Do you feel immersed in 2077? Well, you're not alone.

[northwold]

I think we do have to bear in mind that different studios have different strengths.

Bethesda, frankly, are so bad at writing that it's quite baffling. The last quest that stuck in my mind in a Bethesda game was the Dark Brotherhood... In Oblivion (all I can remember about Dark Brotherhood in Skyrim is that it was totally f***ing terrible). All I remember about the Skyrim main quest is that it was spectacularly racist/ethnonationalist and so ineptly written that it's possible Bethesda didn't even realise that because they seemed to expect the player to sympathise, together with essentially every character speaking with the same generic narrative voice. But they are very good at giving you a world where the main quest simply doesn't matter and you can potter around doing all the side content. That's their thing.

CDPR are very good at a certain style of writing that gives you better stories at the necessary expense of more constrained player freedom.

I'm not going to stand in the way of people asking for more to do. But at the same time if it's a choice between more stuff to do and the writing, in CDPR's case I want the writing because that is what they're superb at. If in Bethesda's case it were a choice between a do-lots-of-different-things-superficially open world or better writing, I'd want the open world because that is where they excel and their "better" writing is never going to be the best.

 

[medion_no]

I think we do have to bear in mind that different studios have different strengths.

I don't understand why you have to choose. If it is a matter of talent they can hire more people (and god knows people need work these days) and if its a matter of money they can charge for it in the form of dlc/season pass. Lots of people would buy it.
Bethesda are not an example of anything, a company that expects mods to fix their game and make it fun, while they break support for them in a constant basis, i like elder scrolls but hell no.
There are a lot of freelance programmers out there and entire staffs who get fired just after finishing a game...
I know the opinion of the people in paying for the dlc but if the option between having certain things or not having them is to pay for them, let them take my damn money. I would at least like cdprojectk to be more transparent with updates.
I can give an example of Sniper Warrior 3, a game destroyed by criticism for bugs. A single guy in his spare time released an unofficial patch that improved shooting distance, map fallings, enemy spawn, weapon lasers, general bugs, added new vehicles, corrected day and night system, rebalanced the progression tree and a like a ton of fixes more, all of this with no access to source code. A...single...guy in his spare time turned an unplayable mess of a game into an interesting sniper experience.
And then come the companies with the story that adding things after the launch is very difficult... No way.

 

[northwold]

I don't understand why you have to choose. If it is a matter of talent they can hire more people (and god knows people need work these days) and if its a matter of money they can charge for it in the form of dlc/season pass. Lots of people would buy it.
Bethesda are not an example of anything, a company that expects mods to fix their game and make it fun, while they break support for them in a constant basis, i like elder scrolls but hell no.
There are a lot of freelance programmers out there and entire staffs who get fired just after finishing a game...
I know the opinion of the people in paying for the dlc but if the option between having certain things or not having them is to pay for them, let them take my damn money. I would at least like cdprojectk to be more transparent with updates.

Because it's real life. Not all studios have the same sensibilities or priorities.

 

[medion_no]

Because it's real life. Not all studios have the same sensibilities or priorities.

How much money do you think they could make from a dlc/season pass for a game that has sold 18-20 million copies and with a much cheaper investment than making witcher 4? And those numbers that are known. I'm not a mathematician but I think a few. Here I also talk about real life.

 

[Guest 3847602]

You say that but then whenever the argument about a better police system comes up you're the first to step up and say "this isn't GTA, GTA is that way"

Not quite. My stance on the police situation is that if they're gonna revamp it, they should avoid wacky, arcadey GTA-like police system like a plague and inseatd spawn 100 level MaxTac team outside of players' field of view who wold one-shot those players who likes to go on GTA-like rampages. That's why I mean by "this isn't GTA, GTA is that way".
So yeah, I'd welcome the change which would make MaxTac a brutally difficult obstacle. When your only option would be to run away and you'd still have about 5% chance of actually managing to escape. That would be an improvement. I don't see GTA-like system as improvement.

 

[Didacgomez]

Not quite. My stance on the police situation is that if they're gonna revamp it, they should avoid wacky, arcadey GTA-like police system like a plague and inseatd spawn 100 level MaxTac team outside of players' field of view who wold one-shot those players who likes to go on GTA-like rampages. That's why I mean by "this isn't GTA, GTA is that way".
So yeah, I'd welcome the change which would make MaxTac a brutally difficult obstacle. When your only option would be to run away and you'd still have about 5% chance of actually managing to escape. That would be an improvement. I don't see GTA-like system as improvement.

