Combat in The Witcher 3

[EliHarel]

I don't understand why they didn't go for a hop instead of that damned dash, it looked amazing in the VGX trailer

The closest thing I remember to a hop is when he jumps from one enemy to another, at 0:59.

It's not really to dodge. But still, I agree that something feels off with the dash.

Edit: Btw, the only shot that's even cooler than that one, is this magnificence:

Still hoping that we'll get something as smooth and gorgeous. I have literally never seen any melee combat come close to that, considering it's actual IG fighting and not a cut scene. It's one of the reasons I'm hoping we'll get to zoom in, to enjoy these details in his movements.

 

[ONLY_ONCE]

The closest thing I remember to a hop is when he jumps from one enemy to another, at 0:59.

It's not really to dodge. But still, I agree that something feels off with the dash. I don't mind the new dodge and that hop is in the game + some half roll, yes to the MAGNIFICENCE

Edit: Btw, the only shot that's even cooler than that one, is this magnificence:

Still hoping that we'll get something as smooth and gorgeous. I have literally never seen any melee combat come close to that, considering it's actual IG fighting and not a cut scene. It's one of the reasons I'm hoping we'll get to zoom in, to enjoy these details in his movements.

I agree, the one of Geralt with those flying monsters is the one thing that has stood out the most since I first found out about TW3. I want to do that in the game just like that so bad!!! I hope CDPR lets us do just that, it's the best damn thing I have ever seen in a video game. I really fucking hope we can do this in the game just as we all saw it up close and amazing looking.
I hope the crossbow did not take this awesome gameplays place, that would be a shame. I like the crossbow option and all but if it took the place of doing what we all saw at E32013, I'm going to fucking cry man!!! lol...

 

[EliHarel]

I agree, the one of Geralt with those flying monsters is the one thing that has stood out the most since I first found out about TW3.

Yep. Likewise. To be honest, the animations are what's on my mind much more than the graphics. The "Game quality" thread mostly focuses on the graphics (obviously, since the spark was a screen shot), but to me the discrepancy in the graphics departments (if there is any) is hardly as noteworthy as the one in the animations; between what we've seen in the VGX and E3 2013 trailer, and what we've seen in the fighting scenes in 2014.

 

[randyrhoads]

The closest thing I remember to a hop is when he jumps from one enemy to another, at 0:59.

The foot movement from that animation should have been implemented into the dodge animation. It looks exactly the way a master swordsman should move.

 

[Lieste]

when he cuts the bandits hand off in the VGX trailer he does a hop to adjust his position and slice the other one's face, imo CDPR should have gone with a hop backwards (or anything really) instead of the megaman dash

I'm not sure ~ we haven't seen it in "the flesh" with a variety of situations, and combinations, or with multiple camera angles and movement directions. It is supposed to be taken from motion capture (and the guy looks fast and agile), so I don't know that I automatically assume it isn't possible. Does it look a wee bit abrupt? Possibly, though as I say it is hard to tell from a single shot like that. ... check out fencing sometime ~ they move really fast, both in footwork and in the body and hands ~ sometimes it isn't possible to identify what is done even in slow motion.

I really like the European schools that work from the fencing manuals ~ both with "unarmoured" and armoured styles of fighting. The actions and speed that things can go bad is a long way away from what we are presented as "good" sword fights in popular media.

I used to fence, but my footwork was no way fast enough, and I lacked the necessary coordination. Contemplated doing archery ~ there is a group that meets around 5 minutes walk from me... may get into that.

 

[Garrison72]

I agree, the one of Geralt with those flying monsters is the one thing that has stood out the most since I first found out about TW3. I want to do that in the game just like that so bad!!! I hope CDPR lets us do just that, it's the best damn thing I have ever seen in a video game. I really fucking hope we can do this in the game just as we all saw it up close and amazing looking.
I hope the crossbow did not take this awesome gameplays place, that would be a shame. I like the crossbow option and all but if it took the place of doing what we all saw at E32013, I'm going to fucking cry man!!! lol...

