About CDPR's attitude

[Oddballe8]

You need to differentiate between "devs" and "exectuives" in this case.

The things you mentioned are all on the exectuives.

The devs weren't part of those decisions.

And it's the devs working overtime over christmas to get you patches like 1.06

So... I still have faith in the devs.

But not those damned corpos!

 

[MAXXVOLTAGE]

That 7.1 average is factoring in PC review scores that are much higher than consoles. It might be the same game, but the experience is completely different based on platform.

Even if you take console complete out of the equations


The fact is pc is the majority of sales . No matter how much you keep repeating and want to make "40% of sales" sound more relevant than it is.

It is still a minority. The fact is pc has the majority of sales , players and user votes on meta critic

Therefore. it still is a better measure of the "game itself " than consoles as it is performing better on PC.

In my view now that console player can get refunds the ones that are "mad" about "pre- ordering" or really anything else regarding the game have nothing to complain about anymore and the amount of console sales is completely irrelevant now. as it s been pulled by Sony and Microsoft any last gen console player can get a refund and move on to another game.

I hope this teaches the dev's to always look forward and not back form now on.

 

[Obsidian_Crane]

I still think johnnys content was intended as a side story just something about the whole thing feels of.
Like it was intended as a expansion im not saying i didnt like it but didnt seem like it was ment as the main story.

There is so much built into the world to support the quest that this position doesn't hold up.

The problem is the story is about V and Johnny, not at all about changing the world. So you don't build evidence of some calamity you will resolve in the story, instead you find evidence of what the story is about and what it means for V and Johnny as you progress. This evidence is found in things like the Doll Conversation when you first go to Clouds, TV spots, reading the Relic files once you get them, and lots of other places. The themes of change and humanity are scattered throughout the game all building on that V and Johnny story.

Now that doesn't mean I feel it is necessarily well executed as a story, I have issues with it as a story, but the game is very clearly built around that story.

 

[Kalfear]

Meh, CDPR is fine with me and everyone I know
Game is a solid 8.5-9 stars outta 10

They released a game that ran properly on systems the game was designed for
Almost no bugs to be found on my game 65 hours in
Pretty amazing for a AAA launched game
I WISH other AAA games had that awesome a launch honestly

Only people that seem to have any complaints really are out of date, last gen console users.
And to be perfectly honest
after this past weeks nonsense
Their complaints in no way influence of affect my view or impression in any way.
They massively over played their hand
And now they have cried wolf way to many times.

As for game itself and things that got cut or diminished for launch
I'm sure all of that and much more will find it way back into game through patches, DLCs, and hopefully expansions

Honestly with how quickly CDPR responded to over the top complaints and accepted responsibility
I'm even more impressed with them
You would have NEVER seen that quick a response from EA, Bethesda, Blizzard, Rockstar, or whole host of other developers.

And with news that 13 million copies still been sold COUNTING the lost sale of refunds
I'd say its safe to say the whole last gen console drama will have no lasting or permanent effect on CDPR reputation what so ever. Might take a little bit of time to be forgotten. But that healing has already started imo.

Me personally, I just hope CDPR learns from this and cuts it out completely so this type of thing never happens again.
NOT trying to pacify everyone would have solved ALLOT of headaches for CDPR at launch.

 

[SeabiscuitV]

You need to differentiate between "devs" and "exectuives" in this case.

The things you mentioned are all on the exectuives.

The devs weren't part of those decisions.

And it's the devs working overtime over christmas to get you patches like 1.06

So... I still have faith in the devs.

But not those damned corpos!

I know and I appreciate the devs' work a lot, but the thing is from the release we can tell that the devs don't have a say in the whole process. I believe in the devs skills and sense of responsibility but the problem is when the corpo is in charge the devs don't make too many differences.

 

[Mebrilia]

I have absolutely not trust left. A thing is messing up the situation in a way that is not intentional another is downright acting shady and lie like it was done. The first one is a thing i can excuse the second one has not excuse at all.

