Cp2020 game on youtube

[stahimooney]

Well here's the issue in most cases...

A story is a story and in their head the GM always has some idea on how he wants the tale to play out. PCs being PCs tend to go completely off script. Our tabletop group is a tactical gamers wet dream. We have half a dozen people who think their way through problems and scenarios like Sun Tzu. People who follow the rules set out for players in the book. When I gm for them I write all my stuff out. This shows a level of planning and experience on the opposing side. I don't sit there and arbitrarily say 'you can't do that because...' or give some impossible number because they thought of something I didn't.

So many gms have this idiotic mindset that they have to beat the players and that is not the case. In the adventure world the players are the heroes. You set up troubles and obstacles for them to surpass. It should never be a you vs me philosophy because as gm you have all this power and it leads to abuse. Abuse means your game suffers.

It's the same principle as playing any game. You go online to play whatever...do you want to play wint/against a cheat. Someone who has all the hacks and can basically drone their way to a win each and every time?

Fair

Firm

and impartial

Those are the rules for gm. You start abusing power and players get mad and quit. I've had the pleasure of playing with great gms over the years with some lousy ones sprinkled in. I've seem rules made up on the fly to accomodate what assinine calls they wanted to make. In the end it always came around to me. I'm the player...I make the decision on what my toon does...and I assure you I have weighed all tactical avenues before making a decision. I will pit my tactical thinking against a crappy gm anyday of the week in most situations, but the cheat to win philosophy is always in play.

This group I am playing with I have never met in person and I didn't know (nor had I heard of) any of them prior to three weeks ago. Playing over Skype I have to trust them on dice rolls and so forth and I hope it goes both ways. Especially since I have invited so many so far and wide to observe and participate through feedback (which I do try to listen and respond to most of) why would I cheat as the REF/GM (I acknowledge you were speaking abstractly with Sardukhar and not refering to me--at least I didn't take it like that) I would like to think that nobody I am playing with would think of it either.

I like to think I am not a typical example of an egomaniac GM. This whole thing is something of a grand experiment. The players knew little about the PnP game and contacted me on facebook. Asking me to teach them how to play. They had already rolled up characters for the most part, and didn't do too bad of a job for never doing it before. Its never been advertised as anything but a very casual introduction to the game and world.

To keep things moving I skip some things that maybe I shouldn't as I won't do that forever if we continue to play. Back in the day we had a pack of rules lawyers in one group. Everyone knew the game inside and out and we'd start playing Friday night and wrap up Sunday evening. We'd get so wrapped around the rules and technical details it robbed some of the fun and tension away. That's fine certainly if that's what everyone wants.

I just want to tell a good story. The finer points of the rules elude me after 20 years and alot of medication, but I am trying.

 

[Sardukhar]

Yeah.

You do realise Cyberpunk delights in being unfair to players, right? It's in the core book and for good reason. The world setting is unfair.

You only need those protections if their ego is involved in some kind of "win" scenario. In a story, how do you win? What good does fair or firm do? Should the GM worry about being fair to the NPCs?

Also..."like Sun Tzu"? Really?

Follow-up: Not all GMs have some idea of how we want the story to end up. Not at all. More on-the-fly storytelling involves a catalyst and plot vectors, but doesn't necessarily entail any kind of endgame.

 

[doomblade403x]

This group I am playing with I have never met in person and I didn't know (nor had I heard of) any of them prior to three weeks ago. Playing over Skype I have to trust them on dice rolls and so forth and I hope it goes both ways. Especially since I have invited so many so far and wide to observe and participate through feedback (which I do try to listen and respond to most of) why would I cheat as the REF/GM (I acknowledge you were speaking abstractly with Sardukhar and not refering to me--at least I didn't take it like that) I would like to think that nobody I am playing with would think of it either.

I like to think I am not a typical example of an egomaniac GM. This whole thing is something of a grand experiment. The players knew little about the PnP game and contacted me on facebook. Asking me to teach them how to play. They had already rolled up characters for the most part, and didn't do too bad of a job for never doing it before. Its never been advertised as anything but a very casual introduction to the game and world.

To keep things moving I skip some things that maybe I shouldn't as I won't do that forever if we continue to play. Back in the day we had a pack of rules lawyers in one group. Everyone knew the game inside and out and we'd start playing Friday night and wrap up Sunday evening. We'd get so wrapped around the rules and technical details it robbed some of the fun and tension away. That's fine certainly if that's what everyone wants.

I just want to tell a good story. The finer points of the rules elude me after 20 years and alot of medication, but I am trying.

Nah dude I don't know you nor have I played with you. My statement was not a jab at anyone, just an observation that I've seen some dick gms pull some chicanery all because they didn't want people veering off their chosen path. You can't corral folks into walking into a trap. You also can't just set impossible die rolls to foil their ideas in escaping said traps. For instance if someone is going to hotwire a car to escape from some kind of ambush in a club parking lot, what kind of difficulty do you set?

