Convince me that Ciri is a good choice.

[Tyrandir]

Not sure what this have to do with Ciri witcher... She always her elder blood as a curse and said several times in the game that if it was possible, she would get ride of it.

And although Ciri goes on a quest to remove her Ancient Blood genes. In any case she can't be a witcher. She didn't have the training and alchemy doesn't interest her.
The scenario chosen by cd projekt red is not credible and divides the community. We might as well create a coherent scenario, which will satisfy fans and which follows the dialogues formulated in The Witcher 3.

 

[LeKill3rFou]

And although Ciri goes on a quest to remove her Ancient Blood genes. In any case she can't be a witcher. She didn't have the training and alchemy doesn't interest her.

Well... I won't explain again why your statement is wrong, everything is in this thread. Ciri as a Witcher is not against the lore nor against TW3 narrative.

Anyway, we won't have more details about this until the game release because "Ciri becoming a witcher" will be a part of TW4 story as far as I understood, so they won't provide any spoiler.

They took this decision even before TW3 release, so Ciri will be the next protagonist and a witcher, you like or not. On side note, no matter they would have decided, people would have been divided, you can please everyone, it's not possible

 

[Tyrandir]

Well... I won't explain again why your statement is wrong, everything is in this thread. Ciri as a Witcher is not against the lore nor against TW3 narrative.

Anyway, we won't have more details about this until the game release because "Ciri becoming a witcher" will be a part of TW4 story as far as I understood, so they won't provide any spoiler.

They took this decision even before TW3 release, so Ciri will be the next protagonist and a witcher, you like or not. On side note, no matter they would have decided, people would have been divided, you can please everyone, it's not possible

We will vote for or against the choice of CD Projekt red with our money by buying or not buying. As it stands I will not buy and this part will not belong to the Witcher saga

 

[TeamLucy]

Witcheress lesbian sex in medieval brothels with beautiful whores. If that doesn't convince you, nothing will

 

[Szincza]

satisfy fans and which follows the dialogues formulated in The Witcher 3

Even so, I stick to the dialogues of The Witcher 3

Same dialogues, that mention her being on the path with Geralt, before the Blood and Wine takes place? Or that she used the dose of Black Blood potion while fighting a Garkain in Angren? Or that she's truly happy because she does what she always wanted to, which is being a witcher?

I believe they're doing just that, so you'll get your wish.

 

[Tyrandir]

Same dialogues, that mention her being on the path with Geralt, before the Blood and Wine takes place? Or that she used the dose of Black Blood potion while fighting a Garkain in Angren? Or that she's truly happy because she does what she always wanted to, which is being a witcher?

I believe they're doing just that, so you'll get your wish.

Same dialogues, that mention her being on the path with Geralt, before the Blood and Wine takes place? Or that she used the dose of Black Blood potion while fighting a Garkain in Angren? Or that she's truly happy because she does what she always wanted to, which is being a witcher?

I believe they're doing just that, so you'll get your wish.

This story is ultimately not very coherent.
she would like to become a witcher, but she cannot do so without having been initiated from a very young age
Ciri is a Hen Ichaer, she is of ancient blood, she has the ability to teleport and gifts of divination, Ciri has another destiny.

 

[LeKill3rFou]

she would like to become a witcher, but she cannot do so without having been initiated from a very young age

Well...

In 1265, with Geralt now accepting Ciri as his destiny, he took the young girl with him to Kaer Morhen, both to keep her in hiding and to train her to be a witcher.
...the witchers, including Geralt, Vesemir, Lambert, Eskel, and Coën, began to train Ciri as a witcher. They used special mushrooms and herbs found in the valley to accelerate both her physical and hormonal progression as a witcher, allowing her much more strength and agility for her size.

If you said Ciri was trained as a witcher, you didn't really paid attention during the game...
So the truth is that Ciri was trained as a witcher, she learned most of the "witcher knowledge" (combat, basic potion & oil brewing, monsters and even basic magic stuff by Yennefer...). Yes, she didn't pass the trial of the grass, but that's all.
Even Geralt, Vesemir or Yennefer call her "our little witcher".

