Did Cyberpunk 2077 missed point of cyberpunk genre? (spoilers)

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Did Cyberpunk 2077 missed point of cyberpunk genre?


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So I know that we dont know anything about DLC or story expansions but do you think they missed point? I will point out this article where founding father and a man who wrote the tabletop RPG that inspired Cyberpunk 2077
https://www.wired.com/story/cyberpunk-mike-pondsmith-interview/




You can’t just say, ‘The world is craptastic and you can’t do anything about it.’ No. You don’t have to save the world, but you need to be able to save your mother or the apartment you and your friends live in.

In a world where people are feeling increasingly powerless, Pondsmith sees the message of hope inherent in the cyberpunk genre. “The thing that I love about cyberpunk inherently is that it's about paying attention, and dealing with things. If you use the technology and your knowledge right, you can make it better. You can’t just let the boostergangs roll over your community, or you’re going to let a microtech tear down your apartment building to put up a microwave tower,” he says.

So did CDPR missed whole point with that 6 months timer? As I said we dont know anything about DLCs so lets say story is finished
 
I think that this should have the spoiler tag.
Why do you think they didnt miss point?
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But he helped with writing and whatnot, didn't he?
He didnt
But he helped with writing and whatnot, didn't he?
That sense of immediate and material concerns is something Pondsmith tried to drive home in his conversations with CD Projekt about the game. “It can not be about saving the world. You’re saving yourself or your community,” he says.
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Why do you think they didnt miss point?
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He didnt

That sense of immediate and material concerns is something Pondsmith tried to drive home in his conversations with CD Projekt about the game. “It can not be about saving the world. You’re saving yourself or your community,” he says.
He talked with them but he didnt help with writing. They asked him, took licence and went to make this game
 
But he helped with writing and whatnot, didn't he?

Yeah but for the main story ? I seriously doubt because as far as I remember, Morgan Blackhand also participated in the Arasaka attack and he was the one who put the bomb in the basement ...
Unless voluntary changes...
 
Yes and no. V manages to make a difference for other people (Aldecaldos, River, Judy and so on) and the 6 months timer/survival in cyberspace can fit the genre (live to fight a little longer/survive but changed).

If it was a movie, I'd have said "grim ending but ok" and moved on. Games are a completely different medium though, especially RPGs. In Cyberpunk, with this kind of main quest, it feels like a complete failure for V unless the player gets a different message from the game based on side quests and their subjective roleplaying (link in my sign for a longer take on that).

So in the end I picked "yes" in the poll. Cyberspace is never presented as an appealing alternative, and you get to decide how attached V is to the NPCs. If your goal is to save both V and Johnny or keep the body, and not help other people in side quests, the "you need to be able to save your mother or the apartment you and your friends live in" bit falls on its ass.

EDIT: I don't mention the recurring themes of the consequences of unhinged capitalism, growing inequality exasperated by technology, transhumanism and human identity, etc because they are a given for the genre to me. These were handled pretty well.

The core of the issue in the game is self reliance and resistance in the face of adversity, and this is where that specific message ("it's about paying attention, and dealing with things") fails. In the game V and Jackie "overstep" when they decide to rob Arasaka, and V never gets to find a proper cure because the deck is stacked against them. "The house always wins". That's an awfully fatalistic take.
 
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Mike pondsmith was informed about the fate of some of his characters.

He was I volved as an advisor but he did not write the story.
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I tend to say that they hit a lot of the right buttons with cp2077.
Setting, use of technology, dystopia, mega corporations ...

Some points however were utterly missed.

The focus on small stories comes to my mind.
Usually, cyberpunk stories revolve around small.and very personal stories and don't end up as world shattering. I dare say they are anti-epics.

V is too powerful and the story is about way too important people. Especially for the first entry of the franchise.
 
Mike pondsmith was informed about the fate of some of his characters.

He was I volved as an advisor but he did not write the story.
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I tend to say that they hit a lot of the right buttons with cp2077.
Setting, use of technology, dystopia, mega corporations ...

Some points however were utterly missed.

The focus on small stories comes to my mind.
Usually, cyberpunk stories revolve around small.and very personal stories and don't end up as world shattering. I dare say they are anti-epics.

V is too powerful and the story is about way too important people. Especially for the first entry of the franchise.

