An idea for Artefact rework

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It is common knowledge that artefacts are badly designed and unhealthy for the game. And now that summoning cirkle has been turned into a create rng card, the only interesting artefact that was basicly carriyng artefacts, you dont reallly see anyone play artefacts at all. Right now there is one exception though and that is hen gaidht sword with pincer maneuver.

Allright so i have been doing my second playthrough through thronebreaker and its from thronebreaker that i got this idea for artefacts. So if you havent played thronebreaker yet or you simply dont remember how the artifacts work in thronebreaker, here is how they work: In the thronebreaker deck builder you can put 1 artifact in your deck and only one, sort of like in the gwent beta when you could only have four gold cars and six silver ones, no more. And the artifact is there, on the board from round one to the last. permanent resilience.

so here is sort of what i suggest artifacts should become:

You can only put one artifact in your deck. You will have your artifact as soon as the match starts, the artifact will be on the left side of the board right in front of your leader, kind of like how the leaders looked in the beta. it will be kind of like another leader ability, sort of. For example for swarm syndicate you would put the eternal fire artifact in your deck and it would do something like this: charge: 2, spawn a zealot, whenever a card gets spawned boost it by one. And maybe Vandergrifts blade would do something like this: Charge: 1, boost a unit by 5. whenever you play a knight boost it by 2.

Reworking the artefacts like this would not only solve and fix artifacts, making them a lot more fun and interesting, it would also give Gwent a lot more flavor and flexibility.
it would also be a good opportunity to rework cards like angouleme and caretaker, cards that dont see any play at all. But what about scoiatel artifact ambush? i suggest the bronze artefacts become special cards and units that ambush. In thronebreaker there are ambush units that work really well and they dont only trigger when your opponent plays something, the do different things. And if ambush becomes a unit thing it opens up a lot of opportunities for all factions. For example assasination, (the nilfgaard tactic special card) could do this: Tactic, human, agent power: 1 ,when your opponent plays a unit flip this card and damage it by 6. decrease the damage by one for every unit next to it. this would also give gwent a lot more flavour. (And to all of you tactic fans, dont worry you could still pull out assasination with cohoorn since tactic cards dont necessarily need to be special cards, all of them just are at the moment) With this rework Eldains leader ability (sorry i forgot what it is called now) would also have to be reworked. maybe an elven deadeye swarm thing could be fun? All artifact removal cards will also have to be changed into something else which would be a good thing, since they are really bad now that the only artefacts that gets played are deploy artifacts which you cant control in any way and you also have no good reason to destroy them either, you are just freeing up some space for your opponent.
 
May be, artefact destroyers may exist if there is an artifact, that can be destroyed. But they can cost more since the artefact is the only one. Or there can be more artifacts, like magical rings, boots and so on in an RPG style.
 
May be, artefact destroyers may exist if there is an artifact, that can be destroyed. But they can cost more since the artefact is the only one. Or there can be more artifacts, like magical rings, boots and so on in an RPG style.
I, personally dont think they should keep any artifact removal in the game, right now the artifacts only strenght is that the wont likely get removed. And if the rework artifacts like i suggest they do in this thread, having a card that destroys your opponents artifact would just be like a usurper, but for artefacts. hmm... Maybe an artifact that stops your opponents artifact?
 
I find this thread intresting because:
It is common knowledge that artefacts are badly designed and unhealthy for the game.
I didn't knew that. I thought they are fine and an intresting change. Also sort of necessary to punish full unit decks with too many reactive cards (just like enslave does) or to enable virtual 2 card 1 turn moves creating momentum. I see many player play artefacts and the units you mention too. I regulary see cartaker recylcing portals, and angouleme is annoying when It uses your portal. sihil and ale of ancestors are super worth on a long round provision vise, and I can see sihil easily set up in a spy deck. Traps are awesome, its more that squishy units like elven scout do not fit there that well if you already play a few units. Black blood is like an extra big killer like geralt especially in NG, Petris Philter is probably the most broken and can substitute defenders in certain decks, vandergrift is like a second reynard odo but unkillable and cheaper.

