Age of braindance decadence: We didn’t get rid of our problems, we multiplied them

[azriel77]

I have not read the whole thread, but I am with wisdom000 here. Brain-dancing might be good for minor plot for watching how NPC's will become addicted to it, and seeing brain dance actor/actress, illegal braindancing..etc again, for plot. However, for the player is sounds boring as hell. So you plug in to braindancing and what? Watch a video or a reenactment that you cannot do anything about but watch? That falls heavily into my hatred of how games rip away control from the player and force CGI/ingame action that you cannot do anything about.

I think VR addiction would have been much better(not to be confused with cyberspace/netrunner which is very different). Something like SAO technology, where you got the full 5 senses and virtual games/worlds where people have better lives/fantasies. I am not saying braindancing would not be as addictive, but it has little impact on PC players since they cannot really experience them. A VR addiction on the other hand is very different. Imagine putting in a VR sim of the perfect life, you have a simulation of whatever you want with A.I. (almost) indistinguishable from real people. In real life you live a crappy job/alone/no money, barely making ends meet. In your fantasy VR you have a mansion, a selection of men/women lovers, maids, buttlers who do your bidding, or perhaps you are more conservative and have the family person with a loving spouse and kids, living the American dream, or perhaps you have some illegal VR sims where you can do unspeakable things.

Anyway, the difference between braindance and VR is that braindance you are just a watcher, a VR simulation and the character can actually interact and do things.

 

[thewarsend]

I have not read the whole thread, but I am with wisdom000 here. Brain-dancing might be good for minor plot for watching how NPC's will become addicted to it, and seeing brain dance actor/actress, illegal braindancing..etc again, for plot. However, for the player is sounds boring as hell. So you plug in to braindancing and what? Watch a video or a reenactment that you cannot do anything about but watch? That falls heavily into my hatred of how games rip away control from the player and force CGI/ingame action that you cannot do anything about.

I think VR addiction would have been much better(not to be confused with cyberspace/netrunner which is very different). Something like SAO technology, where you got the full 5 senses and virtual games/worlds where people have better lives/fantasies. I am not saying braindancing would not be as addictive, but it has little impact on PC players since they cannot really experience them. A VR addiction on the other hand is very different. Imagine putting in a VR sim of the perfect life, you have a simulation of whatever you want with A.I. (almost) indistinguishable from real people. In real life you live a crappy job/alone/no money, barely making ends meet. In your fantasy VR you have a mansion, a selection of men/women lovers, maids, buttlers who do your bidding, or perhaps you are more conservative and have the family person with a loving spouse and kids, living the American dream, or perhaps you have some illegal VR sims where you can do unspeakable things.

Anyway, the difference between braindance and VR is that braindance you are just a watcher, a VR simulation and the character can actually interact and do things.

It doesn't have to be that way, when braindancing, it is not like you are watching a video, it is as if you are living it.. Braindancing could be more like Assasins Creed games, where you are actually reliving the memories of your ancestors, but there is a illuision of choice attached to it.. (To be clear, what you will do in that situation is already been determined by your ancestor, but the protagonist still feels in control)

Braindances are digital recordings of a person’s experience. The viewer can stream a braindance directly into his neural system via special brain augmentations, called a BD player. Braindances allow the viewer to experience all brain processes registered, including emotions, muscle movements and all stimuli perceived by the recording person.
The range of themes of these recordings varies from simple braindances made by megacorporations, which e.g. allow the viewer to feel the full experience of an explorer with all its thrills, sweats, smells, views, sounds and the real feeling of curiosity that pushes men to go beyond the horizon against fear and physical weakness. But there are also more controversial sides of braindance, because some recordings are created illegally in the underground. Entering the mind of a serial killer means not only seeing the monstrosity he performs, but also living his lust to kill and fulfillment.

It could be great if you braindanced a persons memories and it effected your dialogue options (Like in Fallout games if you had low intelligence or dialogue perks like lady killer/black widow or terrifying presence, you would get different dialogue options) since braindancing can mess up with your head..

