Colonel Hansen is a potential hope of Night City and the real victim of Phantom Liberty (personal point of view)

[Guest 4719259]

Time.
I'm starting on
true Hansen's story.
But not because
there's no more grief,
but because the sharp sence of forfeit
has become a clear conscious sorrow.

From the very beginning, when I started the walkthrough of Phantom Liberty, I felt an inexplicable sympathy for this character. Later, having played through to the end, I was very surprised by the fact that according to the canon of "FL" all (almost all ) possible endings end tragically for Hansen. Then came the realization: this is the very circumstance that unites Hansen and V - they are both victims in this story. One of them is treacherously killed by the FIA, the other is unrestrictedly taken advantage of by the Agency, and ends up being deceived as well. Moreover, one is killed by the hands of the other. It seems unfair to me. Hansen does not deserve such a fate. Especially since there is no way for V to compromise with Hansen, or form an alliance with him. Why?! I don't see an explanation in the game's lore.
A common viewpoint expressed on forums, youtube and reddit is that the Colonel is a war criminal and a Warmonger. I disagree. First of all, there is nothing of the "I love that napalm smell in the morning!" in Hansen, that's a different story. Second, Hansen is exactly the kind of person who refused to become a war criminal - he refused to carry out the felonious order of Militech and the NUSA - to flee the battlefield abandoning the wounded soldiers of his unit, just as he refused to serve as an instrument of President Mayers' ill will. He did exactly what So Mi failed to, and what Alex and Reed never even thought to do. So it is Hansen who is a war criminal now?!
I see an injustice here.

 

[WhiteYoghurt]

Hey,
I guess it's all that and everything in between.
V and Hansen may have some things in common - being misused by NUSA, wanting to survive,... - but they met on opposite sides through NUSA.

He did exactly what So Mi failed to

Right, love that thought

 

[Guest 4719259]

Hey,
I guess it's all that and everything in between.
V and Hansen may have some things in common - being misused by NUSA, wanting to survive,... - but they met on opposite sides through NUSA.

Exactly!

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Hansen did not commit war crimes, unlike the "holy trinity" from the FIA (I'm referring to their operation in Colombia), although it is likely that some Militech units did support field agents. It is unlikely that Hansen was personally involved in combat units.
At this time, no confirmation of this has been found.

It's wrong to imagine his activities in Dogstown as a desire to usurp power - he treats an area of town like home, just acts like a tough boss. Nevertheless, it is Hansen's uncompromising nature that attracts to him people who have lost hope in life and are looking for relief from the past, or who are simply fleeing the persecution of various corps and other evil organizations.

Sure, some people don't like the fact that population of Dogstown live in slums or shipping containers for the most part, but the fact is that the Colonel inherited an area where Ms. Mayers' housing program, with all its objective results, had worked before.

Of course, Hansen is forced to look for funding "on the surface." By saying that there are no taxes in Dogstown, he is lying. )
Well, there is no such thing as a man without faults ))

I personally see no basis for calling the Colonel a "tyrant," "usurper," or military dictator of Dogstown. He is simply a man who has taken control of a very, very problematic territory, and has to take care of both his own safety and that of his men.

The FIA may have some other opinion of what is going on and use different definitions, but who cares about the opinions of these misguided souls?

Thus, home for the people, home for the reqruits ))

 

[ExSteam]

I held no ill will to Col Hansen. We just ended up on different sides of the chess board.

 

[Guest 4719259]

So: Hansen is not a war criminal. Hansen is also not a traitor, at least not to those who served with him in the same unit. And since he is also respected (otherwise he would have been shot in the back of the head during Operation Midnight Storm), we can state two things: he is a leader who is used to being responsible for others, and a man who will not shoot in the back (this is absolutely critical in the case of V - V will get stabbed in the back at any outcome of "Phantom Freedom", which automatically puts Hansen morally superior to any of the characters marked by Tarot cards).

Hansen is trusted and respected. He is a man who is not afraid to take responsibility in difficult situations, including when the full array of necessary data for evaluation is not available - I mean the situation with the shooting down of the presidential shuttle over Dogstown (a bold but risky decision, although from a military point of view almost flawless). The shuttle has a landing bay, the president of a hostile nation is on board, naturally with guards of unknown quantity and quality, a deadly NUSA government netrunner (So Mi and Hansen were previously acquainted) known for her "low" moral standards is also on board, the shuttle is propelled by a nuclear engine with not fully documented properties.

Plus beneath the area is a secret network of military tunnels and bunkers with pre-war equipment, the full functionality of which is also unknown to the Colonel. Solution? Shoot the ship down over a remote area of Pacifica, an area of ruins with a low population density, mostly homeless. Risky decision? Yes. Critical? Yes, of course. The alternative? Allow the shuttle to land with unknown consequences (unacceptable).