Its probably shorter to list the weak ones. New summoning circle was probably overnerfed and has a too broad target pool even for assimilate decks, scepter of storms is sort of pointless especially with armor now, cadaverine needs a rework, whatever the role of sacrad flame was in the past the powercreep in syndicate made it useless, and maybe but maybe damaging artefacts should ignore armor in general.

I wouldn't mind the change you propose. Still Its seems to me the powercreep within the total cardpool is a bigger issue and anything else is just minor matter.
 
Reworking the artefacts like this would not only solve and fix artifacts, making them a lot more fun and interesting, it would also give Gwent a lot more flavor and flexibility.

Explain how this would be a lot more fun, or where where is the flavor coming from?
This sounds like something every salesman says about everything they're selling.
 
I regulary see cartaker recylcing portals, and angouleme is annoying when It uses your portal. sihil and ale of ancestors are super worth on a long round provision vise, and I can see sihil easily set up in a spy deck. Traps are awesome, its more that squishy units like elven scout do not fit there that well if you already play a few units. Black blood is like an extra big killer like geralt especially in NG, Petris Philter is probably the most broken and can substitute defenders in certain decks, vandergrift is like a second reynard odo but unkillable and cheaper.
Huh, I swear i have not seen the caretaker portal combo in at least 2 expansions. Its probably because it is simply too expensive and conditional. first you need to have played portal 1 round for it to later get in the graveyard for caretaker, and you also need at least four 4 provision engines in your deck. you can easaly draw into your 4 provision cards so that portal bricks. sihil is also too conditional and expensive which explains why i havent seen it beeing used once since it got nerfed after the F**K SIHIL campaign.

Yeah artifacts are definetly unhealthy for gwent and desperatly needs a rework. I mean whats the point of artifact removal cards like strays bomber and the da`o if the only artifacts that players use are deploy artifacts?

and angouleme is extremely bad not only in design but also in what she does. If your opponent does not have any artifacts she will give you 3 points for 11 provisions! This will happen about 70% of your matches too. and if you get lucky, i mean reeally lucky and you hit a portal with her it might have bricked. for this to work you would have to put 4 provision engines in your deck for a portal you dont have.
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Explain how this would be a lot more fun, or where where is the flavor coming from?
This sounds like something every salesman says about everything they're selling.
Just play thronebreaker and you will see. its a whole new mechanic, could give gwent a lot more depth. it will be sort of like another leader ability only that you see the card and its art on the board like the leader cards in beta gwent. This change would give you more options. it makes a lot more sense than deploy artifacts which should really just be special cards like hen gaidth and portal.

though there are a couple of good deploy artefacts that do something when you play it and then has a passive ability or an order like for example vandergrifts blade or svalblood totem. This is what im suggesting all artifacts should be, and that they are a thing you pick for your deck. you can only have 1 of them, they will cost provisions and they are always present. Just imagine if every playstyle had its own artefact fitting it. you would put svalblood totem in with cultists for example. svalblood totem could do something like: charge: 1 damage an allied unit by 2, once a round when you play a cultist spawn a bear abomination.

Hope i explained to you why this change would be flavorful and add a lot more fun to gwent :)
 
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I like the idea to bound artifacts to a leader. Or they can be bound to a unit. In second case it may look like atrifact is a special card that adds some additional abilities to a unit (more power, invulnerability, striking every round by timer (like catapult). more armor) and so on. We already have it like Armory card. Another artifacts can be a leader cards, that add some passive abilities. It can be a crossbow, that adds ability of range strike. It can be a sword, that buffs knights. It can be a ring of Melitele, that heals random unit every round. And the good idea is to limit number of artifacts by two or one, but every artifact must have provision cost, cause the power of artifacts can be different.
Because now, when u drop an artifact to the field, it is looking unessential, when sword acts by himself without an owner. It's not realistic. It's very very strange-looking behavior.
 
