Did Cyberpunk 2077 missed point of cyberpunk genre? (spoilers)

+

Did Cyberpunk 2077 missed point of cyberpunk genre?


  • Total voters
    58
The payoff or realization isn't missing. You dismissed it because you don't like it. Which is just a point of different strokes for different folks.

The entire nature of Nightcity is summarized by the whole "most legends of Nightcity are all dead". The survival story arc is a surface level, reductive understanding of the story. V saving themselves can encompass elements that are conceptual to the human self: principles, morals, humanity, etc.

The endings aren't even cemented in their conclusions - but it's completely valid to think that you die anyways. Albeit it's weird to think that considering that against all odds you turned two weeks to live into six months to live. The only thing stopping the player here is a lack of imagination.




That's funny, because it didn't stop me from playing the game or starting more playthroughs.

Honest question, since you've said it a million times before that you refunded this game. Did you do it after or before beating the game? This is important, because If the core gameplay loop (you know the main reason for playing most games) isn't inviting enough, then a happy ending to a story (which you dislike top to bottom), isn't going to really redeem it for you.
Enlighten me.
Where is the payoff?
 
I would say no, there were no cybernetic extra limbs or cell phone guns but the setting and atmosphere really drove the "dark future" thing home at least better than any other game I have seen
 
Enlighten me.
Where is the payoff?

That V managed to salvage a bit of their humanity after losing practically everything to a city that, literally, consumes people? That the game lets you decide what is most important, the quiet life or the blaze of glory? The question of self vs. selflessness. That Johnny's parting words are a reinforcement and reminder of everything V does -- from the point Dex shoots them in the head and when they exit Mikoshi.

Are you going to answer my question now or continue to dodge it?
 
That V managed to salvage a bit of their humanity after losing practically everything to a city that, literally, consumes people? That the game lets you decide what is most important, the quiet life or the blaze of glory? The question of self vs. selflessness. That Johnny's parting words are a reinforcement and reminder of everything V does -- from the point Dex shoots them in the head and when they exit Mikoshi.

That's very subjective. The streetkid prologue starts with V doing a favor for Pepe without getting anything in return, detective Stints letting V and Jackie go out of pity and V admitting that Atlanta wasn't better than Night City. V can have ties to Night City.
The quiet life vs blaze of glory choice gets blurry for players that romanced River, Kerry or no one, and turns the final choice of allies into a black and white choice in spite of the nuanced characterization of the lifepaths that the game showed before. The payoff never comes if you played a certain way.
 
That's very subjective. The streetkid prologue starts with V doing a favor for Pepe without getting anything in return, detective Stints letting V and Jackie go out of pity and V admitting that Atlanta wasn't better than Night City. V can have ties to Night City.
The quiet life vs blaze of glory choice gets blurry for players that romanced River, Kerry or no one, and turns the final choice of allies into a black and white choice in spite of the nuanced characterization of the lifepaths that the game showed before. The payoff never comes if you played a certain way.

I agree there's an imbalance in the endings when you factor in LIs. But the original statement was there's no payoff.
 
That V managed to salvage a bit of their humanity after losing practically everything to a city that, literally, consumes people? That the game lets you decide what is most important, the quiet life or the blaze of glory? The question of self vs. selflessness. That Johnny's parting words are a reinforcement and reminder of everything V does -- from the point Dex shoots them in the head and when they exit Mikoshi.

Are you going to answer my question now or continue to dodge it?
My V salvaged her humanity after being kicked out of arasaka. She tried to take life into her own hands and got screwed over.
Then the story offers a carrot on a stick and when you get it, it's exchanged for one made out of cardboard.

The game does not let me decide whats more important for the character. It let's the player decide how to enter arasaka tower. The rest is predetermined by the writer. There is not choice.
The question of selflessness is also not given, because Johnny makes it clear that he is the one who wants to go. Him taking over the body is two characters acting out of character.

