My take on why this game failed so hard, despite how good Witcher 3 was

[Mobster100]

I am not a developer, programmist, or anything like that.

But think about it logically. With the Witcher 3, CDPR had lots of experience. The Witcher 1 and 2 are games with lots of flaws (especially 2, with its clunky inventory, broken minimap etc.) but they provided them experience for the Witcher 3. They knew (more or less) what to do and what not to do, because all the Witcher games share the same setting: a medieval fantasy with lots of combat, intense story, and lore.

This is not the case with Cyberpunk 2077. The game is their first title set in a futuristic setting with guns, cars, skyscrapers. They even changed the camera perspective.

They simply didn't have enough experience with that kind of game, and they failed.

That surely played a part. But honestly I think their biggest issue, might have been that they didn't have a "functional" engine for the type of game they were making, if we are to believe what is said, that the engine was developed alongside the game. Then it should also be fairly obvious I think, that if the engine run into issues so will the whole development of the game.

And something could suggest that this is in fact an issue, looking at some of the bugs in the game, which could potentially be issues with the engine and not as such the game itself. But just speculating.

 

[Nea.Schaefer]

it was not meant to be a good game. pretty everything in the game is stolen from hollywood movies, thrown together in one pot, hyped by a movie star, surrounded by huge eye candy adverts to generate as much dollari as possible.

the greatest „content is cut during developement all the time“ swindle that gaming industry has seen so far.


“take over night city“

how does the game end for real?

 

[Gillian_Seed]

it was not meant to be a good game. pretty everything in the game is stolen from hollywood movies, thrown together in one pot, hyped by a movie star, surrounded by huge eye candy adverts to generate as much dollari as possible.

the greatest „content is cut during developement all the time“ swindle that gaming industry has seen so far.

I agree with this, I think it's fairly self evident.

 

[SaphironX]

I mean I enjoy it, I kind of want to put it down and wait a year to pick it back up though. Like I was just on a mission with panam, and she'd driving, and the wheel is sliding back and forth but her hands were stationary.

You don't see that in many games. like the animation for her to turn the wheel as she drive just didn't seem to exist at all. The we were in this incredibly bad storm and we got to shelter except around my character it was pretty clear except for having his hands up and grunting every few seconds.

I mean a minor example but how did the dev team test that sequence and decide that was ready to ship? Either one? The storm made me think of randy marsh in south park when global warming was supposed to be killing eveyrone, freaking out with nothing there.

And every time i call my bike now it's 90% under the pavement so i can't ride it. So my bike is essentially unusable.

This COULD be a truly amazing game. It just needs time. And I wish they'd waited a year or two more, and gone exclusively next gen.

 

[xShonuffx]

I am not a developer, programmist, or anything like that.

But think about it logically. With the Witcher 3, CDPR had lots of experience. The Witcher 1 and 2 are games with lots of flaws (especially 2, with its clunky inventory, broken minimap etc.) but they provided them experience for the Witcher 3. They knew (more or less) what to do and what not to do, because all the Witcher games share the same setting: a medieval fantasy with lots of combat, intense story, and lore.

This is not the case with Cyberpunk 2077. The game is their first title set in a futuristic setting with guns, cars, skyscrapers. They even changed the camera perspective.

They simply didn't have enough experience with that kind of game, and they failed.

"Fail."

What I hate about people using this word is that they tend to use it like its a point of no return.

Failure is actually a good thing. You learn from your mistakes, and next time, you do better. Or, you fail again. Either way, you learn from it.

The unfortunate reality about game design is that if your designing a game, especially a big one with a big team and company, even if you win, you lose because gamers never do appreciate the work and time that goes into making these things. Game design is hard, its not easy by the slightest, its even harder to be successful at it. Making a game that can appeal to a large target audience in order to cash in is a science and a gamble. We don't see the long hours in the offices. The thousands of lines of code they write. The hundreds of art that gets discarded. The months composing a song, the days making those unique sound effects. The 1000's of pages of story and script work. The stress and anxiety people suffer. The trouble at home with family, the isolation of your friends. All in the span of 3 or more years.