And well... Ciri hate her so called "Destiny" and will do whatever it take to change it. If you didn't paid attention, that's underligned in the trailer... The woman's destiny is to be sacrified, the monster repeat again and again that fate can't be changed... But at the end, it can.

 

[Szincza]

This story is ultimately not very coherent.
she would like to become a witcher, but she cannot do so without having been initiated from a very young age
Ciri is a Hen Ichaer, she is of ancient blood, she has the ability to teleport and gifts of divination, Ciri has another destiny.

I don't see the contradiction, honestly.
At the point of the dialogue you provided Ciri grapples a lot with the responsibility imposed on her by Avallach, so it's no wonder she feels further away from what she identified herself with. Especially when on the run from the Wild Hunt.
Once that's resolved, and she's virtually free - one presumes also from her powers, since stopping the magical cataclysm is not an easy fit and must've taken a toll - her path is pretty clear, as expressed in the Blood and Wine ending's dialogue, on which you were so eager to rely on.

 

[Tyrandir]

I don't see the contradiction, honestly.

I can explain :
At the beginning of The Witcher, when Ciri must be 8 years old, Vesemir tells Geralt
"Killing monster is not something to be taken lightly. Ciri must understand that if she's to become one of us"
but Ciri doesn't like studying. "Well, yes, but... that book was horribly dull!"
When she's around 20 and she says she's not a witcher, it's a confession of failure. She was not diligent enough and failed in her training and from the end of Velen we know that she will never be a witcher, but that she has other powers. We have gameplay from ciri that shows this.
But it doesn't matter Ciri has another destiny.
It is not enough to want to be a witcher to become a witcher and ignore her past failure, she must have the ability. This is the inconsistency of it all.

I may want to be a Formula 1 driver, but if I don't attend the driving lessons because I don't like it and I prefer to go to the boxing lessons, I will never be a Formula 1 driver. I might become a boxer but not a Formula 1 driver.
Even if I said, I want to be a Formula 1 driver, I want to be a Formula 1 driver, I would never be a Formula 1 driver, even if I had a whim. This is logical reasoning and this is exactly what happens in the Witcher3 for Ciri. So it's illogical that she becomes a witcher, she failed.

And even though she does not accept her destiny, she must accept it. she has no other choice. This is where the story is interesting (for witcher 4).
witcher 3 is very well written and much more subtle than you think.

 

[Szincza]

"Killing monster is not something to be taken lightly. Ciri must understand that if she's to become one of us"
but Ciri doesn't like studying. "Well, yes, but... that book was horribly dull!"
When she's around 20 and she says she's not a witcher, it's a confession of failure. She was not diligent enough and failed in her training and from the end of Velen we know that she will never be a witcher, but that she has other powers. We have gameplay from ciri that shows this.
But it doesn't matter Ciri has another destiny.
It is not enough to want to be a witcher to become a witcher and ignore her past failure, she must have the ability. This is the inconsistency of it all.

I may want to be a Formula 1 driver, but if I don't attend the driving lessons because I don't like it and I prefer to go to the boxing lessons, I will never be a Formula 1 driver. I might become a boxer but not a Formula 1 driver.
Even if I said, I want to be a Formula 1 driver, I want to be a Formula 1 driver, I would never be a Formula 1 driver, even if I had a whim. This is logical reasoning and this is exactly what happens in the Witcher3 for Ciri. So it's illogical that she becomes a witcher, she failed.

Again, that doesn't contradict my point at all.
I explained what her mindset is, and I was able to do so precisely because of subtelty of the storytelling.
And none of that changes the fact that chronologically she states that 1) she's a witcher, 2) that she actively hunts monsters without assistance, 3) that she drinks potions, all AFTER the dialogue you're pointing to.

I'm not sure what you're arguing against here. We are quoting dialogues from the same game, except mine are happening later in the story and establish all of the things you claim are impossible.

 

[Tyrandir]

I'm not sure what you're arguing against here. We are quoting dialogues from the same game, except mine are happening later in the story and establish all of the things you claim are impossible.

