I haven't actually tried the Witcher 2 with linux. I did try GW2 which did not preform well at all so I just kept it on Windows along with The Witcher 2. Dark Souls has nasty GWFL and Steam along with the two Batman games so I figured Windows wasn't going anywhere I'll just leave it and cry. But I did see where GW2 did not preform great in wine for you either so maybe there is still hope.
@Glaroug: Did you try Witcher 2 in Wine with CSMT patches? It improves performance a lot. I use the build from PlayOnLinux (1.7.10-CSMT). If you have a good enough CPU, it helps a lot (on weaker CPUs the improvement is negligible).
I didn't attempt playing GW2 in Wine lately, may be things have improved since the last time I tried, thanks for reminding me - I should test it again. I have no Windows installed for quite a while already, so the problem of Windows not going anywhere doesn't bother me anymore ;D
I didn't attempt playing GW2 in Wine lately, may be things have improved since the last time I tried, thanks for reminding me - I should test it again. I have no Windows installed for quite a while already, so the problem of Windows not going anywhere doesn't bother me anymore ;D
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@.Volsung.: Looks like there is no need for manual hacks anymore, since new Debian installer just came out and it supposedly should handle UEFI GRUB and setting of GPT partitions properly. See https://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/
But I didn't really test it yet.
But I didn't really test it yet.
@Glaroug and anyone using Wine can find this useful to play Witcher 2 and other high end and demanding games. Wine project a while ago introduced a feature called CSMT (command stream multithreading). For details, see http://www.winehq.org/pipermail/wine-devel/2013-September/101106.html. However it's still in development and didn't make it into official Wine release. It does work great in many cases though, and there are builds of Wine with these patches applied. PlayOnLinux provides such builds for example (it's a great Wine manager in general).
For example, install Witcher 2 in PlayOnLinux manually in its own Wine prefix and set it to use the build of Wine with CSMT. Once you installed it, you need to enable that feature in Wine registry for that Wine prefix. Run regedit and set this key:
It works very well with high end CPUs.
For example, install Witcher 2 in PlayOnLinux manually in its own Wine prefix and set it to use the build of Wine with CSMT. Once you installed it, you need to enable that feature in Wine registry for that Wine prefix. Run regedit and set this key:
Code:
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Wine\Direct3D\CSMT=enabled
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Awesome! I'm glad I could avoid setting up UEFI partitions manually! This makes me look forward to upgrading my computer.
Very cool thanks 
It would definatly be awesome if I were able to move some games over from windows to linux :yes
It would definatly be awesome if I were able to move some games over from windows to linux :yes
The PC I am building is based around a windows build as that is my comfort zone but I might have a secondary Linux partition to try it out if it's possible.
Admittedly I have no idea where to even start with Linux though. I hear there are many different Linux operating systems to consider and some things said in this thread tell me I shouldn't even think that far ahead if at all. So I guess this is more me dipping my toe into the pool to see what it's about, and if it is possible for me to do so rather than a full on "I'm going to install Linux and nothing will stop me."
Admittedly I have no idea where to even start with Linux though. I hear there are many different Linux operating systems to consider and some things said in this thread tell me I shouldn't even think that far ahead if at all. So I guess this is more me dipping my toe into the pool to see what it's about, and if it is possible for me to do so rather than a full on "I'm going to install Linux and nothing will stop me."
@vincentdante
Try Debian. It's a universal operating system that right now supports the Linux kernel officially, experimentally the FreeBSD kernel and in the future most likely the Hurd kernel (maybe it already does, experimentally). An operating system kernel is a core element that acts as a bridge between the hardware and low level OS functions, such as assigning CPU time, memory allocation, input/output, etc. Debian was one of the first Linux based systems and is widely supported. SteamOS is, in fact, based on Debian (Stable).
I'd recommend Debian Testing. The "testing" branch is more stable than many release level distributions (like Ubuntu) and features mostly recent software, but maybe not bleeding edge. Stable is a production/server style distribution where everything but security updates is frozen, virtually eliminating the possibility of breaking the system with untested updates.
As @Gilrond said, installing Debian now should be easier than ever thanks to the installer supporting UEFI. You can have a dual or multi boot system and try out as many things as you want.
