Anyone thinking Cyberpunk would be better game without rpg elements

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No stats. No skills. No perks. No crafting. No loot ( or working similar to Deus Ex). Clothing only used for customizing appearance.
Most of these only give you shallow, dull 3-10% passive bonuses that add little to nothing to actually modifying gameplay in a meaningful way or changing your interaction with the world.
Like in Deus Ex, you'd simply buy all implants as way of modifying your playstyle.
Without levelled loot, world would be much more open to explore and difficulty more fair and consistent.
In game Economy would also be more logical and balanced.
Protection would come from dermal implants, or from wearing body armor with durability factor ( like in Far Cry games or other FPS).
Less pointless tedium of inventory management, more enjoyable experience focused on completing quests than looting and spending time in ingame menus.
Environment design would be "more clean" and immersive, without loot icons distracting the player and objects often placed without any logic ( by trying to mimic "looter games).
World would be more immersive without illogical restrictions ( equipment "levels" restrictions, bulletsponge enemies with skull icons).
And instead, rpg team could be replaced with open world content creators who would add activities and interaction with the world.
And overall, people would have lower/more accurate expectations: lot of disappointment comes from far higher expectations on rpg aspects than was the case Witcher ( which was just as poor, but by design far more limited in it).
I'm a huge rpg fan and I'd always prefer good rpg over great action game: but in CDPR's case, I think their rpg team does their games far more harm than good and has overall net negative impact on quality of their games.
 
"No stats" - no
"No perks" - no
"No skills" - no
"No crafting" - yes
"No loot" - yes

I would be fine with no progression on those first three, but not with eliminating them. In other words, I'd be fine if we started the game by choosing from a set of stats, perks, and skills that define the character in meaningful different ways. But eliminating them, in my opinion, would also eliminate a lot of the variation in different ways to play the game.
 
I agree with you. Kind of. Remove leveling and make enemies harder or easier depending on their installed cyber ware. Same for V.
Should be a DLC difficulty or something.
 
I'm not sure it would be better, it would just be a different type of game. I'd play it though.

I'd also love some Battlefield type game in the Cyberpunk (the franchise) setting depicting the Corporate wars. Just think of all the cool vehicles, implant stuff and cyber ninjas on the Battlefield.
(Unless they F it up like Battlefield 2042.)
 
Just my opinion and quick answer > No
Most of the stuff (loot, leveling system,...) are very similar to what was in TW3 which was a success I think...
I think TW3's success comes from same strengths of Cyberpunk: world, story, characters, quests, visuals, music, emotional impact. Loot and rpg elements are rarely praised, even by biggest fans. AI systems in Novigrad are actually worse ( police would also teleport) than in Night City: like with rpg aspect, people simply did not have same expectations.
Some things are arguably/objectively an improvement in Cyberpunk: visual style, cinematic storytelling, environment, combat, level design, quests ( from gameplay perspective).
No. Would be boring, feel bare and empty.
I love rpg mechanics, min-maxing, trying out new builds, the whole deal. Heck, last time I played Wrath of the Righteus, It took me a full week to just settle for my character build. However, CDPR's rpg mechanics are more restrictive than deep ( like with crafting: you can't actually build your own weapons with specific properties. Instead they simply gate away upgrades and some unique weapons through recipes). And they come with numerous negative impacts on other aspects of the game ( wordlbuilding, difficulty, immersion, exploration, economy).
With Cyberpunk I finished the game with about 10 unspent perk points: it just feels pointless wasting them on something like +3% dps, -10% fall damage, etc.
Same with weapon mod system( which I stopped using, only thing it did is gaving me a headache): +6.45 range/-0.12 ADS, or switch to +6.43 range/-0.14 ADS, etc.
CDPR's rpg systems simply aren't deep or interesting. More "lean" system, where you cut away all the "bloat" would imo be a much more direct solution, while removing all the negative aspects.
I'd love to see CDPR prove me wrong and blow everyone's minds with expansions/patches, but all of their games have had the same issues coming from same team. So it seems this is a larger issue than on individual, developer level.
I think they need to seriously rethink their design approach and bring outside help( even Bethesda, in recent interviews, seems to be honest in acknowledging and trying to improve shortcomings of their games: like with writing and rpg aspects).
 
Cyberpunk's problem is that it has too little RPG elements, removing more would be terriblem
Problem isn't that there's too little of RPG elements: they simply don't feel impactful/meaningfull.
Stats and Lifepaths ( mostly) only add flavor dialogue options, instead of new ways you can solve quests.
Perks only add minor passive bonuses. Enemies don't have really distinctive abilities. Reputation is only used for locking away gear/implants. Etc.
I would be fine with no progression on those first three, but not with eliminating them. In other words, I'd be fine if we started the game by choosing from a set of stats, perks, and skills that define the character in meaningful different ways. But eliminating them, in my opinion, would also eliminate a lot of the variation in different ways to play the game.
I'm not saying get rid of them altogether: instead relegate them through more direct, quality over quantity system.
So instead of 5 perks, several stats and skill points that give you combined cumulatively something like + 50% recoil reduction, you'd simply buy a single implant that does the same.
 
Stats and Lifepaths ( mostly) only add flavor dialogue options, instead of new ways you can solve quests.
Perks only add minor passive bonuses. Enemies don't have really distinctive abilities. Reputation is only used for locking away gear/implants. Etc.
Hum... From my experience and from I watched on stream/youtube, very different builds lead to very different gameplay styles. So perks/Attributes are quite impactful on how you can play ;)
Enemies can have different abilities... in function of Cyberwares/weapons that they use... (Sandevistan, Bersek, melee, distances, HMG,...)
And for the loot, like everything, if you find it better without, it doesn't imply that everybody will find it better too... matter of tastes.