My preference would be a humanity/empathy attribute that you spec at character creation and you loose adding cyberware and killing non-hostile npcs, maybe with the possibility of regaining some upon completion of some quests where you do a good action... when you reach 0 spawn max-tac and game over...simple,elegant,lore friendly and proven in tabletop and Vampire bloodlines.

 

[exxxed]

I don't understand why you have to choose. If it is a matter of talent they can hire more people (and god knows people need work these days) and if its a matter of money they can charge for it in the form of dlc/season pass. Lots of people would buy it.
Bethesda are not an example of anything, a company that expects mods to fix their game and make it fun, while they break support for them in a constant basis, i like elder scrolls but hell no.
There are a lot of freelance programmers out there and entire staffs who get fired just after finishing a game...
I know the opinion of the people in paying for the dlc but if the option between having certain things or not having them is to pay for them, let them take my damn money. I would at least like cdprojectk to be more transparent with updates.
I can give an example of Sniper Warrior 3, a game destroyed by criticism for bugs. A single guy in his spare time released an unofficial patch that improved shooting distance, map fallings, enemy spawn, weapon lasers, general bugs, added new vehicles, corrected day and night system, rebalanced the progression tree and a like a ton of fixes more, all of this with no access to source code. A...single...guy in his spare time turned an unplayable mess of a game into an interesting sniper experience.
And then come the companies with the story that adding things after the launch is very difficult... No way.

It doesn't always revolve around money and talent, the biggest factor is time.

There's a proverb regarding a woman needing nine months to give birth to a baby, in that respect you cannot throw in nine women to give birth to the same baby in a single month.

The best example in this industry is Cloud Imperium Game and Star Citizen/Squadron 42, they've built a thousand people large global expanding studio on crowdfunded money from 2012 to now while simultaneously building the technology and tools that they need to get things done in a way it was never seen before.

*Multiple Physics Grids interacting with each other on a galactic scale from the smallest (single seat ship) to the largest (planet)

*An AI system like we all want with NPC's that have schedules and a simulated universe with trading, pirating, expansions, corporations, mining, travel, combat etc. that exist and evolve regardless of player interaction, called Quanta - very interesting to look into

*Server Meshing where it allows for the server instances to communicate with each other on the fly creating a seamless experience for the players

*Physics based global particle systems that can create anything from a fully rendered and interactable gas giant planet to a nebulae that expands on a radius of hundreds of millions of square miles to expanding flames with it's effect on everything around it and minuscule particles that propagate through and bounce off any environment

*Physicalized objects, everything exists in the world from a single bullet to a massive space station that is housing thousands or hundreds of thousands of different objects from ships to components, guns, clothing, raw material, goods etc. that need to physically be transported to other places for them to exist there

*And loads, loads more

Not even close to being finished after ten years of continuous work and rework of systems that didn't fully pan out the way people expected.

They've hired the best engineers in the industry if you take a look at any of their podcasts or any of the videos on their channels they go into great length to explain the inner workings of these systems, it's not just a pipe dream, it just takes a really long time.

No standard corporation or medium to large company has the drive, time and/or resources to throw at something like this for such an extended amount of time with little to show for it, Cloud Imperium Games is an outlier supported by people like me who donated money towards a dream.

This is why concessions are made every time in standard game development, you can't just throw money and people at a project and expect them to deliver the moon in four years, it doesn't work like that.

It's also easy to say ''take your time'' when a million other angry voices are demanding a product ASAP with some of them threatening to pull their funding and threaten bankruptcy.

We live in a world where we simply have to give up some things on the road to achieving others, it is how it is.

 

[maniak6767]

My preference would be a humanity/empathy attribute that you spec at character creation and you loose adding cyberware and killing non-hostile npcs, maybe with the possibility of regaining some upon completion of some quests where you do a good action... when you reach 0 spawn max-tac and game over...simple,elegant,lore friendly and proven in tabletop and Vampire bloodlines.

in video game vampire:bloodlines you can play with low humanity, police "system" is more annoying than something reasonable (police has same amensia like in GTA series). There's something like Masquarede points, and you can't break it, but never tried to lower it to zero (that's says something about type of player I am).

