Gameplay overhaul mod

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Have played today with this mod. It was really amazing.
Many points that bothered me in the original game have been optimized in this mod and some were solved even better than in the original. For example the level scaling problem, with this mod the game keeps consistently challenging till the end. The outfit system were completely reworked, so there is no more need to look for legendary outfits. A common outfit has the same stats and mod slots as an legendary outfit. So you can choose what you like to wear and you don't have to look like a clown just because you need the legendary jacket because of the amount of mod slots. Much parameters can also be adjusted by the player itself. I can only recommend the mod. Personally I would appreciate it if CDPR would implement some of this changes, because it improves the game a lot and optimize points that really bother players.
 
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That's what I wanted. Going to replay the game now.
The mod maker is talented and very responsive, so feel free to give it a go. Some of it is based on weapon and armor balance mods that the mod maker has had out for a while. However, also be aware that this mod was just released two days ago, and still needs a lot of balancing itself -- there were two revisions in the first two days. And, the changes impact a lot of things, like store prices.
 
Personally, I have read the description twice and also played two missions with this mod enabled on level 42. So, after a few hours of gameplay I have probably come to the conclusion that I won't use it for this - my very first - playthrough. While it does keep the gameplay challenging and I like the aspect of being able to basically wear and use anything I want, I still have a few issues with the mod:
  1. I'm not a fan of level scaling and try to avoid it whenever possible. If this means I can roflstomp my enemies so be it. However, I didn't mind Witcher 3's Enhanced Edition no-level approach.
  2. Gear loses value and while I am still using gear that looks good and has acceptable stats, I do enjoy to find the odd legendary and iconic item.
  3. Crafting does not seem necessary
However, many gameplay aspects really look and feel enjoyable, therefore I went ahead and shared this mod. Furthermore, it seems perfect for a second playthrough :)
 
Personally, I have read the description twice and also played two missions with this mod enabled on level 42. So, after a few hours of gameplay I have probably come to the conclusion that I won't use it for this - my very first - playthrough. While it does keep the gameplay challenging and I like the aspect of being able to basically wear and use anything I want, I still have a few issues with the mod:
  1. I'm not a fan of level scaling and try to avoid it whenever possible. If this means I can roflstomp my enemies so be it. However, I didn't mind Witcher 3's Enhanced Edition no-level approach.
  2. Gear loses value and while I am still using gear that looks good and has acceptable stats, I do enjoy to find the odd legendary and iconic item.
  3. Crafting does not seem necessary
However, many gameplay aspects really look and feel enjoyable, therefore I went ahead and shared this mod. Furthermore, it seems perfect for a second playthrough :)
I think that he has a lot of good ideas, but they need to be playtested and honed. Level scaling, for instance. As you mentioned, I don't like it either. But the entire game currently is balanced around the idea, and it's going to take some time to rebalance the entire game around not having it. I'm glad the author is giving it a go though. So if anyone has the time and wants play with the mod and give him feedback, I'd encourage you to do so. Several of the things he's trying to do are directly related to some of the most frequent gameplay balance complaints that I see on these threads. It might be your best shot at getting some of those changes in the current game.

Edit: Okay, I went ahead and tried it for a few hours, after I realized that a lot of it was based on his earlier mods. I really like what he's done with this.
 
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This modders is making a beastly improvement on the base game. It has introduced the use of drugs that produce effects in combat, improved the AI of the npcs. It has dozens of improvements in all aspects of the game.
  • AI Improvements and Enemy Balancing
  • Armor and Armor Mods
  • Cyberware
  • Explosives
  • Food Drink and Alcohol
  • Gameplay Mechanics
  • Healing and Drugs
  • Melee
  • Perks
  • Player Stats
  • Ranged Weapons
  • Quickhacks
  • Vendors and Pricing
  • Weapon Mods
  • XP and Gigs

I recommend it in combination with the mod that improves the fight with netrunners: "AI Netrunners Enhanced"

Here they are:

"Full Gameplay Rebalance"

"AI Netrunners Enhanced"
 
So gang items now have an identifying .itm tag which causes immediate aggro in their respective turf? So +10 gang items warrant drone strikes? So possessing Epic/Legendary items on your person will cause a mini=boss to seek you out on the entire map, once word gets out of course?

So I can hire a gunner/merc and build turrets with Engineer in leau of these attacks?
 
