Cyberpunk is retrofuturistic

[Decatonkeil]

Wouldn't it even be somewhat (and ironically) superficial to focus way too much on the idea that Cyberpunk has to look 80s? I mean, we're even debating if cyberpunk was even really born in the 80s, and I'm pretty inclined to say it was, there's nothing bad with calling "Do androids dream...", "Judge Dredd" or "Metropolis" precedents to cyberpunk, and still some people go as far as to say that everything that came after the 80s wasn't really cyberpunk but post-cyberpunk (and it would be arguable when we're talking about what the themes are, but still, too much focus on the date or the era)... and then you have the ridiculous plethora of subgenres like this was Metal or something

I personally wouldn't be bothered in the slightest if CP2077 was retrofuturistic in the broader sense of the word, but you have to give it to the newer fans discovering this world (hey, I'm kinda one of those new fans, if we mean THE Mike Pondsmith's Cyberpunk) that things like the electronics and gear other than the pure cybernetics are obsolete even in our days and so this kind of kills the "sense of wonder" of submerging in a futuristic setting.

 

[Sardukhar]

It's a balancing act - Cyberpunk with chrome and loud Style and rockers and punk has an 80s vibe, yes.

But, making it too 80s would also "date" it. So, the trick is to give it the Cyberpunk feel while keeping it modern enough not to make people feel like AC/DC or Sex Pistols should be playing for the soundtrack.

On the other hand, for the newer fans, the 80s -are- an alien world, full of new weirdness.

 

[Decatonkeil]

It's a balancing act - Cyberpunk with chrome and loud Style and rockers and punk has an 80s vibe, yes.

But, making it too 80s would also "date" it. So, the trick is to give it the Cyberpunk feel while keeping it modern enough not to make people feel like AC/DC or Sex Pistols should be playing for the soundtrack.

On the other hand, for the newer fans, the 80s -are- an alien world, full of new weirdness.

And still, they, of course, have to build upon what older fans have grown to love. Like you said: it's a balancing act.

 

[Mikedudeh]

Where did they say "this is NOT going to be like bladerunner, we don't want 2077 to be dark" or something like that. I swear I read/heard that somewhere but I can't find it anywhere. I wish I could find the exact quote because it's never made sense to me. That is cyberpunk. Isn't it?

 

[blank_redge]

On the other hand, for the newer fans, the 80s -are- an alien world, full of new weirdness.

...and Einstürzende Neubauten. *nods*

 

[dragonbird]

Where did they say "this is NOT going to be like bladerunner, we don't want 2077 to be dark" or something like that. I swear I read/heard that somewhere but I can't find it anywhere. I wish I could find the exact quote because it's never made sense to me. That is cyberpunk. Isn't it?

http://www.vg247.com/2013/05/01/cyberpunk-2077-wont-be-a-dark-and-hopeless-world-like-blade-runner/

“There are lots of cyber games around, but there’s not a lot of punk in those games,” Mateusz added . “We want to put more punk into ours. We do not want to make a dark and hopeless world. We are not doing Blade Runner. It will be full of rock and roll.”

I think that "hopeless" is the key word there.

 

[Sardukhar]

Blade Runner is a primary influence, however. Lest people start to get excited.

Also keep in mind - these guys are Poles and the Poles who made the Witcher. Their idea of dark and your idea may not match. Witcher is pretty dark, pretty grim and often nasty. Just not as dark as say, Dark Souls, for example.

That's their current product, anyway. Perhaps they've hired a trio of singing Californians to do yoga in the studios until the whole place is full of warm joy. I look forward to the M-4s with Hello Kitty on them.

 

[dekkarius]

Look at how Deus Ex: Human Revolution deals with its tech. They make a fully augmented protagonist look sleek, and sexy. His shades are ON his face, and it looks badass. For all we know he may meet the CP2077 definition of a full cyborg, but he looks good and has clear style. The clothing in the game, for example, is slightly gothic and forward looking, which helps lend a darker note to fit Mike Pondsmith's vision, but at the same time looks like something wealthy people would actually think they looked good in, and they believe it. I'd want something more like that going on among the wealthy, even if the lower classes are punking out still.

