difference between CDPR and RockStar..

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I hated Rockstar after GTA 4 port on PC. I hated them so much that I even refused to watch or read anything about GTA 5 when it came to PC. But I later forgave them with Red Redemption 2, now a masterpiece on PC after it received some good patches.

Hopefully one day you will forgive CDPR.

It's funny because while I enjoy the single player games Rockstar makes, it's their online models that really suck. RDR2 is indeed a masterpiece in story telling. Their online though? Terrible. Their communication for it? Nonexistent. And even though people complain and try to make their voices heard to try and get Rockstar to do something about the bugs, lack of content, cheaters and griefers, they're just met with silence and an online experience that is uninspiring, especially in comparison to GTAO.

But yeah, despite that situation, Rockstar's reputation is in tact, and you can bet whatever project they work on next will be met with the same enthusiasm from the majority of gamers.
 
Rockstar put about 6000 work-years into GTA V and more into RDR2. 7-8000 about.

CDPR put maybe 2500 in. Team starting at about 100 and hitting about 700 at peak, across 8 years, the bulk of which was since 2016.

Feel free to do the math.

Rockstar direct-to-game budget is representative of Western costs, Cpunk is Eastern Europe costs-per-dev-hour. Advertising is global for both. This is basic business knowledge.

No one has seen the actual 2077 costs. CDPR has not revealed them. "The budget for the game is estimated at 1.2 billion zloty ($328 million), according to analysts at Polish bank BOS, which would make Cyberpunk 2077 one of the most expensive video games ever made. "

It's a guess. That doesn't make it anything like fact.

Rockstar made the game(s) for consoles first, then PC. Is that what you all would like? Built for base consoles and looking like it, then ported to next-gen and PC later? Years later, looking much much better but still years later?

Because for sure CDPR could do that. Consoles first, PC later after a lot of building.

Where is RDR 1 on PC by the way? Oh yes. Nowhere.

Perhaps CDPR should adopt Rockstar's "Tell them nothing, and release on consoles first" policy. I'm sure that'd go over real well here.
 
Where is RDR 1 on PC by the way? Oh yes. Nowhere.

Perhaps CDPR should adopt Rockstar's "Tell them nothing, and release on consoles first" policy. I'm sure that'd go over real well here.

Seriously, the state of online in RDR2 it is atrocious compared to GTAO, and I was disgusted with the state of GTAO.

Honestly, CDPR and even Bioware can learn from Rockstar's tell them nothing policy. Clearly their fans love this abusive relationship since they keep coming back for more and the majority of gamers have nothing but praise for them.
 
One will give you a base game/story then forget about it and ply everything from then on out into a MP that breeds nothing but toxicity and a need to spend, spend, spend vrs One where you'll get a base game and, probably, multiple dlc expanding on characters, story and new areas to explore??
 
Rockstar put about 6000 work-years into GTA V and more into RDR2. 7-8000 about.

CDPR put maybe 2500 in. Team starting at about 100 and hitting about 700 at peak, across 8 years, the bulk of which was since 2016.

Feel free to do the math.

Rockstar direct-to-game budget is representative of Western costs, Cpunk is Eastern Europe costs-per-dev-hour. Advertising is global for both. This is basic business knowledge.

No one has seen the actual 2077 costs. CDPR has not revealed them. "The budget for the game is estimated at 1.2 billion zloty ($328 million), according to analysts at Polish bank BOS, which would make Cyberpunk 2077 one of the most expensive video games ever made. "

It's a guess. That doesn't make it anything like fact.

Rockstar made the game(s) for consoles first, then PC. Is that what you all would like? Built for base consoles and looking like it, then ported to next-gen and PC later? Years later, looking much much better but still years later?

Because for sure CDPR could do that. Consoles first, PC later after a lot of building.

Where is RDR 1 on PC by the way? Oh yes. Nowhere.