 

[SeabiscuitV]

Meh, CDPR is fine with me and everyone I know
Game is a solid 8.5-9 stars outta 10

They released a game that ran properly on systems the game was designed for
Almost no bugs to be found on my game 65 hours in
Pretty amazing for a AAA launched game
I WISH other AAA games had that awesome a launch honestly

Only people that seem to have any complaints really are out of date, last gen console users.
And to be perfectly honest
after this past weeks nonsense
Their complaints in no way influence of affect my view or impression in any way.
They massively over played their hand
And now they have cried wolf way to many times.

As for game itself and things that got cut or diminished for launch
I'm sure all of that and much more will find it way back into game through patches, DLCs, and hopefully expansions

Honestly with how quickly CDPR responded to over the top complaints and accepted responsibility
I'm even more impressed with them
You would have NEVER seen that quick a response from EA, Bethesda, Blizzard, Rockstar, or whole host of other developers.

And with news that 13 million copies still been sold COUNTING the lost sale of refunds
I'd say its safe to say the whole last gen console drama will have no lasting or permanent effect on CDPR reputation what so ever. Might take a little bit of time to be forgotten. But that healing has already started imo.

Me personally, I just hope CDPR learns from this and cuts it out completely so this type of thing never happens again.
NOT trying to pacify everyone would have solved ALLOT of headaches for CDPR at launch.

About the quick response part you make a lot of sense.
About the cut content part I don't know. Or I should say I wish they would be added back to the game but I don't have the courage to hope anything after the disappointment since I don't want more of it.
I wish what you say would be true in the future.

Post automatically merged: Dec 24, 2020

I have absolutely not trust left. A thing is messing up the situation in a way that is not intentional another is downright acting shady and lie like it was done. The first one is a thing i can excuse the second one has not excuse at all.

The two look the same as results but have completely different motivations behind them...

 

[solarismasura]

Even if you take console complete out of the equations


The fact is pc is the majority of sales . No matter how much you keep repeating and want to make "40% of sales" sound more relevant than it is.

It is still a minority. The fact is pc has the majority of sales , players and user votes on meta critic

Therefore. it still is a better measure of the "game itself " than consoles as it is performing better on PC.

In my view now that console player can get refunds the ones that are "mad" about "pre- ordering" or really anything else regarding the game have nothing to complain about anymore and the amount of console sales is completely irrelevant now. as it s been pulled by Sony and Microsoft any last gen console player can get a refund and move on to another game.

I hope this teaches the dev's to always look forward and not back form now on.

if you received 1000 dollars for doing something and were then forced to give back 400 of those dollars would you not be a bit upset or curious about where you went wrong.? what if because of having to give back the 400 other people wanted their money back too so then you have to give 500 cus they were influenced, then 600 because people were ashamed.?

it is not wise to pretend 40% out of 100 is not a sizable chunk. 60% is an F.

 

[PrincessAmanda]

To me Cyberpunk is one of the best triple A titles released in the recent history. ( PC version ).
However, comparing it to advertising and hype generated through all these years, it feels like the worst type of disappointment you can get in gaming.

Basicaly, most things I was excited about, while waiting for this game - are not in the game. Open world feels shallow and empty and our roleplaying options are very limited. I never truly feel that I am V. We can even say character creator is meaningless. V is Geralt of Rivia 2.0 with predefined personality. I would take blindly, paragon\renegade system from ME instead of what we've got.

Looking at this campaign, I can tell they were going ALL IN too hard. Couple of examples. That Netlix colab and anime announcement for 2022 ? for the love of God who cares ? Multiplayer announced too early as well. Selling trucks of merch before game got popular. Cosplay events for characters nobody really knows etc.

CDPR made their new IP big before it was... big. The Witcher became super popular becouse games were loved by many people. Here ? everything flipped. Fun fact, if you lanch the game and look at the red text, not only Cyberpunk 2077 has trademark, also word "Cyberpunk" alone has R at the end, seperately. So this is truly big investement which ( so far ), kinda failed.

Time to run back to super popular Witcher IP, and print the money.

 

[Mario_Szabo]

This Forum makes me want to study psychology. Must be so much behind the human brain that after so many videos which step by step summarize statements of pre launch footage and statements, compared with the results of version 1.4/5 - the huge list what is or isn't in the Game that still people have the need to defend the current situation and seem to be fine with the standard of the game and PR.

