Combat system

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I just hope it isn't completely shooter and bit of hybrid where you'll have to rely on your fists too at times.
 
Guys, lets not forget the game's CDPR listed as influences, all of them RPG's or hybrid games. Of course it's not going to be a straight up shooter.
 

Aver

Forum veteran
I've got exactly the opposite problem. I've been playing shooters ever since Wolfenstein 3D and by now they're a breeze for me no matter the difficulty setting. I mean, after you got your share of multiplayer fragging, there's no way AI controlled enemies will be much of a challenge. If I don't really need to invest in various skills because I can win the game just fine relying solely on my personal skills as a player, there's little sense of progress in the game.

Tactical game mechanic does not have such a limitation. You order your character to shoot something, but whether he'll hit his target or not depends on HIS skill. Your role is to use his skills in the most efficient manner possible not to substitute his combat skills with yours. That's what RPGs are about in my book. Not about delivering yet another, mostly average shooter that gets easier if you invest some skill points in certain abilities.

It won't be tactical game. Shooting will be manual. Devs said that.
 

Aver

Forum veteran
I must have missed that. Could you link the source?

Well, it was during meeting with fans in their studio. Fans could ask few questions about CP2077 and one of them asked if combat will be based on character's skill or manual. They said that it will be manual. Questions and answers were posted on forum of The Witcher.

I personally hope that skill will influence aiming. I wouldn't mind a tactical combat, but as far I know CDPR, they wouldn't do this.
 
Well, it was during meeting with fans in their studio. Fans could ask few questions about CP2077 and one of them asked if combat will be based on character's skill or manual. They said that it will be manual. Questions and answers were posted on forum of The Witcher.

I personally hope that skill will influence aiming. I wouldn't mind a tactical combat, but as far I know CDPR, they wouldn't do this.

I really prefer a manual system.... but skill having an effect on bullet spread, rate of fire, speed of draw.... these things would be a great way to emulate the skill progression.
 
I want the combat system to work, but to also not be entirely reliant on twitch skills. Sorry but my ability in shooters leads to be lacking.

The whole point of developing your character is that you make certain choices and direct it in a way you like. What's the point of skills if they dont affect the gameplay in any signifacant way? It's like saying i want to be good hacker but at same you would want to have the option to take a gun and take the cop from psycho-squad head on. You sacrafice one thing for another (which doesnt mean you wont be able to use a simple gun when you need it - it's more about thinking of a different way of aproaching the problem)
 
Yup. For me the result will probably be that I'll be able to handle combat with no or little skills points invested, so I'll be able to freely spend them on social or tech. In theory, so much the better for me. In practice, kinda disappointing. Not quite something that would make me not buy the game on it's own, but not what I'd like to hear either.
 
What ever the combat will be, I do hope the skills and attributes actually do something in it (something more than giving slight flyfart sized damage buffs).
 
DXHR for surprise takedowns and the feel of the guns. Sleeping Dogs and Witcher 2 both had great feeling for melee. And maybe sprinkle some Metal Gear Solid CQC for disarming opponents and taking human shields and the like.
I'd be happy with that as far as combat goes.
With the vertical feel of Night City maybe some mirrors edge / assassin's creed like movement? Hmm? ;)
 
Well... the combat system I would like to see in this game is something fresh and new, I wouldn't like to see some batman stuff, whem you hit one bottom to attaque and other bottom to counter, nothing like hit this bottom now and you will be good, thats to much easy for the dangerous of Night City, it's based on tabletop RPG, but nobody said "tabletop RPG combat system" that you roll a dice and just pray for whatever you please, and the dice decides your path, I want this game to feel immersive and realistic, someone comes runing for you in the street, and if you falter for one second BAM! you are dead, that's reall life, you can't stop time to think what to do, of course that here, maybe you got some devise in your head to increase your reasoning but still life is passing and it never stops, I don't like how in mass effect series, whem you are fucked up and about to die you can "freeze" the time, get yourself some hot tea and think about what to do... turned base combat abolition in my opinion is an evolution(sorry but it's my sincere opinion), how you going to be really apprehensive in a life or death combat situation if you can have your time to think? well, actually you can hehe but anyway.

I don't want it to be so fast and flashy too like DMC, I want some next generation combat system, something new, deep. In real life if you want to fight close range, you have to think fast, it is inevitable, so if someone is hitting you from left to right, hold the "block bottom" and move your mouse/cursor in the oposit direction, not just hit one bottom... thats the real feel of a blocking, and just now the enemy have it's weapon on the right, hold the "attack bottom" and move your mouse/cursor to left, and you will cut him in his lungs (hehe) thats is some example of a fast, new and strategical meele combat system (this is just some example that I could think now and of course there is always easy mode ^^). same goes with shotting, hold the "aim bottom" and your character will hold the weapon strong (not necessarely just "aim" but something like prepare your arms and hands to shoot), and than you can shoot, if you forgot to hold the "aim bottom", you just hited the trigger before your arms and hands were strong enough to handle the guns impact and you just missed the target (or even hurted yourself, if your hand were still made of flesh haha), for field shooter, same goes with the fast reasoning, if you are a stealthy guy, there is positioning and timing, and a lot of skills and byonic devises to increase your aiming, holding, dodging, blocking, sonnar, radars (and maybe even some visor with an algorithm to tell approximately the target next moves based on where he is looking at or his heartbeat frequency, creazy stuff haha), also run faster, jump, camouflage suits, Bionic x ray eyes too see behind walls (with adjusted levels to see woman underwear xD) ...