I get that CP2020 is, by demonstration, retrofuturistic. I wouldn't want CP2077 to be nearly as much so, because otherwise it would look like nothing happened in 50+ years.

 

[eilerson5]

its the future envisioned in the 80s, it has that 80s electrosound and Blade Runner aesthetics, and most important of all its dirty.

The trailer was too contemporary futuristic i thought and too clean like star trek and mass effect.

what do you guys think? you like the super modern or you want the retro look?

I agree completely and thought the same thing when I saw the trailer, its a bit off. I think its partly the style they used, the way it has been directed all slo-mo is very contemporary. Also that song is such a terrible choice. Bandcamp is full of great neo 80's future stuff that would work a lot better. The upclose shots of her face are out of place because they look like an Ibiza music video from 2003.

The buildings and the soldiers looked good though.

 

[dekkarius]

Synthen: I am trying to understand what your expectations are here. You felt it was all off, because it didn't fit your interpretation of the 80's vision of the future?

The future is made up until it happens. I feel the trailer very well captured what it needed to about the future that might be, that would portray the world of CP2077. The music has to be somewhat contemporary, by definition, because we don't have music from the future. Futuristic sounding music (whatever that actually means, there is a whole thread about it), if made right now, would be contemporary by definition. Contemporary methods, conventions and styles would have to be used to make a trailer, too.

I guess that begs a more fundamental question; How are we supposed to make stuff futuristic so that it's believable?

 

[Mikedudeh]

I agree completely and thought the same thing when I saw the trailer, its a bit off. I think its partly the style they used, the way it has been directed all slo-mo is very contemporary. Also that song is such a terrible choice. Bandcamp is full of great neo 80's future stuff that would work a lot better. The upclose shots of her face are out of place because they look like an Ibiza music video from 2003.

The buildings and the soldiers looked good though.

I personally thought the song choice was brilliant, the lyrics fit the visuals in the video and the general process of technoshock quite well.

 

[animalfather]

Well according to mike pondsmith Cyberpunk IS Blade Runner, and although i have full confidence in CD Project to deliver a fantastic game I am a bit worried about the art style of the game. Cyberpunk always had its charm in the 80s feel this is why people still play it because of its 80s futuristic nostalgia with the dark burned chrome with obnoxious neon signs, and ripped bleached jeans with big punk mohawks. What we saw from the trailer was character designs that could have come from Halo or Mass Effect or even Xcom EU.
The cyberpunk genre is based on western cynicism of the future with its dystopian feel, inside-jokes and references, and when an eastern company wants to recreate a western cultural marvel theres always going to be a disconnect, things will get lost in translation. Now i know mike is part of the process to fill that gap but the question is how much will they listen to him?

 

[Poet_and_Gentleman.598]

Well according to mike pondsmith Cyberpunk IS Blade Runner, and although i have full confidence in CD Project to deliver a fantastic game I am a bit worried about the art style of the game. Cyberpunk always had its charm in the 80s feel this is why people still play it because of its 80s futuristic nostalgia with the dark burned chrome with obnoxious neon signs, and ripped bleached jeans with big punk mohawks. What we saw from the trailer was character designs that could have come from Halo or Mass Effect or even Xcom EU.
The cyberpunk genre is based on western cynicism of the future with its dystopian feel, inside-jokes and references, and when an eastern company wants to recreate a western cultural marvel theres always going to be a disconnect, things will get lost in translation. Now i know mike is part of the process to fill that gap but the question is how much will they listen to him?

No man, western culture is decadent. Its glory days are for the most part gone.

I am banking on CDPR because they are outside the politically-correct West.

 

[animalfather]

No man, western culture is decadent. Its glory days are for the most part gone.

I am banking on CDPR because they are outside the politically-correct West.

then they should do something related to eastern culture, Cyberpunk is a strictly western phenomena.