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Huh, I swear i have not seen the caretaker portal combo in at least 2 expansions. Its probably because it is simply too expensive and conditional. first you need to have played portal 1 round for it to later get in the graveyard for caretaker, and you also need at least four 4 provision engines in your deck. you can easaly draw into your 4 provision cards so that portal bricks. sihil is also too conditional and expensive which explains why i havent seen it beeing used once since it got nerfed after the F**K SIHIL campaign.

Yeah artifacts are definetly unhealthy for gwent and desperatly needs a rework. I mean whats the point of artifact removal cards like strays bomber and the da`o if the only artifacts that players use are deploy artifacts?

and angouleme is extremely bad not only in design but also in what she does. If your opponent does not have any artifacts she will give you 3 points for 11 provisions! This will happen about 70% of your matches too. and if you get lucky, i mean reeally lucky and you hit a portal with her it might have bricked. for this to work you would have to put 4 provision engines in your deck for a portal you dont have.

Well they might have their weakness but at least I saw them played, It could also just be a question of rank. Competition kills diversity so Its possible those combos are not played at higher rank if they are this risky.
The cartake portal combo I have seen used in an engine heavy NR deck so having 4 provision cards wasn't an issue for them. And well sihil .. you can get for 11 provisions 15 damage over 10 turns; sure its not unconditional but with the right deck its a worth investment (as long you get it for a long turn which is probably the bigger issue).
And angouleme.. well its a situational tech, a hate card. You get no refund for Geralt: Yrden either If there is nothing to debuff. But I see that artefact destruction feels pointless against 25 cards out of several hundred. It would only make sense If traps would be a thing so decks which have to improve their odds agsint it could use artefact hate.
 
IMHO no-units decks based on artifacts should be banned from the game. Artifacts can stay, but only if every fraction will have universal artifact removal, like ida in SC before rework
 
IMHO no-units decks based on artifacts should be banned from the game. Artifacts can stay, but only if every fraction will have universal artifact removal, like ida in SC before rework
If you have not noticed the option to make no unit decks, especially those based on artifacts got removed months ago with the unit requirement in the deckbuilder. you can still make a deck that allows for a semi no unit last round but thats not really a no unit deck.

And im not saying that artifacts should be removed, im suggesting that artifacts should be changed. Changed into something better, more flavorful and healthier. because in Gwents current state artifacts are bad. a product of a rushed homecoming.
 
IMHO no-units decks based on artifacts should be banned from the game. Artifacts can stay, but only if every fraction will have universal artifact removal, like ida in SC before rework
Better remove artifacts in their current form, cause nounit decks are based on immune artifacts. Banning nounit decks is ugly politic. Someone must sit all day and censor all decks to ban nounit ones only because devs cannot make good game design. Can u imagine this?
If artifacts are bound to units, u cannot use nounit decks. Conversely, u will add more units to be sure ur artifacts will be playable. It's the best decision here, I think. And, again, it is best because of realism. Just use realism and logic and everything will become alright by itself. Artifacts are always used by people. Yes there can be some buildings, but they must have just armor to be destroyable and controllable but with no power. Isn't it beautiful? Yes, cause it's realistic.
 
I find this thread intresting because:

I didn't knew that. I thought they are fine and an intresting change. Also sort of necessary to punish full unit decks with too many reactive cards (just like enslave does) or to enable virtual 2 card 1 turn moves creating momentum. I see many player play artefacts and the units you mention too. I regulary see cartaker recylcing portals, and angouleme is annoying when It uses your portal. sihil and ale of ancestors are super worth on a long round provision vise, and I can see sihil easily set up in a spy deck. Traps are awesome, its more that squishy units like elven scout do not fit there that well if you already play a few units. Black blood is like an extra big killer like geralt especially in NG, Petris Philter is probably the most broken and can substitute defenders in certain decks, vandergrift is like a second reynard odo but unkillable and cheaper.