I held no ill will to Col Hansen. We just ended up on different sides of the chess board.

We were forced to, and the FIA did it at the hands of Hands (lol here )
Or Hands did it at the hands of the FIA, and now we have no choice - that is the tragedy of the situation.

 

[EvilMevil]

I would not only side with him ^_^ he's hot!

 

[tavellone]

Well, it's quite clear that Hansen was screwed over by the NUSA and his actions in taking over Dogtown are understandable and some may argue justifiable, but a hope of Night City and the 'real' victim? Not by a long shot. Just about every main character in Phantom Liberty has been screwed over and manipulated by the NUSA. I mean shit, Reed was essentially assassinated for the sake of a peace agreement and his Stockholm Syndrome ass still kept working for the NUSA, UNPAID.

Hansen is certainly not a great hope for Night City either. It becomes apparent that most of Hansen's proclamations about Dogtown are bullshit. People pay 'no taxes', but are shook down and extorted by Barghest, who do very little to actually keep the order and safety they supposedly provide and in many cases are active aggressors against the public. Dogtown is ran by an authoritarian paramilitary, in that sense it isn't much different than Night City and its control by Arasaka.

On the note of Kurt Hansen however, I did think he would have a more prominent role than he did in the main quest. He is quite a well fleshed out and written character, yet he appears maybe twice directly in the whole story. It would have made a more interesting story if you were able to betray the NUSA and So Mi and side with Hansen. Part of me feels like that may have been an original idea in the story, but it was removed for whatever reason.

 

[GrimReaper801]

Part of me feels like that may have been an original idea in the story, but it was removed for whatever reason.

Agreed on everything. Just really touching on this.

I don't actually think that was ever a consideration. V never is actually given any opportunity to be a "bad" merc. You can definitely make morally ambiguous choices but none of them are ever truly bad/evil or in support of bad/evil.

I don't feel like CDPR ever intended for V to be able to go down the dark side. Which siding with Hansen would definitely be.

 

[LeKill3rFou]

Part of me feels like that may have been an original idea in the story, but it was removed for whatever reason.

Also I agree about everything, except about the fact CDPR initially intended to "use" this character more. Like @GrimReaper801, I don't think CDPR ever intended to use Hansen more than what he currently is.

Hansen, like many (most of) characters in the game (like the Twins in another recent thread^^), he's a well written character, so people think it's a shame to not see him more (and for good reason). But it's only because CDPR writted well most of the characters, even those who were never intended to appear a lot (kind of a downside of the medal of CDPR's good writing, people want more^^).

 

[Guest 4719259]

Remember this point: the ability to take responsibility, and make difficult decisions based on an understanding of the public good. This will come in handy in the future, for a fuller understanding of Hansen. This is one of the key parameters that distinguishes, for example, Hansen from Reed. Reed is not motivated by considerations of the good of others - he simply does what he is told to do without a second thought, no matter how dire the consequences of his decisions. And that's why Reed is "Pariah," as the name of his weapon in the game suggests.
This is why Hansen seems to have become "unpopular" in the leadership structures of the New United States - he let himself think..

"Recommendation for Further Evaluation:No" - hm? Right.

The important thing to remember is that the NUSA is a huge extra-continental empire whose power extends far beyond its own territory, with a powerful military-industrial complex that alone can provide mankind with military technology and engineering solutions for centuries to come.
This state has conducted a huge number of military operations on different continents during its existence.

And never, under no circumstances would this have been possible without people like Hansen - without the military, without brave and experienced commanders who are trusted by their subordinates, knowing that the capital of the NUSA and the president with his agents and netrunners are quite far away from them, and directly your life or death on the battlefield at the moment depends only on the mind, knowledge and will of your commander.

Wars, wars, wars...without end or edge, with or without foundation...Hansen is part of the history of this country and this world. Without him and people like him, it wouldn't exist. You can't take the words out of the song, metaphorically speaking...

This world, the world of the dystopian future, is the world of Battlefield, no matter how much one might wish otherwise.

A reality you can't escape.


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Also I agree about everything, except about the fact CDPR initially intended to "use" this character more. ....I don't think CDPR ever intended to use Hansen more than what he currently is.

Hansen, like many (most of) characters in the game (like the Twins in another recent thread^^), he's a well written character, so people think it's a shame to not see him more (and for good reason). But it's only because CDPR writted well most of the characters, even those who were never intended to appear a lot (kind of a downside of the medal of CDPR's good writing, people want more^^).

No, Hansen is not like "many (most of) characters" when we're start talking about CDPRoject and their plot decisions.
It's the third playable character, following V and Johnny Silverhand.

