Cyberpunk 2077 Devs Break Down First-Person Storytelling

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Their explanations about how much more difficult making fpp cutscene is was full of it.
Says who?
If it was so frustrating and difficult to make first person perspective everything, all they had to do is to go back to normal cutscenes.
It was also frustrating and difficult to make the open world game, but they didn't go back to making chapter-based games after TW3.
I personally would praise them.
I don't doubt it. :D
So where was the problem?
If I had to guess, I'd say it's buying the FPP-only game and complaining about why it is a FPP-only game. Over and over and over and over and over again.
Don't see any other problem. :shrug:
Higher-ups. A corporate decission. The boss wants FPP and that's how it'll be.
Aha! The evil corporations... First they stole our money, now they're stealing our TPP cutscenes in videogames, they'll be stealing our souls next (and transfer them to biochips).
 
Aha! The evil corporations... First they stole our money, now they're stealing our TPP cutscenes in videogames, they'll be stealing our souls next (and transfer them to biochips).
I mean... yes. Yes, the same corporation that disregarded devs telling them that the game is not ready to be released. Although the corporation seems to be taking a new direction lately, listening to devs telling them that the Next Gen Update is not ready to be released. It's really good to see. I'm looking forward to see the final result of devs actually being able to finish their work.

I'd like to point out that I don't criticise CDPR for gameplay. Or progression system. Or the way the items and stats work in the game. I don't entirely care if one weapon does +0.03% more damage than other, or that some mod or other is shit because it's has +0.06sec cooldown. I don't really understand what the big deal is. People are discussing builds and which perks should work best with which weapons. And there is a lot of discussions and controversies too. People say that some perks just don't work at all, or are not balanced well. Do you remember me ranting in those topics lately? Or at all?

All I care about is how the game presents its story. I care about stupid glitches ruining a scene so carefuly crafted to make you cry. It's all connected. Bugs and storytelling. Only two things I criticise CDPR for. The rest of the stuff I ever mention is about how they sacrificed so many elements of the game in order to gain nothing. Maybe except for being able to release the game in December, when everybody and their dog would buy any new release to play over Christmas.
 

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I mean... yes. Yes, the same corporation that disregarded devs telling them that the game is not ready to be released.
It's just funny to see them being refereed to as a "corporation" only when they started doing something one doesn't like. As if they didn't have the same structure while they were developing TW3.
And that person who lead the game's development and dared to say no to TPP cutscenes (and Ciri's cameo; seriously, thank god for that!!! ) was not some random suit who have no clue about making games, but someone who's been heavily involved in every game they ever made:
- head of art, game concept, character artist, cinematics, visual effects for TW1
- game director for TW2
- head of studio for TW3
Probably the most experienced developer they have in their "corporation".
All I care about is how the game presents its story. I care about stupid glitches ruining a scene so carefuly crafted to make you cry. It's all connected. Bugs and storytelling.
Because you're not offering any meaningful, constructive criticism and suggestion on how to improve FPP cutscenes, something you knew this game is gonna have. Instead, all you're doing is criticizing them for not having TPP cutscenes, something you knew this game wont have. That is what makes it so absurd.
Always FPP is not good enough on its own.
Well, neither is TPP. :p
 
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Because you're not offering any meaningful, constructive criticism and suggestion on how to improve FPP cutscenes, something you knew this game is gonna have. Instead, all you're doing is criticizing them for not having TPP cutscenes, something you knew this game wont have. That is what makes it so absurd.
I thought that CDPR knows something I don't. I wanted to give them a benefit of a doubt, even thought I had bad feelings about them "revising" what will end up in the final release. They didn't disappoint me too much with The Witcher 3, I had no reason to not trust them. The only disappointing part of TW3 was the graphical downgrade and lots of bugs on release. I thought that CDPR learned their lesson and will apply new knowledge and new experience to Cyberpunk. I thought they got this.