If they are going to swipe a Chevtoyo 17 that's one thing. If your going to boost a Mitsubishi Darkwing it's a completely different animal. Two different tax brackets means there are likely two different sets of security on the cars. The seventeen likely has none unless someon installed it aftermarket. Smash the window, hotwire, drive away. The Darkwing likely has security because the buyer can afford it. So the rolls are going to be logically different. In a game I'd rule the 17 with a range of 20. Darkwing higher...likely 25. A drop in the bucket for techie types. The higher profile the car the more people want it, and the more safeguards the manufacturers put on it to keep it from getting jacked.

I'd like to either sit in or play sometime if you had the inclination to add a person. I think I have skype on my pc.

 

[doomblade403x]

Yeah.

You do realise Cyberpunk delights in being unfair to players, right? It's in the core book and for good reason. The world setting is unfair.

You only need those protections if their ego is involved in some kind of "win" scenario. In a story, how do you win? What good does fair or firm do? Should the GM worry about being fair to the NPCs?

Also..."like Sun Tzu"? Really?

Follow-up: Not all GMs have some idea of how we want the story to end up. Not at all. More on-the-fly storytelling involves a catalyst and plot vectors, but doesn't necessarily entail any kind of endgame.

The setting and the game delights on being unfair to players. that does not mean as a gm you have to set the bar so high some resolution cannot be reached. Cyberpunk is a story of day to day survival and alliances. You scrape and fight to survive from one day to the next. Your blood enemy today might be an ally tommorrow. Your best friend might turn on you. Your girl might sell you out to her drug contact for a score. These are the setups. The Unfair situations the players get placed in. THAT is the part of the game that is unfair. The ideal that your on your own and can really trust no one. The rules are in stone and made to be followed by player and GM alike. If the GM has a different set of rules it's like playing cards with the kid in that Adam Sandler movie. "I win....I win...I win" So if that's the case do you need players? You might win today but this win sets up another adventure...and another...and another. the moral of the story is the street gets you. Might not be today...tommorrow...this week...or even this month...but it always turns you into a trauma team pickup. I can't even count the times this awesomely crafted npc bites the dust early in the combat, and one of the pcs is either heavily wounded...or killed at the hands of some shputz. It's cyberpunk...it happens all the time.

Yep exactly like Sun Tzu. These people think tactically, they operate as a unit, and you would have a hard time pulling out a surprise on any of them. It only makes you a better GM and they learn from one another and become better players. I've pulled my share of miracles in game as well. I had a character fight a full borg with not a scrap of cyberware, and held his attention long enough for a sniper to get a shot. I rolled awesome...and they rolled crappy but we survived. They all operate under that philosophy. You never know how far you can go until you push it to the absolute limit. I could regail you all with tales of how they have survived ambushes or crafted some of their own that were so intricate that dropping the hammer on their foes was an afterthought. We've taken full borgs alive. All done with guile, guts, and strategy. You doubt...well that's ok. Ask people who have played with me how I think about problems and how I solve them. Sure I leave some holes in the plan...but I game with several other who fine tune it to perfection or very close. Not every problem has to be solved with a gun...some problems take a little more finesse.

 

[stahimooney]

Nah dude I don't know you nor have I played with you. My statement was not a jab at anyone, just an observation that I've seen some dick gms pull some chicanery all because they didn't want people veering off their chosen path.

I'd like to either sit in or play sometime if you had the inclination to add a person. I think I have skype on my pc.

No worries I said as much in the previous post that I understood you weren't pointing fingers at me. I don't have a problem with adding players but it isn't my game as odd as that sounds. They tell me when they want to play I am just along for the ride. I'll ask the group next session which looks like next sunday evening. Nobody planned on playing this week.

 

[doomblade403x]

No worries I said as much in the previous post that I understood you weren't pointing fingers at me. I don't have a problem with adding players but it isn't my game as odd as that sounds. They tell me when they want to play I am just along for the ride. I'll ask the group next session which looks like next sunday evening. Nobody planned on playing this week.

Well i usually work EVERY sunday. hit me up with a pm on your skype number or whatever and ill add you when i get home or whatever. I'm on a rotation now so the earliest you would hear from me is like wednesday. Are you doing standard cyberpunk rules or are you using Wisdoms interlock system. Wisdom really improved the whole dynamic of the game in my opinion.

 

[stahimooney]

Well i usually work EVERY sunday. hit me up with a pm on your skype number or whatever and ill add you when i get home or whatever. I'm on a rotation now so the earliest you would hear from me is like wednesday. Are you doing standard cyberpunk rules or are you using Wisdoms interlock system. Wisdom really improved the whole dynamic of the game in my opinion.

We have been using the standard 2020 rules for the most part. We agreed to a few rules mods early on (see first post)

 

[doomblade403x]

Well I'll hopefully get your skype via pm and we will chat it up sometime this week so I can get an idea whats up with all the characters. What they could benefit most from and what have you.

 

[Sardukhar]

I..don't even know where to start. So, I won't. I'm sure you enjoy your style of play and we enjoy ours, lacking in Sun-Tzuian stone though it might be. I hope StaHi knows his rules, though. And obeys them.

Weeee-oow.

 

[doomblade403x]

I..don't even know where to start. So, I won't. I'm sure you enjoy your style of play and we enjoy ours, lacking in Sun-Tzuian stone though it might be. I hope StaHi knows his rules, though. And obeys them.