Perhaps CDPR should adopt Rockstar's "Tell them nothing, and release on consoles first" policy. I'm sure that'd go over real well here.
They are more talented on PC. They started working there, and later converting on consoled, dedicating less time than they should have by their own ammission.

They should develop first on PC, the port later on console, 1 year max, like they did with Witcher 2.

Btw, how do you know the work years?
 
One will give you a base game/story then forget about it and ply everything from then on out into a MP that breeds nothing but toxicity and a need to spend, spend, spend vrs One where you'll get a base game and, probably, multiple dlc expanding on characters, story and new areas to explore??

This is why I don't like the straight up comparisons.

Rockstar do amazing open world sandboxes, they are incredible...but I want a narrative that I can navigate my own way through. I want choice to how I interact and approach missions and characters. I want one playthrough where a character is my characters best bud, and another where they might not even engage.

NOW - if you were to take CD Projekt characters and narratives, drop them into Rockstars open world - and then sprinkle a healthy dash of BioWare squaddie interaction...well....you'd probably never see me again because I'd die alone on my computer with the biggest grin on my face...but it would be spectacular.
 
This is why I don't like the straight up comparisons.

Rockstar do amazing open world sandboxes, they are incredible...but I want a narrative that I can navigate my own way through. I want choice to how I interact and approach missions and characters. I want one playthrough where a character is my characters best bud, and another where they might not even engage.

NOW - if you were to take CD Projekt characters and narratives, drop them into Rockstars open world - and then sprinkle a healthy dash of BioWare squaddie interaction...well....you'd probably never see me again because I'd die alone on my computer with the biggest grin on my face...but it would be spectacular.

I feel the same way about these points.

Rockstar's single player games are amazing. RDR2 had an amazing story, but yeah, you realize that while it looks incredible, Rockstar wants to control every aspect of that game, to the point that I feel they're really extravagant Telltele games. They control how you are allowed to approach to missions, which is so weird for an open world sandbox game. They also control your ability to control yourself. If you try to react to getting knocked down? Can't do anything about it until the ragdoll animation has run its course. Trying to control exactly where your horse runs? The horse is going to continue to run in the exact opposite way and run into a tree. Got off your horse too fast? Lol, you tripped, land face down in the dirt.
 
Problem is they have planned story expansions, so if Cyberpunk is PC exclusive they have to work on port to Xbox or PS and at the same time work on DLC. If you look on Rockstar, they don't care about singleplayer after launch. Only multiplayer milking is their tactic (and no, I'm not saying their games are bad in singleplayer). This isn't problem, problems are unreal deadlines set by management.

Money is one way to look at it.. The other thing is that the game wasnt at all like they said its gonna be SOOO if they released it only on PC and people on consoles saw it they were gonna be like NOOO we didnt ordered THAT... so even though it was worse on consoles the PC version was only less buggy and textures loaded faster... the game is still beta access or hell its not even that.

Ehm, if game was released only for PC, it would be much more polished with more content.
 
Cyberpunk should not have released for current, which is now last gen, game consoles. Although the deal with Microsoft would have made that difficult for sure. The issues were not nearly as bad for next gen.
The issues are there even if the game was in perfect technical state. Story telling, world interaction, crafting system, police behaviour, criminals behaviour, menu design, driving/handling, gangs intro and erradication, district progression, fixers introduction and completion, and so on...
 
The issues are there even if the game was in perfect technical state. Story telling, world interaction, crafting system, police behaviour, criminals behaviour, menu design, driving/handling, gangs intro and erradication, district progression, fixers introduction and completion, and so on...
Coding a AI-Behavior or driving is technical, imho. Nobody said the cars looks awful.
 
whatever.... Rockstar doesn't make games for PC they make it for consoles. The PC release was just an easy way to earn more revenue. And they pretty much sux at it. Their PC ports are pretty bad. And since GTAV, Rockstar doesn't give a damn about making games. All they care about is their GTAV Online, cash cow. Every DLC they had planned for GTAV was revamped into a multiplayer update with the single player getting nothing.