Quiet life is also not given, because V dies. You could argue that Legend-V only takes on the job, because waiting for death sucks. It's not really a choice, because V is dead anyway.

To answer your question. The gameplay loop is not great, because it's highly repetitive. Shooting is fun though. I would have kept the game, if it was not totally broken on console and by totally, I mean it. Not even the cyberware and half my cyberfeck were working anymore not even on new characters, despite deleting all safe files I previously had. All. In addition to the horrible performance and myriad of bugs and glitches.

In addition, the retcon at the end was useless and insulting, because it was only introduced to make the absolutely underdeveloped cyberspace option more appealing. This is purely a result of bad writing. The story up to this point was good. Not stellar and not without plotholes but it was good. Leaving the alterations out, would have made the conclusion logical and worth another run.
 
My V salvaged her humanity after being kicked out of arasaka. She tried to take life into her own hands and got screwed over.
Then the story offers a carrot on a stick and when you get it, it's exchanged for one made out of cardboard.

The game does not let me decide whats more important for the character. It let's the player decide how to enter arasaka tower. The rest is predetermined by the writer. There is not choice.
The question of selflessness is also not given, because Johnny makes it clear that he is the one who wants to go. Him taking over the body is two characters acting out of character.

Quiet life is also not given, because V dies. You could argue that Legend-V only takes on the job, because waiting for death sucks. It's not really a choice, because V is dead anyway.

To answer your question. The gameplay loop is not great, because it's highly repetitive. Shooting is fun though. I would have kept the game, if it was not totally broken on console and by totally, I mean it. Not even the cyberware and half my cyberfeck were working anymore not even on new characters, despite deleting all safe files I previously had. All. In addition to the horrible performance and myriad of bugs and glitches.

In addition, the retcon at the end was useless and insulting, because it was only introduced to make the absolutely underdeveloped cyberspace option more appealing. This is purely a result of bad writing. The story up to this point was good. Not stellar and not without plotholes but it was good. Leaving the alterations out, would have made the conclusion logical and worth another run.

Fair enough. I fundamentally disagree with you on a lot of things, but I won't try to tell you your dislike of the endings is wrong.

I hope that the devs can at least sort out the technical issues so you can enjoy the parts of the game you did find enjoyment in.
 
So I know that we dont know anything about DLC or story expansions but do you think they missed point? I will point out this article where founding father and a man who wrote the tabletop RPG that inspired Cyberpunk 2077
https://www.wired.com/story/cyberpunk-mike-pondsmith-interview/

You can’t just say, ‘The world is craptastic and you can’t do anything about it.’ No. You don’t have to save the world, but you need to be able to save your mother or the apartment you and your friends live in.

In a world where people are feeling increasingly powerless, Pondsmith sees the message of hope inherent in the cyberpunk genre. “The thing that I love about cyberpunk inherently is that it's about paying attention, and dealing with things. If you use the technology and your knowledge right, you can make it better. You can’t just let the boostergangs roll over your community, or you’re going to let a microtech tear down your apartment building to put up a microwave tower,” he says.

So did CDPR missed whole point with that 6 months timer? As I said we dont know anything about DLCs so lets say story is finished

Just as a reminder that V lives in the Nomad and Legend ending as well as becomes an immortal digital being in both the Arasaka as well as Temperance endings.

FYI - I was HOPING this thread would be about the dangers of unfettered capitalism, police brutality, corruption, and the effects of poverty on mindsets or even gun control.

Anyone else hoping the thread would discuss those issues than the goddamned ending being insufficiently happy to a misreading of it?
 
Fair enough. I fundamentally disagree with you on a lot of things, but I won't try to tell you your dislike of the endings is wrong.

I hope that the devs can at least sort out the technical issues so you can enjoy the parts of the game you did find enjoyment in.
Disagreeing is no problem, as long as you can respect other people's opinions.

You can't tell me that my dislike is wrong, because it is based on the writers not respecting the integrity of their own story. It's off course their own decision and they can do with their story whatever they want but it's nonetheless objectively bad writing.

