CP77 Gameplay Lenght for Each Class and Delivery Model?

[Sardukhar]

Honestly, i'd rather have a good 30-50 hours of gameplay with high re playability than upwards of 100 hours of dragging plot developments, pointless fillers, and a watered down, stretched out story.

Ah. You've played Skyrim then?

 

[Aditya]

Ah. You've played Skyrim then?

So it seems, but hey Skyrim is fun if not 'good'

 

[netra]

Ah. You've played Skyrim then?

Skyrim. Hahahaha. I admit I did play hundreds of hours of that...modding it.

 

[Sardukhar]

*blush*

So did I. And I had a great time. I feel -guilty- about it, though! So that counts!

 

[s3ntinel]

Why has everybody here seem to have a problem with Skyrim and DX:HR? Skyrim is weak story-wise, but that doesn't make it a bad game.

Back to topic: it seems to me that OP has extremely high expectations of the game length. I don't see how could somebody make a 300-1000 hour campaign for one class (let alone an entirely different one for each class). This seems to many people here (including me) to be a dream game made by a dream developer, but we have to be realistic. It's still a video game and CDPR hasn't got an infinite budget and we all know making a game like this is costly.

 

[Sunder]

What is it with people and online modes? Were so few of you raised in a time where single-player games didn't require internet access all the time?

 

[dragonbird]

Has the poll been changed since people voted? I don't remember it referencing "paid online" 12 hours ago.

 

[zheldor651]

Why has everybody here seem to have a problem with Skyrim and DX:HR?

DX: HR? Are you even serious?
Compared to the original Deus Ex, HR is a Japanese stealth action with huge robots, artificial limbs, and superior VA. It is everything but cyberpunk. Well, it certainly has the cyber- part, but completely misses the -punk part.
Also you have to kill at least four people instead of one.
Also NPCs treat the protagonist like the center of the galaxy.
Also exp points for eliminating enemies.
That said, HR is an alright stealth action.

 

[s3ntinel]

DX: HR? Are you even serious?
Compared to the original Deus Ex, HR is a Japanese stealth action with huge robots, artificial limbs, and superior VA. It is everything but cyberpunk. Well, it certainly has the cyber- part, but completely misses the -punk part.
Also you have to kill at least four people instead of one.
Also NPCs treat the protagonist like the center of the galaxy.
Also exp points for eliminating enemies.
That said, HR is an alright stealth action.

I don't see what the original DE has that makes it cyberpunk that DXHR lacks. All you just mentioned was basically a part of the first DE as well.

Btw, I dig your sig.

 

[garothmaster]

Has the poll been changed since people voted? I don't remember it referencing "paid online" 12 hours ago.

No it hasn't. This was just from the start. You cannot edit poll options.

 

[garothmaster]

1000?! lol, what game has that much content?

I like long games, but to me long is around 40-50 hrs. If it's a bit less and the replayability is there, like in TW2, I'm fine with that. 20 hrs or less would be a bit disappointing.

A good sandbox with randomised encounters like in CP 2020 certainly has. 40-50 hours gameplay is not a classic RPG game.
CP 2020 is classic and so should become the CP77.

Randomisation and sandbox is a key to true RPG world. The sooner you and other understand it the better.

 

[garothmaster]

Quite apart from the practical considerations (cost, time to make), the thought of 1000 hours of content leaves me cold. I agree with the others - adding massive amounts of content (more than any other game, ever?) isn't the way to engage the player, it just removes any sense of purpose.

Whether or not a game has 1000 hours of play isn't really dependent on how long the developer says it takes to go through the main story and side quests/missions. It depends on whether or not you, as the player, WANT to play for 1000 hours. This might be because you're willing to wander around just viewing the scenery, or because you're quite happy to grind for experience for days at a time. Or it may be because the game holds your interest enough to make it worth replaying over and over again, trying different builds, different choices, different ways of getting from A to B, hell, even different romances. Or you can speedrun it in a couple of hours and then play it another 500 times to see if you can beat your personal best. Or it gets mods that give replay value. Or all of the above.

Or you can get a game advertised as over 300 hours of content and find it lasts 7 hours before you give up out of boredom and never look at it again. (Looking at you, Skyrim).



I don't get the DLC reference - is the suggestion that expansion packs last this long? While it would be great for expansion packs to last as long as the original game, there are, again, practical considerations in terms of how long they'd take to develop. I've no problem with them charging for bigger expansion packs, but I'd rather they brought out smaller ones, maybe 10 hours or so, at a higher frequency. Just make sure that the toolkit is there for the modders.

That's why we need the true sandbox Nightcity with true randomisation and even online input.

Why fallout 1/2 is top 5 RPG ever and is played over and over again. Because it has randomisation mechanisms that are superior till this day and are true basics for any good RPG world. Night City lives. Business Opens, Business Closes. New punks in area, old punks gone. One Monday chicken promotion in chinese district, next Tuesday italian pasta. On Thursday +5% on energy stocks, on Friday +2% on rice price and then Black Monday.

