Controversial Opinion: You shouldn't pick things up

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Should you pick things up in Cyberpunk 2077?


  • Total voters
    56
They may very well tweak it and like @LeKill3rFou wrote earlier, component prices were adjusted radically via some patch. They also changed price of "valuable" junk and while those things may not look much, they have a huge effect. @LeKill3rFou already covered component price impact to need to loot items. Valuable junk price change, was IIRC from 750€$ to 150€$ which as it makes players consider Scrapper perk (junk items are automatically disassembled) from Tech / Crafting. It's also just level 5 perk so players can invest just that without that dictating their entire playstyle / character build. There were topics about that perk before saying, that it might be one of the most essential perks and now threshold to pick that is much lower since even valuable items go for just 150€$.

And like I wrote, they could make hyperinflation not so terrible to practically make €$ economy more viable to players.

There's also that I don't think loot system is finished. I don't wan to start speculating about that any further and they may just leave it like is anyway.
That should do a bit toward making powerful, high-end crafting more accessible, but it's not really addressing the focus of "picking things up". Of course, the system still works, and it's still fun -- just as it can still be improved upon. And I'm sure they will. You're also 100% correct insofar as we have no idea what other tidbits they intend to add into the combat, gear, and loot systems with the DLC and expansions.

What I meant to deliver above by getting into the combat scenarios was showing how an excess of loot can actually decrease the amount of roleplaying a game can offer. If the point is to simply deliver more damage, and that's also the only way to ensure you progress, then every character simply becomes a variously colored and animated damage hose that makes healthbars deplete. To me, that's action gaming, not roleplaying. Roleplaying is all about strengths and weaknesses, unique pathways and opportunities because of "who" and "what" you are, and making choices that affect the gameworld around you. (A riveting story doesn't hurt!) No part of that type of gaming experience really requires me to pick anything up off the ground...ever.

I think this goes for any army in the world: it's absolutely all about achieving the same result, eliminating the opposing force, with whatever.

CP 2077 has the best combat I can think of any game of its type. I can appreciate cheese factor too, with high enough body and certain perks, using machine guns without support and being able to actually hit something, even better, standing with that thing out there which means being a huge target and via game system have some staying power. :LOL:

Deus Ex, Mass Effect series, Fallout 3 and New Vegas, Deus Ex prequels, Outer Worlds. Tom Clancy's the Division, not sure where it's among those but anyway.
I'm not sure I'm following exactly what you're saying here. Explain further?

There was something intuitive in Deus Ex, even though there wasn't cover system or anything like that.
This, in particular, I understand completely, and I agree completely. It was definitely a stiff-feeling game, and had its flaws, but the combat still felt really...good. I'd say the original Deus Ex is a perfect example of how to incorporate an arsenal of weapons into an RPG. You could go in with a character augmented to hold weapons normally found mounted on vehicles, sporting active armor and regeneration ability, laying waste to anything in front of you...or you could go in with nothing but a tiny, concealed crossbow on your wrist, kill no one, and complete the same mission without ever being seen. And the looting was pretty minimal. You found stuff where it belonged, mostly: medical supplies in hospital storage, ammo in military or police supply caches, experimental weapons and augs in research facilities, etc. And everything you found was unique. It had one, particular use, and you couldn't choose everything.

Hence, combat always felt focused, and like you were playing your vision of Denton.


CP 2077 is the best because it actually makes sense and system keeps combat fast paced. There are actually one or two situations with mech where that electrical damage can become very convenient. Poison can be good in situation where last enemy spots V and V can just shot one or two bullets and withdraw to let poison do it's work -> non lethal. Tech weapons, they are bit curious but in the end they are intended to be used with Ping quickhack. It's not that even modern assault rifle ammo can't penetrate things. There are variables, distance, ammo type, fragmentation, bullet changing direction. I tried to look a good source summarizing penetration vs armor, concrete, wood, etc. but didn't find good single source. Anyway, common thing that can happen in CP 2077, shoot NPC through door, Tech weapons achieve that.

For me there are clearly very specific roles that different weapons much like (when applicable) their real life counterparts and I appreciate how different kind of assault rifles for example can work very differently regarding player approach to combat and build. Burst fire Nowaki can be very good for builds with relatively low Reflexes / Assault (early game regardless of build) if tactic is bait and keep retreating back from cover to cover. I actually made a post about different weapons in one of weapon topics months ago, but I'm not going to look that up now.

