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[EPILOGUE] Alvin's identity

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username_2075278

Senior user
#201
Jun 7, 2008
Tarhiel said:
Hi everyone!Yesterday I just managed to finish The Witcher game! Wow! Awesome! But there are questions I would like to ask you, since I didn´t found answers for them in game.First, I have to say I enjoyed the game, but there are things I didn´t like.Why authors never explained, how is actually possible that Geralt returned to Northern Kingdom? From last book (Lady of the Lake) we know, that he was teleported by Ciri to some „land“ maybe Island, with Yennefer. Thats the second question: why nobody in the game is asking about Yennefer? Everybody is asking how it´s possible that Geralt returned from death, when they clearly saw him death, and yet, nobody is asking about Yen? At least Triss could, she knew her well. And she saw her dying with Geralt as well.Generally, I think authors could set the storyline before the novel, because they didn´t achieved such epic climax, as Sapkowsky at the end of the novel, since they many times just reiterates things from book.Little comparison: When Tolkien finished his Lord of the Rings, he wanted to write a sequel to it. It was called „A New Shadow“ or „Return of the Shadow“ or something like that. But when he started to write it he realized it could never be as good as LOTR. It had to be about hobbits, who grew so tired about tranquility and peace in Middle-Earth, that they started worship Sauron again. LOTR was about epic storyline and many other things, the latter about bad human/hobbit character.Also in outro, that witcher Geralt killed, he was just a witcher, no one in particular, yes? And authors let backdoors opened for sequel, yes?Last and, for me, most important question: who the heck is Alvin? I mean, it is Jacob de Aldersberg? Because at the end of game, you found Alvin´s amulet on Aldersberg´s body, but this one was more worn out, like by age. So I suppose, it´s Alvin, and since he has similar abilites like Ciri has in book (he could teleport in space, so maybe in time also), maybe he somehow managed to „aged“ himself. I don´t know for sure, and that puzzles me, becuse in game, you don´t know for sure, what happened.To authors: Please do not take this as plain criticism, I liked the game, and I like that someone tried to do a game about Witcher, which I enjoyed.Personally, I enjoyed most Act IV, because of free movement around :)Nonetheless, these are thing I didn´t understand, or liked (mainly) about storyline.Thanks,Tarhiel
Click to expand...
It's a bit difficult to put a game into the established life of an established hero, because the nature of a games is that there are multiple possible outcomes. If you knew what the ending was before you started it would be a lot less fun to play. So it pretty much has to happen after the action of the books.I suspect the reason Yennefer is not in the game is that people who knew the books would know the Geralt and Yennefer had a thing going, so there wouldn't be the choice of going with Shani. The game provides enough clues for you to guess that de Aldersberg is Alvin, but doesn't actually hard-and-fast prove it - it leaves that open at the end. Make your own mind up.
 
T

tomnut26

Senior user
#202
Jun 12, 2008
i thought that the amulet aldersberg had was a clear sign that he was alvin, especially since alvin could teleport through space/time. also,alvin looked up to geralt for being a witcher and it seemed to me alvin wanted to help people, which alderberg seemed to think he was doing. just my two cents on the topic.
 
D

deviss

Senior user
#203
Jun 12, 2008
Alvin = Grand Master for 100%. ;)
 
M

mcflow

Senior user
#204
Jun 12, 2008
I think that Aldersberg is Alvin, too. But rather in a sense of another incarnation. Alvin admits Geralt for being a witcher and saving/helping people. Aldersberg wants to save the people, too... at least he pretends to do it. Aldersberg could be the "negative" part of the person while Alvin is more positive.At least this would explain why you would not meat Alvin again after he teleported away. Maybe Alvin and Aldersberg are not the same persons. The state of the amulet leaves this question open. I am sure this question will be answered in ann Addon or a second part.I am damned curious.
 
S

spaceritual

Senior user
#205
Jun 13, 2008
If you assume Alvin went back in time then the amulet would age with him so explaining it`s condtion
 
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mcflow

Senior user
#206
Jun 14, 2008
Spaceritual said:
If you assume Alvin went back in time then the amulet would age with him so explaining it`s condtion
Click to expand...
Aaah, you mean:Alvin --> Amulet looks newGrand Master --> Amulet looks more worn out, because of the "passed" time?Would make sense :)
 
I

ideth

Senior user
#207
Jun 15, 2008
Yeah, I think Alvin is Aldersberg, too. But I like to say something about Yennefer.
SimonBrooke said:
I suspect the reason Yennefer is not in the game is that people who knew the books would know the Geralt and Yennefer had a thing going, so there wouldn't be the choice of going with Shani.
Click to expand...
I can understand the reasons why Yen isn't in the game. It's Geralt, whose destiny was more tangled, so she just died and she rests in peace. But I just can't get it, why she isn't even mentioned in the game. Even Dandellion (Jaskier) doesn't say a word about Yen, and he always had something to tell about her. Why all the characters behave like Yennefer had never lived and like they had never known her??
 