Weeee-oow.

You know all I did in this thread was point out the obvious. A pc and NPC are literally the same in scope. Each has skillsets. Each has target numbers. At times they are a friend and other times opposed to one another. The same rules apply for both in completion of tasks. I was even respectful about it. Never once did I insult you...yet you make a backhand jab at my play style? Classy...

 

[Sardukhar]

I'm all about classy!

 

[Sardukhar]

Well, since Doom and I closed off our duel, ( no doubt seconds ahead of Dragon coming in here all red and fiery), I guess I'll resume my gentle enquiries.

StaiHi, do you have your story arc plotted out ahead of time already? How much pre-writing do you do, in advance of player chicanery and cleverness?

Why, particularly, did they get ahold of you to run the game? Do you have superpowers? Are you related to Charlie Sheen?

Are you willing to snuff their characters?

Come to think of it, they -made up- their characters before they got ahold of you? Seems weird, or did I misunderstand?

Is there any way I can convince you to add Bozos to the game? 1) They are silly-funny-deadly and 2) they annoy hell out of Wisdom. No downside, really.

Oh, do you have a copy of Night City sourcebook? It's superb.

 

[doomblade403x]

Funny...never looked at it as a duel

 

[Sardukhar]

All this passion! I think we should date.

 

[doomblade403x]

Ok...

 

[stahimooney]

Well, since Doom and I closed off our duel, ( no doubt seconds ahead of Dragon coming in here all red and fiery), I guess I'll resume my gentle enquiries.

StaiHi, do you have your story arc plotted out ahead of time already? How much pre-writing do you do, in advance of player chicanery and cleverness?

Why, particularly, did they get ahold of you to run the game? Do you have superpowers? Are you related to Charlie Sheen?

Are you willing to snuff their characters?

Come to think of it, they -made up- their characters before they got ahold of you? Seems weird, or did I misunderstand?

Is there any way I can convince you to add Bozos to the game? 1) They are silly-funny-deadly and 2) they annoy hell out of Wisdom. No downside, really.

Oh, do you have a copy of Night City sourcebook? It's superb.

I have a very loose outline. I've always kinda been a plans are for the weak kinda GM--adventures always seem better that way.
No superpowers but I am drinking milk so... It was kind of a random thing really. They found me on facebook.
I am starting to have doubts--I know that I'm not a great GM but I'll continue as long as they ask me to. Hopefully when its done its because they stop having fun. I opened it and invited the community to observe with the hope of an exchange of ideas, so I certainly can't complain about anything. I am not sure how to read the tone of this last reply. It seems to have changed a little.
I am willing to follow through on cause and effect in accordance with the rules. So in a simple answer yes.
They had created characters ahead of time. Due to the format, I had to trust them to be honest. They had intended to play before I was involved.
I have the night city book and all but one or two of the others. I have several duplicates and many are still in plastic. I like the Bozos and their pseudo IRL counterparts juggalos. Tons of source material there.

 

[Sardukhar]

Very honest. I, too, generally prefer seat-of-the-pants GMing, since feeelthy players make hash of my clever storyline and intricate NPCS. Usually as soon as they detect I've created same. Although I do perversely enjoy it when they do something unpredictable and the Grand Antagonist falls over dead, much to his surprise I'm sure. And their delight. Filth.

You seem pretty solid as a GM to me, although I did find you spent much too much time on just one player catching him up. Shooting he Ripperdoc Falcon in the head was quite surprising and a good shocker. I might have encouraged the players to try to stop it and fail or succeed you get an interesting face-off with a heavily-armed Osprey.

The interaction between the players is quite good and I look forward to more of that, too. Which reminds me, I need to catch up on Zdorab's game. Because Reverend.

I rarely worry about my players being honest. You get what you give and adults don't generally bother to cheat. I encourage crazy character ideas and actions because those are fun. I also reward heavily with XP since most campaigns don't make it more than a dozen sessions tops. Let 'em live!

When do you play next?

 

[stahimooney]

I think maybe Sunday evening. Not sure though. I had a family emergency come up and I am in NC at the moment. I should be back in Ohio before the game but I am not sure if i will be in condition to play after driving 10 hours.

I averaged 72mph on the way down INCLUDING the nascar-esque pitstops for fuel and bathroom breaks. If you do 65 it's about 11-12 hours including a meal. I did it in about 9:30 or 9:45. I was alone and driving the R32. (AWD 3.2 liter VW)

 

[stahimooney]

You haven't lived (aka nearly died) until you have had a ride in my former rabbit (think rabbit from Holy Grail in VW form) in Italy with no guard rails. Closest thing I can approximate in Appalachia is I 40 near Asheville NC in something like a WRX or an R32. AWD and more HP than common sense is helpful.

 

[Sardukhar]

Yee-aah. Be careful. I drive for a living, which means I see bad things on the roads. People + metal + speed is not very easy on the people part. You don't want them using that sand and water mix they put on to get the red stuff off, if it's your red stuff.

Risk is fine every time until the one time it's not.