This modders is making a beastly improvement on the base game. It has introduced the use of drugs that produce effects in combat, improved the AI of the npcs. It has dozens of improvements in all aspects of the game.
  • AI Improvements and Enemy Balancing
  • Armor and Armor Mods
  • Cyberware
  • Explosives
  • Food Drink and Alcohol
  • Gameplay Mechanics
  • Healing and Drugs
  • Melee
  • Perks
  • Player Stats
  • Ranged Weapons
  • Quickhacks
  • Vendors and Pricing
  • Weapon Mods
  • XP and Gigs

I recommend it in combination with the mod that improves the fight with netrunners: "AI Netrunners Enhanced"

Here they are:

"Full Gameplay Rebalance"

"AI Netrunners Enhanced"
Man I'd live those 2 on the ps4 pro
 
This modders is making a beastly improvement on the base game. It has introduced the use of drugs that produce effects in combat, improved the AI of the npcs. It has dozens of improvements in all aspects of the game.
  • AI Improvements and Enemy Balancing
  • Armor and Armor Mods
  • Cyberware
  • Explosives
  • Food Drink and Alcohol
  • Gameplay Mechanics
  • Healing and Drugs
  • Melee
  • Perks
  • Player Stats
  • Ranged Weapons
  • Quickhacks
  • Vendors and Pricing
  • Weapon Mods
  • XP and Gigs

I recommend it in combination with the mod that improves the fight with netrunners: "AI Netrunners Enhanced"

Here they are:

"Full Gameplay Rebalance"

"AI Netrunners Enhanced"

Agree completely, with these two mods, you can start to see that it's possible for the gameplay to be salvaged, for the build system to be meaningful, for the itemization to be less absurd and MMO-ey. FGR is quite customizable too, so if you don't like some things you can change them. It's also got lots of difficulty flavours. I'm really enjoying my playthrough with FGR combat-wise, far more than my initial playthrough when I got the game. (Though the combat was always great in terms of fx impact and basic FPS fun, it always lacked in the challenge department.)

You could also add the mod that makes your own netrunning more difficult (you have to physically jack in to machines or unconscious mobs), and the mod that makes the gang balance more intricate and even more rock/paper/scissorsey. But I'm not sure those veer towards being a bit too fiddly. It's always a balance, and I suppose the balance point is different for different players.
 
Have played today with this mod. It was really amazing.
Many points that bothered me in the original game have been optimized in this mod and some were solved even better than in the original. For example the level scaling problem, with this mod the game keeps consistently challenging till the end. The outfit system were completely reworked, so there is no more need to look for legendary outfits. A common outfit has the same stats and mod slots as an legendary outfit. So you can choose what you like to wear and you don't have to look like a clown just because you need the legendary jacket because of the amount of mod slots. Much parameters can also be adjusted by the player itself. I can only recommend the mod. Personally I would appreciate it if CDPR would implement some of this changes, because it improves the game a lot and optimize points that really bother players.
Even just these 2 things would make me dislike the game so much less... Too bad I'm a console peasant and I must stick with cdpr vision of game design :LOL:
 
FGR is quite customizable too, so if you don't like some things you can change them.
Unfortunately, I cannot get behind the level mechanics / auto scaling thing this mod is doing. I might give it a try for my second CP2077 run regardless, but for the first one I'm going to stick with vanilla. I still appreciate immensely what this guy is doing though :)

It's always a balance, and I suppose the balance point is different for different players.
Personally, I don't care that much about balance in single player games as long as every path is viable.
 
Unfortunately, I cannot get behind the level mechanics / auto scaling thing this mod is doing. I might give it a try for my second CP2077 run regardless, but for the first one I'm going to stick with vanilla. I still appreciate immensely what this guy is doing though :)


Personally, I don't care that much about balance in single player games as long as every path is viable.

I meant (in that context) not "balance" in the "game balance" sense, but just balance between something being too fiddly (and/or simulationist and/or realistic) and easy to play gameplay-wise. As players, we expect game worlds to behave somewhat like the real world, or to at least have their own consistent internal logic, but sometimes that doesn't work because it would be impossible to implement within time/budget constraints, or would make the game too laborious to play - IOW sometimes you just have to accept "gamey" logic.

Some people might like the mod's rock/paper/scissors aspect of doing a specific type of damage against a certain type of mob, having to scan or get to know what mobs are weak to what, etc.,; others might not like it, find it too fiddly.

Given time and refinement, it's probably possible to please everybody to some extent with such a system, but since CDPR clearly ran out of time, they went with the easier option of a dps/scaling model. But that displeases a whole other crowd who prefer a more "lethal" system where your HP and the mobs' HP, your power and the mobs' power, are more on a level as you go, because that feels more realistic to them, and keeps the difficulty high. The dps/scaling system also leads to shitty MMO-style itemization that only clutters up the brain, and is also hugely unrealistic (why does this late version of gun X do so much more damage than an earlier version you used to have, when that damage difference is not down to your modding the weapon - did the factory assembly line robots just have a particularly good day that day? :) )
 
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since CDPR clearly ran out of time, they went with the easier option of a dps/scaling model
No, they just like that. Look at W3. That's their vision of RPG. Same for the looter itemization. It's shitty? IMHO definitely. Some people tried to convince them to go for different approaches here on the forum for many years. Unluckily for us and luckily for other people CDPR love looters. That's what we have.
 