The DLC model I considered should be the same gameplay lenght in case of first game dedicated for 1-2 classess option.
I would rather buy another DLC with completly storyline ang gameplay for different class than playing every class similar storylines shooter (action RPG) style game. The Nightcity and areas may be base for all classes.

 

[Sardukhar]

I don't play Fallout 1 or 2 over and over again. Whether it's top 5 RPG ever is highly contentious as well. And I don't recall these randomization scenarios in F1 or 2.

Not that I object to your ideas at all - I think they're great! A living vibrant Night City is a wonderful idea and would encourage both replay and DLC purchase as well as rave reviews.

Perhaps you will find this of interest? http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/02/04/the-isometric-age-shadowrun-returns-screens/

Shadowrun Returns details. Further down in the comments are links to some pretty cool screens and summaries.

I would certainly not object to seeing much of that in 2077, only of course done in CDPR's way and non-isometric.

 

[zheldor651]

I don't see what the original DE has that makes it cyberpunk that DXHR lacks. All you just mentioned was basically a part of the first DE as well.

HR is a Japanese stealth action with huge robots, artificial limbs, and superior VA. It is everything but cyberpunk. Well, it certainly has the cyber- part, but completely misses the -punk part.
Also you have to kill at least four people instead of one.
Also NPCs treat the protagonist like the center of the galaxy.
Also exp points for eliminating enemies.
That said, HR is an alright stealth action.

First things first: the original game had bad vioce acting. Almost comically bad.
Yep, it had huge robots and artificial limbs. That's the cyber- part.
About the kills. While the only person that needs to get dead due to your actions and nothing else is Bob Page, you don't ever get to fight him, while HR pits you against four bosses that do require a certain amount of fireworks. AND the game encourages eliminating enemies by giving you additional exp for it.
NPCs react to AJ like "Would you kindly solve my problem?" while even Jock tells JC something like "Go get me some beer, punk. Yo, it better be a cold one, not some warm racoon piss." People treat JC like an ordinary guy. That's the -punk part right there: you are never a superhero, just another soon-to-be-cold body in the streets.
Being a superhero is another huge problem in HR. Denton could install up to nine augs, each one forcing the player to choose between two radically different effects. Rough. The skills also were a total pain since you could like a maximum of like one third of skill points required for making JC a jack of all trades. During my second (and last) playthrough of HR after collecting a total of sixty-something praxis points I rolled in the Hyron control room all pimpy and screamed "IM GODZILLA WHATCHYALL GOT". Ok, that was slightly untrue, but you get the general idea.
Also I never noticed any lowlifes in HR. Of course there were people sleeping in the sewers and stuff, but Japanity level was so high around them I couldn't even think those people were really homeless. I mean, after hearing that kid telling you (with a steel emotionless voice, of course) a super secret passcode for which he could easily get shot, all because he's starving... just no.

Btw, I dig your sig.

Most people don't. What a shame. There are good people, actually. What a rotten way to disrespect the classics.

 

[garothmaster]

Games like the Fallout series, TES series and other such games which have evolved away from your basic adventure model, and incorporated a lot of "Sim" in the form of housing, followers, clothing, weaponry, cars, and so on, do often lack the sort of pressing need to be advancing a story. What I mean is this:

In Oblivion, for example, you escort the King who then dies, and you're left with the very important task of finding his son and bringing the amulet to him. Well. Nobody said you have to do it right now. How about we have a small vacation of about, oh I don't know, a couple years, doing all kinds of random things such as picking flowers and hunting rabbits, and then we can continue on the actual story?

To me, while a system such as that allows you to go adventuring elsewhere, it also disconnects you from the story completely, and because of that it doesn't feel like a story-driven game. Now, I've played my fair share of Sim City, Transport Tycoon, even Sims, or for example Spore, as well as other such fun games which have nothing to do with a story, and I can appreciate having some of that incorporated into the game, but I still feel like having a story that feels alive instead of "on pause" does good to a game.

To me, for some reason, S.T.A.L.K.E.R. has this. It allows you to explore areas somewhat freely, it allows you to "farm" enemies and get better gear and there are factions in the game too, so there's a very small sim-style element to it, and even though you spend hours sniping Russian soldiers from the bushes, it doesn't feel like the actual main story in the background has paused at all. Perhaps because the protagonist isn't the center of what's happening until at the very end.

For Cyberpunk 2077, I would be very disappointed if there wasn't a very rich story in it, almost like reading a book or watching a movie. I would also (have been) disappointed if it was going to be an on-rails type of a story, which I gather it's not going to be. However, having the freedom a sandbox brings, without disconnecting the player from the main plot like the TES-games and Fallout sort of do, will be a difficult thing to accomplish, I think.

