Let's complain about things that aren't parroted in the media

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XianeX

Forum regular
There are so many complaints about the game but I think the people that do the most complaining aren't the people that have completed the game multiple times in every lifepath and gotten every achievement available in the game. I'd like to hear the complaints of people that ACTUALLY PLAYED the game to a point that they could possibly be more useful in giving their opinions about what should be different.

I have an alternate version of the complaints that I hear, so I'd like to share the alternatives.

1. "When the map opens up at the beginning of the game there's a clusterfuck of data". The game is better that way. It's impossible to figure out everything that's going on in the game world in the first playthrough unless you have superhuman memory. By the second and third playthrough, all of a sudden connections between the shards start forming. What would be USEFUL would be a search system to connect the dots. A bunch of names and places while the player is emphasized to preserve V's life and get the chip out of his/her head. Meanwhile, there is a boatload of back story that the player is collecting and it's EXTREMELY difficult to determine what information is ephemera vs what information is tied to behind the scenes storyline. For instance, the Tucker Albach story is scattered way on the other side of the map. There's no reason a player would review (or even remember) the shards to connect those pieces, but multiple playthroughs make the connections more apparent. If the game allowed the accumulation of a database with search features, it would have been an "Oh! Wow!" moment in at least the second playthrough if not the first.

2. Where the hell is B@D? That character's story is scattered all over the map. In some places that most players may never go. Ironically, he's not even an image in the game LOL! That's not a typical complaint, just my effort to find closures on a bunch of characters LOL!

3. Hideshi Heno. . . Do you know how random and next to impossible to connect that poster with the dialog?! It would have been funnier if Goro heard V's joke about it. . . not a complaint, just more of my random musings. . .

4. It's pretty obvious that the development team was probably learning the algorithms that they implemented, thus some of the glitches that seem like novice work. The spawning is crazy. Chunking for managing them is obviously weird. However, there is a way to make it a feature more than a questionable bug. If the hidden story is that the story is of V from within Alt then some of the glitches are forgivable. Obviously, she was a bad judge of character. . . She had Johnny for a boyfriend. Even as a hacker, the bugs in her mind would manifest beyond the Black Wall. LOL!!!
 
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On my second playthrough I decided to play as an asshole streetkid. That included taking the money from Maiko and going with her plan. Judy was rightfully pissed and the last I heard from her was a text saying fuck you and she's living the city.

I then decide to do the suicide ending, not expecting Judy to be there sobbing over my death as though we were as close as we were in my previous playthrough. Seriously immersion breaking.
 
I feel the game world is so big and detailed, a player would want to 'live in the world' instead of taking drastic actions in the main quests and trying to change it. In reality trying to change a stable power structure usually brings even worse consequences.

I'd like to see more of this "livability" even if it's small details to enhance the roleplaying experience.
Affinity with different gangs and factions - even what you wear defines acceptance and hostility.
Ability to recruit a crew or companion to do dynamically generated jobs for friendly factions.
A mission maker where you can select your employer and search for abovementioned jobs.
Details concerning ownership of property and vehicles - Being able to buy a basic business as a front for your mercenary services? Employing your hired muscle and companions to build things for sale, offer services, gain info on factions and jobs?
V and romanceable characters' apartments currently don't have proper parking lots, the worst being Judy's, can't even fit a normal sized car in there.

Missing sleep option in Judy's apartment, or at least let me interact with the pillows :D
 

XianeX

Forum regular
I feel the game world is so big and detailed, a player would want to 'live in the world' instead of taking drastic actions in the main quests and trying to change it. In reality trying to change a stable power structure usually brings even worse consequences.

I'd like to see more of this "livability" even if it's small details to enhance the roleplaying experience.
Affinity with different gangs and factions - even what you wear defines acceptance and hostility.
Ability to recruit a crew or companion to do dynamically generated jobs for friendly factions.
A mission maker where you can select your employer and search for abovementioned jobs.
Details concerning ownership of property and vehicles - Being able to buy a basic business as a front for your mercenary services? Employing your hired muscle and companions to build things for sale, offer services, gain info on factions and jobs?
V and romanceable characters' apartments currently don't have proper parking lots, the worst being Judy's, can't even fit a normal sized car in there.

