2019 DEMO was telling the truth, you just didn't listen.

[CS554]

yeah, you might have a point if that was the only thing in game, and most shooters don't give you an option to defeat a boss without killing them. The context was the announcer saying, kill her? or don't kill her, your cyberpunk, your choice. This is showing you can choose the values of your character.

Yeah, Serious Sam argument is totally different context.

I have seen these things come up every now and then I recall reading these on Mass Effect forums too. It was about that choise between two soldiers didn't matter because you get either of them anyway, and when someone pointed out that if it played differently it would be linear but then argument got back to point "but there's no choice" like nothing happened. Same with Krogan character you could kill or spare. Consequences were to have or not have him in squad after that and IIRC there was no replacement for it. It still was classified as linear as there were no further consequence. People said that you had less option for squad but for some reason choice folks just said that was not valid consequence.

I recall they finally pissed some people of with their drivel and some folks threw scenario for them. If certain actions should have certain outcome. After watching that argumentation for couple of days I left the forums for months. If order of revealing something should influence the outcome, scenario was a scratch lottery coupon but in... SPACE!!!

In Cyberpunk 2077 and other story driven games, if character death doesn't work out as consequence, even when there are even major chained consequences (Takemura lives / dies -> Hanako) then it's about something else. That not everybody connects to the game world and events in there through characters. This presents a problem in terms of realistic writing because in the end what are private or public institutions, legal or illegal, corporations, police, gangs in the end but group of people performing relevant tasks to fulfill the goal of institution, portrayed through characters.

Paragon / Renegade meter in Mass Effect didn't bother me, it sort of was there and in the Outer Worlds there was a graph player could access, graph presented player relationship with different factions and I checked it like perhaps 3 times in my playthrough. I don't want anything like that to Cyberpunk 2077, I really don't see it would work for me, but perhaps it's lack of presentation like that, that is real reason for some of these arguments.

 

[Hexipoo]

I didn't watch any deep dives because I didn't want to get spoiled even more than Jackie's death did.

Maybe if they stopped spoiling 50% of the game before launch, you would have a point. if I just wanted to watch someone else play the game, I wouldn't have bothered buying it. Not knowing what's gonna happen is 90% of what makes an RPG fun.

 

[batouyukinawa]

People heard what the devs said, took it and multiplied it by every game made and expected that.

 

[SpookyFX]

cars handle, is the same thing as the horses in W3,

Geeezzez I wish they would handle like horses. I was expecting/hoping they would have some CAR AI to help you drive the car like the Horse AI.

I am not sure if I am using your mod or someone else, but if it is your mod THANKS! I would have refunded the game on day one if not for my own mod for key binding and the driving mod plus the min map mod. One other but somehow I am not remembering what it was just now. The save anytime mod because when a game can CTD at anytime you will go crazy without frequent saves. I learned this from the Bethesda GAMES!

 

[Geommander]

I'm talking about the Red Engine it seems to me that they were struggling with it, writing or not, if more than two thirds of your production is you wrestling the tech then there's nothing much one can do.

True. Truer when you consider the last-gen botch and the major quest that this has turned into. Even truer now that a ransomware attempt was made with unknown (at least to us, understandably) consequences to the production flow, apart from the widely accepted result that is the vague delay of patches. This is no criticism, just that I am a bit worried at how this will pan out amidst the legal battles ahead and the various 3rd parties attempting to play with shares and CDPR's image (for personal gains obviously).

It seemed to me that they ultimately decided to tell a somewhat linear cohesive story that flowed well rather than creating more bifurcations that would lead to a myriad more things to fix.

It's not an excuse but an observation, and like I've mentioned before I would have loved more options.

Well, considering engine and writing they are two different subjects but they also intertwine in production in the part that in the end you will need an effective way to apply writing practically. The intent of good writing is there in CP2077, I think; I don't know how many writers were onboard, but if we suppose each one were mainly (not exclusively) responsible for quest-lines, you can see some excellent quests, some good quests and some not so good examples - and after that filler content. That is expected, I guess, to some degree.

