Does Eredin really that bad? [Spoilers]

[Enfrize]

Does Eredin really that bad? [Spoilers]

Though Eredin is the main antagonist, I didn't hate him. Sure, he is cruel and cynical, but he at least has some understandable motives: he wanted to save his people and himself from annihilation (though apparently Avallac'h knew better way to do this). Radovid was the character I really hated and was so glad when Dijkstra offered to kill him. Being killed by Philippa-it was poetic justice for this madman.

 

[Willowhugger]

Though Eredin is the main antagonist, I didn't hate him. Sure, he is cruel and cynical, but he at least has some understandable motives: he wanted to save his people and himself from annihinaltion (though apparently Avalac'h knew better way to do this). Radovid was the character I really hated and was so glad when Dijkstra offered to kill him. Being killed by Philippa-it was poetic justice for this madman.

Eredin and his people exterminated the humans on their own world and intended to do the same to the ones on this world. I think that should have been brought up.

Then again, they seemed to want everything to be ambiguous.

Which just makes a plot hole as there's no reason Ciri couldn't help them evacuate without needing to kill them all.

 

[Enfrize]

Eredin and his people exterminated the humans on their own world and intended to do the same to the ones on this world. I think that should have been brought up.

Then again, they seemed to want everything to be ambiguous.

Which just makes a plot hole as there's no reason Ciri couldn't help them evacuate without needing to kill them all.

I think they just not provided enough screen time for him and Wild Hunt (which is strange as it is the protagonists), that's why his story is so incomplete.

Also, why Eredin said that the elf tricked both him and Geralt? Remember at the last fight Eredin said that he has something to say. Once you about to kill him he say he got tricked by the elf and that Eredin tricked him.
Is that mean that the elf told Eredin that the only way to stop the white frost was to invade the other world ?

I dont get it . How he was tricked?

 

[OutgoingHermit]

He wants to enact the genocide of the human race.

So yes, he is that bad.

 

[Willowhugger]

He assumes Avallach is going to betray Geralt and Eredin both by stealing away Ciri at the last minute.

In fact, he wasn't.

Really, what I wanted from Eredin was what we got from Radovid instead. I wanted to HATE Eredin. I wanted him to be Handsome Jack, basically, for the kind of character that you want to track down and MURDER WITH YOUR BARE HANDS. I wanted to see him wipe out whole villages, kill Vesemir himself, and snap the neck of a little boy in front of Geralt just to show he could.

I wanted Eredin to make a big bombastic speech where he says, "I AM GOING TO COME TO YOUR WORLD, EXTERMINATE YOUR PEOPLE, FORCE YOUR DAUGHTER TO BEAR MY CHILDREN, AND THEN USE THE CHILDREN TO VISIT OTHER WORLDS TO EXTERMINATE THEIR PEOPLE."

Basically, I wanted Eredin to be Whoreson Junior and Radovid except a x1000 times worse.

That would have made him AWESOME compared to all the other morally ambiguous villains of the franchise.

I also would have had Ciri kill him rather than Geralt.

 

[Enfrize]

He assumes Avallach is going to betray Geralt and Eredin both by stealing away Ciri at the last minute.

In fact, he wasn't.

I remember when Geralt came just before Ciri went to the portal the elf said he sorry he survived the fight. Weird stuff.

Also, i start to think Eredin was right .

Avallach planned this ages ago. remember when you in his lab he did the research over 200 years. He predict what would happen. I think he set the stage to kill the elven king and make all this happen. He probably thought Geralt and Eredin would kill each other. That way eliminate any threat for his plan to stop the white frost. Geralt could easliy stopped Ciri from going to the portal. I think Eredin probably would use her to open a portal to move his people to the witcher world. I think Avallach is a trickster lol.

 

[Willowhugger]

Yeah, it's why Avallach and Emhyr and Phillipa should be the villains for The Witcher 4: More Silver for CD_Projekt Red.