Submachine guns are perhaps a bit of wasted potential because the way how combat works, as silencer would more sense with them than assault rifles, but that's nothing to do with loot system / crafting.

I'm not going to do breakdown of melee any further than in context of game system and loot. My first and third playthroughs were great as I didn't bothered with all the junk but just kept checking time to time if there's better baseball bat dropped. For my corpo it was pistols, but mainly system enables that. Being dependent of gimmicks would be counterproductive for that and goal of OP.
Yeah -- by no means am I trying to argue that the game was not really enjoyable, or that I feel this consideration "ruins" the game. It doesn't. It...does what lots of other Action/RPGs do.

That's more the point I'm driving at. The loot and combat seems like it was made this way because that's supposedly how RPGs need to work: scalable loot and items. Hence, it's there mostly because that's the expectation, perhaps, rather than because it's a finely honed approach to combat that punches the salient gameplay features of Cyberpunk 2077.

Or, in really simple terms, I feel this was a missed opportunity to create something really different, engaging, and slick. Although, to be fair, if anything, I'd have to say that combat has always been the biggest weakpoint with any CDPR title for me. It was never terrible, but it was never something that completely wowed me either. I think TW3 offered the best feeling combat of all the games.

It makes me wonder what might have been if CDPR had put all of the focus and effort into designing 12-15 weapons in extreme detail, unique attack patterns, very distinct modifications, and deep synergies with other gear rather than a looter-shooter approach. Love the variety, but it does leave weaponry, especially, feeling a little plastic to me. (Visually, though, I love the designs of the different guns. Cool loading animations, etc. That was great stuff.)
 
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That should do a bit toward making powerful, high-end crafting more accessible, but it's not really addressing the focus of "picking things up". Of course, the system still works, and it's still fun -- just as it can still be improved upon. And I'm sure they will. You're also 100% correct insofar as we have no idea what other tidbits they intend to add into the combat, gear, and loot systems with the DLC and expansions.

What I meant to deliver above by getting into the combat scenarios was showing how an excess of loot can actually decrease the amount of roleplaying a game can offer. If the point is to simply deliver more damage, and that's also the only way to ensure you progress, then every character simply becomes a variously colored and animated damage hose that makes healthbars deplete. To me, that's action gaming, not roleplaying. Roleplaying is all about strengths and weaknesses, unique pathways and opportunities because of "who" and "what" you are, and making choices that affect the gameworld around you. (A riveting story doesn't hurt!) No part of that type of gaming experience really requires me to pick anything up off the ground...ever.
I don't know how many people really care if game is roleplaying game or action adventure. Regardless of that, story rich, story manages to engage on intellectual and emotional level, relevant characters are multidimensional, there's certain amount of freedom how to deal with challenges presented some depending from abilities of player character, some depending from other choices. There's also practical possibility to just play character and character then sort of just forms like that, play baseball bat wielding Nomad, well I got that, play Corpo who prefers handguns and assault weapons, and I got a character who was very good at those. I didn't need to read wiki or anything to achieve that, things worked.

For story, let's take meeting Peralez, so obviously this is subjective but here is my V and these people have a flying car and they have a problem, they also has this thing like they want to throw threesome with V and there might be some reflecting like what the heck it's with these people? and rationalizing that it's 2077 politics and these people take every advantage they can, and then you may think that they might have had bit of fun at studio when they created this piece LOL.

But then with Peralez, it's not just about how those characters dress and graphical assets in their apartment but body language and how they express themselves that really separates them from the rest, they have different problems and that is part of cross section of the Night City society we get.

Then much later we meet Hanako at tower and game doesn't say it on big bold letter but she is one of the most influential people in CP universe, she is in Night City. Her concerns are then about Yorinobu but really, she is a global player and isn't that kind of terrifying where that puts Jefferson Peralez on power scale?

Yeah. Lot's of that can be undermined by focusing on loot. Roleplaying, focusing on story aspects, just going for ride, all that can suffer if player focus on collecting bottles.