I wonder though if using advanced machine learning or quest-oriented "AI" could help writers or production teams actually play out quests faster than what is possible now, by having all the different scenarios played in a myriad ways that would introduce them to a wider spectrum of "good-scenarios-to-keep", "things-that-need-fleshing-out", "unforeseen plot-holes" or just broken quests. Sorry if I sound stupid, I admit I have no idea, I am not a software engineer, just considering this possibility. I mean a "smart" bot did learn to beat human champions in Starcraft 2 (even with serious handicaps in parallel action processing) by being subjected to countless (virtual) hours of training, so maybe a "smart script-proofing" bot could do the equivalent by actually "playing the game" virtually. On the other hand, the AI behind facial animation and lip-syncing actually worked, to be honest (well, except for the rare occasions when characters decide to keep their lips shut while the dialog plays out ) - that was indeed a time saver for production, if I understand it well.

Of course, one of the main themes here is human error (and error of judgement coming as a result, so it is an escalating chain of errors) and how much of it lead to the assumption that this version of the engine was possible to be run on last-gen...

EDIT:
I was re-reading my post then it came upon me as a revelation - if one had such "AI" technology ready, then maybe the different factions and police wouldn't respond the way they do now (well, with no AI/scripting whatsoever - unless we accept the argument of it being there and being stopped by "a bug")... I put me into thinking... I think...

 

[waquzy]

CDPR pointed out the AI is bugged too. I'd expect vast changes to the AI in this upcoming update.

I highly doubt it, they would have to start the work from ground up.

 

[exxxed]

-snip-

I believe the term you're looking for is procedural generation of assets, scripts and dialogue, which in theory could be possible.

The problem is, really, cohesion, making it seem seamless.

I think the most advanced procedural generation technique to date is found in Star Citizen, and that's just for assets, basically what they've done was to create a system where the artists are able to create various assets and, well, biomes that can be used in a procedural generation algorithm to create massively detailed large scale planets, one of them being a city planet akin to Coruscant and it looks incredible to be fair.

A byproduct of that is that it's rather static, it looks amazing but there's no dynamism to any of the assets without developer intervention except for moving sprites, that's pretty much as far as we've got in video game terms at the moment with highly detailed seamless large scale environments - bare in mind that the planet is part of a system of planets governed by physics and atmospheric effects, you can seamlessly travel unhindered from planet to planet.

But yeah, I don't see why it wouldn't be possible in the future to combine the JALI AI algorithm for facial animations with highly detailed AI scripting for procedural animations and combine that with a highly adaptive environment that's partly procedurally generated - basically different path ways through scenarios based on player choice.

I'd wager you would still need a really talented cast of actors for the dialogue though, it's the only way to convincingly portray emotion.

If nothing else, people are definitely working on such systems.

 

[batouyukinawa]

I highly doubt it, they would have to start the work from ground up.

True if AI didn't exist at all. Luckily this isn't the case.
We've already seen improvements to the NPC interaction.

 

[ralfetas]

Geeezzez I wish they would handle like horses. I was expecting/hoping they would have some CAR AI to help you drive the car like the Horse AI.

I am not sure if I am using your mod or someone else, but if it is your mod THANKS! I would have refunded the game on day one if not for my own mod for key binding and the driving mod plus the min map mod. One other but somehow I am not remembering what it was just now. The save anytime mod because when a game can CTD at anytime you will go crazy without frequent saves. I learned this from the Bethesda GAMES!

Not my mod no, i don´t release nothing for CP yet.
Indeed, would be better if was horses, at least we should now what to expect!

 

[Lorenzo_C_ssaro]

People heard what the devs said, took it and multiplied it by every game made and expected that.

I already told you what I think of it: those features I addressed were not "multiplied by 10"
Look, it's right to blame the overhype, but you must also recognise that such things just can't be overlooked!
Tech weapons, 'nuff said.

 

[batouyukinawa]

I already told you what I think of it: those features I addressed were not "multiplied by 10"
Look, it's right to blame the overhype, but you must also recognise that such things just can't be overlooked!
Tech weapons, 'nuff said.

Tech weapons, 'nuff said? What? Now you really do need to explain.

 

[Guest 4531988]

Tech weapons, 'nuff said? What? Now you really do need to explain.

The Ai has not idea how to deal with long range weapons or Tech Weapons.

I've repeatedly shot them through cover and they stay in the same spot having no idea how to react. They are reacting as there are no tech weapons, taking cover like one would vs Power Weapons.

