Except the glitches, I only attracted the cops because of the gunfire in the encounters (I'm stealth player but many or most of encounters are almost impossible to stealth, at least in early stage)
I was law-abiding like a NPC when I first played this game, only active attack in the encounters. Now if I find the mobs den that have somethings, with yellow and below level icon, no cop nearby, not so likely to accidentally hit civilians, I'll poke when I see
Even in GTA I'm like this. I usually only attack NPCs like drivers with road rage
Ok, for the Basilisk, you don't have to kill them (Panam could, it's her choice). And how to say that... If you travel in the world (and read some shard), we can easily say that Militech (like Araska), kills all those who annoy them. Basically they're not good guys...
For Voodoo boys, you help them. But V didn't know they will kill Netwatch's Guys...
Netwatch is an official law enforcement organization, and the Voodoo boys are criminals whose actions could have led to the collapse of the local Night City network. V didn't know that when agreeing to help them, but they did know the Voodoo boys were criminals.
Also you can't prove any of those Militech soldiers had done anything wrong, and it's still theft. As I posted before the golden rule of being a Solo is not getting caught. It's why V's eyes mess with cameras to blur their face. So when people do get caught shouldn't they be punished?
Netwatch is an official law enforcement organization, and the Voodoo boys are criminals whose actions could have led to the collapse of the local Night City network. V didn't know that when agreeing to help them, but they did know the Voodoo boys were criminals.
Also you can't prove any of those Militech soldiers had done anything wrong, and it's still theft. As I posted before the golden rule of being a Solo is not getting caught. It's why V's eyes mess with cameras to blur their face. So when people do get caught shouldn't they be punished?
I haven't played the entirety of the game yet but from what I've played so far you are allowed to play it in many different ways. You can be lethal or non-lethal, you can be stealth or gun-blazing. the game allows you to play how you prefer to play. If you want to go and blow off some steam, kill bystanders and blow up cars, the game also let's you do it. But what kind of a game would that be if you were not to be pursued by police? As many of you mentioned, V is a freelancer, a merc. He is not a member of any of the gangs of Night City so non of the gangs bribing the police would ask the police to not take him down. By the logic of the world of Cyberpunk 2077 our protagonist would be pursued as non-associated. In other words: the police won't get into trouble by killing him off.
Now, the way the police works right now is terrible in comparison to the GOOD elements of the game. It's behaviour does not fit the rest of the game because it feels unnatural, superficial, fake and cheap.
Removing police from the game would be yet another missing system like riding the monorail, being able to customise the player, their equipment, their vehicles and buy and customise their apartments/properties. Is that the path we want to force CD Projekt into going for? Removing the content because we think it's difficult?
That brings another argument to my mind: humans achieve things not because they're easy, but because they are hard. We strive for challenge. We climb mountains, dive in oceans, go to space. But making a game not a mess is too much to ask, it would seem.
And one last thing: a choice. What is forgiveness without sin? What is good without evil? What is light without the darkness? That's what decisions are. You have a choice. Most people would decide to not kill a civilian. But that is their choice and the game won't simply show you a message on the screen and reload the last save. The game will present you with a consequence for your actions and a challenge to overcome. That challenge should not be a punishment. Because a punishment for you doing something against devs intent is your save reloaded or you being teleported back to your intended path. It should be a consequence of your actions.
Numerous time, I have a warrant against me because of a stray bullet hitting a passerby. It happens a lot when i fight indoor and an enemy stand before a door or a window with NPC wlaking around outside like the Armagedon is not happening next door.
But it is not the major flaw. On a mission, I HAD to fight some cops but, afraid of the broken warrant system, I ran away and lose the rewards. In this mission, you can shoot the policemen without immediate and deadly repraisial but there is no way to know that. By giving mixed signals, it broke this part of the story.
But why so much focus on the cop response? Perhaps because killing the NPC is the sole and only way to interact with them?
You can not :
-Play at the arcade.
-Go eat somewhere.
-Go drink.
-Race outside of quest.
-Have scores at shooting ranges.
-Play at the casino.
-Obtain a realistic response for your behaviour.
...