That said, I respect your opinion.
 
FYI - I was HOPING this thread would be about the dangers of unfettered capitalism, police brutality, corruption, and the effects of poverty on mindsets or even gun control.

Anyone else hoping the thread would discuss those issues than the goddamned ending being insufficiently happy to a misreading of it?

Well, OP's question was about the fatalistic doom and gloom take of cyberpunk as a genre. The other aspects were presented pretty well in the game imo, even in minor gigs (the XBD father/son duo, the gig about the corrupt cop, the one about the biotechnica lady experimenting on nomads, etc). They did a great job with the city, the constant noise, trash heaps, lights and advertisements and its contrast with the badlands.

The NCPD is a bit too efficient considering how violent NC is supposed to be, outside of some scripted interactions most neighborhoods don't feel that dangerous to walk around in. I wish the pros and cons of lifepaths were explored a bit more, they all require compromises.
 
That's very subjective. The streetkid prologue starts with V doing a favor for Pepe without getting anything in return, detective Stints letting V and Jackie go out of pity and V admitting that Atlanta wasn't better than Night City. V can have ties to Night City.
The quiet life vs blaze of glory choice gets blurry for players that romanced River, Kerry or no one, and turns the final choice of allies into a black and white choice in spite of the nuanced characterization of the lifepaths that the game showed before. The payoff never comes if you played a certain way.
Isn't, what you call a payoff, a little stereotypical, even if "neutral" as you call it on your essay, in the videogame industry?
I heard so much people talking shit about Cyberpunk2077 that at some point made me question my tolerance to the bugs and how grand I feel this game is.
People play, game to win, for the payoff, but maybe that wasn't the plan with this "game".
At some point I started looking at CP2077 as the Groundhog Day movie, you know by the end of the day it's going to loop back, once it does, how am I going to play it next?
If I didn't felt in tune with the game, I'd log off and do something else, but I do, I come back and give priority to different missions, I perfect my skills and try to make everything different each time.
CDPR cannot please greeks and trojans, and it was maybe a big risk doing some things the way they did, but for me, i'm happy, I keep coming back and would really like to see this NC or the game grow.
I'm not a gamer, I cannot compare this game to others, what I can say is that, personally I feel they managed create something really extraordinaire. I don't want to know of dragons, ridding horses, magic spells or being a gangster in the 50s or a thug in san francisco or whatever, so don't bother recommending anything you feel so awesome and technically crafted better than CP2077. The reality is that for the first time I am glued to a computer to play a videogame, days, weeks in a row (thanks covid?)
Cyberpunk 2077 isn't a game for everyone in my opinion and to be honest, with all due respect to anyone fragile enough to feel offended, I believe it has mainly to do with age. Let me put it this way, you go to a gallery, look at a painting and think the artist should have used blue instead of yellow.. now the same painter travels to your workplace and starts giving hints on how you should do your job, something you have been doing for years. If it was me I'd say "go fly a kite hippie".

and with all this I managed to kill time, new patch is out :D
 
Isn't, what you call a payoff, a little stereotypical, even if "neutral" as you call it on your essay, in the videogame industry?
I heard so much people talking shit about Cyberpunk2077 that at some point made me question my tolerance to the bugs and how grand I feel this game is.
People play, game to win, for the payoff, but maybe that wasn't the plan with this "game".
At some point I started looking at CP2077 as the Groundhog Day movie, you know by the end of the day it's going to loop back, once it does, how am I going to play it next?
If I didn't felt in tune with the game, I'd log off and do something else, but I do, I come back and give priority to different missions, I perfect my skills and try to make everything different each time.
CDPR cannot please greeks and trojans, and it was maybe a big risk doing some things the way they did, but for me, i'm happy, I keep coming back and would really like to see this NC or the game grow.
I'm not a gamer, I cannot compare this game to others, what I can say is that, personally I feel they managed create something really extraordinaire. I don't want to know of dragons, ridding horses, magic spells or being a gangster in the 50s or a thug in san francisco or whatever, so don't bother recommending anything you feel so awesome and technically crafted better than CP2077. The reality is that for the first time I am glued to a computer to play a videogame, days, weeks in a row (thanks covid?)
Cyberpunk 2077 isn't a game for everyone in my opinion and to be honest, with all due respect to anyone fragile enough to feel offended, I believe it has mainly to do with age. Let me put it this way, you go to a gallery, look at a painting and think the artist should have used blue instead of yellow.. now the same painter travels to your workplace and starts giving hints on how you should do your job, something you have been doing for years. If it was me I'd say "go fly a kite hippie".