Yeah I went back and watched the old trailers. I'm not sure if it's filters or what but the game looks very different. Not worse either. It's weird how the animations have completely changed.

 

[Jack Bauer 24]

Has the combat been downgraded?

 

[tommy5761]

Ugh....fellas that`s just the way the guy is playing it . I`m sure there will be plenty of other alternative moves available .

 

[MkTama]

Everyone is seeing downgrade in every corner.. come on guys..

 

[ONLY_ONCE]

Yeah I went back and watched the old trailers. I'm not sure if it's filters or what but the game looks very different. Not worse either. It's weird how the animations have completely changed.

Exactly, I like/love all the new stuff... but yeah it sure looks a little different to me.
I don't care, just as long as we/I can still fight those nasty flying things in combat as it was shown way back when

 

[Pedrolago]

The foot movement from that animation should have been implemented into the dodge animation. It looks exactly the way a master swordsman should move.

Thats exactly it! They need a way to make that dash more natural, the slash animations and his stance also look bad imo, he doesn't look like a master fencer at all

 

[KingHochmeister]

Has the combat been downgraded?

What?

 

[EliHarel]

I don't think they changed the combat since the VGX and E3 2013 trailers. At least, not for worst. What I do think happened is that these two trailers captured very specific moments in the game where everything just "clicked" with the animations. Also, they stand out because Geralt is moving from one enemy to another, without pause, so the battle has a real nice pace to it.

The recent gameplay footage didn't help recreate these moments because the player demonstrating was stretching out the battles with a hit-and-"roll" TW2 gamestyle. Also, the camera is zoomed out in comparison to the two short trailers, so it's much more difficult to catch the nuances in Geralt's movements (shame! really hope we can zoom in).

I rewatched the battles. 37 minute gameplay

- Drowners.
- Harpies.
- Swamp bandits.
- Wildlife before werewolf.
- In the werewolf battle there wasn't really a chance, because the wolves came one at a time.
- Endregas defending the tree spirit.

Not sure how to phrase this, so apologies if it's not clear. Not in any of these group battles did the player "jump" from one enemy to another in immediate fashion as was shown in the two short trailers. He always focused on one, chopped away, and quickly jumped back to get some distance from an enemy who was closing in. There were many opportunities for the player to continue quickly to another attacker at his side or back, and somehow recreate those cool moments in VGX \ E3 2013.

I don't want to discuss his tactics. That's not the point. Could be that it was the right way to go for a smooth presentation limited inn time and not focused solely on combat. Still, this defensive and cautious gamestyle makes combat feel lackluster.

Near release, there was a long gameplay footage of Shadow of Mordor, played on the highest difficulty, with just the purpose of seeing Talion running around. Moreover, the player demonstrating wasn't exactly careful. He jumped straight into the thick of things. Whether it's smart or not isn't the point - it allowed them to show really fast-paced fighting scenes where the enemies were really pushing him back, and he barely had a moment to rest. That was cool to watch, and I'm hoping we'll get something similar.

 

[BRANCHINGSTORIESFTW]

GIF's really aren't good indicators of animation quality...

They're not, you're right, i used it to pinpoint the footage that irked me the most.See it for yourself on youtube,The dodge's just not free-flowing and natural

 

[xanetan]

I don't think they changed the combat since the VGX and E3 2013 trailers. At least, not for worst. What I do think happened is that these two trailers captured very specific moments in the game where everything just "clicked" with the animations. Also, they stand out because Geralt is moving from one enemy to another, without pause, so the battle has a real nice pace to it.

The recent gameplay footage didn't help recreate these moments because the player demonstrating was stretching out the battles with a hit-and-"roll" TW2 gamestyle. Also, the camera is zoomed out in comparison to the two short trailers, so it's much more difficult to catch the nuances in Geralt's movements (shame! really hope we can zoom in).