I think only problem with system in Cyberpunk is - it's not really punishing.AC series it's basically game over when you kill civilian, ba, in new COD it's game over, so you can say it's design choice or there's some policy behind it (like no ability to kill children in Cyberunk).

Also these comparisions GTAvsCyberpunk have nothing to do with how good game is, only with fact what kind of marketing game had before release. You could predict reaction of GTA fanbase, only knowing what kind of games CDPR done before. In my opinion CDPR knew what was coming, so it's only on them to fix this situation.

At some point all these demands started to be really interesting, some reactions were really close to some kind of "Paris syndrome".

 

[Didacgomez]

in video game vampire:bloodlines you can play with low humanity, police "system" is more annoying than something reasonable (police has same amensia like in GTA series). There's something like Masquarede points, and you can't break it, but never tried to lower it to zero (that's says something about type of player I am).

I think only problem with system in Cyberpunk is - it's not really punishing.AC series it's basically game over when you kill civilian, ba, in new COD it's game over, so you can say it's design choice or there's some policy behind it (like no ability to kill children in Cyberunk).

Also these comparisions GTAvsCyberpunk have nothing to do with how good game is, only with fact what kind of marketing game had before release. You could predict reaction of GTA fanbase, only knowing what kind of games CDPR done before. In my opinion CDPR knew what was coming, so it's only on them to fix this situation.

At some point all these demands started to be really interesting, some reactions were really close to some kind of "Paris syndrome".

I don't remember exactly in bloodlines, because there was the blood meter also that lead to frenzy and such.
You can do a kind of positive feedback,that lower humanity increases the chance of commiting a random act of violence and this in turn decreases even more humanity or whatever.
The point at the end, is that cp2077 can include other mechanics in the open world to handle "murder sprees" that don't rely on mechanics that are designed to...promote "murder sprees" as gameplay loops .

 

[maniak6767]

I don't remember exactly in bloodlines, because there was the blood meter also that lead to frenzy and such.
You can do a kind of positive feedback,that lower humanity increases the chance of commiting a random act of violence and this in turn decreases even more humanity or whatever.
The point at the end, is that cp2077 can include other mechanics in the open world to handle "murder sprees" that don't rely on mechanics that are designed to...promote "murder sprees" as gameplay loops .

Yes. if we use Vampire: Bloodlines as example: there's no "fun" element in systems like humanity, police etc. theses system are used to restrict players. But again you don't need use old niche title as example. You can use new COD as example, murdering civilians is not part of gameplay and you don't have to make some advanced systems to prevent it.
Problem with Cyberpunk is you can drive cars, and you can kill people while driving, most (if not all) RPG games don't have "problems" like that. It's new territory for RPGs.

 

[exxxed]

Also these comparisions GTAvsCyberpunk have nothing to do with how good game is, only with fact what kind of marketing game had before release. You could predict reaction of GTA fanbase, only knowing what kind of games CDPR done before. In my opinion CDPR knew what was coming, so it's only on them to fix this situation.

It must have just been me, but really can't remember the game being advertised as a GTA type of game.

I was obsessing over the marketing material before release and at all points I was still expecting an open world Deus Ex meets The Witcher style of game.

I remember reddit posts going apeshit over the cars and sandbox gameplay while other posts were trying to temper their expectations with quotes from CDPR that Cyberpunk is meant to be first and foremost an open world narrative driven RPG.

I've been trying to find any marketing material portraying this game as a GTA style open world sandbox and I just cannot find any that is not some random youtuber or blog post that has nothing to do with CDPR.

In fact I found this random pre-release thread on a random forum with people blowing their expectations through the roof based on mere unsubstantiated rumors sometimes without even linking to anything beyond ''I've seen this posted elsewhere so I'll post this here - bla bla over 1000 NPCs with daily schedules, long lasting relationships with main characters, you can go on dates etc.''

Last post on this page:

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads...ame-released-go-to-new-thread.122398/page-368

The thread is going bananas.

Either way, to circle back to the original point, it wasn't advertised as such so I don't get this argument.

It's like complaining that the new Spider Man games are not like GTA just because they feature a city in an open world, or how people cannot get immersed because Spidey can't drive cars and get into shootouts with cops or joining different gangs and take over territories.

No it's not hyperbole, replace Spidey with being an unaffiliated Mercenary and you get the same argument.

 

[maniak6767]

It must have just been me, but really can't remember the game being advertised as a GTA type of game.