My point of view is nevertheless easy to understand. Although she refuses her destiny or says that she is a witcher, at 20 years old she has not undergone the physical transformations of witchers, and she has failed in her training to be a witcher. She knows some basics but she's not a common witcher, this is the disappointment we have.
She cannot make up for her training gap in a few months at the end of Blood and Wine. It's absurd to think that
She is a Hen Ichaer who possesses other powers certainly superior to those of witchers, and this without physical transformations. She has powers that allow her, among other things, to kill monsters on her own, but she is better than that.

I can say I'm the President, but I'm not. I don't have the skills.

Maybe she feels like a witcher, but she's not because she doesn't have all the skills. Her destiny must catch up with her...

The angle addressed in the trailer for The Witcher 4 is not the right one.

 

[Szincza]

and she has failed in her training to be a witcher.

She knows some basics but she's not a common witcher

See, now you’re just making stuff up.
How did she fail? She’s more than capable when it comes to the sword fighting - she defeated Bonhart, who bested a couple of witchers, she managed to deflect a crossbow bolt with her sword, which is specifically stated as nearly impossible, when Geralt does it - does that sound like a failed training? I don’t think so.

this is the disappointment we have.

That you have. Plenty of people that are happy with the direction taken by REDs.

She is a Hen Ichaer who possesses other powers certainly superior to those of witchers, and this without physical transformations. She has powers that allow her, among other things, to kill monsters on her own, but she is better than that.

You’re operating under the assumption that she still possesses her powers, which is doubtful - considering magic isn’t exactly “free” in the witcher world and takes a toll on you. She stoped the White Frost at the end of TW3, no doubt not without a cost.

Maybe she feels like a witcher, but she's not because she doesn't have all the skills

I mean, you can deny the reality as much as you want, it’s not my business.
The facts are that she both posses the necessary skill and that she underwent the trials, as presented in the TW4 trailer. You may not like it, but it doesn’t change the truth of the matter.

 

[Tyrandir]

See, now you’re just making stuff up.
How did she fail? She’s more than capable when it comes to the sword fighting - she defeated Bonhart, who bested a couple of witchers, she managed to deflect a crossbow bolt with her sword, which is specifically stated as nearly impossible, when Geralt does it - does that sound like a failed training? I don’t think so.

Yes, she fights with a sword, that's all she did during her training to be a witcher. That's the problem. she can fight very well and not be a witcher

That you have. Plenty of people that are happy with the direction taken by REDs.

I also know some people who won't buy the game because RED completely crashes.
We will see the success of the game or not. The future will tell us

You’re operating under the assumption that she still possesses her powers, which is doubtful - considering magic isn’t exactly “free” in the witcher world and takes a toll on you. She stoped the White Frost at the end of TW3, no doubt not without a cost.

This is my reading of the story and I find it much more logical than yours and that of cd projekt red. The team that developed the witcher 4 is not the one that developed the witcher3 and obviously no one understood the story.
This is actually the goal of my post. Give the real story of the witcher 3

 

[Tyrandir]

See, now you’re just making stuff up.
How did she fail?

If she said, "I'm not a witcher." It’s because she didn’t succeed. I don't see any other reason why she would have said that.

 

[Szincza]

Yes, she fights with a sword, that's all she did during her training to be a witcher. That's the problem. she can fight very well and not be a witcher

Well, as stated in the TW3, she managed to hunt the Garkain down handily, so that's not factual.

The team that developed the witcher 4 is not the one that developed the witcher3

That's not factual either. Some of the people that made TW3 are no longer in the studio, and some of the people that did are still there. Most notable one being Marcin Blacha, the lead of the writing team, which has been in the studio since TW1 days.

and obviously no one understood the story.

Same story, from which you cherrypick the quotes and screenshots while completely ignoring the ones proving you're incorrect?

I'll say this again, it's The Witcher 3 storyline that establishes Ciri as a witcher. It's not something conjured up specifically for TW4.

