[Act I] Is Abigail bad and guilty?

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Juuuhan said:
Bad? nah...Becides Abigail is my favorite character (together with the Fisher King)Why Abigail should be saved in my opinion.- She aswell as Geralt is an outcast- Aswell as Geralt, she is decribed as powerful/dangerous but humans/people still need her, like they need witchers.- She prefer to work alone rather than with other people just as Geralt.- She helps Geralt more than those religious fundamentalism. (which in my eyes are one of the major source of evil in this world) So... always fun to slaughter them then. :evil:- And why would her religion matter? Geralt doesn't belive, he couldn't care less in religious status. So to save a woman accused by alot of bullshit from those ignorant bastards seems like the right thing to do in my eyes. :)
Yes, I agree :beer: The arguments of the religious fanatics never convinced me to leave Abigail to the mob.Regardless of her membership of the LHS...
in this case (The Beast) she is innocent according to a comment of the healer in Murky Waters. But then it's already tooo late.(You will only get this comment when you leave Abigail to the mob):
 
If you take the multi parallel universe theory then that is not strictly true, just because Abigail is a member of LHS if she dies does not necessarily mean that she is also a member of LHS if she survives.We can say she is a member of LHS only if it is mentioned in the survival universe.
 
fchopin said:
If you take the multi parallel universe theory then that is not strictly true, just because Abigail is a member of LHS if she dies does not necessarily mean that she is also a member of LHS if she survives.We can say she is a member of LHS only if it is mentioned in the survival universe.
Well you can see it that way, I don't. In my opinion it's the same "one" world with consequenses. You can change the outcome but not peoples decisions.And if you look at it as a story, this game is like a story with multiple endings/happenings. However this do not rule out the fact that some people have certain opinions/religions etc etc.However i won't debate this any further, cause frankly in my opinion this is an absurd statement.
 
It is not an absurd statement because you can only judge a person by the experiences that are given depending on the road taken.You can change people’s decisions depending on the road taken, as an example one person could be considered a very good person if the road they took in life worked out.If they took the wrong road they could be considered bad people because life forced them to change what they considered to be good so they would survive.
 
fchopin said:
It is not an absurd statement because you can only judge a person by the experiences that are given depending on the road taken.You can change people’s decisions depending on the road taken, as an example one person could be considered a very good person if the road they took in life worked out.If they took the wrong road they could be considered bad people because life forced them to change what they considered to be good so they would survive.
Which is why i disagree. Abigail was greatly hated by all humans right from the start until the wery moment she would be burned. (which were when Geralt stopped them) It's not like she right at the end joined the LHS based on the fact that she saw Geralt would leave her, or she did this earlier based on the future fact that Geralt would leave her. Becides being a witch and being hated by humans it would make sense if she had some spiders in her closet.In my eyes you could see this like a movie, a story of Geralt of Rivia. And even if the choices can be made different, all character "sheets" were already decided. Some were revealed in the way you play it and some not.So yes, in my opinion this is absurd and now, i won't continue this debate. ::)
 
Also consider that she is a WITCH and knows the name of deities fair and foul, and if she is going to utter a curse with her last breath, it will not be one of the nice gods she calls upon.
 
Okay, I just got here (sort of), so I have to throw in my two cents...The doll threw me off a bit, until I recalled that upon visiting each of Heron, Mikul and Odo, as well as outside the (bandits) cave and just down from the Chapel, the Beast appeared at each location. It, of course, has to be night for it to appear, and as not all of the townsmen's tasks must be completed after dark it was just coincidence that I was at all locations at night. So I noticed the Beast's arrival at each. If the townsmen had been innocent, wouldn't the Beast have only shown up at Abigail's door?Also, Odo had gone to the bandits asking for advice on how to kill his brother. Alvin remarked to Geralt that it was the Reverend who told him to go to that certain house (the bandits'). Mikul was a confirmed rapist. Heron was a traitor. There is hard evidence of each of their crimes; what evidence do we have that Abigail committed any?A bit of historic symbolism, for what it is, played a part for me as well. Long ago, women were rounded up by mobs and burned as witches for what were perceived by them as sins against God. In actuality, many of these women were midwives, with knowledge of natural medicine, and users of herbs. I know that's a stretch, relating it to the game, but it did cross my mind in making my decision.This is an immersive game, though, isn't it?
 
I have to say I absolutely love this thread.One thing to consider: as someone mentioned, if Abigail is part of the LHS cult, she would be naturally interested in driving people to suicide. So yeah, selling poison to Ilsa. BUT: after you choose to save Abigail, when you meet her again in Murky Waters, she implies she had changed a lot, more than Geralt suspects (remember, if you save her, she doesn't mention the LHS). And this seems to be true: she could very well suggest the way to resolve Alina's ghost situation that involves Adam's suicide, but instead she offers the entirely benign way of poetry.So, even if Abigail was somewhat evil at the start, at least she has the potential to reform her ways, unlike the villagers, who when given the chance of backing off, still ambush you.
 