I was obsessing over the marketing material before release and at all points I was still expecting an open world Deus Ex meets The Witcher style of game.

I remember reddit posts going apeshit over the cars and sandbox gameplay while other posts were trying to temper their expectations with quotes from CDPR that Cyberpunk is meant to be first and foremost an open world narrative driven RPG.

I've been trying to find any marketing material portraying this game as a GTA style open world sandbox and I just cannot find any that is not some random youtuber or blog post that has nothing to do with CDPR.

In fact I found this random pre-release thread on a random forum with people blowing their expectations through the roof based on mere unsubstantiated rumors sometimes without even linking to anything beyond ''I've seen this posted elsewhere so I'll post this here - bla bla over 1000 NPCs with daily schedules, long lasting relationships with main characters, you can go on dates etc.''

Last post on this page:

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads...ame-released-go-to-new-thread.122398/page-368

The thread is going bananas.

Either way, to circle back to the original point, it wasn't advertised as such so I don't get this argument.

It's like complaining that the new Spider Man games are not like GTA just because they feature a city in an open world, or how people cannot get immersed because Spidey can't drive cars and get into shootouts with cops or joining different gangs and take over territories.

No it's not hyperbole, replace Spidey with being an unaffiliated Mercenary and you get the same argument.

Nope it wasn't, but it was attracting its fanbase (but you can't say it objectively if it was intentional or not, without knowing CDPR intentions). I would say marketing had "funky" vibe (watch heist trailer), when game and its theme is rather grim,dark, bleak, sometimes (often) not really pleasant. Hype culture is marketing tool, no matter if CDPR is "rightous" or not, they were not able to lower expectations that's on them.
In my opinion many people doing all these comparisions (most of them are pointless), because they were not happy with game and what it is. I don't like this kind of reaction, because next step of this would be marketing team dictating what kind of game devs should make, not devs. Luckily Cyberpunk is Pondsmith IP's and I don't think he will allow to go "full retard".
Like I said I get, I don't like comparisions, even comparing it to Bloodlines or Deus Ex, Cyberpunk is it's own thing and devs had every right to make game they wanted. Buying game, even after watching trailer - is not guaranted "customer satisfaction", same like with movies, books etc.etc.One simple thing like adding driving cars to RPG game can create many many new diffuclties, people just ignore (willingly or not), that it's pretty clear that CDPR's inentions was to make "different" game.

 

[nirile1410]

To me, it's always important to look at the context.

Police isn't needed 100% in all open worlds games... BUT... If you tease me with Max Tac in the trailers, I kinda expect that right?
And also, the police system is working in the quest (main or gigs), because is scripted.
This tells us that the police system is supposed to be in the game, and was in the developers idea.
So for Cyberpunk, the Police System it's not "out of place" or something You sohouldn't care, but part of the gameplay, and the lore.

Btw, the over 1000 NPCs with daily schedules was actually said from CDPR.
They also said the "More Advanced City in an RPG games..." LOL
A city where You can't interact properly even with vendors...

 

[incomingdamage]

It seems quite possible to me that CDPR just wanted to focus the player as much as possible on the main story and these smaller stories in side quests, while keeping contracts and crime scenes as side activities, to fill somehow the game's open world part this way and build the lore (through data shards mostly, which inform us what happened and why it happened). Maybe they were discussing more side activities while creating the whole concept, but decided at some point that more things to do in the game's world would distract players from the story, which they wanted to give us above all else? Just a thought.
Someone above said that different studios have different strengths and weaknesses, and I guess it's true. CDPR were always, since Witcher 1, best in telling stories, in my opinion.

I think that many players have a problem with Cyberpunk mostly because REDs created a very intriguing environment, which somehow raises a certain hunger for more interaction with it. Night City is excellently designed, it has a very intense atmosphere, so many people might have a feeling that just following the story and side missions in this visually rich environment is not enough. They would love not only to look at the architecture and those colorful crowds, but do something with them. Not only look, but touch as well. Cyberpunk seems to be a game focused strongly on the story though and Night City plays a role of a background for it, most of the time.