Its probably shorter to list the weak ones. New summoning circle was probably overnerfed and has a too broad target pool even for assimilate decks, scepter of storms is sort of pointless especially with armor now, cadaverine needs a rework, whatever the role of sacrad flame was in the past the powercreep in syndicate made it useless, and maybe but maybe damaging artefacts should ignore armor in general.

I wouldn't mind the change you propose. Still Its seems to me the powercreep within the total cardpool is a bigger issue and anything else is just minor matter.

I find it to be very obvious. They are cards that you can do nothing about without specific counter cards. That is just not a good idea and it sets up the game for broken no unit style decks which were extremely unpopular.

Summoning circle is a great example. Everyone has to tech in artifact removal just for this one extremely strong card? That's just silly.
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To the OP

Your idea is probably what they should have done at the start of homecoming but unfortunately I don't have any faith in CDPR to introduce this mechanic now.
 
Here are some examples and ideas for changes of the artifacts together with the rework of how artifacts play:

Portal: Neutral. 12 provisions
Charge: 2. summon a random 4 provision unit to a row

Ale of ancestors: Neutral 12 provisions
Cooldown: 3. boost a unit by 2

Tainted ale: neutral 11 provisions
Charge: 4 damage an enemy unit by 2

Hen gaidth sword: neutral 12 provisions
order: damage a unit by 2. deathblow spawn and play a base copy of it.
Whenever a deathblow is triggered damage a randow enemy unit by 2

Land of a thousand fables: Neutral. 12 provisons
order: play a gold special card form your deck, then play a bronze special card form your deck.

mahakam horn: scoia`teal. 12 provisions
Charge: 3. boost a unit in your hand by 3
Whenever you play a unit with a unique category boost a random unit in your hand by 1.

Sihil: Neutral 12 provisions
Cooldown: 3. damage an enemy unit by 1.
Deathblow: increas sihils order damage by 1.

Sacred flame: Syndicate. 12 provisions
Charge: 1. Spawn a base copy of an allied bronze unit on the battlefield.
Whenever you spawn a unit boost it by 1.

Svalblood totem: skellige. 12 provisions
order: damage an allied unit by 2. refresh this ability if a svalblood fanatic was summoned last round.
Once a round, if you play a cultist spawn and summon a svalblood fanatic to the melee row.

Dormant frightener: monsters. 12 provisions
charge: 1 destroy an allied unit and damage the highest enemy unit by that amount
Counter: 8 reduce the counter by 1 whenever an allied unit is destroued or consumed
when the counter reaches 0 spawn and summon Awekened frightener to the melee row.

Cadavarine: nilfgard. 12 provisions
order: create and play a gold tactic card from your deck
Whenever you play a gold tactic card play a random 1 power unit from your deck.

Vandergrifts blade: nortern realms. 12 provisions
order: boost an allied knight by 6
Whenever an allied northern realms card with order is played boost it by 1
 
Better remove artifacts in their current form, cause nounit decks are based on immune artifacts. Banning nounit decks is ugly politic. Someone must sit all day and censor all decks to ban nounit ones only because devs cannot make good game design. Can u imagine this?
If artifacts are bound to units, u cannot use nounit decks. Conversely, u will add more units to be sure ur artifacts will be playable. It's the best decision here, I think. And, again, it is best because of realism. Just use realism and logic and everything will become alright by itself. Artifacts are always used by people. Yes there can be some buildings, but they must have just armor to be destroyable and controllable but with no power. Isn't it beautiful? Yes, cause it's realistic.