"ah it isn't that bad you are overreacting, it's a 9/10 because of bugs and your unrealistic wishes"

Marvelous so advertisements for the end product isn't related to any of the expectations you should have and tuning down decisions and freedom is ok because " decisions impact the gameplay" is now the yes, friendly yes and 1 question between and after yes (maybe in a corpo way) way of implementing it.

Furthermore as the graphic is beautiful, the response to player actions in terms of graphic is weird. Shooting tires or tossing grenades, or the windshield behaves weird in my opinion.

The AI Life and own pattern what they talked about is interesting. Fast forward the game and they didn't move? You go to a shop which wants to sell you food but the keeper says I should fuck off. Rated 10/10 would recommend.

Also the K. I from police and civilians often shown.. Well.. Seriously? This is good? When people say the didn't noticed or realize that this isn't horrendous I would love to see what other games you play to get the "good things and programming" in that.

Don't get me wrong I want this game to succeed and love good rpgs with a good story. But please don't get the Stockholm Syndrom from 8 years of waiting for this game and now as it is here, it MUST be perfect. It surely isn't. Yes they can iron out the bugs and enhance the performance but there is much more they should do and for me, when they want the lost fanbase back, they should think about enhancing the experience much more. Right now it is Cyberpunk 2077 EA in Beta. Waiting for the polishing and getting some Content in it.

 

[NevaEilhart]

This Forum makes me want to study psychology. Must be so much behind the human brain that after so many videos which step by step summarize statements of pre launch footage and statements, compared with the results of version 1.4/5 - the huge list what is or isn't in the Game that still people have the need to defend the current situation and seem to be fine with the standard of the game and PR.

"ah it isn't that bad you are overreacting, it's a 9/10 because of bugs and your unrealistic wishes"

Exact same thing can be said the other way around, with people overreacting and bashing everything because some youtubers or whatever told them to. Cuts happen in videogames. To that extent ? Maybe, maybe not. We don't know because usually developers don't communicate that much around their product. Not all developers though share their developement footage like CDPR did with a 2 years old video of 48mns (and the sweet irony is, they didn't want to share it because they knew it was just there to tease the press about the possibilities of what the game could be, but people cried and wanted more). That's because they know things will be cut or changed, especially when you're dealing with a new setting and new mechanics for the studio.

Does this excuse everything ? No. But there are some very strong moments in the game and there are some genius ideas behind it. The foundations are stunning and the potential is definitely there.

But I guess nowadays it's either love to the death or hate till your last breath. No middle grounds. I'd recommend rather studying that if you want to go into the psychology field.

 

[Metropolice]

This Forum makes me want to study psychology. Must be so much behind the human brain that after so many videos which step by step summarize statements of pre launch footage and statements, compared with the results of version 1.4/5 - the huge list what is or isn't in the Game that still people have the need to defend the current situation and seem to be fine with the standard of the game and PR.

I think it's called bias (can go in either direction of course) or "coping".

I'm honestly somewhere in the middle. To blindly take one side (unless you plain out have fun and can live with what's not there or don't consider any other critical arguments an issue etc) is often foolish. I see both pros and cons in what we got.

I do feel that whoever was responsible for one big or several revisions of the games approach throughout the years would've done themselves and the final product a favor if they either sticked with an initial approach from the start or knew the right one they wanted from the start. I assume this must've cost valuable time that could've been spent on 'perfecting' the main approach or design for the game.

This is obviously (I guess anyway) why initially promised features had to be cut and why there were delays - no more time or changing other priorities. I think it was rather the lack of time than over-selling, but I also think there was a bit of over-selling in the marketing material opposed to what we saw on release in some areas of the game. This is why, I think, the debate is so public and apparent, even if you subtract "the typical one-sided hater".

E: To add, I am currently, right now, playing it again after a break. Progressing your char is fun, the world and city itself is great, but I'm not fully or remotely satisfied in other areas of the game. Mixed feelings, could've been in development longer in my eyes, but "hype killed it", I guess. Remember the near riots when people suspected another delay would happen. Yeah.