We don't appreciate this because we don't see it, we only see the game and we are selfish. We only want the product and could care less how we get it as long as we do and we get it fast.

Cyberpunk 2077 was an ambitious project, something no one has ever attempted at this scale, the amount of content they wanted to put in this game was unheard of but of course it was exciting and of course we rooted for them.

I'm not saying CDPR did not screw the pooch here, but if their is any failure, as already stated, its with the management and management alone.

 

[PepeSmug]

That, and the Witcher 3 was overrated, or more specifically, technical and gameplay flaws were overlooked in favor of the narrative and characters.

 

[Guest 3847602]

That, and the Witcher 3 was overrated, or more specifically, technical and gameplay flaws were overlooked in favor of the narrative and characters.

I don't think "overrated" is the right word. Everyone's prerogative is to rate the game however they want. Those players who value narrative over combat mechanics and deep RPG elements love TW3 because it excels at one thing that's most important to them. Nobody plays and praise TW3 for combat, just like nobody plays and praise Dark Souls for story.
So, what's different about Cyberpunk, a game which also excels at writing and atmosphere (like TW3), but has average RPG mechanics (better than in TW3) and non-interactive world (exactly like in TW3)? Intentionally vague marketing combined with insane hype and expectations ranging from 1st person Disco Elysium to futuristic GTA. Unlike TW3, which had two predecessors who are also carried by strong writing instead of gameplay, CP2077 is a new IP and huge number of people expected to see everything they ever wanted from the video game inside this one.
edit: typo

 

[exxxed]

I seem to recall spending more time with my "romantic" option in cp than i did in w3 IE questing an getting to know them

I seem to believe, if you only play either one game or the other and nothing else, the cast is alot more developed and you the player get to know them better in CP as opposed to geralt already knowing them and having a relationship already developed with them.

This is why I can't get behind the ''The Witcher 3 was all so much better than Cyberpunk'' because to me, being invested in The Witcher 1 and The Witcher 2, The Witcher 3 was a HUGE disconnect (who's this Yennefer and why am I searching for Ciri?!?!?!!??!?).

It took me until the second playthrough and some time spent with the characters to get on board with the new Geralt's goals.

The only thing that was consistent was Nilfgaard invading.

 

[kofeiiniturpa]

They simply didn't have enough experience with that kind of game, and they failed.

I don’t think it’s a case of incompetence in creating something, or ”how” to do it, but rather a case of not fully knowing ”what” to do. The team they had was fine, they’re not interns.

Hence the crude copypaste features from their previous title, half finished and cumbersome other features whose design portrays a lack direction and awareness of how they might affect other features and the experience as a whole, and the troubled dev cycle as a whole.

If they had a clear view of what they wanted and more humility with their scope, they would’ve managed just fine. But as it is, it seems that the directors didn’t seem to be at the same page with themselves and now you have sorry clusterfuck that aims to please everyone instead of a product with clear end-experience in mind regardless of if ”everyone” will like it or not.

 

[iseeitake]

Nobody expected the spanish, i mean W3, or atleast not to the extent of the ppl waiting eagerly for CP2077

If CP2077 released before W3 it be a different story being played imo

Correct me here when im wrong as im sure most will but

I seem to recall spending more time with my "romantic" option in cp than i did in w3 IE questing an getting to know them

I seem to believe, if you only play either one game or the other and nothing else, the cast is alot more developed and you the player get to know them better in CP as opposed to geralt already knowing them and having a relationship already developed with them.

Ppl wanting to sit an drink an eat, when in W3 do you do it outside scripted scenes just like CP?