With Cyberpunk, CDPR showed that TW3 was just a happy accident. In reality they have no idea what they're doing. Making the entire game FPP was a bad choice, both artistic and organisational. If I recall correctly, most of the bug-fixes is in regards to the story. Something doesn't load. Something doesn't trigger. Leftover assets. Cars driving infinitely with mission-critical NPCs on board. Examples are plenty. Some of them could be avoided if they used good old cutscenes, like almost any other company does.

Just go and take a look at the patch-log for patch 1.3:

8 months after the game released. Please take a look at how many issues had to be addressed regarding quests.
Here's just a selection of those regarding "real time cutscenes":
  • Fixed an issue causing NPCs to not look at V during various scenes.
  • Fixed an exploit where player was granted a Unity Pistol after each save/load.
  • V's facial animations while looking in the mirror will now be played properly.
  • Fixed an issue where Rogue was spawning next to the player after calling her and asking about Adam Smasher.
  • Fixed an issue where some NPCs could stop performing animations after a longer game session.
  • Fixed multiple issues with NPCs mounting vehicles incorrectly.
  • Fixed various issues where NPCs could be placed incorrectly and clip through objects after loading a saved game.
  • Fixed an issue that could cause NPC animations to be played in the wrong spot in various quests.
  • Fixed an issue where Jackie could spawn before the player's eyes during the half-year montage.
  • Fixed an issue where NPCs' appearances got randomized when looking away.
  • Fixed an issue where quests and scenes could progress before the loading screen disappeared.
Please take note of words such as "in various quests" and "multiple issues with". Plural.

8 months from relese. Still fixing cutscenes. And I bet there will be more fixing cutscenes with patch 1.5

Is this not enough? Please open patch notes of Patch 1.2, the list regarding "cinematic design" is way longer:
 
8 months from relese. Still fixing cutscenes. And I bet there will be more fixing cutscenes with patch 1.5
In short, it seem that FPP cutscenes were not that easy to do... At least not "more" easy than TPP ones... :ok:
Maybe that's why many games avoid this kind of cutscenes and go for "video" cinematics (sound way more "easy" and practical to let the game play video files. In a video, you can't have bugs, for sure...) :)
 
In short, it seem that FPP cutscenes were not that easy to do... At least not "more" easy than TPP ones... :ok:
Maybe that's why many games avoid this kind of cutscenes and go for "video" cinematics (sound way to easy to let the game play video files...) :)
In that case... making a normal cutscene is:
1. easier
2. better
It's a win-win.

Making them all in first person is a waste of resources during development and after the release. I just thought that they are easier to make because they just don't look as good. First person view works really great in speciffic situations. Use the right tool for the right job. Using adjustable wrench and a pair of pliers to do every job is just bad workmanship-- ask any mechanical engineer.
 
In that case... making a normal cutscene is:
1. easier
2. better
1 - Little change ? I believe it was because it was more easy/simply/cheap to make in FPP that CDPR choose to do it in that way o_O
2 - As explained before (and all along this thread), matter of taste, which is not yours... fine (I think all have understand that).

Like explained in the video in the passage that I quote, it's because instead of "normal" cutscenes where you can put your controller away until the end of the "video" (In short you don't play, you watch your game), in Cyberpunk there are so many way that players can break the game by doing something that CDPR have not planned.
 

Guest 3847602

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With Cyberpunk, CDPR showed that TW3 was just a happy accident. In reality they have no idea what they're doing. Making the entire game FPP was a bad choice, both artistic and organisational.
You not liking FPP is not the proof of anything you claim here. It didn't work for you, it worked for others.
If I recall correctly, most of the bug-fixes is in regards to the story. Something doesn't load. Something doesn't trigger. Leftover assets. Cars driving infinitely with mission-critical NPCs on board. Examples are plenty. Some of them could be avoided if they used good old cutscenes, like almost any other company does.
Well, notice how many times the word "could" is used in the patchnotes. The only one that ever affected me is NPC not looking at V. Claire, to be precise.
TW3, on the other hand had few "infinite loading screens" during cutscenes. Those glorious, invaluable, good old 3rd person cutscenes. Reloading was of no use. One of them, in The Lord of Undvik (right before the Ice Giant boss battle) affected every single player in the world, regardless of platform.
No bug in Cyberpunk 2077 comes close in severity to this one. Game breaking bug during 3rd person cutscene. :p
 
Like explained in the video in the passage that I quote, it's because instead of "normal" cutscenes where you can put your controller away until the end of the "video" (In short you don't play, you watch your game), in Cyberpunk there are so many way that players can break the game by doing something that CDPR have not planned.
My dear friend, in the same interview video they admitted multiple times that the most important scenes in the game, where the player would love to have something to do, are always designed in the same way: you can only rotate the camera, and even that in a limited range.