Now the real issue here is Linux Gaming. Keep in mind binaries or executables are architecture and operating system dependent, meaning a Windows binary will not run in Linux, period. The way we do it is through third party software like, in this case, Wine, which provides runtime libraries to interpret Windows programs and make it possible for them to run in a Linux system. As you can imagine this may unleash a series of issues and problems, but at least it's possible. Can't say the same about running Linux binaries in Windows
Now, what I root for is native Linux gaming. That is, games with real Linux executables. There are several examples, mostly from indie developers, such as Trine 1 & 2, Anomaly Warzone Earth, Expeditions: Conquistador, Shadowrun Returns, and hell even Metro Last Light. Valve has, for obvious reasons, put a lot of effort into porting their Source engine, so right now you can play Portal, Left 4 Dead, Team Fortress and Half Life in Linux too. Most of the time running native games in Linux is as easy (or even easier) than doing it in Windows.
So if you decide to try and play games in Linux, I'd recommend playing native versions first. Once you feel comfortable with handling configuration and settings in Linux, go ahead and try Wine gaming.
A cool technical aspect of Linux is that, being open, it is highly customizable to the point where you can have a whole operating system with only the bare essentials and super fast and efficient memory management. For years Linux has been the number one choice for computationally intensive tasks (over 95% of the world's fastest supercomputers run Linux), and as you can imagine games should/will benefit from this. A cool non technical aspect is that there are formal ways to detect when/if the system abuses or violates your privacy, so you can be sure (at least Debian) is safe. Also, it is DRM free: no activations, no installation limits, no restrictions.
Try Debian. It's a universal operating system that right now supports the Linux kernel officially, experimentally the FreeBSD kernel and in the future most likely the Hurd kernel (maybe it already does, experimentally). An operating system kernel is a core element that acts as a bridge between the hardware and low level OS functions, such as assigning CPU time, memory allocation, input/output, etc. Debian was one of the first Linux based systems and is widely supported. SteamOS is, in fact, based on Debian (Stable).
I'd recommend Debian Testing. The "testing" branch is more stable than many release level distributions (like Ubuntu) and features mostly recent software, but maybe not bleeding edge. Stable is a production/server style distribution where everything but security updates is frozen, virtually eliminating the possibility of breaking the system with untested updates.
As @Gilrond said, installing Debian now should be easier than ever thanks to the installer supporting UEFI. You can have a dual or multi boot system and try out as many things as you want.
Now the real issue here is Linux Gaming. Keep in mind binaries or executables are architecture and operating system dependent, meaning a Windows binary will not run in Linux, period. The way we do it is through third party software like, in this case, Wine, which provides runtime libraries to interpret Windows programs and make it possible for them to run in a Linux system. As you can imagine this may unleash a series of issues and problems, but at least it's possible. Can't say the same about running Linux binaries in Windows
Now, what I root for is native Linux gaming. That is, games with real Linux executables. There are several examples, mostly from indie developers, such as Trine 1 & 2, Anomaly Warzone Earth, Expeditions: Conquistador, Shadowrun Returns, and hell even Metro Last Light. Valve has, for obvious reasons, put a lot of effort into porting their Source engine, so right now you can play Portal, Left 4 Dead, Team Fortress and Half Life in Linux too. Most of the time running native games in Linux is as easy (or even easier) than doing it in Windows.
So if you decide to try and play games in Linux, I'd recommend playing native versions first. Once you feel comfortable with handling configuration and settings in Linux, go ahead and try Wine gaming.
A cool technical aspect of Linux is that, being open, it is highly customizable to the point where you can have a whole operating system with only the bare essentials and super fast and efficient memory management. For years Linux has been the number one choice for computationally intensive tasks (over 95% of the world's fastest supercomputers run Linux), and as you can imagine games should/will benefit from this. A cool non technical aspect is that there are formal ways to detect when/if the system abuses or violates your privacy, so you can be sure (at least Debian) is safe. Also, it is DRM free: no activations, no installation limits, no restrictions.
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I might have to try Debian once Sui Generis releases a native Linux executable. Since it uses OpenGL people have already had success getting it to run in both Linux and on Macs. However, they don't plan on doing an official port until after release.
The alpha version already runs very well in Linux. People get the same 120 FPS in Linux that they are getting in Windows, which is pretty damn good since it's only being emulated and not run natively.
The alpha version already runs very well in Linux. People get the same 120 FPS in Linux that they are getting in Windows, which is pretty damn good since it's only being emulated and not run natively.