As for Cyberpunk.... not a single moving cop car in the game. or car AI smart enough to go around other cars.

And those complaining about customizing cars, and what not.... GTAIV didn't even have that.
 
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It's hard to believe that in April 2020 CDPR was apparently valued at $27 billion. I'm not sure of its valuation now but stories imply 50% was knocked off value due to bad press over Cyberpunk and other issues, so maybe it's around $10 billion? Rockstar Games as of May 2021 is valued at around $5 billion and yet it managed to find the time and money to make the AI in its games make that in Cyberpunk look like decades-old technology.

I'm going to give CDPR 3 or 4 major patches to get this game up to snuff. If that doesn't happen, two things will change my attitude to CDPR.

1. I'll never pre-order a CDPR title again and will wait on reviews.
2. If they do release a good game I'll purposefully avoid buying the game on GOG and will buy it on other digital platforms.

So CDPR needs to get this game polished. I'm not holding out much hope though. Fixing bugs is obviously important but the damned game has such poor quality game systems on PC as well as consoles such as asset streaming as well as lame car and NPC AI, even after patch 1.22 landed, that I suspect steps 1 and 2 above will come to pass. I still let out a sigh of utter disappointment as I walk around this so-called 'Living, breathing Night City' and see detailed lines of vehicle traffic and crowds of people vanishing as I pass them and turn around 180 degrees, not to mentioned vanishing and appearing directly in front of me, pathing issues causing cars to constantly drive into barriers and NPCs walking through walls.

The implementation of the vehicle and NPC AI seems nothing more than 'minimum viable effort' or 'proof-of-concept' stage on the part of the devs and I'm not convinced these games systems are ever going to be polished to a better standard than AI we all used to see a decade ago.
 
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Difference between CDPR and Rockstar ?
CDPR : Game fully translate in many languages.
Rockstar : Whatever the non english-speakers... Why bother translating the game... You will have simple and stupid subtitles (even if it is not possible to read them during actions or worst, if several people are speaking at the same time).
 
whatever.... Rockstar doesn't make games for PC they make it for consoles. The PC release was just an easy way to earn more revenue. And they pretty much sux at it. Their PC ports are pretty bad. And since GTAV, Rockstar doesn't give a damn about making games. All they care about is their GTAV Online, cash cow. Every DLC they had planned for GTAV was revamped into a multiplayer update with the single player getting nothing.

As for Cyberpunk.... not a single moving cop car in the game. or car AI smart enough to go around other cars.

And those complaining about customizing cars, and what not.... GTAIV didn't even have that.
So true and so sad... and they continue to milk it even further with their PS5 port, whereas if you don't make the time limited switch to PS5 from PS4 in a month you will need to buy the game AGAIN. I feel after the PS5 release they will continue to do so for another couple of years at the mininum, whilst slipping here and their some carefully placed rumors about future GTA6 to keep up hype and sells in GTA5. And on top of shifting everything to the Online version their updates are absolutely mediocre focusing mostly on overpriced vehicles that seem to further try encourage spending even more money on that hot garbage that is GTA5 Online. They don't even have proper servers, but rely on peer-to-peer connection, which translates in 10-15 loading times just to enter a single lobby and to find it filled with toxic players, because that's literally what that game is - a toxic swamp. It literally encourages player toxicity by rewarding players for destroying other players hard earned products. Like... literally the worst ever online game model I had the displeasure of experiencing.. ever!

I honestly can't believe this company have still so much good will after pulling such atrocities with GTA5, but CDPR are condempt by overwhelming negativity over one bad game release. It's honestly mindboggling.
 
Literally all of that has 0 bearing, if it's even true. IF.

Again, this is a problem with management not listening to talent saying this game needs more time. They could have the most talented staff in the world, it doesn't make a difference when you ignore their calls for more time. Do not blame the devs for the state of this game, praise them for their ability to get it as good as they did with the restrictions they were given.
Um, no.
Sure - the execs are wholly responsible for it being released and released in the state it is in. Completely agree.

