Lets appreciate the star of the show

[BigWezz69]

having them go to a building door and then what? doors open for them but you cant enter? or they just dissapear? People would complain about that so having them wander around is probably better.

Again, its not about the fine detail, its the overall scope. Seeing NPC's come out of a building is fine enough, V does not need to be able to enter, all players know that game's must have their limitations.

In order to see the dystopia, the mirror that the city is, the beautiful parts aswell as the ugly parts, the NPCs are scenery and they dont have to do anything complex. It would obviously depend on what you screenshot and exploring would be better but a set of screenshots can do the job, yes. And in that case the AI complexity or lack thereof, doesnt matter.

And that's the issue. You (and I assume others too) see the NPC's as scenery, pretty much mannequins that are just on scene/stage for a screenshot or to be in the way. To only "see" NC rather than be part of it. Its almost like its a film set (or worse, a tech demo), the NPC's wander into view, the shot is taken, move on to next shot.

However, maybe its because a lot of people have played games like GTA V and RDR2 and been exposed to that level of AI complexity they come to see this as the norm, or what AI should be since that AI makes those NPC's a bit more than set pieces for screenshots.

I think when CDPR said they wanted to make the game immersive, people expected the NPC AI to also be immersive and not just a minor feature, since they are part of the world in which the player is supposed to be immersed within, and a city without people is no city at all.

 

[-Nailes-]

Again, its not about the fine detail, its the overall scope. Seeing NPC's come out of a building is fine enough, V does not need to be able to enter, all players know that game's must have their limitations.

fine enough for you, not for others. Games have their limitations yes.

And that's the issue. You (and I assume others too) see the NPC's as scenery, pretty much mannequins that are just on scene/stage for a screenshot or to be in the way. To only "see" NC rather than be part of it. Its almost like its a film set (or worse, a tech demo), the NPC's wander into view, the shot is taken, move on to next shot.

You are still in a topic that talks about the message that the city passes. Not a topic on AI analysis or the main story or gameplay.

I think when CDPR said they wanted to make the game immersive, people expected the NPC AI to also be immersive and not just a minor feature, since they are part of the world in which the player is supposed to be immersed within, and a city without people is no city at all.

the citizens do that just fine. The example you give is of pedestrians turning around when you park your car on the pavement or in the middle of the road. If I did that irl, I'd get a ticket or my car would be towed, so I do what is logical and park in the correct spot. NPCs have no trouble navigating around a correctly parked car. Its the same as with stalking NPCs to see where they go. I'm not a stalker and neither is V, so I dont follow people to their homes. Thats immersion.
In pretty much the same way that I buy the Aerondight Guinevere and drive it around carefully never going over 50 so as to avoid scratches. "but Nailes, you can just respawn that car" and I'll still drive it carefully because I dont want scratches on my expensive hypercar, thats immersion. I have no trouble seeing NC, which is why I made this topic.

Cars that get stuck on a seam on highways, thats an issue they need to fix. NPCs not going having routines is not an issue. And as I said, if people want the same AI as RDR2 or Fo4, they are setting unrealistic expectations, well, nothing new there.

 

[BigWezz69]

You are still in a topic that talks about the message that the city passes. Not a topic on AI analysis or the main story or gameplay.

It goes hand in hand, NC is the people and the city, you cannot have one without the other.

the citizens do that just fine. The example you give is of pedestrians turning around when you park your car on the pavement or in the middle of the road. If I did that irl, I'd get a ticket or my car would be towed, so I do what is logical and park in the correct spot. NPCs have no trouble navigating around a correctly parked car. Its the same as with stalking NPCs to see where they go. I'm not a stalker and neither is V, so I dont follow people to their homes. Thats immersion.

And that is how you chose to play, there is no correct way of playing, others do play differently, and AI should be able to navigate a basic obstruction.

In pretty much the same way that I buy the Aerondight Guinevere and drive it around carefully never going over 50 so as to avoid scratches. "but Nailes, you can just respawn that car" and I'll still drive it carefully because I dont want scratches on my expensive hypercar, thats immersion. I have no trouble seeing NC, which is why I made this topic.