Ultimately, the only way to see the world feeling your presence is by killing everyone.
There were more moments which showed NCPD in the same colours like gangs .. they are just working for government with own amount of dirt on their hands. I occasionally use NCPD (MaxTac) as ultimate test of my V in melee combat, but except this there are just very rare moments when is there given reason (gaming) for engage in longer fight with them. I remember one situation where ncpd patrol guarded crime scene where was legendary loot ... they went hostile to my presence and it was obviously their last mistake . Imo there should be much more in game in regards to police including possibility join them or work with gangs and become criminal, or stay somewhere in the middle ... but this may need big changes and very likely will never happen in this game.
Short answer, it's a half-baked game mechanic, breaks immersion when the other game systems are designed to promote it and conflicts with the lore/setting.
The immersion of an RPG breaks when you see your enemies pop in-to place. Police were a shining example of that. It showed itself as an aspect not thought through to be engaged, when in reality it should've been a competent consequence to your actions. I remember something about them being designed to stop the player and teach them a lesson to not try commit crime like it's a GTA game. Instead the mechanic was so goofy, transparent and shallow, people obviously turned towards making fun of it.
It served as a really simple and short generalization of the game. Not that I agree or disagree with that.
Um no, V does a lot of illegal stuff like steal a biochip. The cop stuff is due to the cops being so overwhelmed that they can't respond to the majority of calls. The golden rule of being a Solo in Cyberpunk is don't get caught.
Ok, the 'law' is different in 2077. Edgerunners or mercs walk the line between legal and illegal. Because law enforcement is basically just killing people who make too much ruckus, mercenaries are hired to do almost everything else. Stealing is generally not enforced by the law, because everybody steals from everybody, and if someone steals from you, that is grounds to kill them, or hire someone to steal it back.
The relic was actually already "stolen" when V is trying to take it(by yorinobu). And, by many standards it was illegal technology to begin with. Its literally a body stealing technology, they stole the technology from another corporation 50 years ago. And it was initially used as a mind stealing technology. BTW, can Arasaka legitimately "own" Johnny's consciousness? He never agreed to that. Its also a job essentially contracted to Netwatch, a corporation in charge of regulating net technology, or the VDBs acting to essentially free an illegally obtained soul, as an act of faith with Alt, who is essentially the representative of digitally stolen consciousnesses.
A lot of V's other thefts fall in line with a PI's job.
Killing someone in response to grievance, or if you believe yourself to be in danger is not illegal in night city. If someone robs you, and you have them killed, the law shrugs it off.
Also, netwatch is not actually a government organization, its a private company paid by corporations to generally enforce some semblance of impartial(between corporations) order on the net. They are basically moderators. Its questionable if the VDBs are doing illegal acts. There is no law against accessing the old net, its just seen as a really bad idea by those in charge of maintaining the city networks. In fact most of the "law" enforcement are just people paid to enact someone else's idea of what they think is right. Like corporate security and Edgerunners. By the time V is dealing with the VDB's, netwatch has already illegally captured, and tortured the leadership of the VDBs, because they seek to make contact with old net AIs.
Basically in many ways NC is mostly a lawless society, the only people who get justice is those who take it, or pay people to take it. Mercs are the people who people pay to take it. The only laws the government of NC enforces is against egregious acts and senseless killing. In any legal dispute, generally whoever wins, without openly killing civilians is the riteous party.
Numerous time, I have a warrant against me because of a stray bullet hitting a passerby. It happens a lot when i fight indoor and an enemy stand before a door or a window with NPC wlaking around outside like the Armagedon is not happening next door.
But it is not the major flaw. On a mission, I HAD to fight some cops but, afraid of the broken warrant system, I ran away and lose the rewards. In this mission, you can shoot the policemen without immediate and deadly repraisial but there is no way to know that. By giving mixed signals, it broke this part of the story.
But why so much focus on the cop response? Perhaps because killing the NPC is the sole and only way to interact with them?
You can not :
-Play at the arcade.
-Go eat somewhere.
-Go drink.
-Race outside of quest.
-Have scores at shooting ranges.
-Play at the casino.
-Obtain a realistic response for your behaviour.