But the game Devs gave us a mediocre story, poor merging of story and open world, a ticking timebomb plot / but not reals-ies!, and an ending which isnt an ending and none can be called exactly hopeful and very railroaded. The writing and design can and should be criticized for those who think that way.

Just look at current players playing it. Other games far older have way more players

MORE TIME would not resolve the issue of dual protagonist, lack of agency, and how they wrote the endings. The writing generally comes years before release to a large degree
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Difference between CDPR and Rockstar ?
CDPR : Game fully translate in many languages.
Rockstar : Whatever the non english-speakers... Why bother translating the game... You will have simple and stupid subtitles (even if it is not possible to read them during actions or worst, if several people are speaking at the same time).
I'm sure the subtitles hurt their... 140 million sales for the biggest game... oh wait.... maybe, just maybe, artistically makign sure you have one voice acting unit of actors and making sure they knock it out of the park is their biggest importance.
 
I'm sure the subtitles hurt their... 140 million sales for the biggest game... oh wait.... maybe, just maybe, artistically makign sure you have one voice acting unit of actors and making sure they knock it out of the park is their biggest importance.
Honestly, I just see the effort they have made for the non-English speakers, ie none. For a big developer, it's astonishing ... (Play RDR2 with subtitles, horseback riding won't be the same when your eyes are fixed at the bottom of the screen).
I have RDR2 since day one, and all the updates I have seen are for... multiplayer... I don't play multiplayer [...]*.

*[...]Sorry (French slang) :(
Could be better (i hope): Because for me, the RockStar community is filled with toxic players.
 
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Let's not forget that Rockstar failed on PC with GTA 4 and RdR 2 on PC the same way that CDPR failed this time on consoles.

At least for RDR 2 they apologized.


All of this never generated much hate on internet towards Rockstar, guess PC gamers have a patience of steel forged over the years with bugged games at launch (Ultima X, Gothic 3, Skyrim, Witcher 1+2+3 etc...)
RDR2 had nowhere near the problems Cyberpunk 2077 had. Saying Its similar Its simply not true.
The game has multiple broken systems and problems after 6 months. LOL.
 
Seriously, the state of online in RDR2 it is atrocious compared to GTAO, and I was disgusted with the state of GTAO.

Honestly, CDPR and even Bioware can learn from Rockstar's tell them nothing policy. Clearly their fans love this abusive relationship since they keep coming back for more and the majority of gamers have nothing but praise for them.
Surely its better "tell them nothing policy then" follow by release of something good then hype a game beyond measure(interactive RPG(released when ready) in alive and believable open world -"We believe that having a world you can interact with and which reacts to your presence is a key part of a good open-world experience, ... Dynamic environments ultimately serve to fulfill that promise exactly: they help to enhance your immersion, the game world to become more alive and believable") follow by release of a turd(broken loot shooter with zero interactivity and dead world).
RDR2 its in another league when comparing with Cyberpunk 2077.
RDR2 its a masterpiece while Cyberpunk 2077 a mediocre release borderline joke, an palm on the face of gamers.
 
RDR2 its a masterpiece while Cyberpunk 2077 a mediocre release borderline joke, an palm on the face of gamers.
In open world's beauty, in horse's "simulating", no doubt.
But for me, in terms of gameplay, I wouldn't say that at all. I would even say it's just a nightmare. After finishing ACO, i had restart a run on RDR2 and god damn, what a shock (Arthur is just a big truck...) :(
 
In open world's beauty, in horse's "simulating", no doubt.
But for me, in terms of gameplay, I wouldn't say that at all. I would even say it's just a nightmare. After finishing ACO, i had restart a run on RDR2 and god damn, what a shock (Arthur is just a big truck...) :(
RDR2 for what it is its a masterpiece.
Cyberpunk 2077 for what it is is just a mediocre half made, rushed game.
 
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