If we assumed that some more side activities were to be added to the game, we might ask ourselves a question what would these be exactly. We have to remember that such activities would need to fit our protagonist's characteristics as a merc (because that's who V is) and the game's lore.
- Barber and / or plastic surgeon? I wouldn't count these among side activities, it's just character cutomization system pushed beyond the game's starting point, nothing more.
- Pachinko machines? Well, probably, I guess... You can imagine a merc wanting to entertain themselves between stressful jobs on a small simple arcade game on a machine passed by on the street. How many times though during the whole CP playthrough? Two, three times? We've got much more interesting things to do in a far more excellent environment outside of these arcade machines, so not much point for the devs to spend resources for a few additional minigames played by just a handful of players only a couple of times. Not better to spend these resources on more substantial content (i.e. side missions)?
- What else? Taxi driver? Come on... A merc, gun for hire, rescue mission specialist doing a side job as a cab driver? Sounds a bit ridiculous, doesn't it?
- Tennis? Nah, doesn't fit an action figure like merc V, who lives in a small megabuilding apartment.
- Pool game? Yeah, maybe, in one shady bar somewhere in Heywood. Again, how many times would you play that?
- Prostitutes on every corner? How many times would you like to see those short digital awkward sex scenes in the game?
- Braindances - a couple more of them in the game could be nice indeed, I think, but rather as a part of investigation work. What's the point in watching / rewinding some virtual movies on the market? Isn't the game itself a big braindance already?
- Buying / selling / managing apartments - as the devs expressed themselves already, it doesn't fit much V as a merc having to deal with their life problems and doing dirty work for others. It's not a real estate management simulator. If just managing our megabuilding apartment - sure, why not, but how many times do you visit this place? How many times do you take shower, sit on the couch and watch tv during your playthrough? Even if you want to roleplay an everyday life of a "normal" person, how often would you really want to do that?
- Karaoke with friends in a bar? Are we still in the gritty, dark world of Cyberpunk2077?
- not sure what else we could think of...

I'm myself not against side activities per se, but maybe at least some of them, even possible within the game's world and reality, somehow don't seem to fit the character and the game's purpose. That's how I see it at least.

 

[nirile1410]

It seems quite possible to me that CDPR just wanted to focus the player as much as possible on the main story and these smaller stories in side quests, while keeping contracts and crime scenes as side activities, to fill somehow the game's open world part this way and build the lore (through data shards mostly, which inform us what happened and why it happened). Maybe they were discussing more side activities while creating the whole concept, but decided at some point that more things to do in the game's world would distract players from the story, which they wanted to give us above all else? Just a thought.
Someone above said that different studios have different strengths and weaknesses, and I guess it's true. CDPR were always, since Witcher 1, best in telling stories, in my opinion.

That's a matter of taste and opinion.
If for you the main quest is a wonderfull story or experience, I can agree with you.
For me, the story was nothing too good, so I can see the game is lacking of content.
Choices would be a smart moves here, to replay the main story; and was supposed to be here.

I think that many players have a problem with Cyberpunk mostly because REDs created a very intriguing environment, which somehow raises a certain hunger for more interaction with it. Night City is excellently designed, it has a very intense atmosphere, so many people might have a feeling that just following the story and side missions in this visually rich environment is not enough. They would love not only to look at the architecture and those colorful crowds, but do something with them. Not only look, but touch as well. Cyberpunk seems to be a game focused strongly on the story though and Night City plays a role of a background for it, most of the time.

But If you developer, You promise me that "This city is the most advanced in RPG games" you se why people were expcting this, right?

If we assumed that some more side activities were to be added to the game, we might ask ourselves a question what would these be exactly. We have to remember that such activities would need to fit our protagonist's characteristics as a merc (because that's who V is) and the game's lore.

As a note, I dont see how NPCD scanners atcvitiy fit the character.
A mercenary who do dirty work for fixers and gang, work for COPS to fight the same gangs. Make sense?

Anyway, activities can be:
- Bounty hunter: since you have a scanner, and you can see how much bounty peoples have (seems more fitting, than just works for NPCD).
Also RD2 has this, for example.

- Car race: not a fan myself, but would make sense.

- Aldecados "smuggler mission": get out the city, and smuggle somthing into che city.

-Bar fight: Night City is a dangerous city, so it makes sense you can have a good fist fight.

- Corpo Htiman: get jobs done for corpo

-Stripclubs: actually working stripclubs.

And the list can go on and on....
There ae like 100 activity you can put in, that make sense with the lore and the character...

I'm myself not against side activities per se, but maybe at least some of them, even possible within the game's world and reality, somehow don't seem to fit the character and the game's purpose. That's how I see it at least.