But then what you do? I wrote that table where I had different groups in there. I wanted to add a world cloud, what goes in head of some adult person who is a casual gamer, but I'm not going to get picture host just for that sort of thing. But in the end we are what we are. I have wrote a lot about story aspects of game but in table I'm actually opposite right, just something to do, CP 2077 just happened to have qualities that worked for me. But really, for people who are to romantic scenarios, they will be to that, people who are to looter shooter thing they do that and addicts are going to do whatever it's to get their fix, till they find other game to give that fix.


I'm not sure I'm following exactly what you're saying here. Explain further?
There are different mechanics that make sense and fit in with different settings and story. For ME3 multiplayer, someone had freeze thing, other had fire thing and then third had plasma ammo or something like that and exploded the combo, that was fun in that game.

In CP 2077 combat is different and I really like because what it has works for that. Shoot someone with a pistol/smg/ar/shotgun they die. Death comes fast, is gory and ugly and there's nothing more to it and in this sort of game that's what makes sense.

This, in particular, I understand completely, and I agree completely. It was definitely a stiff-feeling game, and had its flaws, but the combat still felt really...good. I'd say the original Deus Ex is a perfect example of how to incorporate an arsenal of weapons into an RPG. You could go in with a character augmented to hold weapons normally found mounted on vehicles, sporting active armor and regeneration ability, laying waste to anything in front of you...or you could go in with nothing but a tiny, concealed crossbow on your wrist, kill no one, and complete the same mission without ever being seen. And the looting was pretty minimal. You found stuff where it belonged, mostly: medical supplies in hospital storage, ammo in military or police supply caches, experimental weapons and augs in research facilities, etc. And everything you found was unique. It had one, particular use, and you couldn't choose everything.

Hence, combat always felt focused, and like you were playing your vision of Denton.
It was very well focused and only game I really got similar experience was not Deus Ex prequels but CP 2077. Arasaka facility we discussed earlier is a good example.

Yeah -- by no means am I trying to argue that the game was not really enjoyable, or that I feel this consideration "ruins" the game. It doesn't. It...does what lots of other Action/RPGs do.

That's more the point I'm driving at. The loot and combat seems like it was made this way because that's supposedly how RPGs need to work: scalable loot and items. Hence, it's there mostly because that's the expectation, perhaps, rather than because it's a finely honed approach to combat that punches the salient gameplay features of Cyberpunk 2077.
Games with level scaling, it's about inflating value of things, say looted items to keep player engaged. It was sort of hilarious though, after my first playthrough I went to look up for things and there were players who were found solution rather quickly. So everything besides level 50 items are like fake money, but grenades. So they crafted grenades, broke them to components and sold those components till they had so much fake money, to make abstraction, they had volumes of fake money, where value of paper it was printed on exceeded inflation rate caused by level scaling. Amount of components needed was so high that it broke save games but it solved the problem for them. It could be argued that they sabotaged their own playthrough but I don't necessarily see it but character builds focused on Crafting of course were most viable strategy to get there but anyway, they didn't need to loot anything after certain amount.

Whatever has changed since then, have you ever thought about weapon stores in game? With inflation there's going on, only really valuable items are weapon mods, armor mods and for Tech/Crafting builds blueprints. There are weapons in those stores too of course but why would you buy any of those before end game, depending of playthrough level 35 - 50? Funny thing, during my last playthrough with Corpo I actually bought couple of handguns, end game LMG was a bit different things as it was level 50. But anyway, those two handguns happened because I run out of patience with fiddling with what components I have and all that to keep up damage output with silencer (reduced damage) up with level enemy level scaling. Self imposed limit? Yes and no, for me it was that if the fixer wants job done silently and or without bloodshed, my V attempts to complete said job that way.

But for the most part, there are lot's of guns in shops and it makes little sense to keep buying them and that can convey to player to craft and pick up whatever is there.

I wrote about two economies earlier. For my Corpo run, I actually overshot my target for eddies but problem remains, it's difficult to plan your budget ahead.

Or, in really simple terms, I feel this was a missed opportunity to create something really different, engaging, and slick. Although, to be fair, if anything, I'd have to say that combat has always been the biggest weakpoint with any CDPR title for me. It was never terrible, but it was never something that completely wowed me either. I think TW3 offered the best feeling combat of all the games.

