FPP only cutscenes might be a deal-breaker for me

[kirell]

It's not about perspective anymore. That just made me look harder at all the stuff I'd been ignoring since my first day pre-order. I just am not confident it will be an actual RPG anymore and not just an FPS with some RPG elements.

Heh, the "real" RPG debate is so old... Basically every generation thinks their favorite childhood RPG is the definition of true RPG, nothing existed before them, and everything afterwards was bad unless it followed their favorite formula...

Choice & Consequence = real RPG? Nope, that was a rather recent innovation. Most old RPG quests before BG had one solution.
Third person over the shoulder = real RPG? Thats also quite new, most older RPG players would associate this with action adventures like Tomb Raider (original, not reboot)
Real time with pause = real RPG ? Nah, only true turn based games are RPGs, read the players handbook noob...
Real time without pause = thats no RPG at all !!! What has the world come to...
etc. etc.

I even vaguely remember a newsnet debate that only roguelikes with infinite dungeon creation are a real RPGs, and
those text and choices games are really just glorified text adventures "with RPG elements"

Damn, now i feel old ;-)

 

[Wenceslaus]

So you see yourself from behind irl? Interesting.

Well this one is a bit unfair.
You do have peripherical vision irl.
Together with other senses you do have better awareness than like trough a monitor.

 

[Sardukhar]

Well this one is a bit unfair.
You do have peripherical vision irl.
Together with other senses you do have better awareness than like trough a monitor.

True. Although nothing like Third person of course (look around corners!) but yeah, peripheral vision. It's why driving is still TPP.

I'm hoping the head-tracking devices will work for driving in first person. I'm excited to RP in something close to actual headspace, including cutscenes. Should be interesting!

 

[SigilFey]

Alright, here's what I think about FPP only custscenes after letting this stew in my brain for a few days:

1.) It will make V more of the player's vision than the narrative's. Never seeing V in action will project less and let the player envision more according to their own agency for the character. It helps to let the player develop V's attitude in their minds, and I think someone said that attitude is everything.

2.) More sense of immediacy and continuity during gameplay. Like the original Half-Life games, you'll have a sense of walking "step-for-step" along the journey. While I'm sure there will be transitions at times, it will feel more like living through contiguous experiences and less like an interactive film.

3.) Potentially the ability to dynamically influence scenes. I'm speculating here, but I get the impression there might be times in the game where the player may be able to "interrupt" the action and change the outcome (pull a gun, click on a character to cut them off, see someone stalking up behind them, etc.) If so, it would feel a lot better during gameplay if everything were viewed from one, constant perspective.

4.) It helps the player stay focused on the narrative...not get distracted by how cool the new jacket they just bought looks. I admit freely, I often found myself studying the detail in Geralt's armor or beard growth during conversations in TW3, rather than paying attention to the dialogue.

5.) All of the above combined will definitely keep the gameplay flowing a little more smoothly. It may not be everyone's preference, but I imagine the sense of smoothness will be there. (I'll guess the most annoying part will be finding good stopping places.)


_______________


@Sardukhar ... How is it that you always manage to ninja something just ahead of me when I'm writing a post like this?

 

[gogmeister777]

Heh, the "real" RPG debate is so old... Basically every generation thinks their favorite childhood RPG is the definition of true RPG, nothing existed before them, and everything afterwards was bad unless it followed their favorite formula...

Yeah, very good point imo. The examples you mentioned are also spot on.

Iirc, the first two video game rpgs I played were the AD&D based Pools of Radiance and The Bard's Tale. The former was isometric, the latter was FPP, both were turn based. You can forget open-worlds, TPP or non-linear, branching storylines with meaningful choice and consequence, heh. If all those things are necessary, then rpgs apparently never existed back in the day!

I feel your age related pain

 

[Guest 4322765]

I am not against only first person camera for cinematics, even if it may be weird for sex scenes, but seeing my character only in mirrors or when driving is clearly not enough, and the inventory is not satisfying because it's an interface, the character is not in the game world.
I think that a vanity camera is mandatory, not for playing in 3rd person, but just to allow the players to admire their character.