Story? Subjective from person to person

Features? W3 does have more i guess because of gwent but CP does have boxing and street races though wee could always do with more

On a 1 v1 game v game basis, bugs, crashes aside i personally feel more attached to the cast in CP than anything offered in W3 simply because im forging these relationships, im furthering them, im building them a hell of alot more than anything W3 offered, CP cast beats any cast in any Witcher game on a 1v1 basis and if we got a trilogy of CP games with a continuation of the same cast aswell as relationships and V as our PC i sure as hell will undoubtedly hold my hand up and say it will probably sit up as the best trilogy of games i've ever played even if every one launched with the same bugs and glitches but had the same expertly written storys and characters.

Luckily i live in a world where i can sit and enjoy both equally if i choose which i will

Firing squad at the ready

Reading your comment I see you haven’t fully played TW3

For example, TW3 has a lot of romance options that had their own side quest. 2 of which are part of your main story. So you do build quite a relationship with them.

You also have fight matches and horse races.

Drink and eat? Really? Well TW3 had random NPC drinking and eating too. Some you could even sit down and talk to or play Qwent with.

You’re right about one thing. CP will have nothing close to Qwent. It was so successful that they even made a standalone game and a story mode version.

BTW, V has nothing on Geralt’s character.

 

[Krul2k]

Reading your comment I see you haven’t fully played TW3

For example, TW3 has a lot of romance options that had their own side quest. 2 of which are part of your main story. So you do build quite a relationship with them.

You also have fight matches and horse races.

Drink and eat? Really? Well TW3 had random NPC drinking and eating too. Some you could even sit down and talk to or play Qwent with.

You’re right about one thing. CP will have nothing close to Qwent. It was so successful that they even made a standalone game and a story mode version.

BTW, V has nothing on Geralt’s character.

Its called opinion an i see you have yours

Yenn in skellige an Triss saving the mages an the son at the masked party, less time spent with both than even V spends with say Panam an both fully developed and already potentially in a relationship with Geralt.

Maybe i should've worded it better an said apart from Gwent CP has the exact same in boxing an races

V has nothing on Geralt?? Abit like story an subjective since i see plenty prefer V

As i said im glad i live in a world were wee can enjoy both

 

[BigRock22]

BTW, V has nothing on Geralt’s character.

That is an unfair comparison. You're comparing apples to oranges.

Geralt is over 90 years old in TW3. Not only have you spent 2 games beforehand exploring his story but he is someone heavily burdened by his witcher past. He is also universally recognised in TW world as the Butcher of Blaviken.

The premise behind CP2077 is completely different. V is a nobody whose initial goal is to become a 'legend' and later he tries to save himself from the chip. He purposefully has no backstory and is meant to start with a blank sheet. The player is given the opportunity to build & live his story.

Therefore who you prefer is highly subjective.

 

[Obsidian_Crane]

The success of a game is measured in sales and people playing it. CP2077 has succeeded by both metrics, and that's with the disaster that is their console launch.

Noise makers on the internet are not indicative of success or failure.

 

[linegenrou]

rushed game and bad directing
TW3 director knew what he was doing, I remember one interview with him saying they wanted each side-quest to be unique, didn't have to be something major, but a little something that stood out to the player.

what the cyberpunk director decided was to bloat the game with repetitive content because the main story was too short.
so you had a million NCPD markers with just shards showing some convo between NPCs you don't know so you don't care about 'em, it's the equivalent of the skellige's spoils of war x100. something out of ubisoft games

 

[a3n3a]

I believe that even in the most charitable light possible, Cyperpunk 2077 has seriously flawed game mechanics which, if unaddressed, will give most people the impression that it is indeed a failed game.

Whether they are right to present this game as such, I don't know.

Game-changing, revolutionizing futuristic RPG
> failed
Amazing open world full of rich details and locations (PC)
> success

etc

It's all a matter of perspective.

 

[Restlessdingo32]

Failure is actually a good thing. You learn from your mistakes, and next time, you do better. Or, you fail again. Either way, you learn from it.