Idea of destryable artifacts with armor sounds reasonable; the biggest current problem of artifacts is , that to counter it You have to use a card, that in other games is a brick. The best present artifact destroyer - again, only IMHO - is Syndycate special card (i don't renember it's name) for 4 provinsion that geave 4 coins if there is no artifact:/
 
Here are some examples and ideas for changes of the artifacts together with the rework of how artifacts play:

Portal: Neutral. 12 provisions
Charge: 2. summon a random 4 provision unit to a row

Ale of ancestors: Neutral 12 provisions
Cooldown: 3. boost a unit by 2

Tainted ale: neutral 11 provisions
Charge: 4 damage an enemy unit by 2

Hen gaidth sword: neutral 12 provisions
order: damage a unit by 2. deathblow spawn and play a base copy of it.
Whenever a deathblow is triggered damage a randow enemy unit by 2

Land of a thousand fables: Neutral. 12 provisons
order: play a gold special card form your deck, then play a bronze special card form your deck.

mahakam horn: scoia`teal. 12 provisions
Charge: 3. boost a unit in your hand by 3
Whenever you play a unit with a unique category boost a random unit in your hand by 1.

Sihil: Neutral 12 provisions
Cooldown: 3. damage an enemy unit by 1.
Deathblow: increas sihils order damage by 1.

Sacred flame: Syndicate. 12 provisions
Charge: 1. Spawn a base copy of an allied bronze unit on the battlefield.
Whenever you spawn a unit boost it by 1.

Svalblood totem: skellige. 12 provisions
order: damage an allied unit by 2. refresh this ability if a svalblood fanatic was summoned last round.
Once a round, if you play a cultist spawn and summon a svalblood fanatic to the melee row.

Dormant frightener: monsters. 12 provisions
charge: 1 destroy an allied unit and damage the highest enemy unit by that amount
Counter: 8 reduce the counter by 1 whenever an allied unit is destroued or consumed
when the counter reaches 0 spawn and summon Awekened frightener to the melee row.

Cadavarine: nilfgard. 12 provisions
order: create and play a gold tactic card from your deck
Whenever you play a gold tactic card play a random 1 power unit from your deck.

Vandergrifts blade: nortern realms. 12 provisions
order: boost an allied knight by 6
Whenever an allied northern realms card with order is played boost it by 1
Better this way:

Portal: Neutral. Building. 10 provisions
Armor 8. Summon and play weakest bronze unit from ur deck. Repeat this every 3 turns.

Ale of Ancestors: Neutral. Spell. 10 provisions
Boost all allayed units by 1.

Tainted Ale: Neutral. 10 provisions
Damage all enemy units by 1.

Hen Gaidth Sword: Neutral. Artifact. 7 provisions
Apply to a unit: damage by 1 and add bleeding (3) to a random enemy unit. Repeat this every 2 turns.
Apply to a hero: add bleeding (1) to a random enemy unit every turn.
Bleeding because it's a real essence of this sword.

Land of a Thousand Fables: Neutral. Spell. 12 provisons
Play a gold special card form your deck, then play a bronze special card form your deck.

Mahakam Horn: Scoia`teal. Artifact. 7 provisions
Apply to a unit: rise power of this unit and adjacent units by 3 until they are adjacent.
Apply to a hero: buff every played allied unit by one.

Sihil: Neutral. Artifact. 8 provisions
Apply to a unit: damage strongest enemy unit by 4. Repeat this every 3 turns
Apply to a hero: in 3 turns damage strongest enemy unit by 10.

Sacred Flame: Syndicate. Building. 9 provisions
Armor 6. Deploy: Spawn a Firesworn Zealot and Summon it on both sides of this card.
Whenever you Spawn a unit, boost it by 1.

Svalblood Totem: Skellige. Building. 8 provisions
Armor 10. Damage adjacent units by 1 every turn.

Dormant Frightener: Monsters. I don't think, that this must be an artifact! It's a unit.

Cadavarine: Nilfgard. Artifact. 10 provisions.
Apply to a unit: add poison to a random enemy unit every 2 turns.
Apply to a hero: add poison to a weakest enemy unit every turn.

Vandergrift's Blade: Northern Realms. Artifact. 7 provisions
Apply to a unit: damage lowest enemy unit by 1. Repeat this every turn.
Apply to a hero: buff every played knight by 2.
 
Better this way:

Portal: Neutral. Building. 10 provisions
Armor 8. Summon and play weakest bronze unit from ur deck. Repeat this every 3 turns.