Same crap happens with Hacks once in combat.

 

[batouyukinawa]

Enemy AI is bugged. I've seen them react to my tech weapons, I've also seen them do nothing. I've seen them
move to higher cover from my elevated position too which was damn smart. AI is inconsistent.

 

[Cerejo90]

Yeah, the NET. Quickhacking has nothing to do with NET. NET or old net is what is beyond Black Wall. Did you play the game really?

NET - is made of anything else that can transmit information from one computer to another.

NETRUNNER - A person who has a CYBERDECK to acess the NET.

CYBERDECK - A brain implant that provides an much more immersive and intuitive connection to the NET, allowing him to hacking faster than conventional methods, or QUICKHACKING

BLACKWALL - A wall on the NET to prevent A.I's to get there.

NETWATCH - A organization, like the names says, who WATCH the NET. Including, but not only, the BLACKWALL.

Help this can help ya, you can search bout it in CYBERPUNK GAMEBOOKS, where the CDPR adapt this thing they call a game from.

 

[CS554]

NETWATCH - A organization, like the names says, who WATCH the NET. Including, but not only, the BLACKWALL.

Help this can help ya, you can search bout it in CYBERPUNK GAMEBOOKS, where the CDPR adapt this thing they call a game from.

Yeah, and as CP2077 is very different for tabletop for certain gameplay reasons, making quickhacking small beans really and for other more general reasons, Netwatch doesn't really give a damn about that. NET and Black Wall is their focus. I happened to check couple of the MadQueen show videos about that, and especially interviews with R. Talsorian games presentative J. Gray and previous show with Jim Morrison made certain things pretty clear.

I don't care how anal or autistic people are going to get about this to find a way to throw yet another rock at CDRP because people who want to do that do that anyway. But what comes to settings, I'm pretty damn sure R. Talsorian knows their game.

 

[Lorenzo_C_ssaro]

Tech weapons, 'nuff said? What? Now you really do need to explain.

I already told you in my ither post: they are not balanced at all.
With just a tech rifle and ping hack, people can clear out an entire hideout without moving from the first room.
Do I really have to get through all of that again? I already told you, but you keep ignoring even legit critiques.

 

[batouyukinawa]

I already told you in my ither post: they are not balanced at all.
With just a tech rifle and ping hack, people can clear out an entire hideout without moving from the first room.
Do I really have to get through all of that again? I already told you, but you keep ignoring even legit critiques.

I'm not ignoring anything. Yes, really any build late game is OP. However, this isn't a live service game. There's no end game, so there's no actual enemies high level enough to be a challenge after you're fully leveled.

You can only hack people through the wall after obtaining a legendary Ping quickhack. Unless you're just strictly specing into intelligence it's gonna take you a while to reach this level of power as a netrunner. I do agree Tech weapons need to be limited to a single wall or two before their lethality no longer applies. Something where the game calculates a -% debuff to the initial damage output after in travels through a wall.

 

[Lorenzo_C_ssaro]

I'm not ignoring anything. Yes, really any build late game is OP. However, this isn't a live service game. There's no end game, so there's no actual enemies high level enough to be a challenge after you're fully leveled.

You can only hack people through the wall after obtaining a legendary Ping quickhack. Unless you're just strictly specing into intelligence it's gonna take you a while to reach this level of power as a netrunner. I do agree Tech weapons need to be limited to a single wall or two before their lethality no longer applies. Something where the game calculates a -% debuff to the initial damage output after in travels through a wall.

Not hacking
Shooting through walls

 

[Bukary77]

We've already seen improvements to the NPC interaction.

What do you mean? I haven't noticed any improvements so I am curious.

 

[batouyukinawa]

What do you mean? I haven't noticed any improvements so I am curious.

They have more varied reactions.
They will stare back at you if you stare at them.
Aim a gun at a walking NPC and they will recognize you're insane, turn around, and walk away quickly.
They'll get up and leave if you start punching things.
They will comment on things too which can be very apt at times. "He's gone Cyberpsycho" being one of my favorites.
If you walk up to someone's car and stare at them while they're at a light they will stare back and give a
uneasy expression on their face.
Some still hit the ground and duck but usually happens when I'm in a fire fight which makes sense if
bullets are flying. They still need some work though.