 

[GrimReaper801]

Also I agree about everything, except about the fact CDPR initially intended to "use" this character more. Like @GrimReaper801, I don't think CDPR ever intended to use Hansen more than what he currently is.

That's not what I meant. I am solely speaking about V going the "evil" way. I don't think that was ever a consideration.

I was also genuinely surprised Hansen didn't get more screen time considering he's the main antagonist of PL. He's a compelling vilain and a very well acted and well written one to boot.

Then again, plenty of other very good villains have had very little screen time in other games. Mayhaps it is that rarity that make their impressive performance stand out even more.

 

[LeKill3rFou]

That's not what I meant. I am solely speaking about V going the "evil" way. I don't think that was ever a consideration.

I was also genuinely surprised Hansen didn't get more screen time considering he's the main antagonist of PL. He's a compelling vilain and a very well acted and well written one to boot.

Then again, plenty of other very good villains have had very little screen time in other games. Mayhaps it is that rarity that make their impressive performance stand out even more.

I could be wrong, but I don't think there is any vilain in the game who have much screen time.
Smasher, Saburo, Yorinobu, Dex, Royce, Oda (if considered as "vilain"), Woodman, etc... only appear a little (Maybe Hanako a bit more if you go for the Devil ending).

 

[koalahugs]

I don't feel like CDPR ever intended for V to be able to go down the dark side. Which siding with Hansen would definitely be.

I agree, although it's worth noting there is a gig from Dino where he asks V to steal sex tapes of Councilwoman Cole because she's been a thorn in the Corpos' side. The gig doesn't explicitly allow the player to take her side and protect her privacy (at best, you can simply avoid doing the gig, but that's it). I think it's the sole gig that's inconsistent with V's overall character.

 

[GrimReaper801]

I could be wrong, but I don't think there is any vilain in the game who have much screen time.
Smasher, Saburo, Yorinobu, Dex, Royce, Oda (if considered as "vilain"), Woodman, etc... only appear a little (Maybe Hanako a bit more if you go for the Devil ending).

I'd say you are like 99% correct?

It might stem from the fact I personally see Arasaka as a whole as the antagonist in the base game and, as an whole, Arasaka gets plenty of exposure in the base game.

In PL, it's Hansen and Barghest. Which are essentially one and the same as Hansen is an iron fisted autocrat. Yet, Hansen gets very little exposure.

I'm not even disappointed about it. I'm just surprised Hanse didn't get more screen time.

I agree, although it's worth noting there is a gig from Dino where he asks V to steal sex tapes of Councilwoman Cole because she's been a thorn in the Corpos' side. The gig doesn't explicitly allow the player to take her side and protect her privacy (at best, you can simply avoid doing the gig, but that's it). I think it's the sole gig that's inconsistent with V's overall character.

Is it though?

That strikes me as definitely more morally ambiguous than just outright evil/bad. I mean, it's just blackmailing a corrupt politician. I find it hard to have pity for her.

I mean, it's a thought experiment to have I guess.

 

[koalahugs]

Is it though?

That strikes me as definitely more morally ambiguous than just outright evil/bad. I mean, it's just blackmailing a corrupt politician. I find it hard to have pity for her.

I mean, it's a thought experiment to have I guess.

I mean I might've missed something that would suggest she's actually bad, but I couldn't find anything. I was just going off of the laptop you access and the brief given by Dino:

"So there's this Councilwoman, Eva Cole. By day, she's a living nightmare for greedy corpos, pointin' the finger on abuse, digging up problematic witnesses, dishin' out fees and penalties and whatever. And by night - she fucks. Like a fuckin' cat in heat, with whoever lands on the deck of her yacht docked down at the marina. I'd act more surprised, but I ain't - I mean you gotta let out all that stress somehow, right? So anyway, one of these corpos that got its toes stomped on wants footage of these wet-n-wild orgy fuckfests. They got in mind a joint screening with the councilwoman will help her see the light of a more... pro-business attitude.I send you the yacht name and coords, you fetch the footage. Oh... and I wouldn't sit on any of the furniture if I was you.One last thing - there's more €$ to be made if you do this on the quiet."

So basically she's... kinky? Is that it?? And the corpos want the footage to humiliate and blackmail her so that they can carry on doing their shady shit?

Again, maybe I'm missing something, but I dunno what it is. Is the sex she's having in her own time not consensual or something? Is she sleeping with traffic victims?