How would I fix Cyberpunk 2077 "always fpp" cutscenes:


1. Use the right tool for the right job-- not everything will work well in first person, don't be afraid to use normal cutscenes in conjunction with the first person view.
2. Give the player something to do-- sitting and moving the camera around is boring. The player has to be engaged, has to feel like they are contributing to the scene, not just BE in the scene.
3. Walk and talk is good, but not when you are being guided everywhere all the time-- every time when there is an important cutscene going on in a car, it's not the player who's driving. I know we all hate GTA here, but in every GTA it's the player who drives, while the other person sits as a passenger. Don't be afraid to learn from other games!
4. Let the player lead the way! If the player is being escorted everywhere, they feel like they are on a rollercoaster. There is no sense of participation. It's a live-action cutscenes on rails.
5. Giving the player full freedom of movement is great, but only when that freedom of movement gives the player some sort of advantage during the scene. Being able to see stuff from different angles, performing tasks while NPCs are performing theirs. DOING SOMETHING in a cutscene.
6. If you absolutely have to make the player sit in a chair, give them something to do. One point of view from a chair is not fun!
7. There are moments when you are being kept somewhere against your will for the sake of exposition. And that's OK, as long as it's not 99.9% of your exposition ideas.
8. Let the player have to make choices that matter in a scene! Because we as players want to feel clever! There is no bigger disappointment and feeling of betrayal than when a player learns that they were doing something for nothing. Especially in a game that was supposed to have choices and consequences! Remember telltale and their illusion of choice in The Walking Dead? Do you remember that a company called Telltale Games even existed?
9. If you REALLY have to create a "sweet spot" for a scene, at least make a couple of them? OR make the NPCs acknowledge where you're standing? So they would rearrange?
10. Make the NPCs react to the player. What's the point of being an actor in the scene when other actors are treating you like air, and only react to your presence when you have to chose a dialogue line?

Those are just some ideas that I just came up with on a spot. Maybe I should apply for cinematic designer?
 
No bug in Cyberpunk 2077 comes close in severity to this one. Game breaking bug during 3rd person cutscene. :p
It never affected me. I literally don't remember a single infinite loading screen. So maybe you had that issue, but not me. :D

@ooodrin , let's face it: you would like anything that was done to the game, no matter what it would be. If the game had normal cinematic cutscenes, you'd not only love them, but also defend them to death. I don't remember you being critical about a single thing in the game, not counting gameplay stuff, builds and progression, because I don't know your involvment in those conversations.
 
for me, nothing can beat the appeal and involvement of a beautiful 3d person cinematic for storytelling/cutscenes (and nothing can fool you more than a beautiful 3d person cinematics:smart: )


byez :cool:👋👋👋
 
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And also an important point, I think the goal was to make a FPP game with "no cut" (or almost) during the whole game. So playing a TPP cutscene in middle of a FPP gameplay seem to be "a cut" for me :)
And that is... an important element of a game set in a cyberpunk setting, I suppose? That is the most arbitrary thing in any design. The most meaningless too.
 