...
Ultimately, the only way to see the world feeling your presence is by killing everyone.
I haven't played the entirety of the game yet but from what I've played so far you are allowed to play it in many different ways. You can be lethal or non-lethal, you can be stealth or gun-blazing. the game allows you to play how you prefer to play. If you want to go and blow off some steam, kill bystanders and blow up cars, the game also let's you do it. But what kind of a game would that be if you were not to be pursued by police? As many of you mentioned, V is a freelancer, a merc. He is not a member of any of the gangs of Night City so non of the gangs bribing the police would ask the police to not take him down. By the logic of the world of Cyberpunk 2077 our protagonist would be pursued as non-associated. In other words: the police won't get into trouble by killing him off.
Now, the way the police works right now is terrible in comparison to the GOOD elements of the game. It's behaviour does not fit the rest of the game because it feels unnatural, superficial, fake and cheap.
Removing police from the game would be yet another missing system like riding the monorail, being able to customise the player, their equipment, their vehicles and buy and customise their apartments/properties. Is that the path we want to force CD Projekt into going for? Removing the content because we think it's difficult?
That brings another argument to my mind: humans achieve things not because they're easy, but because they are hard. We strive for challenge. We climb mountains, dive in oceans, go to space. But making a game not a mess is too much to ask, it would seem.
And one last thing: a choice. What is forgiveness without sin? What is good without evil? What is light without the darkness? That's what decisions are. You have a choice. Most people would decide to not kill a civilian. But that is their choice and the game won't simply show you a message on the screen and reload the last save. The game will present you with a consequence for your actions and a challenge to overcome. That challenge should not be a punishment. Because a punishment for you doing something against devs intent is your save reloaded or you being teleported back to your intended path. It should be a consequence of your actions.
the police is the consequence of your actions. The reality is, there isn't really a good way to have police actually be a deterrent to crime in a game world that doesn't bend the rules of virtual reality, unless the game is designed around it.
Its a fair point, that in a generally well realized world, unreal mechanics stick out. But to realize a believable police force that actually discourages crime, in a realistic city is a whole entire game's worth of resources and development.
And really, not even gta achieves that, as the cops/robbers play doesn't discourage crime at all.
Without reading any further, don't even need to guess you make full use of the fast travel system, where as I don't. Hench why you forgot an option. With that everything's said.
Ok, the 'law' is different in 2077. Edgerunners or mercs walk the line between legal and illegal. Because law enforcement is basically just killing people who make too much ruckus, mercenaries are hired to do almost everything else. Stealing is generally not enforced by the law, because everybody steals from everybody, and if someone steals from you, that is grounds to kill them, or hire someone to steal it back.
The relic was actually already "stolen" when V is trying to take it(by yorinobu). And, by many standards it was illegal technology to begin with. Its literally a body stealing technology, they stole the technology from another corporation 50 years ago. And it was initially used as a mind stealing technology. BTW, can Arasaka legitimately "own" Johnny's consciousness? He never agreed to that. Its also a job essentially contracted to Netwatch, a corporation in charge of regulating net technology, or the VDBs acting to essentially free an illegally obtained soul, as an act of faith with Alt, who is essentially the representative of digitally stolen consciousnesses.
A lot of V's other thefts fall in line with a PI's job.
Killing someone in response to grievance, or if you believe yourself to be in danger is not illegal in night city. If someone robs you, and you have them killed, the law shrugs it off.
Also, netwatch is not actually a government organization, its a private company paid by corporations to generally enforce some semblance of impartial(between corporations) order on the net. They are basically moderators. Its questionable if the VDBs are doing illegal acts. There is no law against accessing the old net, its just seen as a really bad idea by those in charge of maintaining the city networks. In fact most of the "law" enforcement are just people paid to enact someone else's idea of what they think is right. Like corporate security and Edgerunners. By the time V is dealing with the VDB's, netwatch has already illegally captured, and tortured the leadership of the VDBs, because they seek to make contact with old net AIs.
Basically in many ways NC is mostly a lawless society, the only people who get justice is those who take it, or pay people to take it. Mercs are the people who people pay to take it. The only laws the government of NC enforces is against egregious acts and senseless killing. In any legal dispute, generally whoever wins, without openly killing civilians is the riteous party.