@vincentdante: To add to what @.Volsung. said above. There are many distributions of Linux, but in general they are all considered the same operating system (in more narrow sense, as in sharing the same OS kernel which is Linux proper). On top of a choice of distributions, unlike Windows, Linux offers a choice of desktop environments. This aspect can be unfamiliar to Windows users but it's commonplace in the Linux world. You can explore what better suits your needs. My personal recommendation is Debian testing + KDE.
Also, before actually fully installing the system (or creating a computer with dual boot installation), you can give Linux a try in a virtual machine (use VirtualBox) inside your Windows installation, or you can create a live disk / USB stick and boot from it to see at least how certain desktop environment looks (don't forget also that some of them like KDE are very customizable, so default look-n-feel can be changed quite a lot). Once you decide you are ready, you can attempt installation with dualbooting. I'd recommend using separate hard drives for that for better separation and flexibility (i.e. don't share same hard drive for multiple OSes if you can).
And good luck in exploring Linux!
Also, before actually fully installing the system (or creating a computer with dual boot installation), you can give Linux a try in a virtual machine (use VirtualBox) inside your Windows installation, or you can create a live disk / USB stick and boot from it to see at least how certain desktop environment looks (don't forget also that some of them like KDE are very customizable, so default look-n-feel can be changed quite a lot). Once you decide you are ready, you can attempt installation with dualbooting. I'd recommend using separate hard drives for that for better separation and flexibility (i.e. don't share same hard drive for multiple OSes if you can).
And good luck in exploring Linux!
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@freakie1one
Cool! It is fairly "common" to support Linux nowadays, especially indie devs. I am looking forward to Sui Generis and I am glad to know it will have a native Linux version, sooner or later.
And yes, with decent hardware most of the time you can play Windows games with Wine with little to no performance hit. Let's be honest here, most gaming PC's are overpowered and PC gamers like to brag about their expensive hardware Also, except for GPU usage, I don't know of any game with will use 100% of a modern system's resources, i.e. 4 or more fast CPU cores, 8 or more GB of RAM, etc.
Cool! It is fairly "common" to support Linux nowadays, especially indie devs. I am looking forward to Sui Generis and I am glad to know it will have a native Linux version, sooner or later.
And yes, with decent hardware most of the time you can play Windows games with Wine with little to no performance hit. Let's be honest here, most gaming PC's are overpowered and PC gamers like to brag about their expensive hardware
Also, except for GPU usage, I don't know of any game with will use 100% of a modern system's resources, i.e. 4 or more fast CPU cores, 8 or more GB of RAM, etc.
@.Volsung. @Gilrond
Cool thanks for the advice guys. I wasn't aware you could boot a Linux desktop of USB drive, I will take your suggestion and try it out. The PC I am building will have multiple hard drives (space junkie) actually to be exact I was planning to have an SSD for Windows and a handful of games (like The Witcher) and a HDD to dump everything else onto. Per your recommendations I will have a look at Debian Testing.
Cool thanks for the advice guys. I wasn't aware you could boot a Linux desktop of USB drive, I will take your suggestion and try it out. The PC I am building will have multiple hard drives (space junkie) actually to be exact I was planning to have an SSD for Windows and a handful of games (like The Witcher) and a HDD to dump everything else onto. Per your recommendations I will have a look at Debian Testing.
Because Debian jessie (testing) is updated frequently, and trying to get a stable copy with support for devices that have no free drivers is challenging, I prefer to install it indirectly. Download and install Debian wheezy (stable), then do a distribution upgrade to jessie (testing):
sudo vi /etc/apt/sources.list #and replace "wheezy" with "jessie" throughout
sudo apt-get update
sudo apt-get dist-upgrade #then reboot and you're running jessie
They now have a stable alpha install image for jessie, so this may not be strictly necessary anymore. But it is reliable.
If you do not need high graphics performance, installing to a VM is a good idea. I use VirtualBox. I also like the KDE and LXDE desktops. LXDE is good for small systems and VMs. KDE is happier with bigger systems where it is natively installed.
sudo vi /etc/apt/sources.list #and replace "wheezy" with "jessie" throughout
sudo apt-get update
sudo apt-get dist-upgrade #then reboot and you're running jessie
They now have a stable alpha install image for jessie, so this may not be strictly necessary anymore. But it is reliable.
If you do not need high graphics performance, installing to a VM is a good idea. I use VirtualBox. I also like the KDE and LXDE desktops. LXDE is good for small systems and VMs. KDE is happier with bigger systems where it is natively installed.