This announcement, and then today announcement of multiplayer made me delete the game from my wishlist, I'll keep an eye for release, but for now I'm doubtful.

 

[gogmeister777]

Alright, here's what I think about FPP only custscenes after letting this stew in my brain for a few days:

1.) It will make V more of the player's vision than the narrative's. Never seeing V in action will project less and let the player envision more according to their own agency for the character. It helps to let the player develop V's attitude in their minds, and I think someone said that attitude is everything.

2.) More sense of immediacy and continuity during gameplay. Like the original Half-Life games, you'll have a sense of walking "step-for-step" along the journey. While I'm sure there will be transitions at times, it will feel more like living through contiguous experiences and less like an interactive film.

3.) Potentially the ability to dynamically influence scenes. I'm speculating here, but I get the impression there might be times in the game where the player may be able to "interrupt" the action and change the outcome (pull a gun, click on a character to cut them off, see someone stalking up behind them, etc.) If so, it would feel a lot better during gameplay if everything were viewed from one, constant perspective.

4.) It helps the player stay focused on the narrative...not get distracted by how cool the new jacket they just bought looks. I admit freely, I often found myself studying the detail in Geralt's armor or beard growth during conversations in TW3, rather than paying attention to the dialogue.

5.) All of the above combined will definitely keep the gameplay flowing a little more smoothly. It may not be everyone's preference, but I imagine the sense of smoothness will be there. (I'll guess the most annoying part will be finding good stopping places.)

1: Completely agree...because of the 'I' word

2: Agree. I'm not fond of control being taken away from the player. It's not a deal breaker when games do this (and most do I think) but I do enjoy the change when I'm in control the vast majority of the time and, as you say, taking it step by step myself. It'll be refreshing, I think.

3: I think this is a crucial point. Interacting in cutscenes, for example the bit where V tears his hand away from the Voodoo Boy, shows great promise imho. Assuming they find ways and situations to have it occur often and entertainingly then it makes perfect sense to stay in FPP.

I'm guessing they'll also be a lot of scenes like the Doc's cybernetic shop or ones similar to the intro of DX: Human Revolution where you walk through the R&D building.

4: I see where you're coming from with this. I also found myself sometimes studying Geralt or backgrounds more than concentrating on dialogue but that could just be to a lack of interest in that particular dialogue/cutscene. I guess it's a bit like real life when, despite ones best efforts, you realise you've lost focus on what someone was saying and your mind has wandered off. You started studying their clothes, the surroundings or people walking about behind them. In both cases then, better conversation might be the key, heh! Or perhaps just being a better listener

5: On summary of the above, again I agree completely.

 

[Keive]

Doesn't matter if you like FPP or TPP more and all, it's a FPP game with small instances of TPP.
I think the game is a RPG regardless, to an extent maybe, I don't really believe in just "True RPG", I don't even know what that's suppose to mean.
There are a bunch of games that are different in so many ways from one another but can still be called a RPG and truly are RPGs just not maybe your ideal RPG.

The game being mostly FPP doesn't even bother me anymore, it really looks fun, and if they sell it as an RPG then it's an RPG and one I look forward to. Though I do get a bit sick from FPP at times (but head bobbing can be turned off from what I heard so that's great!)

 

[evilhippo]

So you see yourself from behind irl? Interesting.

So, do you see the world like you are wearing horse-blinkers in real life? Interesting.

I have peripheral vision & move my head & eyes around to gain situational awareness in real life. It is very hard to simulate that in a game projected on a flat screen, but TPP does a better job of showing how a character relates to cover & their immediate surrounding than FPP.

Obviously neither are perfect, but claims FPP is 'more immersive' seem odd as that is only how blinkered horses actually see the world

 

[JMB96815]

Explain why if you wannna raise objection.

The reason why I don't think Baldur's gate is true rpg is on post #305, #311

There's no need, I read it all. You just have a different definition than I would, and there's no point wasting time on it as you or I will not change our minds. I am comfortable that my definition of why BG is a great RPG is a good interpretation for many people, but that not 100% will agree either.

Explain why if you wannna raise objection.