in conclusion: realistic combat, modeled in character skills and the player skills, for immersive purposes, fast and smoth animations and moves, inovative comands (not just the same stuff of todays games), estrategical meele and ranged reall time combats, more or less thats what I wanted... =)
 
I'm kinda torn on the combat system. Part of me would really like a turn based combat system just so they could bring as much of the CP2020 combat into the game (I like the system). Probably won't happen though. I guess my biggest hope is that whatever combat system they come up with they remember that health and damage are not abstractions. One of the things I liked about CP2020 was that the combat was very realistic in terms of what getting shot meant. You didn't have all that much in terms of health and weapons dealt out considerable damage so if you took a shot to the leg and it got past your protections you were at best walking funny and at worst crawling.
 
yep, that would be good indeed, but it's not a easy job to do it with digital games, because if you die to fast, it would be too hard, or too few enemies, and also this local damage you mentioned, if you got shot or cut on the leg (and if you don't have an augmented leg as well) you woud run slower, it's hard to think how you can do that in a digital game but not impossible I guess...
 

akordas

Guest
Deus ex was perfect combat system, I loved mass effect 1 combat system with no ammuntion
 
yep, that would be good indeed, but it's not a easy job to do it with digital games, because if you die to fast, it would be too hard, or too few enemies, and also this local damage you mentioned, if you got shot or cut on the leg (and if you don't have an augmented leg as well) you woud run slower, it's hard to think how you can do that in a digital game but not impossible I guess...

Oddly enough they had local damage working pretty well in Perfect Dark for the N64. If you bothered to take the time and shot somebody in the leg they'd limp, if you shot them in the arm it would just hang at their side. Once I got some of the unlocks that made you basically invincible I'd just run through missions without killing anyone unless I had to (it was an objective). Shoot the gun out of their hand, pick it up, shoot the leg and they'd usually give up. More recently Fallout 3 did a good job with this as well.

Not sure how you could eliminate the difficulty problem when 2-3 shots can kill you, and one lucky one can cripple you. It's not so bad in the PnP when you've got people with you to drag you to safety or call Trauma Team, but in a SP game (assuming it is SP could be MP I suppose) I dunno.
 
My nuyen;

  • No enemy health bars.
  • No slow fights (i.e. no waiting for "auto-attack" - always manual attack)
  • No 'list of spells' (i.e. Mass Effect)

Third person, First person.
Just shot or punch stuff and use 1-0 to select weapon or whatever.
Doesn't need to be a project just to play the game.


yep, that would be good indeed, but it's not a easy job to do it with digital games, because if you die to fast, it would be too hard, or too few enemies, and also this local damage you mentioned, if you got shot or cut on the leg (and if you don't have an augmented leg as well) you woud run slower, it's hard to think how you can do that in a digital game but not impossible I guess...

Play SWAT 4.
Heck, I think even the first Rainbow Six did it but I am not sure.
 
My nuyen;

  • No enemy health bars.
  • No slow fights (i.e. no waiting for "auto-attack" - always manual attack)
  • No 'list of spells' (i.e. Mass Effect)

Third person, First person.
Just shot or punch stuff and use 1-0 to select weapon or whatever.
Doesn't need to be a project just to play the game.

It will have some sort of skill's to choose from I am sure of it. Tho "run and gun" means IA would have to be really stupid to allow you this sort of thing (One man Army)
Cover system has to be implemented and smart enemies IA.. example; using flanking tactics and suppressing fire. No kids Call of duty difficulties nor gameplay style. Please remember CP2077 is meant for adults just like Witcher 1 and 2.
 
It will have some sort of skill's to choose from I am sure of it. Tho "run and gun" means IA would have to be really stupid to allow you this sort of thing (One man Army)
Cover system has to be implemented and smart enemies IA.. example; using flanking tactics and suppressing fire. No kids Call of duty difficulties nor gameplay style. Please remember CP2077 is meant for adults just like Witcher 1 and 2.

No, the AI can be really smart and still make the mistake of allowing you to run and gun. No matter how smart an AI is you can still run straight up to him/her and put a shotgun to their face. Proven method in several games with so-called smart AI. The best example of this straight of the bat on my hand is the Half-Life series which prided itself on having a really clever AI that took cover and organized it's attack on you - yet I found out that you could still run and gun them.

When I think cover system, I think of just throwing myself behind a wall.
But a cover system today is usually equal to that of hiding behind a chesthigh wall, popping up and taking a few pot-shots and then hiding back down again. Nothing wrong with that, it's quite enjoyable in Gears of War. But if there's to be a cover system implemented, I'd like an easy access button and not a forced cover so to put it. I want to chose if I am going to hug the wall or just stand next to it.

Your last line really agitates me. It really sounds like you're spitting on what I am saying so let me counter argue;
What's so adult wtih having a health bar over your enemies?
What's so adult with having a skill system that forces you to temporary pause a moment to decide what skill to use and where to use it?
What's so adult with having an auto-attack?

I'd like to point out to you that one of my favorite games is SWAT 4 for PC, now, I don't know if you've played it but I have a few videos of it on my youtube and there are several others on the youtube as well. SWAT 4 doesn't have the most sophisticated of AI's but they will punish you badly for trying to run and gun (though, it is entirely possible if you have quicker reflexes). And, AND - SWAT 4 in my opinion, is a game for adults.

We like different things.
I happen to just not really like certain systems that many others like because it takes me out of the game too much.
If you ever played the Game of Thrones game, you'd know what I'm talking about (I'd guess at least) because that game seriously breaks the flow with it's combat.
 
CDPR has made it clear CP2077 is mature and not for everyone, but I believe they were speaking of story subject matter, not game mechanics.
 
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