It makes me wonder what might have been if CDPR had put all of the focus and effort into designing 12-15 weapons in extreme detail, unique attack patterns, very distinct modifications, and deep synergies with other gear rather than a looter-shooter approach. Love the variety, but it does leave weaponry, especially, feeling a little plastic to me. (Visually, though, I love the designs of the different guns. Cool loading animations, etc. That was great stuff.)
Well, for me this was that game, luckily I was totally indifferent towards crafting and looting on my first playthrough. I think my best shotgun at end game was either rare or epic. I don't think I had much weapon mods installed either. When playing on normal difficulty it's easy to get away from irritating aspects.

For me combat works and cool looking weapons, reload animations, those are not where I focus. It's detail like sound, I don't know if it's still in game in 1.31 but when firing submachine gun or assault rifle in city area, it's like hundreds of triangles playing. It's sound of shell casings hitting hard surface like concrete or tarmac, combined with gun play game has, it was weird feeling sometimes, I could almost smell the powder, game reminded me of that.
 
I appreciate keeping this discussion alive even though we are going at times more or less in circles. Regardless I came to think another way to illustrate how looting can impact to experience.

Following may look familiar to some and it's indeed from the novel Hardwired by Walter Jon Williams I chose for this demonstration. Unfortunately I can't set fixed width for columns so it's not as readable I hoped. However it should demonstrate how sometimes more hardly equals better.

Original textWith looting version
Cowboy and Sarah have walked two kilometers into town and the only public phone they’ve found has been disemboweled by what appears to have been a chainsaw. Now they’re watching a tavern and wondering if strangers would be noticed there.Cowboy and Sarah have walked two kilometers into town. On route Cowboy kept his eye on whatever could be found to increase their chances of survival. He picked up several rather banal items from side of the road to assemble something else from them later. Only public phone they’ve found has been disemboweled by what appears to have been a chainsaw. Now they’re watching a tavern and wondering if strangers would be noticed there.
The tavern is called Oliver’s and it’s breathing a late-night Saturday crowd in and out with each pulse of the litejack music that’s playing seven beats against sixteen from the inside. Cowboy and Sarah watch the place for a while as neon-colored holograms waver in the windows and the music begins to play eleven against four. The local cops pass by once without showing any interest in its clientele.
The tavern is called Oliver’s and it’s breathing a late-night Saturday crowd in and out with each pulse of the litejack music that’s playing seven beats against sixteen from the inside. Cowboy and Sarah watch the place for a while as neon-colored holograms waver in the windows and the music begins to play eleven against four. Cowboy looks for trashcans, bags, everything that might have contain item of more or less value. He finds couple of bottles, a bloody knife, an ashtray which has very little of value for him, but maybe he could use them as material for something that might be of use. The local cops pass by once without showing any interest in its clientele.
“Let’s go before they come again,” Sarah says. Cowboy nods but somehow he doesn’t want to move. Sarah gives him a hard-alloy glance.“Let’s go before they come again,” Sarah says. Cowboy nods but somehow he doesn’t want to move. He is still thinking what he might be able to assemble from all the junk he just found. Sarah gives him a hard-alloy glance.
“Think of me as your bodyguard,” she says. “It’s something I know how to do.”
The tavern inhaled them. Fluorescent holograms burn Oliver’s ceiling and walls with cool, persistent fire. It is the only illumination except for a plain white spotlight trained on an expressionless man standing on the stage with five instruments plugged into his head, his monochrome shadow standing behind him like a male Medusa. He’s playing all the instruments at once, five against seven now. People ace dancing through his changes, even the zoned moving to his complex, compelling rhythms.
“Think of me as your bodyguard,” she says. “It’s something I know how to do.”
The tavern inhaled them. Fluorescent holograms burn Oliver’s ceiling and walls with cool, persistent fire. There were lot’s of bottles and food items scattered on tables and ashtrays on seats. Cowboy’s eyes also notice packs of cigarettes and condoms. He goes to collect items he saw and soon after checks his pockets to estimate how much materials he gets from items he has picked up. He could assemble a weapon soon, if only he had a blueprint for that. It is the only illumination except for a plain white spotlight trained on an expressionless man standing on the stage with five instruments plugged into his head, his monochrome shadow standing behind him like a male Medusa. Cowboy had to focus to be sure that he didn't forgot a mental note he had made to remember to get blueprint for items he thought before. He’s playing all the instruments at once, five against seven now. People ace dancing through his changes, even the zoned moving to his complex, compelling rhythms.