Missing sleep option in Judy's apartment, or at least let me interact with the pillows :D
Very good points! All things that I'd really like in the game!!! However, there is plenty of parking for Judy's apartment behind the building (unless you're using a motorcycle LOL!) The affinity issue is BIG! It's an AI problem, and what I think would bring the Fixers closer to what is done in Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri / Civilizations series. I don't think that it's REALLY difficult to implement, but, it would definitely force CDPR to change a huge swath of the engine of the game. The more I think about it, what you described is a merger of Uplink/Hacknet systems and an AI system like Alpha Centauri to manage the gang factions. Also, buildings and apartment ownership are something that most people want. Simply put, too many closed doors. The world doesn't feel lived in, because of them. LOL! Just a bunch of meandering people that live in the streets and the few apartments with hallways LOL!
 
Simply put, too many closed doors. The world doesn't feel lived in, because of them. LOL!
I wonder if it's me, if it's a "french speciality", but when I wandering in a city (whatever the one), it seem "weird" and I don't know why, but all the doors are locked o_O
Without a key, code or electronic badge, I am unable to enter any of the buildings that I can encounter (even less enter in unknow poeple's apartement). So it doesn't seem "unreal" to encounter bunch of locked door in Night City...
 

XianeX

Forum regular
True! I'm not bothered by more doors being unaccessible than openable. I'm more interested in the ones that suggest that they can but don't or can't. That's why I've watched a bunch of videos about weird stuff in the game. I have no expectation that every door will be accessible, but it would be nice to either enter the ones that suggest that they can be. Also, I think it would be interesting to have more characters that have designated residences. It's not a necessity for why I play the game, but I think it would be interesting for the purposes of emersion. Simply, it's not unreal to have closed doors, but it's definitely unreal that people aren't entering and exiting many, if at all. LOL!
I wonder if it's me, if it's a "french speciality", but when I wandering in a city (whatever the one), it seem "weird" and I don't know why, but all the doors are locked o_O
Without a key, code or electronic badge, I am unable to enter any of the buildings that I can encounter (even less enter in unknow poeple's apartement). So it doesn't seem "unreal" to encounter bunch of locked door in Night City...
 

exxxed

Forum veteran
I wonder if it's me, if it's a "french speciality", but when I wandering in a city (whatever the one), it seem "weird" and I don't know why, but all the doors are locked o_O
Without a key, code or electronic badge, I am unable to enter any of the buildings that I can encounter (even less enter in unknow poeple's apartement). So it doesn't seem "unreal" to encounter bunch of locked door in Night City...

To be fair I can somewhat get behind the ''closed doors'' statement myself.

Was roaming through the city center the other day and it its slightly immersion breaking seeing so many store fronts as mere facades with no way to interact with them.

It's an amazing city but having more interactable interiors would have gone a long way, for example, there are so many items of clothing they could all have several individual shops that specialize in certain facets of them (like fashion stores).

Have food vendors and add in a ''light survival'' mechanic where V needs to eat and drink (sleep would suck) so it justifies having them around, or if not have different buffs attached to the several food items, it's Night City we should have some crazy energy drinks that let you see in the dark or synthetic beef burritos that increase strength etc.

How come there's no big shopping malls either?!

Could always add in a race track somewhere or a destruction derby in that massive stadium so you don't have to struggle with the AI following specific routes through the city and getting stuck, just have pre made tracks in a closed off environment and have some small gameplay loops centered around that, how awesome would it be taking some of the nomad vehicles in a stunt rally shoot out...

Have some VR arenas where you can fight hoards of enemies and spawn in friendlies that you can upgrade yourself, or a somewhat tower defense VR game with crazy shenanigans.