It's the second best way to learn something provided you learn from it. The trouble I see with CP is many of the questionable mechanics were ported over from TW3 in a damn near identical form.

We don't appreciate this because we don't see it, we only see the game and we are selfish. We only want the product and could care less how we get it as long as we do and we get it fast.

I do not think this is true. The well done areas deserve praise. Even the effort itself placed into certain weak spots, assuming it was genuine, deserves praise. Sometimes you just don't get it done right. This praise has been provided. Yeah, there is a lot of negativity. I can't think of many, if any, instances where it was directed at developers.

I don’t think it’s a case of incompetence in creating something, or ”how” to do it, but rather a case of not fully knowing ”what” to do. The team they had was fine, they’re not interns.

Hence the crude copypaste features from their previous title, half finished and cumbersome other features whose design portrays a lack direction and awareness of how they might affect other features and the experience as a whole, and the troubled dev cycle as a whole.

If they had a clear view of what they wanted and more humility with their scope, they would’ve managed just fine. But as it is, it seems that the directors didn’t seem to be at the same page with themselves and now you have sorry clusterfuck that aims to please everyone instead of a product with clear end-experience in mind regardless of if ”everyone” will like it or not.

If the captain or captains don't steer the ship right everyone is in for a bumpy ride.

You’re right about one thing. CP will have nothing close to Qwent. It was so successful that they even made a standalone game and a story mode version.

The standalone game where they claimed they'd return the game to it's roots and constructed a completely different one. Oh, and consoles. Here is an idea, let's make a mobile version. Sorry consoles, we can't support ya anymore. <--- The pinnacle of consumer friendly.

Sorry, I'm not all rainbows and unicorns. Something to work on perhaps....

Maybe i should've worded it better an said apart from Gwent CP has the exact same in boxing an races

TW3 had races, boxing and Gwent. The Gwent analogue is matching up hexadecimal characters in a certain order. Because, ya know, computers. FFFE belongs somewhere in there.

 

[weirdwayne15]

I disagree with the concept that the game "failed". It clearly didn't "fail". It didn't instantly become "the greatest game of all-time, #1 on world-wide charts, and lauded as an instant classic, setting the standard for all similar games to follow..."

2.) It's a relatively short, single-player game. (It's really unlikely for an SP game to compete with the ongoing popularity of an MP game.)

5.) It's not what many players were "expecting", but just listening to many of the harshest reviews and criticisms out there, I would need to argue that they are based on hearsay, misinterpretation, or outright assumption -- not objective understanding of what was actually announced or revealed. (In short, speculation and imaginings being treated as official announcements and verified confirmations.)

Going to have to completely disagree with you on MP games. Many people like them, I'm not among them, but even so we aren't comparing a multiplayer game to a single player game. We're comparing single player to single player.


Second I have followed this game for a LONG time, and I don't know why a pinned thread where the devs made many "confirmations" was taken down as many of our "expectations" were asked about and confirmed in that thread. [...]

 

[linegenrou]

Amazing open world full of rich details and locations (PC)
> success

etc

It's all a matter of perspective.

it's definitely NOT an amazing open world
it's a pretty looking game, look a bit closer and you see broken AI and basically a dead city with mannequins wandering around aimlessly

 

[a3n3a]

it's definitely NOT an amazing open world
it's a pretty looking game, look a bit closer and you see broken AI and basically a dead city with mannequins wandering around aimlessly

I meant an open world in the literal sense, a world where I can walk anywhere the game allows me too, and discover all kind of locations and static events

broken AI / lack of dynamic events was something I implied with seriously flawed game mechanics

 

[linegenrou]

I meant an open world in the literal sense, a world where I can walk anywhere the game allows me too, and discover all kind of locations and static events

broken AI / lack of dynamic events was something I implied with seriously flawed game mechanics

it still fails because you can't walk around everywhere, you can't enter 99% of the buildings or stores. in TW3 you could enter every single house.