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With Debian testing though, there are no official prebuilt live images. You can attempt building one, which is doable, but somewhat involved process. For more details see:
http://live.debian.net
http://cgi.build.live-systems.org/cgi-bin/live-build
Debian stable however has various prebuilt live images with different desktop environments: http://live.debian.net/cdimage/release/stable+nonfree/amd64/iso-hybrid/
http://live.debian.net
http://cgi.build.live-systems.org/cgi-bin/live-build
Debian stable however has various prebuilt live images with different desktop environments: http://live.debian.net/cdimage/release/stable+nonfree/amd64/iso-hybrid/
@Guy N'wah: Actually, installation wise Debian testing works better since it has newer kernel (if you have an installer at all), but if the installer doesn't bundle various non-free firmwares, then one might hit a wall with missing WiFi and so on. Some installers bundle that stuff (see the link above with non-free flavored versions). Default Debian installer doesn't include non-free firmwares. As their documentation says:
But if the installer is missing or some other reason, your method is what I usually use. I.e. install stable, repoint repositories to testing and do the upgrade. Except that I use "testing" as distro name, not Jessie or other codenames.
I.e. /etc/apt/sources.list can look like this after you repoint them:
And then run:
Note, that in this case one might need manual steps if hardware is very new and has hard drives more than 2 TB as well as UEFI motherboard. I.e. Wheezy installer doesn't handle all that automatically (Jessie one does).
For a HOWTO, see http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=81120
More very useful pointers for the reference which I went through when figuring that out:
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/GPT
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/UEFI
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Advanced_Format
https://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/
But if the installer is missing or some other reason, your method is what I usually use. I.e. install stable, repoint repositories to testing and do the upgrade. Except that I use "testing" as distro name, not Jessie or other codenames.
I.e. /etc/apt/sources.list can look like this after you repoint them:
Code:
# Debian testing
deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ testing main contrib non-free
deb-src http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ testing main contrib non-free
deb http://security.debian.org testing/updates main contrib non-free
deb-src http://security.debian.org testing/updates main contrib non-free
Code:
sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgradeFor a HOWTO, see http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=81120
More very useful pointers for the reference which I went through when figuring that out:
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/GPT
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/UEFI
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Advanced_Format
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I think trying out Linux in a virtual machine (like VirtualBox) is good because you can get used to the installation process without any worries, while a live disk skips that part and puts you right in the desktop environment. Debian has a fairly intuitive graphical installer that shouldn't be too hard to figure out. Once you feel comfortable, replicate the process in your real computer (choosing the right hard drive and all).
If you dist-upgrade, you get the newest kernel. You're right about not going that route if you must use a GPT partition table.
I prefer to go through the canned "firmware" distribution to get the non-free drivers already set up so they work during installation.
http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/current/multi-arch/iso-cd/
Now that jessie alpha-1 is available, you can go directly to
http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/jessie_di_alpha_1/multi-arch/iso-cd/
We rev-lock projects to specific distributions rather than track "stable" and "testing" (so that we aren't suddenly pointing at a different version with a different toolchain when it goes from testing to stable). Your mileage may vary, of course.
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See my updated post above about certain gotchas with UEFI and GPT if you use Wheezy -> testing upgrade installation path.
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I currently have an older version of Linux Mint installed on one of my partitions. I've never used Debian and I've always wanted to check it out so if Sui Generis comes out with a native Linux client it would give me enough incentive to install Debian lol.@freakie1one
Cool! It is fairly "common" to support Linux nowadays, especially indie devs. I am looking forward to Sui Generis and I am glad to know it will have a native Linux version, sooner or later.
And yes, with decent hardware most of the time you can play Windows games with Wine with little to no performance hit. Let's be honest here, most gaming PC's are overpowered and PC gamers like to brag about their expensive hardware
And yes, many gaming PC's won't be 100% utilized by running a single game. However, if people like to multitask while gaming (ex: stream their gameplay live) it is quite easy to max out even a high end system. I currently have a somewhat dated system (Intel i7 980x hexa-core processor OC to 4.2 ghz, 12 GB RAM, Nvidia 680 GTX) and I can max out all three if I'm streaming and recording footage while gaming.
Another thing that really requires a powerful rig is playing games at 4k resolution. It requires a lot of GPU power and VRAM. But that isn't too common yet since it usually requires SLI at a minimum to run games at a decent FPS. However, it does make games look quite amazing! Especially if you're gaming on a larger screen. Everything is crystal clear. But now I'm getting wayyyy off topic
:huh:.