Since we're doing NCPD tasks, have us interact with them more, have some police stations, help them with investigations etc. have the gigs naturally open up instead of having all of them available at all times, spread them out in chains of quests. Have one per district and have an NPC relay the tasks on us as we get called in as a merc or something.

Make it less ''gamey'' I suppose.
 
Simply, it's not unreal to have closed doors, but it's definitely unreal that people aren't entering and exiting many, if at all. LOL!
When doors are closed, it's mostly because the building is empty (there is nothing in it and no texture at all).
Like these doors not locked but with empty building (fixed now)

So if an NPC open these kind of doors and players could see the void in it... It's even worst :)
Keep in mind, it's not the same scale of map of TW3 or RDR2, there is literally buildings and doors everywhere... Even with adding 100 doors/apartements/buildings accessible around the city, it's nothing...

Edit : Yes, lot of things could be "better" for sure, but don't forget : "lack of time before release" :)
 
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XianeX

Forum regular
To be fair I can somewhat get behind the ''closed doors'' statement myself.

Was roaming through the city center the other day and it its slightly immersion breaking seeing so many store fronts as mere facades with no way to interact with them.

It's an amazing city but having more interactable interiors would have gone a long way, for example, there are so many items of clothing they could all have several individual shops that specialize in certain facets of them (like fashion stores).

Have food vendors and add in a ''light survival'' mechanic where V needs to eat and drink (sleep would suck) so it justifies having them around, or if not have different buffs attached to the several food items, it's Night City we should have some crazy energy drinks that let you see in the dark or synthetic beef burritos that increase strength etc.

How come there's no big shopping malls either?!

Could always add in a race track somewhere or a destruction derby in that massive stadium so you don't have to struggle with the AI following specific routes through the city and getting stuck, just have pre made tracks in a closed off environment and have some small gameplay loops centered around that, how awesome would it be taking some of the nomad vehicles in a stunt rally shoot out...

Have some VR arenas where you can fight hoards of enemies and spawn in friendlies that you can upgrade yourself, or a somewhat tower defense VR game with crazy shenanigans.

Since we're doing NCPD tasks, have us interact with them more, have some police stations, help them with investigations etc. have the gigs naturally open up instead of having all of them available at all times, spread them out in chains of quests. Have one per district and have an NPC relay the tasks on us as we get called in as a merc or something.

Make it less ''gamey'' I suppose.
The light survival mechanic is something that I've thought about several times. Each playthrough, I either end up selling all of the food Items or end up with a bunch of them that are never used. Being able to see in the dark IS A NECESSITY! I was just thinking yesterday, "Why is there no FLASHLIGHT?!?!??!" LOL. Ironically, the only "real mall" in the game is the one in Pacifica. Definitely under-utilized! I'd love for there to be more racing events outside of Claire's story arc. I'm actually surprised that there aren't more races, considering all of the cool places in the game that would have been better for racing. (Not to mention the racing being hinged to the technical ability attribute). It would definitely be cool if even the game that's played in the River story with the kids could be played outside of that context (which reminds me of the minigames in Watchdogs 1). Which kinda refers back to what @KaliSharma said. Depending on how you play the game, it's noted but not really emphasized that V is an NCPD sub-contractor. The relationship that V has with the NCPD is strikingly odd when you consider this. This is why in my third and fourth playthrough, I've put priority on playing all the NCPD stuff (blue icons) first before playing any of the missions (yellow icons). I think that would have been a better design decision and removed a lot of confusion about how the game progresses.

For instance. It would have made more sense to call the Policing system an APB than a warrant, considering how the NCPD "V hunting" is performed and resolved. It's semantic but has always irked me about them using "Warrant" than "All Points Bulletin".
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When doors are closed, it's mostly because the building is empty (there is nothing in it and no texture at all).
Like these doors not locked but with empty building (fixed now)

So if an NPC open these kind of doors and players could see the void in it... It's even worst :)
Keep in mind, it's not the same scale of map of TW3 or RDR2, there is literally buildings and doors everywhere... Even with adding 100 doors/apartements/buildings accessible around the city, it's nothing...