I rewatched the battles. 37 minute gameplay

- Drowners.
- Harpies.
- Swamp bandits.
- Wildlife before werewolf.
- In the werewolf battle there wasn't really a chance, because the wolves came one at a time.
- Endregas defending the tree spirit.

Not sure how to phrase this, so apologies if it's not clear. Not in any of these group battles did the player "jump" from one enemy to another in immediate fashion as was shown in the two short trailers. He always focused on one, chopped away, and quickly jumped back to get some distance from an enemy who was closing in. There were many opportunities for the player to continue quickly to another attacker at his side or back, and somehow recreate those cool moments in VGX \ E3 2013.

I don't want to discuss his tactics. That's not the point. Could be that it was the right way to go for a smooth presentation limited inn time and not focused solely on combat. Still, this defensive and cautious gamestyle makes combat feel lackluster.

Near release, there was a long gameplay footage of Shadow of Mordor, played on the highest difficulty, with just the purpose of seeing Talion running around. Moreover, the player demonstrating wasn't exactly careful. He jumped straight into the thick of things. Whether it's smart or not isn't the point - it allowed them to show really fast-paced fighting scenes where the enemies were really pushing him back, and he barely had a moment to rest. That was cool to watch, and I'm hoping we'll get something similar.

Good post.

Pre-release gameplay videos very rarely show how the combat is at its best, because for some reason those demoing it usually aren't even too good at playing the game, or they have some other reason for playing "weirdly", such as creating space to show-off plenty of signs, etc. But take Shadow of Mordor for instance, when you play it "fast-paced", it looks very good, with continuous movement. However, if you played it like the guy who played the Witcher 3 demo, it'd look kind of lackluster too, with weird pauses etc.

 

[B_l_a_d_y]

meanwhile on dragon age

http://webmup.com/CYHNe/

 

[Engagerade]

Dragon age combat is horrendous.Ultra exagerated animations,enemies that take 500 blows to kill -.-
But then again i hate party based combat :/ Being terrible at it does not help either :lol:

 

[BRANCHINGSTORIESFTW]

I'm not sure ~ we haven't seen it in "the flesh" with a variety of situations, and combinations, or with multiple camera angles and movement directions. It is supposed to be taken from motion capture (and the guy looks fast and agile), so I don't know that I automatically assume it isn't possible. Does it look a wee bit abrupt? Possibly, though as I say it is hard to tell from a single shot like that. ... check out fencing sometime ~ they move really fast, both in footwork and in the body and hands ~ sometimes it isn't possible to identify what is done even in slow motion.

I really like the European schools that work from the fencing manuals ~ both with "unarmoured" and armoured styles of fighting. The actions and speed that things can go bad is a long way away from what we are presented as "good" sword fights in popular media.

I used to fence, but my footwork was no way fast enough, and I lacked the necessary coordination. Contemplated doing archery ~ there is a group that meets around 5 minutes walk from me... may get into that.

For me fencing does not represent a real battle in any way.Even the battles in medieval revival contests like Battle of the Nations are far from realistic.Why?
Because in a real life battle you want to kill the other person.Not pound him with a blunt sword or pinch him with a blunt rapier for points.You want to put your full force behind blows to smash his head or slash his intestines.

 

[xanetan]

For me fencing does not represent a real battle in any way.Even the battles in medieval revival contests like Battle of the Nations are far from realistic.Why?
Because in a real life battle you want to kill the other person.Not pound him with a blunt sword or pinch him with a blunt rapier for points.You want to put your full force behind blows to smash his head or slash his intestines.

His point was never that fencing is realistic, he was just saying that their footwork isn't that far from what Geralt does -- and there's nothing unrealistic about moving away fast and in balance from your enemy.

 

[BRANCHINGSTORIESFTW]

His point was never that fencing is realistic, he was just saying that their footwork isn't that far from what Geralt does -- and there's nothing unrealistic about moving away fast and in balance from your enemy.

You're right, my post was kind of dumb,but movie battles are more spectacular so maybe we should stick to their kind of combat instead of trying to be realistic all the time.