Well, considering this thread is about Act I only...Unless something eye-opening, in regard to Abigail, happens after you slay the Beast (which I haven't done yet): at this point moral judgement is clearly in favor of Abigail. At this point, the only thing she's guilty of is selling poison to Ilsa, and we do not know whether she sold it to her out of sympathy, out of greed (unlikely... just a vial of potion) or as an act of vengeance against Mikul and the rest of the town (also unlikely, since she's smart enough to know that this would come right back to her) . . . or just detached disinterest. I think the latter is the most likely, although I suppose it's somewhat likely she gave Ilsa the poison out of sympathy.Other than that: all the guilt is just about entirely on the townspeople. They're guilty of murder, rape, selling children into slavery or sacrifice or whatever the Salamandra want them for (we don't know at this point, if ever . . . I'm guessing I'll find out in later chapters) and violence against non-humans. Other than the vial of poison: the only thing Abigail is guilty of is trying to defend herself (that's what the voodoo doll is for, as well as the cauldron in the cave).What happens after Act I is irrelevant. You have to make a judgment call when the mob comes. The obvious judgment is in Abigail's favor and against the townspeople, and foremost of all guilty people is the preacher . . . nothing new for the 'middle ages'.
 
Hogger49 said:
...Abigail still looks less evil than the crowd--by comparison. Of course her card makes you think, "WTF did I just do? I need a shower and maybe a shot." ;D
Absolutely! When I saw that my first thought was "Ye Gods, woman! There are CHILDREN in that cave with you! You've probably just smashed their innocence into a thousand tiny pieces!" No wonder Alvin goes weird!
 
Maerahn said:
Maerahn said:
...Abigail still looks less evil than the crowd--by comparison. Of course her card makes you think, "WTF did I just do? I need a shower and maybe a shot." ;D
Absolutely! When I saw that my first thought was "Ye Gods, woman! There are CHILDREN in that cave with you! You've probably just smashed their innocence into a thousand tiny pieces!" No wonder Alvin goes weird!
If there are children in the cave what does that make Geralt, remember that you only see the card if Geralt says yes.So if you blame Abigail for this you have to also blame Geralt.
 
Well... to be fair: Geralt really only says that he's "been drawn to [her] from the start". He doesn't actually, physically initiate anything carnal....And we're also not given the option to tell her that we have certain preferences in regard to time and place and atmosphere and who is or isn't invited to the event... ....Personally, I think if I had to blame anyone it would be the game developers. :)
 
Evnissyen said:
...Personally, I think if I had to blame anyone it would be the game developers. :)
I do not blame the developers as you have the option to choose, if you don't like her then say no.For me this is one of the best scenes in the game and i hope there are more for TW2.
 
fchopin said:
fchopin said:
...Personally, I think if I had to blame anyone it would be the game developers. :)
I do not blame the developers as you have the option to choose, if you don't like her then say no.For me this is one of the best scenes in the game and i hope there are more for TW2.
Hey, I blame the developers for everything from getting me hooked on The Witcher and thus preventing me from getting any actual work done to making Geralt get me into heaps of trouble by saying really stupid things at the stupidest moments. :) (Though the latter doesn't apply to Act I. Those still in Act I: You'll see.)Anyway: Joking.Except that it is a little annoying when... (ch. 2 spoiler):
Geralt starts saying things to people, without my ability to intervene, like "Tell me your list of benefactors." or "Who're your clients?" or "Got anything incriminating you can tell me about your clients?" or "I suspect you're closely tied to Salamandra and you're taking orders from them, but I have no proof so lets forget I said anything about it." or "I think you're in league with Salamandra!" or "Your 'professor' guise doesn't fool me for a moment!"Geralt... Geralt... you're getting me into trouble, here.Luckily he stops doing that after he gets out of Vizima.
But anyhow... I'm quite fond of Abigail, as well as her card. True, her card was not at all what I expected, it was quite a surprise, but it's just crazy and freaky and weird enough to really interest me. :)
 
Maerahn said:
Absolutely! When I saw that my first thought was "Ye Gods, woman! There are CHILDREN in that cave with you! You've probably just smashed their innocence into a thousand tiny pieces!" No wonder Alvin goes weird!
Have you been in the houses in the game? Most of them have only one room.The children in the Outskirts have seen adults having sex before. And this is realistic -- throughout most of history, people didn't live in huge houses with lots of privacy. Sex might happen under the cover of darkness, so children might not have seen it, but they certainly heard it. And they certainly saw farm animals going at it. Innocence is a modern invention. :)
 
Corylea said:
Innocence is a modern invention. :)
As is privacy, you're right.Of course: I'm sure Maerahn was talking about the sort of... well... kinky nature of Abigail's... well... approach to sex... that is to say: what she turns into at point-of-sex... that is: What Hogger was referring to when mentioning he thinks he needs "a shower and a maybe a shot" after his interaction with Abigail.Good thing Geralt is immune to infectious diseases, eh? Eh?But I like Abigail. In both guises.
 
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