G

Gamewidow

Forum veteran
#208
Jun 15, 2008
She is alluded to .. but you're right, never outright mentioned. When Triss talks about Geralt and a sorceress tearing up a town with a djinni, that's Yennefer she's referring to. And also, when (and I don't recall to whom right now) Geralt says that he thinks he loved a sorceress once, deeply -- that's a reference to Yennefer as well.there are probably more, but i've only read the short stories so they may well have escaped me. You just can't fit all the witcher lore into one single game, they had to make choices, some of which some people may not agree with :)
 
I

ideth

Senior user
#209
Jun 15, 2008
gamewidow said:
And also, when (and I don't recall to whom right now) Geralt says that he thinks he loved a sorceress once, deeply -- that's a reference to Yennefer as well.
Click to expand...
It was an entry in the journal. Yes, it's reference to Yen, but Geralt in the game says it about Triss. Well, I understand that they had to make choices, I agree with that, but I don't think that straight reference to Yennefer would change the whole game and story. Anyway the game is just great, the best I game I have ever played, don't think that I make a fuss ;) You know, Yennefer is my second favorite character from the book, right after Dandellion :)
 
D

desoshade

Senior user
#210
Jun 15, 2008
Alvin has the ability to transport himself anywhere, "even through time". He has visions, just as GM. Wore the same medallion. He's always the grand master when he plays kill the elf. It's clear that the grand master was alvin. But that being told, you can't help but wonder why the grand master wanted to fight geralt. Geralt was like a father figure to him. The mystery of the ending lies in the assassin at the end of the game. The assassin that looks like geralt. Maybe geralt traveled through time himself. Maybe when Alvin transported himself back in time, he transported to before the attack on kaer moorn and got with geralt (notice the assassin didn' thave any facial scars). Maybe alvin told geralt about the future, that his killing off the gm and letting the king live would cause the end of the world, so maybe alvin transported geralt forward in time to try to kill the king and prevent more chaos.... maybe all that time travel is what caused geralt to lose his memory or explain why so many people knew geralt but geralt didnt' recognize them. Jeesh. We really do need a sequel/prequel. I'm confused! :eek:
 
T

Tarhiel

Senior user
#211
Jun 26, 2008
Thank you all for responses. :)To Simon Brooke: Yey, I understand what you said about difficulties of great heroes transformed into PC game. But still, it is not explanation why there is not even one straight mentioning about Yennefer. Geralt could have his affairts with other women nonetheless, he behaved like that in books- there are hints, suggestions, that he had affair even Triss (and not only with her)- and in other place in book, when he was talking with Yennefer (in bed :) ) she asked him:Did you make love with other women besides me?Geralt: No.Yennefer: Really?Geralt: Okey I did. But I was always thinking about you.It is just loose translation of what I remember from book, but I think this speak for itself.Well, considering the book, I read only that long 5 book novel, which was fantastic! I´m waiting for reprint of Sword of Destiny, so I can start reading Last Wish. Yes, McFlow, your reply about that amulet thing, that´s exactly my way of thinking :)Thanks to you all for your opinion about Alvin. I also think that Aldersberg and Alvin is the same person.
 
S

st_ghost

Forum veteran
#212
Jun 26, 2008
I disagree and this is why:people in Act II and II (townspeople) mention Jacques de Aldersberg already and his glistening armor. I doubt Alvin can exist in 2 planes at the same time.
 
U

username_2075278

Senior user
#213
Jun 26, 2008
STGhost said:
I disagree and this is why:people in Act II and II (townspeople) mention Jacques de Aldersberg already and his glistening armor. I doubt Alvin can exist in 2 planes at the same time.
Click to expand...
why do you doubt this?
 
S

st_ghost

Forum veteran
#214
Jun 26, 2008
From what the game tells us, Alvin can travel time and space, but it doesn't tell us that he can exist in two instances at a time. Otherwise, why would Alvin disappear eventually instead of being Aldersberg AND at Geralt's side for instance.
 
U

username_2075278

Senior user
#215
Jun 26, 2008
STGhost said:
From what the game tells us, Alvin can travel time and space, but it doesn't tell us that he can exist in two instances at a time. Otherwise, why would Alvin disappear eventually instead of being Aldersberg AND at Geralt's side for instance.
Click to expand...
Because at some point he went back in time. After that point, he no longer exists as a little boy, but only as de Aldersberg. Just as, from the time he looped back to until he was born, there was no Alvin bot only de Aldersberg. But from the time he was born until the time he jumped backward, both were in existance together. There's nothing complicated about that... is there?
 
S

st_ghost

Forum veteran
#216
Jun 26, 2008
I suppose that is entirely possible Simon, though my belief does differ a bit from yours here :)It is difficult to imagine that he exists as two people at the same time as early as Act II. I mean I leave Alvin with Triss/Shani in Act II and step out of the house and hear people talk about Jacques afterall. If Alvin were not present at that time, I certainly could understand and support that idea, but not really when Alvin is physically present and so is Jacques.
 
G

Gamewidow

Forum veteran
#217
Jun 26, 2008
in the cut scene in Act IV where the Order ambushes the elves in the village, before Alvin teleports away, you glimpse Jacques de Aldersberg directing his men. So you even see them, if not in the same shot, at these at the same place / plane at the same time.I don't know if this adds fuel to the debate, but i felt compelled to add it :)
 
S

st_ghost

Forum veteran
#218
Jun 26, 2008
Oh? I never actually noticed that! I shall watch out for it as I am almost in Act IV .... again..(I was just there last week in my previous run)
 
G

Gamewidow

Forum veteran
#219
Jun 26, 2008
I just finished Act IV on an Order run ... it's possible that you only see Jacques then ... not sure
 
U

username_2075709

Senior user
#220
Jun 27, 2008
I think Alvin and the GM are the same entity.I saw a post somewhere saying how Alvin has blue eyes and the GM has green eyes.Well my gfx seem to be fine and I was recently chatting to a blue eyed GM, I also noticed during the conversation that he sometimes kind of bounces and shrugs when he talks and the only other character ingame I've seen do the same is Alvin.
 
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