I could have went on for a long time on right column writing about how Cowboy searches things at taverns backyard and what sort of things he sees there besides items but I think what is in there should be enough. Besides "more" it's also demonstrating distraction discussed earlier in topic.
 
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I appreciate keeping this discussion alive even though we are going at times more or less in circles. Regardless I came to think another way to illustrate how looting can impact to experience.

Following may look familiar to some and it's indeed from the novel Hardwired by Walter Jon William I chose for this demonstration. Unfortunately I can't set fixed width for columns so it's not as readable I hoped. However it should demonstrate how sometimes more hardly equals better.

Original textWith looting version
Cowboy and Sarah have walked two kilometers into town and the only public phone they’ve found has been disemboweled by what appears to have been a chainsaw. Now they’re watching a tavern and wondering if strangers would be noticed there.Cowboy and Sarah have walked two kilometers into town. On route Cowboy kept his eye on whatever could be found to increase their chances of survival. He picked up several rather banal items from side of the road to assemble something else from them later. Only public phone they’ve found has been disemboweled by what appears to have been a chainsaw. Now they’re watching a tavern and wondering if strangers would be noticed there.
The tavern is called Oliver’s and it’s breathing a late-night Saturday crowd in and out with each pulse of the litejack music that’s playing seven beats against sixteen from the inside. Cowboy and Sarah watch the place for a while as neon-colored holograms waver in the windows and the music begins to play eleven against four. The local cops pass by once without showing any interest in its clientele.
The tavern is called Oliver’s and it’s breathing a late-night Saturday crowd in and out with each pulse of the litejack music that’s playing seven beats against sixteen from the inside. Cowboy and Sarah watch the place for a while as neon-colored holograms waver in the windows and the music begins to play eleven against four. Cowboy looks for trashcans, bags, everything that might have contain item of more or less value. He finds couple of bottles, a bloody knife, an ashtray which has very little of value for him, but maybe he could use them as material for something that might be of use. The local cops pass by once without showing any interest in its clientele.
“Let’s go before they come again,” Sarah says. Cowboy nods but somehow he doesn’t want to move. Sarah gives him a hard-alloy glance.“Let’s go before they come again,” Sarah says. Cowboy nods but somehow he doesn’t want to move. He is still thinking what he might be able to assemble from all the junk he just found. Sarah gives him a hard-alloy glance.
“Think of me as your bodyguard,” she says. “It’s something I know how to do.”
The tavern inhaled them. Fluorescent holograms burn Oliver’s ceiling and walls with cool, persistent fire. It is the only illumination except for a plain white spotlight trained on an expressionless man standing on the stage with five instruments plugged into his head, his monochrome shadow standing behind him like a male Medusa. He’s playing all the instruments at once, five against seven now. People ace dancing through his changes, even the zoned moving to his complex, compelling rhythms.
“Think of me as your bodyguard,” she says. “It’s something I know how to do.”
The tavern inhaled them. Fluorescent holograms burn Oliver’s ceiling and walls with cool, persistent fire. There were lot’s of bottles and food items scattered on tables and ashtrays on seats. Cowboy’s eyes also notice packs of cigarettes and condoms. He goes to collect items he saw and soon after checks his pockets to estimate how much materials he gets from items he has picked up. He could assemble a weapon soon, if only he had a blueprint for that. It is the only illumination except for a plain white spotlight trained on an expressionless man standing on the stage with five instruments plugged into his head, his monochrome shadow standing behind him like a male Medusa. Cowboy had to focus to be sure that he didn't forgot a mental note he had made to remember to get blueprint for items he thought before. He’s playing all the instruments at once, five against seven now. People ace dancing through his changes, even the zoned moving to his complex, compelling rhythms.
I could have went on for a long time on right column writing about how Cowboy searches things at taverns backyard and what sort of things he sees there besides items but I think what is in there should be enough. Besides "more" it's also demonstrating distraction discussed earlier in topic.
Yeah, it's distracting and not "better" wrote like that. But some players maybe like to be distracted.
Like me in RDR2 where almost all the times, NPCs call me and get impatient because I take time to loot all the corpses.
"Arthur !!! What are you doing !? Come here, we have to go !"
It always makes me laugh :)
(currently, I restarted a TW3 playthrough and the first thing that I do when arriving in a new town, it's visiting all the houses and loot all I can^^)
 
I appreciate keeping this discussion alive even though we are going at times more or less in circles. Regardless I came to think another way to illustrate how looting can impact to experience.

