Inventory

[Sardukhar]

Could be done, but you'd have to fully develop both systems. Is it worth the cost and development time to do so?

No idea. I guess it depends. People might be very receptive to the choice and you'd get extra kudos. Or, they'd complain because neither system was exactly what they wanted and you'd get..negative kudos?

I'd say it had to do with the investment required to do both systems as opposed to one. You have to fully develop one system anyway. Maybe a grid system? And if you opt for a weight inventory measurement, the grid system goes to multiple pages as the items overflow the pretty gridding, but tracks the weight regardless?

Don't know if that would cause a real issue or not. I'd say sticking every itme with a weight value and then comparing it to the player's max carry would be fairly simple, as opposed to a grid where you have to set a space allocation and a grid value both.

 

[ReptilePZ]

There's no poll.

Why isn't there a poll? Don't make me... think and type words. Anyway, TW3 seems to have an interesting approach to inventory, using both weight and space as a resource for it. Guess we'll have to wait and see how it'll work before we can judge if it's any good, though. Still, I'm intrigued.

As for CP 2077, we don't even know how the game's going to be structured. If it's anything like, say, Shadowrun, then all the Inventory management might be done at your base or w/e, while you're only restricted to things you can actually carry around with you. That'd be interesting, but perhaps a bit cumbersome in an open world. Especially if it's as big as or, God forbid, bigger than TW3's size.

How is inventory handled in the PnP version anyway?

 

[Sardukhar]

There's no poll.


How is inventory handled in the PnP version anyway?

You don't deserve a poll.


It's mostly ignored by Refs, save for mean looks when characters say, "Yeah, I have a cyberdeck, a backup cyberdeck, a Hurricane Assault Shotgun and MetalGear body armour, plus a dufflebag with all my tools, food and sleeping bag! I'm still nimble, right?!"

That gets fixed.

The PnP tracks it by weight compared to your BOD stat and how much you can carry without encumberance, if a Ref does get fussy.

 

[ReptilePZ]

You don't deserve a poll.


It's mostly ignored by Refs, save for mean looks when characters say, "Yeah, I have a cyberdeck, a backup cyberdeck, a Hurricane Assault Shotgun and MetalGear body armour, plus a dufflebag with all my tools, food and sleeping bag! I'm still nimble, right?!"

That gets fixed.

The PnP tracks it by weight compared to your BOD stat and how much you can carry without encumberance, if a Ref does get fussy.

Well, there you have it, the solution. They just need to pack in a GM with every copy of the game, you have all your items with you at all times, but he tells you what you can and can't use. Sorted.

Oooh, I hope I get Marcin as my GM.

 

[Sardukhar]

Well, there you have it, the solution. They just need to pack in a GM with every copy of the game, you have all your items with you at all times, but he tells you what you can and can't use. Sorted.

Oooh, I hope I get Marcin as my GM.

I hope I get you guys as my players.

Snicker.

 

[vongo.859]

There's no poll.

Why isn't there a poll?

Huh. Didn't even occur to me for some reason. Well, if one of you mod-people added a poll I would be eternally grateful!

I'm also inclined to agree that, because we know next to nothing about how the game will be structured, it's difficult to say what inventory system would work best. At some point I might share a few of my thoughts, but first I need to figure out how to articulate them.

 

[Suhiira]

I hope I get you guys as my players.

Snicker.

Oh really?
Are you amenable to logical and supported by real world data discussions about rule alterations?

 

[Sardukhar]

Oh really?
Are you amenable to logical and supported by real world data discussions about rule alterations?

God no! Are you kidding? That sounds a lot like work! That's -why- we have rulebooks! To settle these issue without wikipedia wars!

Plus, I prefer the counter, "if you're so smart, why aren't you rich? Huh? Huh?"

And then laughter.

 

[Suhiira]

Plus, I prefer the counter, "if you're so smart, why aren't you rich? Huh? Huh?"

Who needs the headaches of being rich?
I have a roof over my head, I eat what I want when I want, I have a car I love, what more do I need?

 

[Sardukhar]

Who needs the headaches of being rich?
I have a roof over my head, I eat what I want when I want, I have a car I love, what more do I need?

A bigger inventory.

Duh.

You know the size of your inventory is the size of your value. Come on!

 

[Suhiira]

You know the size of your inventory is the size of your value. Come on!

I predate Yuppies, I measure my self worth/value by the amount of respect and friends I have not the size of my bank account.

 

[Poet_and_Gentleman.598]

Who needs the headaches of being rich?

People who have cancer and no insurance?

I have a roof over my head, I eat what I want when I want, I have a car I love, what more do I need?

The reassurance that your neighbours are not flesh-eating hobos?

 

[Sardukhar]

I predate Yuppies, I measure my self worth/value by the amount of respect and friends I have not the size of my bank account.