 

[Enfrize]

So yes, he is that bad.

It's a mix I think. He is evil, in that he enjoys killing humans, and is power hungry enough to kill his own king but at the same time does what he does for a cause. The most dangerous type of villain really, the ones that do evil not just for evils sake but for something they believe to be neccessary.

 

[ATiBotka]

Who's Eredin?

 

[Willowhugger]

It's a mix I think. He is evil, in that he enjoys killing humans, and is power hungry enough to kill his own king but at the same time does what he does for a cause. The most dangerous type of villain really, the ones that do evil not just for evils sake but for something they believe to be neccessary.

Yeah, but honestly, I can't imagine anyone really wanted that for Eredin.

I mean, by the time I met the Wild Hunt, I was WELL AND TRULY *SICK* of moral ambiguity.

I wanted the Thalmor but WORSE.

BRING ON THE NAZI ELVES!

 

[Zatch]

I remember when Geralt came just before Ciri went to the portal the elf said he sorry he survived the fight. Weird stuff.

Also, i start to think Eredin was right .

Avallach planned this ages ago. remember when you in his lab he did the research over 200 years. He predict what would happen. I think he set the stage to kill the elven king and make all this happen. He probably thought Geralt and Eredin would kill each other. That way eliminate any threat for his plan to stop the white frost. Geralt could easliy stopped Ciri from going to the portal. I think Eredin probably would use her to open a portal to move his people to the witcher world. I think Avallach is a trickster lol.

Eredin wanted her to concieve a child, likely with himself though it is hard to tell when the white frost would actually appear so it is likely that he wanted her to open a portal as well. I also believe that Avallac'h will be the villain in the next game.
He will also likely be the new king of the Aen Elle when the "competition" is taken care of.

Avallac'h was nicknamed "The Fox" which I believe CDPR paid attention to when shaping his character.

 

[Enfrize]

Yeah, but honestly, I can't imagine anyone really wanted that for Eredin.

I mean, by the time I met the Wild Hunt, I was WELL AND TRULY *SICK* of moral ambiguity.

I wanted the Thalmor but WORSE.

BRING ON THE NAZI ELVES!

Well that's kinda the point of the entire setting. There's pretty much no absolute evil. Even the crazed Radovid isn't all evil (while i HATE him), he just wants what he considers best for his kingdom, and he considers elves, dwarves, and mages to be evil schemers because that's pretty much all he's seen of those people. Hell, even Hitler himself was far from pure evil, he was all about the improvement of life quality for the citizens of his country, and uniting the continent so people would no longer fight amongst the individual countries. He did what he thought was right, the cause he believed in. He just unluckily had that (huge) personal flaw about racial problems.

 

[Willowhugger]

Well that's kinda the point of the entire setting. There's pretty much no absolute evil. Even the crazed Radovid isn't all evil (while i HATE him), he just wants what he considers best for his kingdom, and he considers elves, dwarves, and mages to be evil schemers because that's pretty much all he's seen of those people. Hell, even Hitler himself was far from pure evil, he was all about the improvement of life quality for the citizens of his country, and uniting the continent so people would no longer fight amongst the individual countries. He did what he thought was right, the cause he believed in. He just unluckily had that (huge) personal flaw about racial problems.

By that definition, evil can't exist anywhere.

Evil is a value judgement.

You take a set of principles which someone has their reasons for abiding by.

I.e. "Kill the elves" and you say, "Nuh, uh, not on my Watch."

The villains can and should be able to give a coherent reason for the way they believe like they do and you should be able to say, "And I believe the proper response for your beliefs is to stab you in the face until dead."

See, for example, the Eternal Fire.

"I am following my religion, Sir Witcher, which says that all witches, nonhumans, and Witchers must die."

"I am following my beliefs, Sir Priest, which says that people who believe that gotta be stabbed."