 

[SeabiscuitV]

Exact same thing can be said the other way around, with people overreacting and bashing everything because some youtubers or whatever told them to. Cuts happen in videogames. To that extent ? Maybe, maybe not. We don't know because usually developers don't communicate that much around their product. Not all developers though share their developement footage like CDPR did with a 2 years old video of 48mns (and the sweet irony is, they didn't want to share it because they knew it was just there to tease the press about the possibilities of what the game could be, but people cried and wanted more). That's because they know things will be cut or changed, especially when you're dealing with a new setting and new mechanics for the studio.

Does this excuse everything ? No. But there are some very strong moments in the game and there are some genius ideas behind it. The foundations are stunning and the potential is definitely there.

But I guess nowadays it's either love to the death or hate till your last breath. No middle grounds. I'd recommend rather studying that if you want to go into the psychology field.

Overly forgiving consumers will doubtlessly generate more false advertisement. After all it's consumers' fault not to be able to tell. If advertisements can't be believed what's the point of making them? A promise is a promise, they did release a good game but it's still far from what's been shown in NC wire, which is released in 2020 right before the release, not in 2018 btw.

Post automatically merged: Dec 24, 2020

I think it's called bias (can go in either direction of course) or "coping".

I'm honestly somewhere in the middle. To blindly take one side (unless you plain out have fun and can live with what's not there or don't consider any other critical arguments an issue etc) is often foolish. I see both pros and cons in what we got.

I do feel that whoever was responsible for one big or several revisions of the games approach throughout the years would've done themselves and the final product a favor if they either sticked with an initial approach from the start or knew the right one they wanted from the start. I assume this must've cost valuable time that could've been spent on 'perfecting' the main approach or design for the game.

This is obviously (I guess anyway) why initially promised features had to be cut and why there were delays - no more time or changing other priorities. I think it was rather the lack of time than over-selling, but I also think there was a bit of over-selling in the marketing material opposed to what we saw on release in some areas of the game. This is why, I think, the debate is so public and apparent, even if you subtract "the typical one-sided hater".

E: To add, I am currently, right now, playing it again after a break. Progressing your char is fun, the world and city itself is great, but I'm not fully or remotely satisfied in other areas of the game. Mixed feelings, could've been in development longer in my eyes, but "hype killed it", I guess. Remember the near riots when people suspected another delay would happen. Yeah.

People were angry with the delay because they didn't know it would be unfinished to this extent. If anyone from CDPR honestly told the market that the game was completed for only 30%, I assume the number of people who were urging them to release would reduce drastically. Or they could release a beta version (pretty much what we play now) and be truthful about it. However they chose to destroy the company's credit for short term sale boost. Sad.

 

[NevaEilhart]

Overly forgiving consumers will doubtlessly generate more false advertisement. After all it's consumers' fault not to be able to tell. If advertisements can't be believed what's the point of making them? A promise is a promise, they did release a good game but it's still far from what's been shown in NC wire, which is released in 2020 right before the release, not in 2018 btw.

Post automatically merged: Dec 24, 2020

It's not to be overly forgiving to have reasonable expectations about one thing and not to follow the over hyped trend we have nowadays for pretty much everything. Seems like a problem on the end of people following the hype rather than a problem of educated consumers vs false advertising.

People hype themselves to no end and follow whatever they're being told by influencers, and after that they fall.

Just look at how many of those influencers praised the game (PC version) just before the console release happened, and turned their jacket just after. I'm quoting one of them here "CP2077 lived up to my expectations" on the day of release, and one day after it, basically started making videos trashing the whole game.

That's the real issue to me. No middle grounds. Everyone should take what they're being told with a grain of salt and take some time to analyze things a bit. But as I've said, nowadays it's not something people do anymore. Poor educational system, over-advertisement, social network economic system (which ends up being basically the need to publish your review as soon as possible to generate some clicks and stay ahead of the competition) and the constant need of going from one new thing to another are likely to be some of the causes.

 

[jahkin]

I mean no offense when I say this.

Is there anything in here that doesn't have it's own thread already? Or hasn't been discussed already?

Frankly, we know CDPR screwed up and CDPR knows they've screwed up. This incessant rehashing before CDPR has even had a chance to win back some modicum of respect is leading us nowhere and convoluting the forum.

Sorry, don't you know this has to be milked for al lits worth now? Prepare yourself for the next eternity that CDRed will rival EA now for shittiest company of all time!