Anyway... it could be "improve" for sure. But it won't be better with your suggestions (for me at least). it's defintly matter of tastes and obviously, an endless discussion :)
 
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A question: why did you not make it a poll?

And as for me, my answer is no. While you have some nice suggestions (dermal plating (?) being much more important factor in your overall armour), removing the RPG elements would be a bad decision. And btw the perks might seem like they don't add alot, but they add up. 1rst level V with a katana will play/feel alot different than high level one with high dex and cool for example.
 

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Nah, the game wold have been better with more RPG elements. And by that, I don't mean animations for chewing burgers or chugging beer or having the opportunity to go clubbing or inviting girlfriends and boyfriends to the apartment and whatever, but actual RPG elements like character's skills and dice roll having far greater impact on how competent he/she is in and out of combat.
 
If i kill Judy, blam no more missions. Same with kerry, river and panam

Keeping players locked in your novel and in your world while letting them then pretend to have a choice is disappointing

^ this part ^
I agree with you. However allowing them to be killed would mean a making the game hours shorter than it is already. I would want more game AND to be able to make (bad) choices that can lock me out of quests. That kind of thing worked out fine for Fallout:


Same with the RPG elements, this game (CP2077) would be too short with out them.
 
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No but, yes yes always a but, they should've made the story more linear and cut out most of V's dialogue options or made those choices meaningful, make how you reply/treat someone meaningful.

As it stands i can treat ppl like shit through dialogue, completely skip interactions with them and steam roll through their missions with no down side aslong as i pick the correct choice/action at the end.

The story works if you constantly pick the "be nice" options with every main npc, it's laughable when you don't, dont get me wrong there is certain things you can do like rat out panam or run away from convo's that result in some laughable texts but how and what you say to these ppl means nothing aslong as the end result is you click that "i'll do it" option.

Now that's not to say it all fluff because it's not, case in point is All Foods and your interactions and convo with Maelstrom, that's all pretty well done, there's tension and your dialogue has meaning and consequence, just a pity the rest of the game doesn't. (saying no to a mission but still being able to go and do that mission with zero consequence does not count)

Rest of the RPG mechanics i don't really have a problem with, only dialogue for the most part, if it was a straight up linear narrative i'd give it S tier, but the dialogue options tbh bump it down to C, B at most
 
No stats. No skills. No perks. No crafting. No loot ( or working similar to Deus Ex). Clothing only used for customizing appearance.
Most of these only give you shallow, dull 3-10% passive bonuses that add little to nothing to actually modifying gameplay in a meaningful way or changing your interaction with the world.
Like in Deus Ex, you'd simply buy all implants as way of modifying your playstyle.
Without levelled loot, world would be much more open to explore and difficulty more fair and consistent.
In game Economy would also be more logical and balanced.
Protection would come from dermal implants, or from wearing body armor with durability factor ( like in Far Cry games or other FPS).
Less pointless tedium of inventory management, more enjoyable experience focused on completing quests than looting and spending time in ingame menus.
Environment design would be "more clean" and immersive, without loot icons distracting the player and objects often placed without any logic ( by trying to mimic "looter games).
World would be more immersive without illogical restrictions ( equipment "levels" restrictions, bulletsponge enemies with skull icons).
And instead, rpg team could be replaced with open world content creators who would add activities and interaction with the world.
And overall, people would have lower/more accurate expectations: lot of disappointment comes from far higher expectations on rpg aspects than was the case Witcher ( which was just as poor, but by design far more limited in it).
I'm a huge rpg fan and I'd always prefer good rpg over great action game: but in CDPR's case, I think their rpg team does their games far more harm than good and has overall net negative impact on quality of their games.
Less RPG elements? LOL No.

Depends on your definition of "role play" I guess. To me, role play has always been the decisions i make as my character and the effects it has on its development in the world its in (the character not the world).

Stats are mainly to facilitate control checks of success of a certain action, not decisions (with a possible exception of a charisma stat if applicable).

Skills and perks in CP are mainly combat related and therefore not related to role play, and I would argue that a RPG in its most extreme does not need combat at all (Ref Disco Elysium).

Crafting and loot are also not RPG mechanics, rather economy mechanics and as such (again) have nothing to do with role play.

It has been my greatest gripe from the start that the game does not have enough RPG elements (as per my definition). V is in any shape or form a whiny brat regardless of life path or player choice...

If anything, CP2077 should have vastly more RPG elements.

I do give you though that stats, skills and loot mechanics are faulty.

I'm still hoping CDPR will release a CP game worthy of the legacy of the PnP RPG they announced in 2013...
'Til then I'll drop by the wake from time to time awaiting and hoping to witness the resurrection.
 
To me, it would be weird to take out all of the rpg elements in Cyberpunk 2077. It's based off a tabletop rpg, after all. If something is based off a tabletop rpg, I tend to expect it to be an rpg or, at the very least, have a decent amount of rpg elements in it.

So the question kinda confuses me, but maybe it's just me? Like, you don't see people go to the D&D games or Pahtfinder games and ask for the RPG elements to be removed. So to me it seems weird to go to Cyberpunk 2077 and ask for the RPG elements to be removed.
 
I dont know if the game would have been better without any of those rpg elements you mentioned because without those i never would have purchased it in the first place. Without those it would only be an ego shooter with quests that focuses on the players skill with keyboard, mouse or gamepand without the char offering features that help the player to play in a choosen playstyle.
 
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