 

[Poet_and_Gentleman.598]

then they should do something related to eastern culture, Cyberpunk is a strictly western phenomena.

So now the game will not only offend the feminists it will also offend hippies and purists.

Oh, the humanity!

 

[chriswebb2020.736]

Well according to mike pondsmith Cyberpunk IS Blade Runner, and although i have full confidence in CD Project to deliver a fantastic game I am a bit worried about the art style of the game. Cyberpunk always had its charm in the 80s feel this is why people still play it because of its 80s futuristic nostalgia with the dark burned chrome with obnoxious neon signs, and ripped bleached jeans with big punk mohawks. What we saw from the trailer was character designs that could have come from Halo or Mass Effect or even Xcom EU.
The cyberpunk genre is based on western cynicism of the future with its dystopian feel, inside-jokes and references, and when an eastern company wants to recreate a western cultural marvel theres always going to be a disconnect, things will get lost in translation. Now i know mike is part of the process to fill that gap but the question is how much will they listen to him?

then they should do something related to eastern culture, Cyberpunk is a strictly western phenomena.

Yes, Blade Runner is Cyberpunk, but Cyberpunk isn't Blade Runner. It was part of the influence behind it, As were other works by Philip K. Dick. William Gibson was an even bigger influence.

I really fail to see how you come to the conclusion that Cyberpunk is exclusive to Western culture. There is a huge amount of Anime, (both written and televised,) that are staples of the Cyberpunk genre and even the Western stuff takes a huge influence from Japanese culture.

I really cannot understand where you are coming from.



Anyway...

I love the 80's vibe of 2020 as much as the next die hard fan of the game. However, I don't believe that particular style is essential to convey the nature of the setting. After all, look how fashion and style have changed in the last 57 years. Would you really expect anything less in the fast paced dark future?

 

[animalfather]

Yes, Blade Runner is Cyberpunk, but Cyberpunk isn't Blade Runner. It was part of the influence behind it, As were other works by Philip K. Dick. William Gibson was an even bigger influence.

I really fail to see how you come to the conclusion that Cyberpunk is exclusive to Western culture. There is a huge amount of Anime, (both written and televised,) that are staples of the Cyberpunk genre and even the Western stuff takes a huge influence from Japanese culture.

I really cannot understand where you are coming from.



Anyway...

I love the 80's vibe of 2020 as much as the next die hard fan of the game. However, I don't believe that particular style is essential to convey the nature of the setting. After all, look how fashion and style have changed in the last 57 years. Would you really expect anything less in the fast paced dark future?

Blade Runner came before cyberpunk so claiming Blade Runner is Cyberpunk but not the otherway is beyond foolish. Mike Pondsmith own quote is that Cyberpunk Is Bladerunner, its an actual quote.

Another thing that bothers me with some users here is that they assume just because the game is set in 2077 that it should abondon its iconic 80s retrofuturistic style which i completely disagree with and many posters in this thread agree. If you dont like the 80s retrofuturistic look I would understand but saying it shouldnt have it just because its set in 2077 and that it should reflect our vision of the future like they did in the 80s is just childish and i dont these people have any of value to offer when it comes to discussing the artstyle of the game.

Its true that Japans obsession with shiny things neon signs, pachinko played a big role in forming the cyberpunk look but i wouldnt really categorize Japan as a 2nd world eastern nation, its culture is very much intertwined with western culture. and most animes like Akira came AFTER bladerunner.

 

[Sardukhar]

Blade Runner came before cyberpunk

Giggle.

 

[animalfather]

Giggle.

cyberpunk came out 1988, Bladerunner came out 1982, giggle all you want.

 

[Decatonkeil]

But then, you're obviously refering to Cyberpunk the RPG. The genre... it could have come one year later than BR... or fourty years earlier. That's where I see that sticking to the 80s look might be superficial. It could also be like acknowledging that cyberpunk (both the genre and the game) aren't relevan't anymore, relegating them to being a ucronic type of science-fiction like steam-punk of things that won't happen instead of a test field for problems whose seeds are being planted right now.