*stabbing ensues*

 

[Lieste]

I remember when Geralt came just before Ciri went to the portal the elf said he sorry he survived the fight. Weird stuff.

Also, i start to think Eredin was right .

Avallach planned this ages ago. remember when you in his lab he did the research over 200 years. He predict what would happen. I think he set the stage to kill the elven king and make all this happen. He probably thought Geralt and Eredin would kill each other. That way eliminate any threat for his plan to stop the white frost. Geralt could easliy stopped Ciri from going to the portal. I think Eredin probably would use her to open a portal to move his people to the witcher world. I think Avallach is a trickster lol.

Not sorry he (Geralt) survived the fight, but that he was present when Ciri entered the tower - because there was some doubt about how Geralt would take it... some anger/grief/questions there really isn't time for/possible threats of violence.

Easier too for Ciri, not to have to explain and justify to Yenn and Geralt about what she is doing, by her own choice.

 

[Enfrize]

By that definition, evil can't exist anywhere.

Evil is a value judgement.

You take a set of principles which someone has their reasons for abiding by.

I.e. "Kill the elves" and you say, "Nuh, uh, not on my Watch."

The villains can and should be able to give a coherent reason for the way they believe like they do and you should be able to say, "And I believe the proper response for your beliefs is to stab you in the face until dead."

See, for example, the Eternal Fire.

"I am following my religion, Sir Witcher, which says that all witches, nonhumans, and Witchers must die."

"I am following my beliefs, Sir Priest, which says that people who believe that gotta be stabbed."

*stabbing ensues*

I never said there wasn't any evil and that the people in mention weren't evil, I said there was no ABSOLUTE evil. And yes by that definition true and pure evil can't really exist anywhere (perhaps with a few exceptions like true sociopaths and such) but yeah that's pretty much spot on. There's plenty of evil, just differing degrees of it. In the case of the villain about to kill the elf, you can kill the villain but that in itself is an act of evil. Yeah you saved the elf but who says that elf won't from now on be jaded against humans and perhaps go on to kill a human just for the hell of it? But that's the entire point of the plot. Every key person and situation has flaws and evils to them. The hard thing is choosing the lesser evil, and as Geralt says it he'd rather not have to choose. It just so happens that he has to quite often.

 

[Willowhugger]

Point taken.

I suppose on my end, I think Eredin would have been more interesting as a Hate Sink. A kind of character we can and could WANT to defeat and feel no emotional qualms in destroying.

I don't approve of those kind of characters in general but I think Geralt would have no emotional hangups about it with Eredin.

Eredin is threatening Ciri, Geralt will go to ANY lengths to destroy him.

 

[Enfrize]

I don't approve of those kind of characters in general but I think Geralt would have no emotional hangups about it with Eredin.

Eredin is threatening Ciri, Geralt will go to ANY lengths to destroy him.

Exactly. If you want some disposable character, think of Junior.

 

[Gerald01]

How do you even define absolute evil? What's one character that is just literally evil for the sake of being evil with no ulterior motive or any justification for his actions?

 

[Songborn]

I would have liked it if Eredin made me feel anything. I was so engaged with the other characters, even some of the minor ones, but Eredin just seemed like a nuissance to me. Which is rather bad when it comes to your Big Bad.
Hell, Emhyr was more threatening to me than Eredin, who just felt like the obstacle du jour.

 

[Gerald01]

I would have liked it if Eredin made me feel anything. I was so engaged with the other characters, even some of the minor ones, but Eredin just seemed like a nuissance to me. Which is rather bad when it comes to your Big Bad.
Hell, Emhyr was more threatening to me than Eredin, who just felt like the obstacle du jour.

The dread of the WH in the game came from the mistery, relentless, unpredictability, praeternaturalness and so on.
The moment you give them a flesh and blood face, no matter how well done, makes it lose that.
The fact Eredin sux as a villain and the Wild Hunt itself as a menace isn't properly built upon are just the cherry on top