Again, you choice of play style, it is not the correct, or incorrect way of playing, just your way. When I buy a fast car, I buy it to go fast (in game ofc).

You are confusing immersion with simulation. Simulations are immersive yes, but you can have immersion without having to play a simulator style of game.

No one would really want to live in CDPR's NC, nor would they want to live in Mike Pondsmith's NC as its too dangerous. Well noone who is sane that is.

Cars that get stuck on a seam on highways, thats an issue they need to fix

I can most certainly agree with that.

NPCs not going having routines is not an issue. And as I said, if people want the same AI as RDR2 or Fo4, they are setting unrealistic expectations, well, nothing new there.

Un real expectations because CDPR are unable to make something like that? I don't think its impossible for them, hard sure, and it depends on the engines limitation.

 

[ChrissyVicious]

Night City definitely isn't the star of this game..maybe in the books and interviews CDPR makes it sound that way..but once you play the game and explore..its a dead boring place to be..graphics on my ps5 (I know is still the ps4 version) look like a ps3 game and sometimes worse..the buildings are plain..vehicles and npcs look like children drew them..the star of the game is is still in the dressing room waiting for its big entrance to the show

 

[-Nailes-]

Most has been said, not going to repeat everything, just respond to this

Un real expectations because CDPR are unable to make something like that? I don't think its impossible for them, hard sure, and it depends on the engines limitation.

Any good developer studio(like CDPR) can make that. But requires work on the engine, yes. It takes a lot of time and work. If your developers work on the engine for 10 years, you have to pay them for ten years without any money coming in because you are developing and not selling games. Thats capitalism. If CDPR makes another cyberpunk or two, the AI will likely improve and become more complex aswell, as they continue where this game left off. As they rework the engine to do what they want it to do. Just as Rockstar has been able to work with the AGE and then RAGE engine for a couple decades now. I dont think thats difficult to understand.

I mentioned Duke Nukem Forever before, that whole project went down the drain because 3d Realms didnt want to be outdone by other games. They wanted the best and kept buying different engines and reworking them(the Unreal engine being the last). Take Two, whom they had contracted to publish the game and kept pouring in money got tired of it in 2010 and gave the whole project to Gearbox. 3D Realms started as an innovative and successful publisher called Apogee, now its a small studio owned by a Danish investment company with only one IP left.

 

[BigWezz69]

Any good developer studio(like CDPR) can make that. But requires work on the engine, yes. It takes a lot of time and work. If your developers work on the engine for 10 years, you have to pay them for ten years without any money coming in because you are developing and not selling games. Thats capitalism.

I think people forget that TW3 still sells, and Gwent is also a money maker for CDPR too.

 

[SigilFey]

I think people forget that TW3 still sells, and Gwent is also a money maker for CDPR too.

Cyberpunk still does alright, as well.

Again, TW3 was going to be an incredibly hard act to follow no matter what. What I still love about CDPR is that their primary focus is capturing their vision, not raking in money. The simplest, most capitalistic way of handling CP2077 would have been to simply clone Witcher 3's gameplay and reskin it. They went after something totally new instead. Might not have been an instant legend, but I agree with the OP:

It's the best, most believable, most detailed open world city I've ever seen. I'm an aesthetic and immersion junky, and while there are certainly issues and rough spots with the overall game, it did nothing to keep me from becoming hopelessly captured by the streets of NC. I was constantly engrossed for hours just walking or driving around and discovering new areas. So unique -- so distinct -- so believable. I've lived in a lot of different places, and I'd say this is the first game that really made me feel like I was in a true city space. (GTA V is the runner up, but I've always felt the detail of the GTA series breaks down a bit in the smaller details. And no game has ever made a city feel as truly populated as Cyberpunk does.)

 

[Erdrick80]

The way the city looks is only part of its appeal to me.. I enjoy playing the gigs and NCPD encounters to learn more about the people and main NPC's in a zone. Every time I do a playthrough, I pick one zone to explore and complete reading all the shards as they come up. In watson I always save Jotaro until last now.

There's plenty of places to explore, back alleys and the like but there's also the roof tops, each level seems to have it's own life going on.

You took the words out of my mouth. Exactly!! how i feel. Well said brother!