Following may look familiar to some and it's indeed from the novel Hardwired by Walter Jon William I chose for this demonstration. Unfortunately I can't set fixed width for columns so it's not as readable I hoped. However it should demonstrate how sometimes more hardly equals better.

Original textWith looting version
Cowboy and Sarah have walked two kilometers into town and the only public phone they’ve found has been disemboweled by what appears to have been a chainsaw. Now they’re watching a tavern and wondering if strangers would be noticed there.Cowboy and Sarah have walked two kilometers into town. On route Cowboy kept his eye on whatever could be found to increase their chances of survival. He picked up several rather banal items from side of the road to assemble something else from them later. Only public phone they’ve found has been disemboweled by what appears to have been a chainsaw. Now they’re watching a tavern and wondering if strangers would be noticed there.
The tavern is called Oliver’s and it’s breathing a late-night Saturday crowd in and out with each pulse of the litejack music that’s playing seven beats against sixteen from the inside. Cowboy and Sarah watch the place for a while as neon-colored holograms waver in the windows and the music begins to play eleven against four. The local cops pass by once without showing any interest in its clientele.
The tavern is called Oliver’s and it’s breathing a late-night Saturday crowd in and out with each pulse of the litejack music that’s playing seven beats against sixteen from the inside. Cowboy and Sarah watch the place for a while as neon-colored holograms waver in the windows and the music begins to play eleven against four. Cowboy looks for trashcans, bags, everything that might have contain item of more or less value. He finds couple of bottles, a bloody knife, an ashtray which has very little of value for him, but maybe he could use them as material for something that might be of use. The local cops pass by once without showing any interest in its clientele.
“Let’s go before they come again,” Sarah says. Cowboy nods but somehow he doesn’t want to move. Sarah gives him a hard-alloy glance.“Let’s go before they come again,” Sarah says. Cowboy nods but somehow he doesn’t want to move. He is still thinking what he might be able to assemble from all the junk he just found. Sarah gives him a hard-alloy glance.
“Think of me as your bodyguard,” she says. “It’s something I know how to do.”
The tavern inhaled them. Fluorescent holograms burn Oliver’s ceiling and walls with cool, persistent fire. It is the only illumination except for a plain white spotlight trained on an expressionless man standing on the stage with five instruments plugged into his head, his monochrome shadow standing behind him like a male Medusa. He’s playing all the instruments at once, five against seven now. People ace dancing through his changes, even the zoned moving to his complex, compelling rhythms.
“Think of me as your bodyguard,” she says. “It’s something I know how to do.”
The tavern inhaled them. Fluorescent holograms burn Oliver’s ceiling and walls with cool, persistent fire. There were lot’s of bottles and food items scattered on tables and ashtrays on seats. Cowboy’s eyes also notice packs of cigarettes and condoms. He goes to collect items he saw and soon after checks his pockets to estimate how much materials he gets from items he has picked up. He could assemble a weapon soon, if only he had a blueprint for that. It is the only illumination except for a plain white spotlight trained on an expressionless man standing on the stage with five instruments plugged into his head, his monochrome shadow standing behind him like a male Medusa. Cowboy had to focus to be sure that he didn't forgot a mental note he had made to remember to get blueprint for items he thought before. He’s playing all the instruments at once, five against seven now. People ace dancing through his changes, even the zoned moving to his complex, compelling rhythms.

