Eredin says 12 sentences during the whole game and.....

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I doubt it. We know from the leaked storyline plans that there was a lot more Wild Hunt back then.

Also it is not hard to make up at least something with such a setup :p

the "cut content" you mean, yes ?
if so, then i hope to god they restore the most important parts with it, involving the wild hunt. that'd be so good *_*

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If I remember correctly it was only Stebastian Stepien who began working on TW3 but moved onto Cyberpunk writing team early on, and Marcin Blacha who only wrote additional dialogue for TW2 (don't know whether he was working on TW1 though). The others left
i see !
maybe that's why many stated that the first act of the game is solid, while third act is a mess. it could be that Mr. Stepien made a complete draft, but never got to polish it properly, so the new writer changed some stuff about it.
 
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Of course, but there is no denying that going open world would affect storytelling, once you give players freedom to enjoy things at their own pace, it will limit the overall storytelling potential, there is no two ways about it, doesn't mean that I hate open world games, don't take it wrong.

But, as you said, what little scenes the Wild Hunt were in were really damn good, but the only thing CDPR can do is just add more scenes to the King of the Wild Hunt himself in the last act, and have a different goddamn writer to write his lines instead of the one who wrote those damn awful cheesy lines he currently has.

Not the way this game is structured, it won't. Something like Skyrim, then yes but this game has plenty of cut scenes it uses as a mechanic for story telling. Eredin appears in the prologue, twice in Act 1, during a significant part of Act 2 and again in Act 3. All these appearances were opportunities to develop the character, all of them were ignored. I mean really, was "Humans are so impractical" the best line they could come up with? Could there not have been extended dialogue between Geralt and Eredin when he kidnaps/kills Ciri? When Eredin attacks Hendrik's village? When Geralt pursues him through the Elven catacombs? During the Battle of Kaer Morhen? During the final confrontation? Plenty of opportunity was presented and ignored, for what reason I'll never understand.
 
Eredin is not even a villain, he is just an enemy. His actions are not outcome of evilness - he wants to save his people. And Ciri has skills he just needs.

Second - we don't see Eredin so often - there is not so much interaction with him during gameplay and this implies little opportunity to have a conversation.

Third - after having conversations with Ciri, reading books scattered around world you have enough understanding what he is really about. I read Sapkowski's books my first play-through and explanation about his motives were completely sufficient for me.

Fourth - did someone considered Eredin is simply an introvert?

Personally, I am not sure why this thread is so long - you should rather push CDPR to fix wolves that inflict way to much damage...
 
What fans don't understand is that the reason why Eredin and The Wild Hunt in general absolutely suck is that those who wrote him in the last games and had their plans for him as the main antagonist in TW3 left the writing team.
That's why Geralt's and Eredin's deal and Geralt being a rider of the Wild Hunt built-up premises weren't discussed and and obviously resolved.
Really? Damn that sucks if true. CDPR seems to be going through some growing pains recently, a lot of old people leaving, and a lot of new ones coming in. I hope the writing in future games doesn't suffer. HoS shows that there are still great writers at CDPR.

The Wild Hunt really is the biggest wasted potential though. I'm honestly shocked that the nobody at CDPR seemed to think Geralt's time with the Hunt should've played an important role.
 
What fans don't understand is that the reason why Eredin and The Wild Hunt in general absolutely suck is that those who wrote him in the last games and had their plans for him as the main antagonist in TW3 left the writing team.
That's why Geralt's and Eredin's deal and Geralt being a rider of the Wild Hunt built-up premises weren't discussed and and obviously resolved.

It's irrilevant. If they have the capabilities to write Gaunter O'Dimm, they can write a good Eredin as well.
But, yes, something went wrong with The Witcher 3. It's not only Eredin. Even Menge has a huge potential, but it has been wasted in...a couple of minutes.
 
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Eredin is not even a villain, he is just an enemy. His actions are not outcome of evilness - he wants to save his people. And Ciri has skills he just needs.

Second - we don't see Eredin so often - there is not so much interaction with him during gameplay and this implies little opportunity to have a conversation.

Third - after having conversations with Ciri, reading books scattered around world you have enough understanding what he is really about. I read Sapkowski's books my first play-through and explanation about his motives were completely sufficient for me.

Fourth - did someone considered Eredin is simply an introvert?


Personally, I am not sure why this thread is so long - you should rather push CDPR to fix wolves that inflict way to much damage...

An introvert that likes to kidnap people and butcher Humans in his spare time? Yes, very introverted!
 