and with all this I managed to kill time, new patch is out :D
Payoff from a storytelling and roleplaying point of view, according to my previous ingame choices. Which the game had managed to do fine until Act 3 and it's natural to expect from an RPG.
I play on PC so have no issues with bugs and have no complaints about the worldbuilding and gameplay. Glad it worked for you but we seem to play the game for very different reasons. I care about V's story, gameplay is secondary. Not being in the industry doesn't automatically make anyone's criticism invalid.
 
Last edited:
Payoff from a storytelling and roleplaying point of view, according to my previous ingame choices. Which the game had managed to do fine until Act 3.
I play on PC so have no issues with bugs and have no complaints about the worldbuilding and gameplay. Glad it worked for you but we seem to play the game for very different reasons. I care about V's story, gameplay is secondary.
V is a vessel that allows me to be in NC whenever I want. I cared for V and all the protagonists and the whole plot, but i'm not coming back to NC for them anymore, because there's so much more about NC, so many doors to be opened and people to meet, one day maybe.
It was fun, I went to the Afterlife and someone shouted behind me "yo V" and immediately V answered "not now im busy", and I thought to myself "wtf V, lets socialize a bit uh?" I made V turn around and couldn't see anyone looking at me... I thought it was a cool thing.
 
V is a vessel that allows me to be in NC whenever I want. I cared for V and all the protagonists and the whole plot, but i'm not coming back to NC for them anymore, because there's so much more about NC, so many doors to be opened and people to meet, one day maybe.
It was fun, I went to the Afterlife and someone shouted behind me "yo V" and immediately V answered "not now im busy", and I thought to myself "wtf V, lets socialize a bit uh?" I made V turn around and couldn't see anyone looking at me... I thought it was a cool thing.
Guess that's the main difference. I care for my V and her story as her own character, if I wanted to play as myself I'd be going out and doing things myself :shrug:
 
Guess that's the main difference. I care for my V and her story as her own character, if I wanted to play as myself I'd be going out and doing things myself :shrug:
1st, where i'm at, I can be fined if I go out.
2nd I don't want to go out, I want to go in to NC :D

Peace? as if we were at the Afterlife.
 
Just as a reminder that V lives in the Nomad and Legend ending as well as becomes an immortal digital being in both the Arasaka as well as Temperance endings.

FYI - I was HOPING this thread would be about the dangers of unfettered capitalism, police brutality, corruption, and the effects of poverty on mindsets or even gun control.

Anyone else hoping the thread would discuss those issues than the goddamned ending being insufficiently happy to a misreading of it?

Well the game certainly is showing unfettered capitalism and corruption.

Police brutality? Well i don't know... It's a lot more about corruption and the overal burtality of the world? So i wouldn't stay that's a clear theme here?

The effects of poverty on the mind, well... i don't see that effect truly. I rather see an actual problem put forward with the people at the bottom not able to actually get through life with normal jobs without more or less becoming indentured servants. As capital has made labour demand drop (similar to the early industrialization) and therefore people no longer able to find enough paying jobs, needing to loan from companies to get "upgrades", while they're quite likely not ever able to pay off such loans. But that might be reading too much into the children dialogues about food and the talk show thing with the guy getting two new arms...
 
Top Bottom