 

[Tyrandir]

[...]
Thank you for the discussion, I explained in detail what I understood about the story of The Witcher 3. I understand that others do not have the same reading as me and I respect that.
I'm not going to spend forever rewriting everything I've already written, that doesn't interest me. If anyone else wants to give their point of view, they are welcome.
bye

 

[Szincza]

That's fair.
Look at the bright side though - it seems like you're due for another replay, since you have forgotten this much.

Also, couple of quotes from Lady of the Lake, to put the notion of Ciri supossedly not being a witcher to bed:

I understand why people might be upset about Ciri going through the Trials, as that plot point is a difficult one to tackle given everything that’s been established within the lore. The books also state that she doesn't need the Trials to become a Witcher, since her blood is already mutated - it’s just a different kind of mutation. However, the fact that she is a Witcher is not debatable. A streak of her hair turning white and reflecting the crossbow bolt signifies that change in the source material.
And while I do get that the games are an adaptation and the studio decided to put her through a (sort of) identity crisis in The Witcher 3, they still end up reinforcing her "witcher-ness" within the very same game.

 

[Tyrandir]

That's fair.
Look at the bright side though - it seems like you're due for another replay, since you have forgotten this much.

Who's chating with me? The moderator or the human being behind it?

I haven't forgotten anything. My understanding of The Witcher 3 remains as I described previously.
No more, no less

I still think that Ciri is more powerful than a common witcheress, and I expected something else from the angle used in the trailer for The Witcher 4.
This is my opinion.

 

[Szincza]

I can see Ciri justified as the lead in a main story line, but I can't see her character being enjoyable throughout the game. Perhaps, I just can't see a girl as the lead.

Consider this, strictly based on what the trailer tells us:

The parallel between Ciri and Mioni is deeply rooted in destiny - yet Ciri’s defiance of it applies just as much to the girl being sacrificed by the village as it does to herself. For Mioni and her secluded people, destiny is an omnipotent force - absolute, inescapable, and unquestionable. But to Ciri, who has suffered under its weight, destiny is nothing more than superstition, cowardice, and folly. She views the prophecies surrounding her in much the same way, a perspective that aligns beautifully with her arc in The Witcher 3. So many sought to use her, to reduce her to a mere pawn in the name of fate, when in truth, everything came down to the conscious choices of those who pursued their ambitions at the expense of others - especially at hers.

Except for Geralt, of course, whose bond with her supposedly went beyond mere fatherly love and basic human decency.

The echoes of her Trials resonate throughout this conflict, regardless of the circumstances.
Her legacy and her curse - elven blood, poisoned and distorted by mutation.
The revelation of her offspring and the responsibility it entailed - flatly rejected.
It feels as though she is desperately trying to break free, to seize the reins of destiny and steer it toward a path of her own choosing. But not without a price, I'm sure.

Bauk screams at her that she cannot escape fate, that it is immutable. On the surface, these words are directed at Mioni and the villagers, yet they reverberate just as powerfully within Cirilla herself - especially when they are tragically proven true by the death of the girl who was almost saved.

The idea of a protagonist being pulled in countless directions by what everyone insists is destiny, all while struggling to forge her own path, holds immense storytelling potential - especially in light of the studio’s storytelling prowess visible through Cyberpunk 2077 and Phantom Liberty's writing. It is precisely because of who Ciri is - and the potential ramifications of her choice to sever herself from the legacy she despised throughout her adolescence - that will possibly make the story so compelling.

Of course, if these themes don’t resonate with you, or if you are deeply sentimental about Geralt and cannot imagine the series taking a different direction, no argument will likely change your mind.
But if your reasoning is simply that you don’t care for Ciri as a character, let me remind you - many once said the same about Geralt, before getting to know him. It's her first game, give her a chance is all I'm saying.

 

[AvarageEnjoyer]

Same dialogues, that mention her being on the path with Geralt, before the Blood and Wine takes place? Or that she used the dose of Black Blood potion while fighting a Garkain in Angren? Or that she's truly happy because she does what she always wanted to, which is being a witcher?

I believe they're doing just that, so you'll get your wish.

The Black Blood bit is a mistranslation, in Polish she doesn't say that, as far as I know. The rest is fair.