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It never affected me. I literally don't remember a single infinite loading screen. So maybe you had that issue, but not me. :D
They tried to patch it, but it kept reappearing few times before it was rooted out for good. It took time and for couple of weeks (June or July 2015) nobody could get past this obstacle.
@ooodrin , let's face it: you would like anything that was done to the game, no matter what it would be.
Nope, I would have hated life-sim Cyberpunk, I would have hated "rags-to-riches" story, I would have hated radiant quests, I would have hated if every mundane activity was animated, I would have hated 50 hours long main quest if it would be full of padding (it always is in games like that). Thankfully, I got none of that.
I don't remember you being critical about a single thing in the game, not counting gameplay stuff, builds and progression, because I don't know your involvment in those conversations.
That's because my main complaints are all gameplay-related: inventory, journal, loot, cluttered map, etc... I think the story is really good and it is told competently. I like the themes and the way they are examined and presented. And I like all of the main characters. So, I can't possibly complain about any of that.
I strongly feel that FPP was the right choice for the game that CP2077 ended up being. It achieves its goal in gameplay, it achieves it in cutscenes. When the main story is dealing with someone else living in your protagonist's head, I believe FPP makes most sense. :)
 
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for me, nothing can beat the appeal and involvement of a beautiful 3d person cinematic for storytelling/cutscenes (and nothing can fool you more than a beautiful 3d person cinematics:smart: )
Nothing wrong with that, because the important words are there > "for me" :cool:
Who means that you assume that it probably not the case for others.
 

Nope, I would have hated life-sim Cyberpunk, I would have hated "rags-to-riches" story, I would have hated every mundane thing being animated, I would have hated 50 hours long main quest if it would be full of padding (it always is in games like that).

That's because my main complaints are all gameplay-related: inventory, journal, loot, cluttered map, etc... I think the story is really good and it is told competently. I like the themes and the way they are examined and presented. And I like all of the main characters. So, I can't possibly complain about any of that.
I strongly feel that FPP was the right choice for the game that CP2077 ended up being. It achieves its goal in gameplay, it achieves it in cutscenes. :)
Never had this bug in my life. Maybe because it got fixed before I reached Skellige.

Also, there you go. I have very little interest in technical aspects of gameplay. I don't care about optimal builds and equipment and etc. I don't min-max my games when it comes to gameplay. We approach gaming in vastly different ways, and I have no doubts that you know your bit really well. But see, I know that I would not contribute in any way in a conversation which goal is to come up with the best progression system, the best build, the best way to fix the gameplay. Because I know that you guys will figure it out and CDPR will listen. Or at least they bloody should because it's you guys who is playing the game. If you make the devs listen and change something in the game that you came up with-- it will improve MY experience too! That's the important part. That's the teamwork! I don't know why those numbers are incorrect, but you do! And CDPR should listen for the benefit of everyone.
 
it will improve MY experience too! That's the important part.
The problem (if I can say that), in a game FPP only (gameplay, cutscenes and almost everything), your experience can't be improve... because you prefer something who wasn't/won't planned to be in the game :)
(I really want FPP in ME, it could be awesome "for me"... But there is no way, it will never happen, whatever if I prefer it or ask for it...)
 
Nothing wrong with that, because the important words are there > "for me" :cool:


true dat, in fact the "for me" factor is also applied even when I read your nick in a post, and it's automatically and immediately translated into my mind as "that CDP defence-lawyer by default no matter what" before I read the rest :p:p:p

:beer::beer::beer:
 
The problem (if I can say that), in a game FPP only (gameplay, cutscenes and almost everything), your experience can't be improve... because you prefer something who wasn't/won't planned to be in the game :)
(I really want FPP in ME... But there is no way, it will never happen, whatever if I prefer it or ask for it...)
Fortunately for all of us, CDPR is hiring people for third person cinematics or third person camera to work on Cyberpunk. Who knows, maybe I'm not that wrong after all.
 
true dat, in fact the "for me" factor is also applied even when I read your nick in a post, and it's automatically and immediately translated into my mind as "that CDP defence-lawyer by default no matter what" before I read the rest :p:p
I often use this kind of words... because obviously, like many thing, it's always (all almost) matter of taste/opinion/point of view... And luckily for me, I love the game :)
Fortunately for all of us, CDPR is hiring people for third person cinematics or third person camera to work on Cyberpunk. Who knows, maybe I'm not that wrong after all.
Yep, who know :)
But "in my opinion", that need more than few peoples for switch all the things in Cyberpunk to TPP from FPP.
 
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