Graphic downgrade

[samplerico]

I'm not missing the point, I totally understand what you are trying to say. I'm telling you that graphics don't drive sales the way you suggest they do. You can't just decide why people are pre-ordering the game to fit your narrative.

And lets stop pretending like the Witcher has suddenly started looking the way it does. One day after preorders were available they released 15minutes of long form gameplay that is consistent with the current look. Between E3 and now they've continued to release footage of the same consistency... we now have a total of ~150minutes of footage. The game has constantly been in the news over this and other matters. Yet, people are still hanging on a 1:15 trailer from over a year ago? If this company really wanted to deceive market then they are going about it in all the wrong ways. If anyone is suddenly surprised by the alleged downgrade its because you have been willfully oblivious... and regardless, you still have another 2.5months to cancel that preorder. If you bought it on GoG you have 15 days after release to return it.

Exactly. You said...not one day but one week after the SoD trailer, the preorder opening, they released E3 trailer. And the SoD trailer and E3 have nothing in common in matter of graphics. But in that moment the preorders and the general concept of the game were already hyped.

And are you seriously telling me that graphics don't sell gameS? really? have you thought deeply about that? clearly not. A spectacular and epic trailer with groundbreaking graphics is the perfect selling spot for a game like that, a game where the immersion is a big factor...so you stop pretending graphics don't do nothing on selling games is ridiculous, if that was true why the hell you think big companys throw that amount of efforts and money to make spectacular trailers and promotional screenshots in big events...youre missing the point again. Besides that discussion, youre missing the fact that theyr shwoing one thing for marketing and theyr releasing another, that is not aceptable besides graphics or whatever...And that agains has nothing to do with grapchis or with anything, its just something you cannot do.

 

[LasurArkinshade]

The thing about the newer footage that truly concerns me as far as the notion of a 'graphics downgrade' is how flat the shading looks. It does seem like the lighting system has taken some degree of a hit (unless - and I'm hoping that this is the case - these effects are just part of the ultra settings that aren't being shown yet). Compare the earlier screenshots to the newer ones (and this includes the PAX gameplay footage as well). Just take a look at Geralt here: http://86bb71d19d3bcb79effc-d9e6924a0395cb1b5b9f03b7640d26eb.r91.cf1.rackcdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/witcher-3-gameplay-screenshot-halberds-and-combat-pc-xbox-one-ps4.jpg

Look at his coat. Look at the blue part. It doesn't even look like it's part of the world - there's no light bouncing off it, no shadows being cast upon it, nothing. It's like it exists in its own vacuum, almost like it was just Photoshopped in. That's my biggest concern, because in the older footage and screenshots, the shading and lighting effects on these materials looked much, much better.

 

[moonknightgog]

The link...rackcdn...is that a malware?

 

[Doctalen]

Besides that discussion, youre missing the fact that theyr shwoing one thing for marketing and theyr releasing another, that is not aceptable besides graphics or whatever...And that agains has nothing to do with grapchis or with anything, its just something you cannot do.

Now hold on a minute. The fact that we even have these threads shows that they are not continuing to market the same footage they did a few years ago like you seem to imply. Let's say they had to downgrade features internally. They are not still marketing the game like it never happened. If it has happened in your eyes then obviously they aren't still marketing it like it hasn't. We have plenty of gameplay to see what the game will look like in the end now. It's not like Aliens Colonial marines when we got E3 footage and then the game came out and it was nothing like that. We have had plenty of recent footage to see how the game looks and so has the general public. If they aren't happy with it then they won't buy it.

 

[samplerico]

Now hold on a minute. The fact that we even have these threads shows that they are not continuing to market the same footage they did a few years ago like you seem to imply. Let's say they had to downgrade features internally. They are not still marketing the game like it never happened. If it has happened in your eyes then obviously they aren't still marketing it like it hasn't. We have plenty of gameplay to see what the game will look like in the end now. It's not like Aliens Colonial marines when we got E3 footage and then the game came out and it was nothing like that. We have had plenty of recent footage to see how the game looks and so has the general public. If they aren't happy with it then they won't buy it.

1. The game is already selling since May-June of 2014. And keep selling...

2. The devs are alleging that all those footage are no representative of the quality of the game, but theres a problem cause before those gameplays we got trailers and screenshots showing another whole thing. So Whats it? We sit and wait?

 

[Lucasip]

We will have to wait, I was so happy when I saw that they were gonna sell the collectors edition here in brazil, but after that i will just wait so see how the final product looks like.

 

[Doctalen]

1. The game is already selling since May-June of 2014. And keep selling...

2. The devs are alleging that all those footage are no representative of the quality of the game, but theres a problem cause before those gameplays we got trailers and screenshots showing another whole thing. So Whats it? We sit and wait?