Seriously, while I see much anger as justified and it needs to stay relevant so CD Red has a feel of pressure on them, I also think people should restrain themselves a little. Will be annoying enough to get Youtube-vids of every wannabe-game-journalist jumping the hate-train to get clicks...

 

[Gorance]

I think we have 2 CD projects now... one that wanted to finish the game which was started before end of 2018 and the other ones with money and wanting a huge image got Keanu Reeves and changed the whole main storyline which pretty much messed up everything so they couldnt even finish on time...

Other thing that i find weird is that everything that was in the trailers and some gameplay and interviews is not in the game .. like at all.. Also its kinda weird that ssd players have less bugs than hdd which we should have seen it coming a mile away and also same setups have a lot of difference in quality... myself had no flying cars or anything glitchy.. and when i see the bugs im like hmm did not have that...on the other hand my bro had a ton of em... different rig but from the same copy of the game... Its soo weird.

 

[Kalfear]

Overly forgiving consumers will doubtlessly generate more false advertisement. After all it's consumers' fault not to be able to tell. If advertisements can't be believed what's the point of making them? A promise is a promise, they did release a good game but it's still far from what's been shown in NC wire, which is released in 2020 right before the release, not in 2018 btw.

In some cases yes
But imo, not in this case
CDPR was very up front on how massive the demands were for this game
They didnt hide a thing even once

So once you know that
CONSUMERS should know that reducing it to fit on out of date technology is most likely going to be buggy and far from appealing.

Ill use Deus Ex Mankind Divided as an example
I pre ordered DE:MD because I absolutely loved Deus EX: Human Revolution.
Edios released the system specs required for that game
I met the recommended specs BARELY

So I KNEW AS A INTELLEGENT CONSUMER I was NOT going to be able to run DE:MD at full bore
AND that I would probably encounter difficulties in areas because I barely met the Recommended spec.
Its just common sense
Its not some advance level economics and consumerism strategy or concept.
MORE is better
LESS is worse

So my pre order comes and my poor computer
man did it struggle to run that game
1-5 system crashes every hour (thats full on reboot, not crash to desktop)
Graphics card was so over taxed it failed to draw stuff properly
If you played DE:MD you know it had a mini game that you would find triangles, scan them with your cell phone and upload to Edios app for special rewards and acheivements
My Graphics card could not properly draw those for them to be scanable

And again, I MET THE RECOMMENDED SYSTEM SPECS (but barely)
The game was playable if I turned everything down to low and took breaks to let processor get a break.

But I expected this BECAUSE I knew I could not run this game in the optimal settings.
My hardware to just to out of date and the game had to be greatly diminished in EVERYTHING just to run poorly

I personally said "welp I tried and put game aside for 2+ years until I got a system that COULD run game a its optimal setting.
And then I enjoyed the game.

As a CONSUMER I understood that even though they sold the game to me
It running properly and smoothly was dependent on ME to get the proper hardware.

I see nothing different i this go around
We all knew well ahead of time this game was designed for current to high end computers and current to next gen consoles.
ANYONE coming in under that was in for a rough ride.

And that's what happened
Current and high end computers and current (next gen not released yet) consoles run the game fine to excellent. Depending on their hardware.

And anyone coming in under that would experience lesser game play

Now personally I don't think CDPR should have even tried to release this on last gen consoles.
But I suspect that's more a Sony/MS/Investors issue then it was CDPR.
That's my gut feeling
So they tried to appease them and make this game fit on systems that simply do not have the hardware (in many cases not even meeting minimum specs).

So yeah, I 1000% call that buyer beware.

I Really wanted to play EQ2 back in the day and even got a closed beta invite to beta test it
My computer back then didn't even meet the minimum standard because EQ2 was a monster hardware MMO.
So I passed on invite

Personally I'll hold CDPR responsible for things in their control
MY HARDWARE, be it computer or console, that's not in their control.

If I was experiencing even 50% of the bugs I experienced in Fall Out 3,4,NV I would scream bloody murder at them
But truth of matter is in 65 hours of play I seen exactly 2 minor graphics bugs and some crash to desktop bugs (which are worse on patch days and then clean up or even disappear)

Thats petty amazing for a new AAA game that is as demanding as this game is truth be told.