 

[Night_City_Native]

FPP isn't a deal-breaker for me overall, and I'm cool with what CDPR is aiming for with the choice for FPP, but given that this game has a character creator and a means to customize your character's appearance during the game, it should have a decent amount of opportunities to view your character in TPP other than hopping on a motorcycle or checking inventory.

The inventory screen shouldn't even count really, because it is an interface screen and not in the game world.

 

[Rawls]

Since first time me and my friend heard the news that CP2077 is FPP, we talk how they probably going to make Multiplayer for it, year later here we are and Multiplayer is coming.

They've been saying for over a year that they were considering MP. Not like it's a surprise. They said it at E3 2018.

 

[Nikola_Nesic]

They've been saying for over a year that they were considering MP. Not like it's a surprise. They said it at E3 2018.

Even before E3 2018 there was rumors that CP2077 is FPP.

 

[Sir_Parsifal]

I really hope the multiplayer will be in the same vein as GTA Online!

 

[Rawls]

Even before E3 2018 there was rumors that CP2077 is FPP.

Approximately a month before yes. So?

 

[Spockprime]

I hate cutscenes.

I don't care whether they're in first or third person, as long as I can skip them. If I can't skip them, then I'm going to hate them regardless. I cringe at the thought of replaying almost any Bioware game of recent years because of the amount of time wasted just sitting and watching a video play out, that may or may not be at all consistent with the way I've played the character otherwise.

 

[ChiliDragon]

I'll add my name to the people disappointed by this decision, for basically the same reasons given by everybody else.

If I never (or hardly ever) see my character then wtf is the point of spending a bunch of time designing and customizing my character?

I wonder if the resources going towards the multiplayer mode could be better spend, I dunno, allowing us to see our character once in a while in the game?

Hmm. Just something for those of you who wonder whether or not investing in a MP mode impacts the SP experience. Food for thought given the timing of the two announcements back to back.

 

[Keive]

I'll add my name to the people disappointed by this decision, for basically the same reasons given by everybody else.

If I never (or hardly ever) see my character then wtf is the point of spending a bunch of time designing and customizing my character?

I wonder if the resources going towards the multiplayer mode could be better spend, I dunno, allowing us to see our character once in a while in the game?

Hmm. Just something for those of you who wonder whether or not investing in a MP mode impacts the SP experience. Food for thought given the timing of the two announcements back to back.

I actually thought the game wouldn't get a multiplayer option, just seemed everyone was so anti-multiplayer and that this game would be leading something for single player only games, not like it's good or bad just depends on the person.
However, though we get TPP cutscenes now (some) our character can also be viewed in multiplayer, which to me is a win for character customization having some use. *Something I thought about before but thought there wouldn't be multiplayer so it wouldn't matter

 

[ChiliDragon]

I actually thought the game wouldn't get a multiplayer option, just seemed everyone was so anti-multiplayer and that this game would be leading something for single player only games, not like it's good or bad just depends on the person.
However, though we get TPP cutscenes now (some) our character can also be viewed in multiplayer, which to me is a win for character customization having some use. *Something I thought about before but thought there wouldn't be multiplayer so it wouldn't matter

Agreed. It depends on the person.

I got nothing against people who are happy about certain design choices. If you like the addition of a MP element, then more power to you! I'm happy you're getting something that you want and are excited about.

But the opposite is also true. I'm virulently anti-multiplayer in what I feel should be completely a SP experience and it IS worth pointing out that some things do appear to be being cut from the SP and wonder whether or not that would still be the case if the MP wasn't there.

For MP fans, I'm wondering if your happiness with the game's direction is coming at my expense sort of thing. I can say with absolute certainty that I'll never play this game's MP mode so the tradeoff of being able to see my character in that mode is........not much of a tradeoff from my perspective.

 

[Bloodartist]

I honestly think that this change in their official twitter says everything anyone needs to know. It's an action/shooting game rather than an RPG. They will cut all the superfluous elements that detract from that before launch, probably. Third-person takes you out of the shooting mindset; why would they keep it?

I honestly don't believe the classification changes anything in the game itself. "Action adventure" is simply a way to sell the game better to the masses, who might otherwise shy away from buying a "role-playing game".