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its interesting that you present a stray bullet as something forgivable.
Post automatically merged:
the police is the consequence of your actions. The reality is, there isn't really a good way to have police actually be a deterrent to crime in a game world that doesn't bend the rules of virtual reality, unless the game is designed around it.
Its a fair point, that in a generally well realized world, unreal mechanics stick out. But to realize a believable police force that actually discourages crime, in a realistic city is a whole entire game's worth of resources and development.
And really, not even gta achieves that, as the cops/robbers play doesn't discourage crime at all.
I don't expect a fully realistic police system. I expect police system to be fun to play. There is so much stuff you can do with it! I'll post some ideas later. Shit, they could do an entire DLC only about that one thing!
I would say I don't shoot NPC's. But that's probably a lie... My point... I never really had a problem avoiding NPCs in combat. I would have picked the model citizen choice because of this, but my in game driving is atrocious. Driving over 100 miles an hour, slam the breaks, and watch your car kill three innocent pedestrians as you make a last second turn because the GPS told me to turn here last second... Don't get mad at me cops! It's hard to slow down at high speeds.
It really upset me when I killed a certain NPC that was trading with Scavs and suddenly, NCPD appeared inside that building.
Right in the middle of those corpses killed by scavs.... but apperently they did not care about them, and were waiting on me.
That was quite immersion breaking (I find akward to think they were just bribed it ws clearly just because how the system works).
The open world in CP2077 is just a background that happens to be there with "why not" attitue. It obviously makes the game feel lacking, even though you are not the type that would cause mayhem for fun. The story is unforgivable drama while the open world is arcade.
Perhaps they should not have make it open world, but I still enjoy the rest to the point I don't find those drawbaks as something crucial, game breaking. Though not 10/10 because of that too.
1. some gangers went hostile and opened fire. As I started firing back, I noticed I was receiving damage from behind. The cops joined with gangers to attack me. No civs involved and they fired first.
2. Attacking a large group for the NCPD, I got stars twice. First time, who knows, I was using a smart SMG at a distance then suddenly the cops attack. Second was understandable, dumping a full mag and a civ runs around the corner gets hosed.
Since V is known to police to a certain extent (ref in 'sinnerman') that would explain cops going red when they see you but CDPR didn't explain or add the mechanic of 'reputation' (for most playthroughs, V's is one of the biggest mass murders in history) ( btw, I want a body count feature to know how many VDB and scavs I've ended)
My problem is the police still appear to close and too suddenly from every which way. Plus, I feel that they should become 'wary' but not hostile less V's 'brandishing' or actively attacking.
Simply not the point. The game is set in a city. A city with crime. A city with police to tackle that crime. The game was advertised as being "the next generation" of open worlds.
Whoa simmer down now. Its just a for fun topic. I know the police system broken and awkward, and people are wanting something on the level of GTA. Because of how I've played my V its a non-issue for me. Its a problem but I dont encounter it because my play style avoids it.
These kind of games let you play your character as you see fit. For me, in most open world games I try to play the characters in a way I think fits their personality. In GTA V, I only really played as a psycho when I was playing as Trevor. I was a relatively sane person playing as Michael and Franklin. With 2077 I saw my V as a mostly law abiding citizen. I try not to kill people that aren't my immediate concern. Even when i'm scanning enemies not always but a lot of times if their list of crimes doesnt involve murder or sexual assault I do a non-lethal take down through quickhacks or blunt weapons. Even with the main target of jobs it depends on what they did that determins if I kill them or us a non-lethal method.
Everyones free the play the game how they like, I just dont see my V as a lunatic.
As I posted before the golden rule of being a Solo is not getting caught. It's why V's eyes mess with cameras to blur their face. So when people do get caught shouldn't they be punished?
I had no idea thats why the face is blurred in cameras, it makes way more sense now. I thought it was because of some weird technical limitation and it was a way of getting around it. Thats pretty cool now that I think about it...but now i'm wondering why V is the only one with this facial recognition scrambling tech?