I could have went on for a long time on right column writing about how Cowboy searches things at taverns backyard and what sort of things he sees there besides items but I think what is in there should be enough. Besides "more" it's also demonstrating distraction discussed earlier in topic.
Do you wanna do a visual novel,graphic adventure (or action-adventure as is more common nowadays),a RPG or a immersive sim?... I know discussing about videogame genres is a bit fuzzy, but this example doesn´t tell anything. And visual novel, graphic/action adventure,RPG and immersive sims... can be all story driven.
And yes, I also like Hardwired (even the tabletop supplement for CP2020):
HW_CP2020.JPG
 
Yeah, it's distracting and not "better" wrote like that. But some players maybe like to be distracted.
Like me in RDR2 where almost all the times, NPCs call me and get impatient because I take time to loot all the corpses.
"Arthur !!! What are you doing !? Come here, we have to go !"
It always makes me laugh :)
(currently, I restarted a TW3 playthrough and the first thing that I do when arriving in a new town, it's visiting all the houses and loot all I can^^)
Yeah, I think we have consensus about loot aspects appeal and that post was more about pondering how to demonstrate what I and @SigilFey has been discussing, even though we have different approach to game.

I think in the big picture, I mean average player, I think what the game has, it works, more or less. We touched this in other topic but main story completion on Xbox ~25% and what you dug from GOG, ~33% on PC. Average player I guess is about level 37-40 at end game and assuming progression about 1 hour / level that would be somewhere 37-40 hours. If looting system were causing a lot of fatigue I don't think completion percentages would be that high.

Loot fatigue has however come up in several discussions, not only this topic and not only here and thing that caught my attention was when it subject was discussed not using exact terms but symptoms and that matched what I experienced on my second playthrough when I went to find out about that aspect of game. It's not for everyone.

I'm sort of screwed here because my first playthrough was 100 hours, game sucked me in with it's story how that world works and that. I'm outlier myself which puts me at disadvantage regarding average players experience.

Time however is objective, how different players perceive quality of that time is subjective. Players who find loot aspect rewarding don't mind going for longer if/when applicable, while for someone like me, 10+ hours that went to loot and disassemble and look for blueprints and was not positive experience, it was filler content so to say and that's sort of there in the post discussed here.

I don't think loot is going anywhere from the game, but I hope CPRP would think about balance of that and if they find a way, find some way to signal players that loot isn't that important if you don't care about that. Maybe they could come up with something, I mean I wrote how hilarious it was on day 1 when in game there were sex toys everywhere and for me that, especially hating that from TC's the Division sort of put things into perspective and helped me just go on, utterly ignorant about things and that was great run.

So maybe they could rethink things and they really are only ones that can solve this. I mean there's also that loot / crafting makes things possible, like having iconic weapons, some with unique functions like Overwatch that would be just something exotic to have in current economy / level scaling unless player could upgrade it.

Think of it like this.
Weapons couldn't be upgraded, Iconic loot would lost value, but iconic loot has iconic function / a corner.
Iconic weapons would auto upgrade, players would only invest their time to iconic weapons / a corner.
and like it's at the moment, there are lot's of weapons in stores but before end game, why would anyone buy anything? / a corner

Role playing thing. There's also sort of umbrella I'm thinking. For what I have read CP2020 and Red are very popular among army personnel, police and security. People who are to chromed guns and that, they might be sort of different crowd. And game let's you play this V who doesn't have illusions, so our mercenary V has a job and pulls Unity and shoots ganger, and then there lies this ganger, hole in his head, his gold plated gun lying on the ground beside him.

Whole roleplaying thing is convoluting my thoughts. My characters in games like these are J.C. Denton or John Smith. For this game, I don't know what to think but that, like paragraph above, I don't think that sort of thing is just me. Make it more clear for players and easy to get that game can be played like that too.
 
I just play the game the way I want to play it each playthrough. Why live off what anyone else says on how to play it? Seems irrational.
 
Yeah, I think we have consensus about loot aspects appeal and that post was more about pondering how to demonstrate what I and @SigilFey has been discussing, even though we have different approach to game.

I think in the big picture, I mean average player, I think what the game has, it works, more or less. We touched this in other topic but main story completion on Xbox ~25% and what you dug from GOG, ~33% on PC. Average player I guess is about level 37-40 at end game and assuming progression about 1 hour / level that would be somewhere 37-40 hours. If looting system were causing a lot of fatigue I don't think completion percentages would be that high.

Loot fatigue has however come up in several discussions, not only this topic and not only here and thing that caught my attention was when it subject was discussed not using exact terms but symptoms and that matched what I experienced on my second playthrough when I went to find out about that aspect of game. It's not for everyone.