I must say, reading this thread has really opened a new perspective for me. From a certain perspective, the OP is totally right. If you take the novels out of the context- Eridin and the Wild Hunt in general were really underdeveloped as villains, and don't hold a candle to Jacques de Aldersberg of W1 or Letho of W2. But the thing is, the former villains were entirely original creations. Most of the things in the first games were. Meanwhile, game 3 began using key characters from the books as centrail things in its plot- and since Geralt had regained his memory, the game presented many things as something to be taken for granted, without bothering to explain. Now while this was entirely ok for us book readers- seeing how we knew characters like Ciri, Yennefer and Eridin from the books, well before going into the first game, I imagine for a game player, it was downright confusing. Who is this Geralt's true love supposed to be? Wasn't my Geralt in love with Triss? Wait, what, Geralt has a daughter? And the Wild Hunt specters are actually elves from another world...? What the hell is this?

So yeah, if you look at it from that perspective, Eridin had to seem like a completely underdeveloped villain to someone who resigned themselves to games only. But, say, for me, it made no difference. Going into the game, I knew precisely who Eridin was and what his goals were. And from that perspective his portrayal is acceptable. He doesn't waste time monologuing with Geralt. His objective is Ciri and he very well knows Geralt wouldn't give her up for the life of him- so why even bother talking to your sworn enemy? To me Eridin's portrayal in TW3 was just a follow up from the books- and made perfect sense, so I didn't find it unsatisfying.

With regards to him being a pushover in a fight- well, that once again makes perfect sense. Remember, the Wild Hunt are not superhumans of some kind. They're elves from another world. That's that. And you may very well be underestimating just how downright OP the characters WE'RE in control are. Ciri's power is self explanatory and Geralt is hinted in the books to be perhaps the best swordsman currently alive. Eridin may be a formidable swordsman himself, but he lacks the superhuman reaction and agility. He put up as much fight as he's supposed to. Besides, Eridin has another fatal flaw- he's vain and arrogant. Exploiting that weakness allowed even Ciri to defeat him in a duel in the novels- and she's nowhere near on Geralt's level as a swordsman. Actually, between the three of them, Imlerith and Caranthir are both more intimidating presences than Eridin in combat. Imlerith is this scary nigh indestructible brute who wields weapons the size that a regular man could scarcely lift and has so much metal on him, I'd be hard pressed to imagine Geralt dealing any kind of damage to him with a sword. And Caranthir is a mage, whose also extremely skilled in melee combat with a staff- a combination that, if you recall, gave Geralt no shortage of trouble in the novels in the form of Vilgefortz. So yeah. After all, who says the leader of any kind of unit must also be its greater fighter as well? Doesn't apply to most militaries, shouldn't necessarily apply to the Aen Elle either.

So again, I personally found the game's portrayal of the Wild Hunt to be entirely agreeable. But I understand how it might be confusing or disappointing to a non-book reader. While the first two games were perfectly eligible as standalone and didn't require knowledge of the novels to play and enjoy, I imagine Witcher 3 could be downright confusing without having read up on the source material beforehand. The only thing I can agree to here is that Geralt's time with the Wild Hunt should have been more touched upon. Seeing how this is a new fact even to novel readers- and a surprising one at that- I too find myself wondering for more details on that particular bit of Geralt's history. But other than that? I'm good.
 
-screams in vader's voice-
"...NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooooo..."

it may have caused some pacing issues as he said, sure, but DAMN it would've made the wild hunt more interresting.


Forget pacing issues, that's no excuse. If the pacing is off you adjust the pacing to allow for the antagonist to be fleshed out. No self respecting writer would ever marginalise the story's villain. Would Star Wars be a success if not for Vader? Would Star Trek II be considered the best Star Trek film if not for Khan? Ghostbusters' Marshmallow man is scarier than Eredin! The writer/s of this game should be ashamed of themselves for such a poor effort.
 