Let's be fair here.
There are a lot of elements of this game and story that doens't fit.
NPCD gigs deosn't fit...
Backpath that merge in street kid doesn't fit...
Takemura change of hearth doesn't fit...
and so on.

So I don't see why It's ok to have misplaced things in story and gameplay, but hey! Don't you dare ask for more content! It's not lore friendly

 

[exxxed]

Nope it wasn't, but it was attracting its fanbase (but you can't say it objectively if it was intentional or not, without knowing CDPR intentions). I would say marketing had "funky" vibe (watch heist trailer), when game and its theme is rather grim,dark, bleak, sometimes (often) not really pleasant. Hype culture is marketing tool, no matter if CDPR is "rightous" or not, they were not able to lower expectations that's on them.
In my opinion many people doing all these comparisions (most of them are pointless), because they were not happy with game and what it is. I don't like this kind of reaction, because next step of this would be marketing team dictating what kind of game devs should make, not devs. Luckily Cyberpunk is Pondsmith IP's and I don't think he will allow to go "full retard".
Like I said I get, I don't like comparisions, even comparing it to Bloodlines or Deus Ex, Cyberpunk is it's own thing and devs had every right to make game they wanted. Buying game, even after watching trailer - is not guaranted "customer satisfaction", same like with movies, books etc.etc.One simple thing like adding driving cars to RPG game can create many many new diffuclties, people just ignore (willingly or not), that it's pretty clear that CDPR's inentions was to make "different" game.

I can see where you're coming from, but regarding ''The Heist'' trailer, it's literally a minute long CGI made for TV add out of thousands of marketing materials, very convenient.

I also believe that particular trailer suffers from a ''subverted expectations'' syndrome, that was the point, make belief rags to riches cliche to be flipped on it's head which was pretty clear coming from the other trailers and presentations, at least to me.

But yeah I agree about tempering your audience's expectations when it comes to such things, but apparently business wise it's not a good strategy even though it costs reputation.

Although I do believe that comparing Cyberpunk to Deus Ex and Vamps The Masquerade has some merit when it comes to immersion to say the least, you may ask why as well and I shall extrapolate.

What makes Deus Ex and Vamps The Masquerade immersive?

It certainly isn't the amazing out of this world AI and NPC interactions, nor is it the amazingly good open world sandbox filled to the brim with mini games and activities (like sitting on a stool at a bar and drinking, you can't in either of them) nor is it the amazingly detailed wanted system that reacts to the player's reputation... I can go on but you get the gist.

What makes them immersive is the brilliantly designed world, atmosphere, level design, lore, characters, soundtrack, narrative, open ended gameplay design and art design, that's it, there's nothing else one can take from these games that can be quantified as immersive and I dare anyone to do that.

So it begs the question, why are these games regarded as the epitome in their respective subgenres (immersive Sim and action-RPG) and Cyberpunk is having such a hard time whilst filled to the brim with the same qualities ''brilliantly designed world, atmosphere, level design, lore, characters, soundtrack, narrative, open ended gameplay design and art design'' ?

Is it because of the open world compared to hub world structures?

Is that it?

The open world is the only reason why people have their panties in a bunch when it comes to Cyberpunk?

Because when it comes to the immersion factor all of these games feature the same design elements to one extent or the other and they are directly comparable while simultaneously having nothing to do with anything resembling Rockstar design language.

It's simply baffling to me how anyone can reason around this argument.

 

[incomingdamage]

But If you developer, You promise me that "This city is the most advanced in RPG games" you se why people were expcting this, right?

Sorry friend, but this seems like constant crying over spilled milk. They didn't choose their words fortunately enough? This shit happens even to the best. And they probably have learned their lesson by now.

As a note, I dont see how NPCD scanners atcvitiy fit the character.
A mercenary who do dirty work for fixers and gang, work for COPS to fight the same gangs. Make sense?

Yes, it actually makes sense to me. Night City is a dangerous place, full of mercs, who do dirty jobs for everyone who pays. The police might take advantage of that and hire even bad guys to get rid of other bad guys, so to speak. It makes sense to me that police in such reality might want to make a "rotten" compromise to get things done and enforce the law every possible way. They aren't golden clean themselves anyway, just like in our world. V is a merc, does shit for money. It's up to you, the player, who you choose to work for.