Edit : Yes, lot of things could be "better" for sure, but don't forget : "lack of time before release" :)
The infamous glitch areas LOL! Remember in the Sandra Dorsett mission with Jackie, where V fans the lady to go back into her apartment. You can't actually go into that room. Obviously, there's a bunch of development overhead that goes into putting those details in. That's why it doesn't bother me too much that people aren't entering and exiting the many doors in the game. It's an aesthetic touch. Honestly, I think if they resolve the chunking issue for how and when NPCs are rendered, it should free up enough memory to allow them to do more with rooms without it becoming a performance penalty on the game's systems. Lately, I've been irked by a bug in Japantown (near the bridge and water) where one of the Scav women is frequently stuck in a building, but ever so often, she spawns with a tech weapon and can shoot through walls, sometimes she can see through the doors. but she can't exit. It's probably one of the more annoying problems in the game but isn't actually game-breaking. My point is that this is why there should be a better use of the doors and storefronts. It's definitely more work for the developers, but it would (in this specific case) solve the annoyance of the enemies that tend to get spawned within buildings with doors or garages, but can't actually get out of them.
 
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So if an NPC open these kind of doors and players could see the void in it... It's even worst :)
Keep in mind, it's not the same scale of map of TW3 or RDR2, there is literally buildings and doors everywhere... Even with adding 100 doors/apartements/buildings accessible around the city, it's nothing...

Edit : Yes, lot of things could be "better" for sure, but don't forget : "lack of time before release" :)
Anyway, it would mean additional models and textures and more I/O load.

Its okay for people to ask new features, improved features but for things like this sometimes wonder, how interesting these would be after Covid.

Myself, I'm kinda indifferent. IIRC there's no washing machine in V's apartment, but I don't even recall for sure if there are laundromats in Night City.
 
Obviously it would be better with more accessible buildings/apartments/houses, but we all know that they were running out of time before the release (and anyway, it would be a huge work to add a lot of interiors which in the end would only be there to "look good")
 
On my second playthrough I decided to play as an asshole streetkid. That included taking the money from Maiko and going with her plan. Judy was rightfully pissed and the last I heard from her was a text saying fuck you and she's living the city.

I then decide to do the suicide ending, not expecting Judy to be there sobbing over my death as though we were as close as we were in my previous playthrough. Seriously immersion breaking.
Judy is such a darling, she sticks with u even after pissing her off and making her tell u to go fuck yourself :ohstopit:
 
1. "When the map opens up at the beginning of the game there's a clusterfuck of data". The game is better that way. It's impossible to figure out everything that's going on in the game world in the first playthrough unless you have superhuman memory.
I could not disagree more.

In other games, when the player nears a location of interest, then those icons start appearing on their map/compass, this stops the map looking littered.

At the moment, the map has pretty much everything on it quest/job wise, it leaves little for exploration and naturally stumbling across events/jobs.

V is not omniscient so V should not know where everything is. Even TW3 did a better job of this with notice boards. Only after reading a notice board would certain quests and question marks appear, this helped keep the map looking cluttered. Obviously going to every notice board strait off the bat would negate this, but that's then a players choice.

Why could V not log in to the NCPD database for jobs or find out what's going on? Or better yet, actually work their way through The Afterlife, doing jobs, helping out ect?

There was a better way of doing it, and CDPR either ran out of time, or actually though slapping everything on the map was a good idea. :LOL:
 
I could not disagree more.

In other games, when the player nears a location of interest, then those icons start appearing on their map/compass, this stops the map looking littered.

At the moment, the map has pretty much everything on it quest/job wise, it leaves little for exploration and naturally stumbling across events/jobs.