Ale of Ancestors: Neutral. Spell. 10 provisions
Boost all allayed units by 1.

Tainted Ale: Neutral. 10 provisions
Damage all enemy units by 1.

Hen Gaidth Sword: Neutral. Artifact. 7 provisions
Apply to a unit: damage by 1 and add bleeding (3) to a random enemy unit. Repeat this every 2 turns.
Apply to a hero: add bleeding (1) to a random enemy unit every turn.
Bleeding because it's a real essence of this sword.

Land of a Thousand Fables: Neutral. Spell. 12 provisons
Play a gold special card form your deck, then play a bronze special card form your deck.

Mahakam Horn: Scoia`teal. Artifact. 7 provisions
Apply to a unit: rise power of this unit and adjacent units by 3 until they are adjacent.
Apply to a hero: buff every played allied unit by one.

Sihil: Neutral. Artifact. 8 provisions
Apply to a unit: damage strongest enemy unit by 4. Repeat this every 3 turns
Apply to a hero: in 3 turns damage strongest enemy unit by 10.

Sacred Flame: Syndicate. Building. 9 provisions
Armor 6. Deploy: Spawn a Firesworn Zealot and Summon it on both sides of this card.
Whenever you Spawn a unit, boost it by 1.

Svalblood Totem: Skellige. Building. 8 provisions
Armor 10. Damage adjacent units by 1 every turn.

Dormant Frightener: Monsters. I don't think, that this must be an artifact! It's a unit.

Cadavarine: Nilfgard. Artifact. 10 provisions.
Apply to a unit: add poison to a random enemy unit every 2 turns.
Apply to a hero: add poison to a weakest enemy unit every turn.

Vandergrift's Blade: Northern Realms. Artifact. 7 provisions
Apply to a unit: damage lowest enemy unit by 1. Repeat this every turn.
Apply to a hero: buff every played knight by 2.
Better this way? i disagree
 
I find it to be very obvious. They are cards that you can do nothing about without specific counter cards. That is just not a good idea and it sets up the game for broken no unit style decks which were extremely unpopular.

Summoning circle is a great example. Everyone has to tech in artifact removal just for this one extremely strong card? That's just silly.
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Forgive me that I come back to this but it is absolutly not obvious to me. Maybe its because I didn't experienced the abuse of those cases and lack this emotional involvement.

"They are cards that you can do nothing about without specific counter cards." this argument wont work. It wont work because there are many other mechanisms which dont even have a counter card or cant be countered.

You can't counter any deploy skills killing your cards on field, you can't counter deploy damage, deploy destruction. Well you sort of can, If you field functions on your field which can't be touched, oh wait thats exactly what half the artefacts are...
You can't really counter immune cards (only a few cards can), you can't really counter seize either.

The game is full of reactive cards which create huge pointswings using your opponents field. The only way to dodge them is not fielding anything making those turns wasted for the enemy. Under such conditions the rise of unitless decks is sort of a logical development. Unless you take the hit and manouver around it. But if you can do that with all those mechanisms why can't you do that with artefacts?

At the end, the question remains is something imbalanced because of the mechanism itself or due to the lack of finetuning of numbers. The old summoning circle was not properly balanced and was too flexible compared to its provision cost. And popularity is a terrible measure for balance.

Please help me to understand why artefacts are bad. The current arguments presented do not convince me. I dont mind change nor the proposal in the OP.
 
Please help me to understand why artefacts are bad. The current arguments presented do not convince me. I dont mind change nor the proposal in the OP.

The problem is rooted in very little strengh and unusefulness of artifacts-removal cards , when played aginst opponent without artifacts. Exception of the rule is Scirocco of scorath , but - again - use a 10 provinsions special card to counter artifact is pointless. Therefore or artifacts have to be counter by "standard" ways (like domage or block) , or the cards to counter artifacts has to be more usefull when there are no artifacts on the table (like Ida was, before rework)
 
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