 

[azriel77]

It doesn't have to be that way, when braindancing, it is not like you are watching a video, it is as if you are living it.. Braindancing could be more like Assasins Creed games, where you are actually reliving the memories of your ancestors, but there is a illuision of choice attached to it.. (To be clear, what you will do in that situation is already been determined by your ancestor, but the protagonist still feels in control)



It could be great if you braindanced a persons memories and it effected your dialogue options (Like in Fallout games if you had low intelligence or dialogue perks like lady killer/black widow or terrifying presence, you would get different dialogue options) since braindancing can mess up with your head..

Actually, different versions of braindance tech would be amazing. The basic and consumer model just does playback of experiences, but an expensive VR sim BD player with an A.I. could go further and actually recreate the scene in a VR sim that allowed the user to interact and do different things in that experience that did not happen in the recording. Think of it as a form of holodeck like in star trek. The A.I. could recreate the scene based on what information it knows and past information it has collected to recreate the scene on what most likely would happen. So you would be able to go off script in the sim version. This would be way more interesting than watching boring videos, or sticking to a script that cannot change.

 

[Leon_M]

This has probably been mentioned already in this thread, but couldn't BDs be used to solve crimes, Minority Report-like? I mean if they really are recordings from other persons experience. They could be used by the police we see on the game's trailer.

Excuse me if I'm saying something stupid, I don't know much about CP2020 background and lore.

 

[Maelcom404]

This has probably been mentioned already in this thread, but couldn't BDs be used to solve crimes, Minority Report-like? I mean if they really are recordings from other persons experience. They could be used by the police we see on the game's trailer.

Excuse me if I'm saying something stupid, I don't know much about CP2020 background and lore.

The Braindance are just a video that you "live", it's like youtube, you can see almost anything you'd want to (porn, crime, etc...), there's no way to play it like "minority report", if a guy shoot a Braindance film, he'll probably wear a hood or something, so you can't see his face, etc...
If cops doesn't arrest everyone puting video of them smoking pot or driving beyond speed limits on youtube, they'll probably don't do it with braindance (except for a few cases), since it's mostly sold on black market for the most "criminals" tapes (rape, snuff, kind of stuff).

Check the movie "Strange Days", it'll gives you an idea of how it works.

 

[Leon_M]

The Braindance are just a video that you "live", it's like youtube, you can see almost anything you'd want to (porn, crime, etc...), there's no way to play it like "minority report", if a guy shoot a Braindance film, he'll probably wear a hood or something, so you can't see his face, etc...
If cops doesn't arrest everyone puting video of them smoking pot or driving beyond speed limits on youtube, they'll probably don't do it with braindance (except for a few cases), since it's mostly sold on black market for the most "criminals" tapes (rape, snuff, kind of stuff).

Check the movie "Strange Days", it'll gives you an idea of how it works.

Thanks, I'll check that movie out.
Braindances are a very interesting concept.

I was suggesting using them as evidences for special cases, like missions in the game, if you're playing as a cop. Imagine that a victim's BD was found, and you could identify the assaulter. Or watching through a murderer BD, you could find his location, or if some object was missing from the crime scene, things like that.

 

[Maelcom404]

Thanks, I'll check that movie out.
Braindances are a very interesting concept.

I was suggesting using them as evidences for special cases, like missions in the game, if you're playing as a cop. Imagine that a victim's BD was found, and you could identify the assaulter. Or watching through a murderer BD, you could find his location, or if some object was missing from the crime scene, things like that.

Oh, yes it could work like this.
It's a little how the movie Strange Days turns out (I'll not spoil you anything thought),
Honnestly we know how it works "on paper", but in-game, I don't know how that's going to work.

 

[thewarsend]

Thanks, I'll check that movie out.
Braindances are a very interesting concept.

I was suggesting using them as evidences for special cases, like missions in the game, if you're playing as a cop. Imagine that a victim's BD was found, and you could identify the assaulter. Or watching through a murderer BD, you could find his location, or if some object was missing from the crime scene, things like that.