 

[exxxed]

Btw, the over 1000 NPCs with daily schedules was actually said from CDPR.
They also said the "More Advanced City in an RPG games..." LOL
A city where You can't interact properly even with vendors...

That was a mistranslation made by a German publication in a German Podcast about the development of the game.


"While there are some areas in the Witcher 3 where villagers don’t have a daily routine, they are planning to improve this with giving more than a thousand NPCs a handmade routine."

CORRECTION:

Most people have Automated Routines from a pool which can divert into branching options. Its mostly randomized but remains believable.

https://forums.cdprojektred.com/index.php?threads/corrected-german-podcast-translation.11032286/''

So no, the guy took stuff out of context failed to verify it's source and ended up hyping a few hundred people based on pure nothingness, picture this and then multiply it by a thousand, can you see how stuff like this may have helped spread misinformation and ended up inflating peoples expectations?

That was the only reason why I posted that example, it's at the root cause of the issue.

Now don't take that as me saying that the game would not benefit from these systems, it absolutely would no doubt about it.

I'm trying to reframe the argument from a more negative standpoint (they lied, they promised, I'm being owed this etc.) into a more productive and critical form where we could debate how things like this would actually impact the rest of the game and the experience in general.

Overall a fully fledged out wanted system would impact the general experience very little I'd say and as long as V would not act like a psychopath (which is not a narrative thread in itself so it doesn't make sense from a narrative standpoint to do so) it would not really affect the immersion factor at all.

What would actually affect the immersion factor is the general behavior of the crowds AI and traffic AI, I would definitely want this expanded upon and/or fixed.

Also the introduction of public transport like Delamain, Busses and Trams.

 

[incomingdamage]

That's a matter of taste and opinion.
If for you the main quest is a wonderfull story or experience, I can agree with you.
For me, the story was nothing too good, so I can see the game is lacking of content.

I didn't say anything in my comment about quality of the main story It's a matter of taste indeed, just like you said. What I said was that the devs might have wanted to focus as much as possible on the story because that was what they wanted to give us above everything else. How it actually was with the decision process - I don't know. But that's why I said "might have".

Post automatically merged: Jan 21, 2022

Backpath that merge in street kid doesn't fit...

You mean lifepaths? Corpo / Street Kid / Nomad? It does fit the story. We have a tale about a person who's life changes drastically at some point, whatever their past activities, or even life philosophy might have been. They start from scratch and try to fix their own mess. That's it. The devs even explained to us in a couple of interviews and streams (sorry, can't point you to the right places now) that their intention was to prepare a couple of "background stories" for the character and that's what we got. Unless we assume that they all are filthy liars
Why we don't play separate paths throughout the whole game... Well, it's a game that cost a lot of time and work already. How many additional years would they have to spend creating Cyberpunk 2077 if it was divided into 3 separate complex stories? 10-15 years? More? They had to focus on something relatively smaller. And the game was also probably meant to be a one certain tale - exactly what we received.

 

[maniak6767]

As a note, I dont see how NPCD scanners atcvitiy fit the character.
A mercenary who do dirty work for fixers and gang, work for COPS to fight the same gangs. Make sense?

Anyway, activities can be:
- Bounty hunter: since you have a scanner, and you can see how much bounty peoples have (seems more fitting, than just works for NPCD).
Also RD2 has this, for example.

- Car race: not a fan myself, but would make sense.

- Aldecados "smuggler mission": get out the city, and smuggle somthing into che city.

-Bar fight: Night City is a dangerous city, so it makes sense you can have a good fist fight.

- Corpo Htiman: get jobs done for corpo

-Stripclubs: actually working stripclubs.

And the list can go on and on....
There ae like 100 activity you can put in, that make sense with the lore and the character...

1. bounty hunter: you are bounty hunter, you get eddies for killing NPC, it's way it works in this game.
2. car races: car races are in game, four of them, personally no matter how they will enchance it, it won't be as good, as gigs, side quests.
3. smuggling: there's whole quest around Nomad V smuggling iguana, don't know how do you want expand on it and make it interesting activity, looks more like idea for another quests.
4. bar fights: it's not wild west.
5. corpo hitman: merceneries get jobs through fixers, V is pawn of Arasaka while kidnapping Hellman, many gigs are jobs from corporations...
6. stripclubs: empathy, dicky twister for example, they are stripclubs, especially empathy