V is not omniscient so V should not know where everything is. Even TW3 did a better job of this with notice boards. Only after reading a notice board would certain quests and question marks appear, this helped keep the map looking cluttered. Obviously going to every notice board strait off the bat would negate this, but that's then a players choice.

Why could V not log in to the NCPD database for jobs or find out what's going on? Or better yet, actually work their way through The Afterlife, doing jobs, helping out ect?

There was a better way of doing it, and CDPR either ran out of time, or actually though slapping everything on the map was a good idea. :LOL:
Given the N.C.P.D. system Vic puts in, it's possible that's how V knows where all the events are going on, it came in through the implants. Why we can see them before this, now that's a different story, but once we get our first upgrades, it's fairly plausible for V to have that much intel just from the software.
 
Given the N.C.P.D. system Vic puts in, it's possible that's how V knows where all the events are going on, it came in through the implants. Why we can see them before this, now that's a different story, but once we get our first upgrades, it's fairly plausible for V to have that much intel just from the software.

I get what you are saying, but to me, that's just a cop out.

Notice boards worked well in TW3, perhaps V could have visited the local NCPD precinct in each area to get the new jobs, even meet new characters? Hep MAX-TAC?

MAX-TAC were criminally under used in the game.
 
I get what you are saying, but to me, that's just a cop out.

Notice boards worked well in TW3, perhaps V could have visited the local NCPD precinct in each area to get the new jobs, even meet new characters? Hep MAX-TAC?

MAX-TAC were criminally under used in the game.
One thing a lot of people seem to not understand is that, despite the advancements, technology still has limitations, and that's pretty much what it boils down to. There's only so much that can be added without having to take away from other things. Even in the advanced futures of Cyberpunk and Shadowrun, the hardware can only do so much.
 
People frequently request "job boards". It's not an incredibly bad (or good) idea. The Viktor thing is a good point about the NCPD database. Again, I'll say this. The game presents the story and world better if you do all the NCPD stuff first then do missions. The game should have separated the main game missions AFTER all of the NCPD stuff was done. NCPD stuff first, introduce Regina, then all the other fixers. It allows the player to become familiar with all of NC, it also would be useful if they emphasized from the beginning that V is a NCPD subcontractor. Honestly, I think it should have been as important as the relationship with Jackie. If they would have had that as an intro to gameplay that would have removed the weirdness of V doing most of the game, before the heist, without Jackie as a companion.
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BTW the way they put together the game hides a lot of the Sleeping Dogs parallels. LOL!
 
I could not disagree more.

In other games, when the player nears a location of interest, then those icons start appearing on their map/compass, this stops the map looking littered.

At the moment, the map has pretty much everything on it quest/job wise, it leaves little for exploration and naturally stumbling across events/jobs.

V is not omniscient so V should not know where everything is. Even TW3 did a better job of this with notice boards. Only after reading a notice board would certain quests and question marks appear, this helped keep the map looking cluttered. Obviously going to every notice board strait off the bat would negate this, but that's then a players choice.

Why could V not log in to the NCPD database for jobs or find out what's going on? Or better yet, actually work their way through The Afterlife, doing jobs, helping out ect?

There was a better way of doing it, and CDPR either ran out of time, or actually though slapping everything on the map was a good idea. :LOL:

I definitely do not believe that The Witcher 3 did any better, I think you should reconsider this statement.

But I whole heartedly agree with the rest of your post so much!

There were so many better ways of going about introducing these gigs and hustles, in much more immersive fashions that could have given Night City a lot more character.

A real missed opportunity.
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One thing a lot of people seem to not understand is that, despite the advancements, technology still has limitations, and that's pretty much what it boils down to. There's only so much that can be added without having to take away from other things. Even in the advanced futures of Cyberpunk and Shadowrun, the hardware can only do so much.

Even simply disabling the map icons implying that these hustles are all happening simultaneously all over the map and are just waiting for V to just happen by would work wonders.

Because every hustle has the NCPD dispatcher call happening when you're in proximity, just disable the damned icons CDPR...
 
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