 

[GrimReaper801]

I mean I might've missed something that would suggest she's actually bad, but I couldn't find anything. I was just going off of the laptop you access and the brief given by Dino:

"So there's this Councilwoman, Eva Cole. By day, she's a living nightmare for greedy corpos, pointin' the finger on abuse, digging up problematic witnesses, dishin' out fees and penalties and whatever. And by night - she fucks. Like a fuckin' cat in heat, with whoever lands on the deck of her yacht docked down at the marina. I'd act more surprised, but I ain't - I mean you gotta let out all that stress somehow, right? So anyway, one of these corpos that got its toes stomped on wants footage of these wet-n-wild orgy fuckfests. They got in mind a joint screening with the councilwoman will help her see the light of a more... pro-business attitude.I send you the yacht name and coords, you fetch the footage. Oh... and I wouldn't sit on any of the furniture if I was you.One last thing - there's more €$ to be made if you do this on the quiet."

So basically she's... kinky? Is that it?? And the corpos want the footage to humiliate and blackmail her so that they can carry on doing their shady shit?

Again, maybe I'm missing something, but I dunno what it is. Is the sex she's having in her own time not consensual or something? Is she sleeping with traffic victims?

I don't believe that you are mistaken. We don't know more than that about her.

But it's NC. I mean, politicians are notoriously corrupt. NC is nothing if not corrupt from it's very roots all the way to the top. I am assuming she is a corrupt politician, yes, but I find it easier to believe she's a corrupt politician than a clean one. It seems beyond unlikely that anyone in power in NC isn't on a, or multiple, corporation(s) payroll and working on their behalf to further their goals and looking out for their interests.

 

[Guest 4719259]

Of course, in the ranks of the paramilitary organization "Barghest", created by Hansen, one finds very different people. In view of the constant threat of the NUSA and Militeh (the threat is serious, attempts to rewrite the Arvin Accord have been made repeatedly by the militarist empire),

plus there's the permanent idea of a civil revolution in Pacifica by various anarchist groups,

Hansen is forced to mobilize constantly - on a voluntary basis - which attracts people with very different backgrounds and social views. This is one of the reasons why a number of Barghest soldiers act badly and a number of junior commanders are corrupt.

This happens in para-military organizations, but despite this, it must be assumed that a significant number of Barghest's soldiers are highly conscientious and moral, and meet the high organizational and military standards implemented by Hansen in his organization.

Military standards and accountability - that's Colonel Hansen's standards in the organization, that's his spirit.

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I would not only side with him ^_^ he's hot!

Yes!
Also, he's fashionable and thinks about style: what color do you think would be more suitable for him - crimson or "electric"?

Also, he is erudite and subscribed to "Future" magazine )

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Some people believe that Bargest is a criminal organization. This is unfounded for the following reasons:

1. The organization is quite disciplined. Even in the situation with the capture of Rosalind Mayers, they do not act like killers, but like soldiers.

Hansen is not a terrorist. The principle of "violence for violence's sake" has never existed for him. No, only as a means to an end.

2. Both Hansen himself and his officers are trying to help old veterans of the many wars fought by the NUSA and Night City, including those who suffer from cyberpsychosis. At least Bargest offers an alternative, at least an opportunity to not give in to the disease and lose their skills. This is quite the opposite of the approach demonstrated by Militech and its CEOs.
(do you remember stories like this?)

It is the only organization that is arguably trying to do something about the sick (unless you count the vague efforts of R. Jones )

Although naturally, no one is immune to cyberpsychosis..

3. Bargest is fighting smuggling and drug trafficking at the Dogstown perimeter border to the best of its ability, and what's more, even FIA analysts have noted that Bargest is delivering humanitarian aid to the most disadvantaged areas.

That is, Hansen and his men can in principle act out of compassion for the people (as much as the leader of a paramilitary group in unfriendly territory in semi-official status, pursued by one of the worst corporations in human history, the FIA, can afford to do so).

 

[S0lstafir]

A hell of a lot of work! Chum, are you writing a script for them?

 

[Guest 4719259]

A hell of a lot of work! Chum, are you writing a script for them?

Dude, you're kidding me. Just doing what I'm interested in until I get bored )

Of course, many may not like the Colonel: Barghest's soldiers are far from angels, and military discipline implies authoritarian methods. However, there are couple of important things to understand about the Colonel and Night City:
1. After the unifying war, the American continent is in a precarious political state. Yes, there is an arvin chord, but no one said it was permanent. The NUSA is very eager to subjugate all uncontrolled territories, including Night City, by any means necessary: military intervention, diplomatic games, or sending a "peacekeeping contingent".

And there is the requisite wall, and there is Pacifica, a neighborhood adjacent to Night City that may or may not be part of the city's administrative territory.

2. In fact, of course, no one can know all of Colonel Hansen's plans, but one thing is clear: by staying in Pacifica, he is staying for the long haul. And while he is in Dogstown, no Rosalind Myers will ever think of reformulating the Arvin Accord. Hansen first. He is the primary target of the militaristic NUSA. And as long as he's alive and minding his own business - he's another wall that protects Night City.

 

[S0lstafir]

Just don't overwork yourself!