I'm sort of screwed here because my first playthrough was 100 hours, game sucked me in with it's story how that world works and that. I'm outlier myself which puts me at disadvantage regarding average players experience.

Time however is objective, how different players perceive quality of that time is subjective. Players who find loot aspect rewarding don't mind going for longer if/when applicable, while for someone like me, 10+ hours that went to loot and disassemble and look for blueprints and was not positive experience, it was filler content so to say and that's sort of there in the post discussed here.

I don't think loot is going anywhere from the game, but I hope CPRP would think about balance of that and if they find a way, find some way to signal players that loot isn't that important if you don't care about that. Maybe they could come up with something, I mean I wrote how hilarious it was on day 1 when in game there were sex toys everywhere and for me that, especially hating that from TC's the Division sort of put things into perspective and helped me just go on, utterly ignorant about things and that was great run.

So maybe they could rethink things and they really are only ones that can solve this. I mean there's also that loot / crafting makes things possible, like having iconic weapons, some with unique functions like Overwatch that would be just something exotic to have in current economy / level scaling unless player could upgrade it.

Think of it like this.
Weapons couldn't be upgraded, Iconic loot would lost value, but iconic loot has iconic function / a corner.
Iconic weapons would auto upgrade, players would only invest their time to iconic weapons / a corner.
and like it's at the moment, there are lot's of weapons in stores but before end game, why would anyone buy anything? / a corner

Role playing thing. There's also sort of umbrella I'm thinking. For what I have read CP2020 and Red are very popular among army personnel, police and security. People who are to chromed guns and that, they might be sort of different crowd. And game let's you play this V who doesn't have illusions, so our mercenary V has a job and pulls Unity and shoots ganger, and then there lies this ganger, hole in his head, his gold plated gun lying on the ground beside him.

Whole roleplaying thing is convoluting my thoughts. My characters in games like these are J.C. Denton or John Smith. For this game, I don't know what to think but that, like paragraph above, I don't think that sort of thing is just me. Make it more clear for players and easy to get that game can be played like that too.
I think Devs are aware that it could be a distraction :)
NPCs always remind you not to hang around (many times), like Jackie during The Rescue : "V, quick, we have to find Sandra", or at the end of The Pick Up "Come on V, we're breaking out of here". So I see that like a tries to push players to not paid to much attention on loot (or at least other things that the story).

One problem that I can see on Cyberpunk, it's areas are always (or almost) locked after completing the related quest. So you have to loot now or never, it could be a problem (to follow the story quietly and come back later, on your "free" time). Maybe there is also a lack of explanations (like many things) to how to play without loot (which for me, is perfectly possible, without problem and without carrying/wearing crappy low level stuff).

After "auto-ugrade" or things like that, not for me. But as an option to unable/disable on game settings, yes ;)
and like it's at the moment, there are lot's of weapons in stores but before end game, why would anyone buy anything? / a corner
Just for that, because shops have legendary weapons which are scalled to your level (legendary versions that you can't generally craft or loot). For example, if you have money, Wilson can sell you a legendary Unity gun even at level 3, 4 or 5 (for crafting the same gun, you have to unlock the last perk (level 18 in tech) and have find the crafting spec. I don't know if a legendary Unity gun can be acquired with loot) :)
 
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This post only proves one thing I have noticed, the stealth/sneak kill game style is OP in this game. Popularized by the Last of Us. But it's not realistic and it hands a particular play style the easy mode to the game. Very Hard means nothing, you can still sneak up to someone and kill them instantly. I find this play style not to be "smart" but I find it to be easy mode even though you're on very hard. Very hard should make sneaking and killing impossible. It's not even realistic that a person with 3 strength can sneak up to someone with zero training and skills kill a person instantly. So it does not shock me that this person claims to have done this in the game. Stealth Kills are not "smart" they are easy mode.
 
I think its good that we have it although I would prefer if enemy could hear us sneaking sometimes and especially when we are taking down a person next to him. Sometimes its really effortless. At the end every playstyle can be easily OP in that game if you`re going to max it out. There are weapons that kill with one bullet, there are hacks that take down people on the other side of map. I have to limit myself and not using best cyberware/weapons/hacks all the time which maybe isnt how it supposed to look, but works.
 
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