this game would be. The AI... garbage. The list goes on and on. add a damn 3pp option. It's not rocket science.
Sure... you can place some blame on developers for perhaps prioritising things wrongly in regards to polish, however I do think it's relevant what the devs want when they are the ones creating the game... you are being upset for all the wrong reasons, they have never advertised third person pov and if I were you I would manage expectations for the next couple years because if third person were to ever come out it would likely be in conjunction with multiplayer.
You're right! That being said my point is that just because third person is supported in vehicles does not mean it is necessarily a planned but scrapped feature (though it could be, however from all the info of the game we got before it came out that seems not to be the case). Also with the currently buggy interior lighting, head position/pov from inside the car AND the ridiculously small visibility on some of the cars, i can't imagine first person only driving in cyberpunk.
Some hate it, some don't like it so much, some adore it, etc...
Let me tell you a story:
Once upon a time a certain game developing company announced a game called Cyberpunk 2077. Originally it was announced as an openworld rpg game in the cyberpunk genre and would handle a combination of 1st and 3rd person view. One could deduce several outcomes from what was described there, some of those being a 3rd person game with some parts in 1st person or a game that favors 1st person along with an optional 3rd person (like the Bethesda games).
Is it right, wrong or naive to make such assumptions? Yes ... no ... maybe? Back then (even today it seems) not one cyberpunk title had been developed as a huge openworld (rpg) game with 3rd person view (as far as I know at least). Now finally one would be developed, even with a character creator, and for many by no one less then CD Projekt Red who had released two nice 3rd person openworld rpg's back then. So it didn't take long before a hype started and after the release of the masterpiece The Witcher 3 the hype only grew bigger.
Then, after several years of hype, for many THE cold shower happened in 2018, followed by another in 2019. Many colorful comments followed fueled by frustration and disappointment (let's keep it at that), because: How long do we have to wait from now on before finally a huge openworld cyberpunk (rpg) game will be developed with 3rd person view? Were those comments right or wrong? Yes ... no ... maybe? Not relevant in this story.
Many others reacted to those comments in equally colorful ways. Between those, some sensible reactions erupted, one of them being: Buy and play the game before you criticize it.
Yes, now I'm going to repeat myself. Well, many gave it a shot and played the game, and now they're criticizing. Welcome to "the lack of 3rd person view" and similar topics. I think that's the whole story in a nutshell. Before you react, remember that you came out of your own volition to this topic to ask this particular question.
See, I wouldn't mind 1st person so much except when the FOV bugs out and increases to kingdom come when you decide to wait for the various missions that require you to sit or lean against something for the scene to shift.
In general, the shift to 1st person to make it more immersive is....a dumb point imho because a toggle does the exact same thing while offering people a preference, but I can at least respect the attempt. What gets me is that most cutscenes never even try to pull you out of V's body to offer any sort of cinematography or a chance to see our character's facial expression, and that back and forth is something I enjoy.