Oh, yes it could work like this.
It's a little how the movie Strange Days turns out (I'll not spoil you anything thought),
Honnestly we know how it works "on paper", but in-game, I don't know how that's going to work.

Nope, it couldn't work that since it would really mess up with your psychology.. They are illegal for a reason..

While braindancing, you will feel exactly the way they have felt while committing the murder, any fulfillment they got out of that murder, any hateful feeling, you will feel exactly same way.. There is no other way around..

Also, as far as i know, you can't extract memories from a dead person, so you cannot braindance a dead persons memories..

 

[Maelcom404]

Nope, it couldn't work that since it would really mess up with your psychology.. They are illegal for a reason..

While braindancing, you will feel exactly the way they have felt while committing the murder, any fulfillment they got out of that murder, any hateful feeling, you will feel exactly same way.. There is no other way around..

Also, as far as i know, you can't extract memories from a dead person, so you cannot braindance a dead persons memories..

Right, i hadn't thought about it that way.
but still, i wonder how it'll work "in-game", excepted for screwing your empathy or intelligence points.

 

[thewarsend]

Right, i hadn't thought about it that way.
but still, i wonder how it'll work "in-game", excepted for screwing your empathy or intelligence points.

Well, the whole thing would probably work like a Call of Duty game.. You are not in control of your actions, the whole thing would be linear, but you would feel like as if you are in control.. It would probably mess with your empathy and intelligence points, as well as it would drive you closer to being a cyberpscho.. I would also like to see how it would effect your dialogue options..

 

[wisdom000]

Also, using braindance to investigate a crime wouldn't really work, unless the victim or one of the perps was wearing a braindance recorder...

You can't just go into a persons head and record memories from their, tey have to be recorded live.

Now braindance sequences can also be created whole cloth for just use things like vid recordings with artificial nerve and sensory stimulation, which is why Braindance is a popular prison sentence. They hook the inmate up to what amounts to never ending endless loops of Brady Bunch beamed straight into their head, 24 hours a day, seven days a week, for the duration of the sentence...

It amounts to a more high tech version of the aversion therapy from Clockwork Orange.

 

[Suhiira]

Once again I'll just say.
What wisdom000 said ...

 

[wisdom000]

Because I am awesome!

 

[Suhiira]

Because I am awesome!

Naw, you just type faster so you say it before I can.
I had the idea first !

 

[wisdom000]

Don't bring me dooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooown BRUCE!

 

[Sardukhar]

Also, using braindance to investigate a crime wouldn't really work, unless the victim or one of the perps was wearing a braindance recorder...

You can't just go into a persons head and record memories from their, tey have to be recorded live.

Well.

Well..

WHAT IF...you merged the tech of braindancer and the memory/personality capture techniques of Soulkiller? So you could go in and harvest/live through your victim's experiences post-death/assault/whatever.

I expect a time limit on recovery of course.

Might be a leeeeetle too futuristic to be my preferred Cyberpunk, but it could make for an interesting story.

 

[Suhiira]

I can't see post-death unless it's REAL soon after they die.
After an few minutes (maybe less) the brain is totally shut down, no electrical impulses to capture.

 

[wisdom000]

Well.

Well..

WHAT IF...you merged the tech of braindancer and the memory/personality capture techniques of Soulkiller? So you could go in and harvest/live through your victim's experiences post-death/assault/whatever.

I expect a time limit on recovery of course.

Might be a leeeeetle too futuristic to be my preferred Cyberpunk, but it could make for an interesting story.

Something like that might work... but it would require such massive resources that only really fucking powerful corps or govt agencies would use it, and even then, it would be of limited capability... as you said..

I don't think you could harvest the consciousness of a dead person, unless maybe you had something in place to keep the brain electricly viable... synapses and neurons firing properly and all that...

 

[wisdom000]

Dammit Suhir..... what are you telepathetic???????????

sTOP THINKING MY THOUGHTS....

 

[Suhiira]

Dammit Suhir..... what are you telepathetic???????????

sTOP THINKING MY THOUGHTS....

I'll stop when you do *sticks out her tongue*