Amen, nothing to add.

 

[garothmaster]

I've finished Dragon Age 2 two weeks ago for the first time. It was a nice weekend but already I forgot the main storyline (sunday after party .
Because of the limited numer of quests and linear storyline, the same for each class, it is not worth for the replay.
Although it was a nice movie (it felt like a movie not a game), cerartainly I won't pay much attention to something
I've spent a weekend on.
That is why again I vote option 1. Won't you agree?

 

[Lolssi83.811]

I've finished Dragon Age 2 two weeks ago for the first time. It was a nice weekend but already I forget the main storyline (sunday after party .
Because of the limited numer of quests and linear storyline the same for each class it is not worth for the replay.
Although it was a nice movie (it felt like amovie not a game), cerartainly I won't pay much attention to something I've spent a weekend on.
That is why again I vote option 1. Won't you agree?

I liked DA2 more than original. Yes it had it's flaws(recycled cave, stupid comabt visuals etc.) but I liked the story taking years and how much stuff they managed to put in one city, now picture if they could add as much content to whole world.
Whereas Origins felt like more polished but less epic version of Neverwinter Nights 2.

 

[Decatonkeil]

A good sandbox with randomised encounters like in CP 2020 certainly has [1000+ hours of gameplay]. 40-50 hours gameplay is not a classic RPG game.
CP 2020 is classic and so should become the CP77.

Randomisation and sandbox is a key to true RPG world. The sooner you and other understand it the better.

An MMO where you waste time grinding in a world that itsn't your adventure, but a theme park for tons of people to follow marked steps that take 80 times the effort/time they should has 1000+ hours. I'd rather keep it varied and shorter so that I can replay the game both for reliving the same story and for playing a different one or one from a different point of view. Yes I put 200+ hours in SA (around 160/180 in my main save + a ton of replays of the main story), yes I put around 150 in Pokémon silver back then because with handheld games it's easy to add up that many hours... but I can't do that anymore or, if I can those are the ceilings, the limits I set myself. The game isn't more sophisticated because it has this entry fee that says "thou shall not have a life other than this game or thou shall suffer tha damnation of being labeled a casual gamer". No, stop that. I want a game with a soul, I want a game to be remembered, not a grindfest, not a game that stretches itself artificially, not a game that takes 50 hours to learn, not a game where I'll have to put that many hours... not a game I can't get back to after some days/weeks of distraction from.

 

[Decatonkeil]

Also I never noticed any lowlifes in HR. Of course there were people sleeping in the sewers and stuff, but Japanity level was so high around them I couldn't even think those people were really homeless. I mean, after hearing that kid telling you (with a steel emotionless voice, of course) a super secret passcode for which he could easily get shot, all because he's starving... just no.

What's "Japanity"?

 

[wisdom000]

An MMO where you waste time grinding in a world that itsn't your adventure, but a theme park for tons of people to follow marked steps that take 80 times the effort/time they should has 1000+ hours. I'd rather keep it varied and shorter so that I can replay the game both for reliving the same story and for playing a different one or one from a different point of view. Yes I put 200+ hours in SA (around 160/180 in my main save + a ton of replays of the main story), yes I put around 150 in Pokémon silver back then because with handheld games it's easy to add up that many hours... but I can't do that anymore or, if I can those are the ceilings, the limits I set myself. The game isn't more sophisticated because it has this entry fee that says "thou shall not have a life other than this game or thou shall suffer tha damnation of being labeled a casual gamer". No, stop that. I want a game with a soul, I want a game to be remembered, not a grindfest, not a game that stretches itself artificially, not a game that takes 50 hours to learn, not a game where I'll have to put that many hours... not a game I can't get back to after some days/weeks of distraction from.

Not being quickly over does not equal the game having a soul, nor does an extremely long game equal not having a soul.

The preference for shorter games doesn't make you a connoisseur of video games... it means you either don't have the time, or don't have the patience for longer games... either because of work or ADD.

Personally I am all for longer games, larger open worlds... it's not a matter of having a soul or not, it's a matter of wanting more for my money. Video games aren't cheap, and if I am going to plunk down 60 dollars or more, that game better keep me entertained for a long bloody time... not only with a long storyline, but with plenty to do beyond the storyline. GTA, Fallout3, Fallout New Vegas, Saints Row 2... these games were worth every bloody penny I spent on them. A game where I can complete the main story in under a week.... and there is simply nothing to do after that.... not worth the price of toilet paper. And don't tell me "start the game oper again" because fuck that, I heard that story, I played that shit.... there isn't going to be a significant enough difference, nor a reason to play it again, when everything I am able to accomplish is lost because the game just ends. This is why I no longer buy anything but sandbox, racing, or fighting games... they aren't worth the money or time to me.

What's "Japanity"?

I don't think the guy understands the difference between Japan and China...