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No, they just like that. Look at W3. That's their vision of RPG. Same for the looter itemization. It's shitty? IMHO definitely. Some people tried to convince them to go for different approaches here on the forum for many years. Unluckily for us and luckily for other people CDPR love looters. That's what we have.
I dunno, given that possibilities are there for the different resistances and a more rock/paper/scissors approach (now exploited by several mods), it seems like they did want to try something different at one point. Maybe they just shied away from it because it was a new thing for them and they were running out of time, so they stuck with what they knew.

Or it might just be a calculated effort by them to take the path of least resistance, while leaving other options open for modders? That's also possible. It's been possible to wrangle decent gameplay out of TW3 with several mods, even with quite different approaches (Ghost Mode vs. W3EE for example), so maybe they just trust that modders will be able to satisfy the dissatisfied anyway, so why bother implementing such things themselves when it would require a lot more testing, etc., to get it right?
 
I dunno, given that possibilities are there for the different resistances and a more rock/paper/scissors approach (now exploited by several mods), it seems like they did want to try something different at one point. Maybe they just shied away from it because it was a new thing for them and they were running out of time, so they stuck with what they knew.

Or it might just be a calculated effort by them to take the path of least resistance, while leaving other options open for modders? That's also possible. It's been possible to wrangle decent gameplay out of TW3 with several mods, even with quite different approaches (Ghost Mode vs. W3EE for example), so maybe they just trust that modders will be able to satisfy the dissatisfied anyway, so why bother implementing such things themselves when it would require a lot more testing, etc., to get it right?
To be honest, there's no hint in any of the marketing material (gameplay, interviews etc) that suggests a different approach to progression than what we have. Even the 2018 demo had already level gated enemies and gear. The resistance mechanic is something already well spread in the RPG genre and is present (superficially, like 99% of the game mechanics in cp77) here as well. But they decided to have it that way probably because they wanted the "play as you want/mix and match" design. You can't have them both easily in a game. As I always say, less is more sometimes. I personally prefer the "fluid class system" to the resistance based design in aRPG, and I would have walked the extra mile and completely cut all stats leaving the progression bound to cyberware, meaning choices of the abilities (and therefore builds) you can have. Something like Prey from Arkane (as I said many times prior to release, so my mind hasn't changed). This is already in the game, obviously, it is just less important than it could have been because of the stats scaling with level which is the main pillar of the progression system. The rest revolves around it to the point of being just flavour, also because the game has way too many skills unlocked via levelling that, at level 50, make you able to do pretty much everything: crafting is completely useless because of the loot system, you can have 20 blades, 20 netrunning, 15-ish in body by mid/end game and do pretty much everything. A lower level cap could have solved this (let's say 30 instead of 50). Actually with 20 netrunning and a tech sniper rifle you're literally a god who can clear entire buildings from the other side of the street, but that's a problem with balancing and embarrassing AI. But that's a completely different problem.
 
To be honest, there's no hint in any of the marketing material (gameplay, interviews etc) that suggests a different approach to progression than what we have. Even the 2018 demo had already level gated enemies and gear. The resistance mechanic is something already well spread in the RPG genre and is present (superficially, like 99% of the game mechanics in cp77) here as well. But they decided to have it that way probably because they wanted the "play as you want/mix and match" design. You can't have them both easily in a game. As I always say, less is more sometimes. I personally prefer the "fluid class system" to the resistance based design in aRPG, and I would have walked the extra mile and completely cut all stats leaving the progression bound to cyberware, meaning choices of the abilities (and therefore builds) you can have. Something like Prey from Arkane (as I said many times prior to release, so my mind hasn't changed). This is already in the game, obviously, it is just less important than it could have been because of the stats scaling with level which is the main pillar of the progression system. The rest revolves around it to the point of being just flavour, also because the game has way too many skills unlocked via levelling that, at level 50, make you able to do pretty much everything: crafting is completely useless because of the loot system, you can have 20 blades, 20 netrunning, 15-ish in body by mid/end game and do pretty much everything. A lower level cap could have solved this (let's say 30 instead of 50). Actually with 20 netrunning and a tech sniper rifle you're literally a god who can clear entire buildings from the other side of the street, but that's a problem with balancing and embarrassing AI. But that's a completely different problem.

Definitely agreed that cyberware and modding should have handled a bigger chunk of the stat increases. For a cyberpunk game, the difference cyberware makes is pretty negligible for the most part. You get more oomph out of your pink hotpants :)
 
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