Please. Stay on topic.

Are your friends in your inventory? If not, please put them there.

Oooh. Related note: I used to get a kick out of putting alien bodies in inventory in X Com. I want to do that again.

 

[Poet_and_Gentleman.598]

Perhaps they could innovate and have a 3d inventory.

Point,click and put it in the bag.

 

[Sardukhar]

Perhaps they could innovate and have a 3d inventory.

Point,click and put it in the bag.

I'd like a good 3D inventory, actually.

 

[vongo.859]

A 3D inventory is one of those things I've been struggling to articulate, but I'll share some of my ideas thus far. I would love to see it implemented in something, if only to learn from that and see how to make it work best for future endeavors.

To start, I'm in favor of all items being visible on the character at all times and having this influence other aspects of the game. I think organizing items on a character would be just as important as organizing items in a bag (to be clear, I think both should be in the game). There could be certain points on a person's body where items can be placed based on whether that person has the proper means for carrying it.

For example, if you want to equip a gun, you need the right holster. The holster can be strapped to various parts of the body (it would be made clear by a transparent image of places on the body the holster can go, and you can drag and click it in place). If you don't have a holster or the right holster, you can only put the gun in your bag or hold it (as in Max Payne 3).

This can be done with other items, of course. Ultimately, the player should be able to drape, hang, attach, and equip just about anything to various parts of their body. Modifiers would be what the player is already holding or various cybernetic parts.

On top of this, the player can also have a bag that indicates how much space and weight it has available. The weight of course would also be affected by the items your character is holding that aren't in the bag. I haven't given much thought to how organizing the bag would work, but I imagine it would operate in a similar manner, only with a slight change in the details.

At least, this is how I would do it if I were designing my own RPG. I don't know how it would work in the ones that CDPR has planned.

This idea is also related to my ideas for how character customization and crafting should work. Ultimately, I think the player should be given the tools to create what they want (as long as it remains consistent with the given world and game, of course), rather than relying on pre-made item/character models that are limited by the resources of the development team.

 

[Suhiira]

The only problems I have with something like the above is the amount of artwork that would be necessary to implement it.
Consider, each and every item shown visually on a character must be created individually and a model must be created that show that item with, and without every other item, and all the various combinations of items, a character could conceivably wear. So if you have say 10 items that could be represented visually on a character each in 10 different locations you need something like 3,000,000 pieces of art (someone more into math PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong).
Perhaps a tad much?

 

[Poet_and_Gentleman.598]

10 items in 10 different locations would be
10! = 10 x 9 x 8 x 7 x 6 x 5 x 4 x 3 x 2 x 1

which is actually something like 3.6 millions.

I wonder if they could use procedural generation or something. I know Max PAyne 3 used proc. generation to model on-the-fly animations.
Real artists will study things like muscle anatomy and how it affects how clothing folds.

I remember back in the early 2000s, if you wanted to model a weapon into a game. You had to have two models: one crap one that was meant to lie down on the floor. and a good one that would serve as the gun seen in the FPV.

But right now the guns look so good, you can even see the NPCs pulling the trigger and the bolt kick back when they fire. I wonder if they use the same models after all.

 

[vongo.859]

The only problems I have with something like the above is the amount of artwork that would be necessary to implement it.
Consider, each and every item shown visually on a character must be created individually and a model must be created that show that item with, and without every other item, and all the various combinations of items, a character could conceivably wear. So if you have say 10 items that could be represented visually on a character each in 10 different locations you need something like 3,000,000 pieces of art (someone more into math PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong).
Perhaps a tad much?

What do you mean? I think we might have a misunderstanding in our approach, or I'm just completely not getting what you said.

Assume all items that will be in the game will have a 3D model (which I realize isn't a fair assumption considering that that is a difficult thing to do), like in Skyrim where nearly everything in your inventory is a physical object and not just a sprite. Now, rather than having those items disappear into the magical vault that is your inventory, you can choose to equip them in a way that makes them visible on your character.

Obviously this will not be a thing for all items, possibly even most, depending on how CDPR approaches loot in this game. Something like an apple would simply be placed in to your character's bag, and not hang on the side of your belt like a prized trophy or glorified organic-gadget. Only items that would have any reason for being visible on the outside of your character, will be on the outside of your character. Anything that you would want quick and easy access to.

The biggest issue I can think of is how clothes will contort to things, but even that seems fairly minor the more I think about it.

 

[Sardukhar]

Yeah, I don't mind that commitment at all, actually.

Quality - they are going to be 3D rendering everything anyway, and I hope it's a lot of everything. Millions of objects, I'm fine with that. I hope to be playing CP2077 ten years after it comes out and still occasionally see something new. Wouldn't be the first game like that.