Forget pacing issues, that's no excuse. If the pacing is off you adjust the pacing to allow for the antagonist to be fleshed out. No self respecting writer would ever marginalise the story's villain. Would Star Wars be a success if not for Vader? Would Star Trek II be considered the best Star Trek film if not for Khan? Ghostbusters' Marshmallow man is scarier than Eredin! The writer/s of this game should be ashamed of themselves for such a poor effort.
you're right indeed. it's the "villain" that makes the story, like the kingpin in the daredevil series or Dr. Octopus in Spider-man 2.
ironically,...
... the same goes for Eredin when he appeared in the witcher 1
i was like "HOLY S***! I CAN'T WAIT TO SEE HIM AGAIN !", and had a massive nerdgasm building up over time with TW2 and the trailers,... and then TW3 happened :(
 
Forget pacing issues, that's no excuse. If the pacing is off you adjust the pacing to allow for the antagonist to be fleshed out. No self respecting writer would ever marginalise the story's villain. Would Star Wars be a success if not for Vader? Would Star Trek II be considered the best Star Trek film if not for Khan? Ghostbusters' Marshmallow man is scarier than Eredin! The writer/s of this game should be ashamed of themselves for such a poor effort.

I wouldn't be so harsh. Quest design is really difficult, and if you change something in the middle of the production, things can easily go wrong, expecially in such huge game.
It's not even a matter of writing. I think that quest is the key of this entire problem, because apparently it was an Eredin-centric event, fully dedicated to him and to The Wild Hunt. The game suffer exactly because of the lack of something like that.
 
I wouldn't be so harsh. Quest design is really difficult, and if you change something in the middle of the production, things can easily go wrong, expecially in such huge game.
It's not even a matter of writing. I think that quest is the key of this entire problem, because apparently it was an Eredin-centric event, fully dedicated to him and to The Wild Hunt. The game suffer exactly because of the lack of something like that.

Mate, don't make excuses. It's not like Eredin started strong and fell away because of something they changed, he sucks as a villain from start to finish. Even from that video, the original characterization of him wouldn't have come until late in Act 3 anyway which is far too late. It is, quite simply, like certain other characters in the game, Eredin was an after thought.
 
Ehmm.....Right..So why would that Cut Quest not fit exactly ? Sry, that's nonsense....
Btw, that fits on a few cut content scenes...not really understandable...weird decisions...they should have looked into the story before they cut this or that...



But hey we have the "Found the Pan" Quest..... :victory:........................:eredinfacepalm:
 
To be fair, as players, rather than developers, we really don't know the precise reasons why this quest involving the Hunt and Eredin was cut. While it may seem like it would have been a very important one, and possibly quite useful to the story, unfortunately, the limiting, technical complexities of the process to implement it may have caused its removal. The above presentation offers a very brief glimpse of this intricate process of quest-designing, and, even here, the presenter has gone to lengths to explain that process as simply as possible to his audience.

As that audience, we see only the finished product of the game. I may be wrong, but believe most of us don't know the specific capabilities and limits of the game's engine, the mechanics, or the techniques whereby a quest is woven into the game. Because we like their work, it's quite easy to fall into the false assumption that CD Projekt RED can do anything they like; however, this mayn't always be the case. Sometimes, like everyone else, they have to yield to the pressures of time, budget, and the realistic limits of the medium. Whichever they may have been, the Team had their reasons for cutting content. Some of it was doubtless very painful for them to let go. Since they seem very artistic, inventive and passionate gamers themselves, if they could have realistically implemented their creations, they likely would have done so. These may have been difficult and unpleasant choices they had to make, wherein much hard work had to be scrapped, or used for something else. I think it rather valuable to realise that we aren't the only ones who may be disappointed a bit by the loss. Perhaps they were as well.

(A note to anyone else who thinks to use my post as an excuse to further criticise the plot, characterisations, or the developers: please don't. It's really not worth it. I've already long agreed the game is lacking in narrative consistency/)
 
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I understand your points.
But, to be honest...There are a few Quests in the Game that makes no sense, not relevant for the Story, are boring, not funny ( but supposed to be so..) or are really not good, and they thought they would fit better in the Game than for example Wild Hunt Content ?

I would change a bunch of this Quests gladly for more Wild Hunt Stuff...
In my eyes simply weird decisions to cut this content....i mean this game should be about The Wild Hunt..and what we have ? Nearly nothing and even that was cropped.
 
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Maybe the content was cut before it was done and they did not end up finishing it after the plans changed, one can only guess. The game and its multi-platform nature was obviously too much to handle for the studio. Messing up the main villain - or rather not even featuring him - in a story-driven RPG is a pretty big mistake. Seeing the quality of Heart of Stone's writing, it is obvious that CDPR was not able to focus on developing the main game's storyline enough because of being bogged down in filling the open world and probably sorting out myriads of technical issues.

This is probably the first interview with a CDPR developer where the issue is mentioned explicitly: http://stevivor.com/2015/11/cd-proj...hunt-and-lessons-learned-for-hearts-of-stone/
 
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