And yet Pondsmith is the guy who starts his introduction towards PnP rounds with "the guy who killed you Cyberpunk character"... so i don't think he'd be especially against dying characters. One of his main critiques on Traveller (and why he started creating his own games) was that he seemingly disliked how hard it was to die in Traveller once Characer creation was finished (All infos from Pondsmith here:
).
 
And yet Pondsmith is the guy who starts his introduction towards PnP rounds with "the guy who killed you Cyberpunk character"... so i don't think he'd be especially against dying characters. One of his main critiques on Traveller (and why he started creating his own games) was that he seemingly disliked how hard it was to die in Traveller once Characer creation was finished (All infos from Pondsmith here:
).
This can be read differently.

If it is too hard to get killed by the game, it's not fun, because the risks are low.

There is however a massive difference in dying from pulling too many NPCs (risk is too high) and being killed off by the gamemaster, 'cause reasons.
 
IMO it didn't miss it, quite the opposite.

I found this review to sum this up pretty well.

I consider myself a cyberfanboypunk since the beginning, but after watching this video from start to end with no interruptions, I feel very humbled understanding how deep the hole really is, how much more can be taken from the game, even after my +500 of gameplay. I'm speechless, and once again I take my hat off to CDPR and to the creator of this video.
:applause:

Suggestion to the forum rules, instead of having every new user make 10 posts before they can start a thread, make them watch this video :p
 
Yeah but for the main story ? I seriously doubt because as far as I remember, Morgan Blackhand also participated in the Arasaka attack and he was the one who put the bomb in the basement ...
Unless voluntary changes...

Remember in game we only see those events from how Johnny remembers them or wants to remember them. Certain characters even point this out.
As far as Johnny is concerned he did it all by himself.
 
Yes and no. V manages to make a difference for other people (Aldecaldos, River, Judy and so on) and the 6 months timer/survival in cyberspace can fit the genre (live to fight a little longer/survive but changed).

If it was a movie, I'd have said "grim ending but ok" and moved on. Games are a completely different medium though, especially RPGs. In Cyberpunk, with this kind of main quest, it feels like a complete failure for V unless the player gets a different message from the game based on side quests and their subjective roleplaying (link in my sign for a longer take on that).

So in the end I picked "yes" in the poll. Cyberspace is never presented as an appealing alternative, and you get to decide how attached V is to the NPCs. If your goal is to save both V and Johnny or keep the body, and not help other people in side quests, the "you need to be able to save your mother or the apartment you and your friends live in" bit falls on its ass.

Actually, V makes a huge impact on the world itself by certain choices - Legend Secret ending brings collapse to Arasaka, while suicide ending (or leaving NC) means Yorinobu destroys Arasaka and Militech by starting another corporate war.. And If he sides with Arasaka, he practically saves the corporation and Saburo...
 
Actually, V makes a huge impact on the world itself by certain choices - Legend Secret ending brings collapse to Arasaka, while suicide ending (or leaving NC) means Yorinobu destroys Arasaka and Militech by starting another corporate war.. And If he sides with Arasaka, he practically saves the corporation and Saburo...

Something that is mostly Yorinobu/Hanako's doing and V really doesn't care about, though. They're a pawn and fail at the only thing that matters, surviving.
 
Something that is mostly Yorinobu/Hanako's doing and V really doesn't care about, though. They're a pawn and fail at the only thing that matters, surviving.
Without V, Hanako would be still captured in a villa.. without V she had no hope to get to the board meeting, and without V, she would have no chance to survive the attack of Yorinobu goons... so V plays crucial role in it...
 
IMO it didn't miss it, quite the opposite.

I found this review to sum this up pretty well.

Thnxz for sharing this, cant belive i actually watched it all but as someone who knows absolutely nothing about the genre it was a eye opener
 
Without V, Hanako would be still captured in a villa.. without V she had no hope to get to the board meeting, and without V, she would have no chance to survive the attack of Yorinobu goons... so V plays crucial role in it...

Playing a part in events that decide Arasaka's fate was never V's goal. What V manages to achieve is having an unwilling, relatively big but ultimately temporary impact on the world balance that changes nothing in the long term, at the price of their own life (tarot cards/potential story continuations aside). If Arasaka falls Militech will take their place. If Militech falls, it will be another corp. And V will still be dead.
 
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