People were angry with the delay because they didn't know it would be unfinished to this extent. If anyone from CDPR honestly told the market that the game was completed for only 30%, I assume the number of people who were urging them to release would reduce drastically. Or they could release a beta version (pretty much what we play now) and be truthful about it. However they chose to destroy the company's credit for short term sale boost. Sad.

I think you give those people (ones angry over delays) way to much credit
They would have found something to bitch about
If its not delays its how game runs or how everything not specifically how they wanted it or how they had to give up game when they got a refund or that Judy gay or ....

Its endless and those people will never be happy

Is CP2077 perfect?
of course not
I want Third Person Perspective and playing the game and getting annoyed with jumping makes me want it even more.
But CDPR told me it was FPS mode only
People mad about no net running
CDPR told us that had to be cut


Ive seen companies hide things from their player base before
CDPR is not one of those companies
Not by a long shot

Actually lets look at how out of control the complainers have been
No TPP
The complainers cheered this as some sort of victory
Those nasty 3rd person players have to pay first person
This game a FPS first
This no longer a RPG
This is the 2nd coming of GTA
(ive read all these statements from those people and more)

None of it true tho
CDPR never said this was a GTA clone
CDPR never said this was designed as a fps above all else
In fact CDPR DID SAY Cyberpunk 2077 is a RPG
Yet these are all COMPLAINTS from people who also been screaming about the last gen console performance

So it really doesn't matter what any developer (not just CDPR) a certain malcontent portion of the player base will always find something to bitch about.

Who really cares if it was delayed again or not?
I pre ordered and I just rolled with the delays
OK, Ill look at something else

I had a guy tell me on a message forum (think it might have been facebook actually) about how mad he was at CDPR because he pre ordered and didn't have money for his kids XMAS presents.
My reply was "I fail to see how that's anyone's fault but your own. If you cant afford the game, wait until you can afford it. Are you saying that if the game ran properly for you it would justify not buying gifts for kids????? "
Of course I never heard from him again after that.

To me, that's what most of the complainers sound like!
Occasionally someone makes a legitimate comment
But over all its just complaining for the sake of complaining and a huge waste of time and energy IMO.

CDPR said the game runs surprisingly fine on CURRENT GENERATION Consoles and up
Not amazing, not excellent, not outstanding
FINE

and it did on those machines.

 

[Bloodartist]

1. In night city wire they said you could customize your gun "for example scope and suppressor", but in the game you only have scope and suppressor. They are just leading on with the certain terminology they use and leave the blame to players' imagination

Indeed. In a lot of cases what they promised was technically true, but it was also the ONLY thing that we got. The marketing was misleading in that it implicated that they would have more things up their sleeve, when in fact they didn't. What we saw, was the ONLY thing we got.

I remember watching the Doctor Viktor ripperdoc scene and was like: "its supercool if I go through something like this every time I visit a ripperdoc". Guess what, Viktor scene is in the game, but ripperdocs are just standard vendors. I plug in my implants like they are band-aids. No negative effects, no visuals, no nothing. Same goes for many things. They just went with the bare minimum in whatever they said. Enough to prove their promises right, but nothing past that.

They said that there are prostitutes whose services you can pay for, and there is an equal amount of male and female ones. True, there is one of each. Not exactly the thing I was expecting.

You could argue that CDPR was very open in what they were doing, but if I had known that they were literally hiding nothing but the story from us, I would have had very different expectations and been much less hyped.

ps. I still continue being appalled in where the heck did six years with a 500-man team with 100+ million budget GO? Is this criminally ineffficient managing? Other companies produce better results in less time. You can't even argue that CDPR work is LESS buggy than something Bethesda has done for example. Thats not even an excuse anymore. You can't argue that they were granting their developers better conditions and more lenient work schedule. CP2077 falls dramatically short from bar set by Fallout 4 for example, despite the games having a ton of similarities. I'm struggling to come up with excuses.

 

[GodBlock]

Marketing hey, it's a powerful thing.

I honestly think they're doing OK, they released the game, they are patching it, a little bit of radio silence while they get things done does not bother me.

 

[mahony0]

I'm ok with buying but needs at least 2 or 3 successful releases for me to preorder again.