Yes, the game is selling. People can still cancel pre-orders and such if they aren't happy with recent footage. I find it hard to believe the majority of people that bought the game aren't watching new gameplay or haven't seen a single thing about the game since before E3. I see the devs saying it's not MAX settings which is true, and this footage probably isn't representative of the final product. However, saying that it is not representative does not mean it will look drastically different on release. I am confident the game will look very close to what we have seen recently when it comes out. Unless max settings is some giant leap from high with vegetation density and such.

Yes, you'll have to wait till after launch to see what the game finally truly looks like. That's not really a big deal, just don't pre-order.

 

[Phinnway]

1. The game is already selling since May-June of 2014. And keep selling...

2. The devs are alleging that all those footage are no representative of the quality of the game, but theres a problem cause before those gameplays we got trailers and screenshots showing another whole thing. So Whats it? We sit and wait?

I think the thing you're missing is that those early previews came with a disclaimer "work in progress," just like the current previews do. It is called a pre-order after all. Not an order --as in you're buying a finished product.

I think if someone pre-ordered an automobile before it came out they would have good reason to expect the design of the model to be tweaked before release. Just like what happened with The Witcher 3.


And if CDPR was as ammoral as Ubisoft they couldn't continue to show off updated footage of the game; giving people the chance to cancel their pre-order if they dislike how it's coming along.

 

[Jasheon]

I will be tickled pink if the final game looks like this on PC.

http://youtu.be/N4ony2r0QFs

 

[thislsmadness]

Exactly you said...not one but one week after the SoD trailer (preorder opening) and the E· trailer and the SoD trailer have nothing in common in matter of graphics.

Well, it was actually 3 days, not quite a week either. In either case, that doesn't matter since the point is that they've been feeding us this same footage for nearly a year. So if someone is really bothered by the "downgrade" then they should have cancelled that preorder a long time ago. Unless you want me to believe that someone watched the SoD trailer got super hyped strictly because of the graphics, preorder the game and then shut themselves off with anything to do with the game for the last 9months? Like I said, that would is willful ignorance and a total violation of "caveat emptor"... meaning, its your own fault.

And are you seriously telling me that graphics don't sell gameS? really? have you thought deeply about that? clearly not. A spectacular and epic trailer with groundbreaking graphics is the perfect selling spot for a game like that, a game where the immersion is a big factor...so you stop pretending graphics don't do nothing on selling games is ridiculous...youre missing the point again. Besides that discussion, youre missing the fact that theyr shwoing one thing for marketing and theyr releasing another, that is not aceptable besides graphics or whatever...

Yep, that is exactly what I am saying. Sure, there is some slim margin of the market that cares about graphics and will buy anything with pretty pixels attached to it. On the whole, nope. Games do not sell on graphics alone. I don't need to "pretend" those are just the facts and theres decades of sales data to prove it. As far as them "showing one thing for marketing and releasing another"... what exactly do you think all these gameplay demos are for? Why do you think they've been touring all these press conferences and even having their own preview events for? All of this is marketing. If they wanted to fool you or anyone else then why would they even be showing off the game in this way for 9 months straight? I know the current landscape loves conspiracy theories and feeding into the "us vs them" mentality, but this has to make sense, and this just doesn't.

 

[samplerico]

Yes, the game is selling. People can still cancel pre-orders and such if they aren't happy with recent footage. I find it hard to believe the majority of people that bought the game aren't watching new gameplay or haven't seen a single thing about the game since before E3. I see the devs saying it's not MAX settings which is true, and this footage probably isn't representative of the final product. However, saying that it is not representative does not mean it will look drastically different on release. I am confident the game will look very close to what we have seen recently when it comes out. Unless max settings is some giant leap from high with vegetation density and such.

Yes, you'll have to wait till after launch to see what the game finally truly looks like. That's not really a big deal, just don't pre-order.

Will see, will see, but one thing i assure you, youll not see something like the SoD trailer in your PC. Thats is a fact . And also is a bad advertisment so im still not satisfied.

We have seen so many things in PC gaming those past few years...nobody is free of sin im afraid.

---------- Updated at 11:49 PM ----------

I think the thing you're missing is that those early previews came with a disclaimer "work in progress," just like the current previews do. It is called a pre-order after all. Not an order --as in you're buying a finished product.

I think if someone pre-ordered an automobile before it came out they would have good reason to expect the design of the model to be tweaked before release. Just like what happened with The Witcher 3.


And if CDPR was as ammoral as Ubisoft they couldn't continue to show off updated footage of the game; giving people the chance to cancel their pre-order if they dislike how it's coming along.

You want me ot search and came here with tons of statements of developers saying the product theyr making and the final quality? man thers a lot of content(/promotion/advertisment) If a automobile company advertise some facts about their cars man, they better do the job...

 

[Phinnway]

You want me to search and came here with tons of statements of developers saying the product they're making and the final quality? man that is a lot of content(/promotion/advertisement)

(A) That wasn't really a rebuttal to anything I said. (B) You might want to step away from this thread for a little bit and cool down. You're starting to not make a lot of sense.

 

[samplerico]

Well, it was actually 3 days, not quite a week either. In either case, that doesn't matter since the point is that they've been feeding us this same footage for nearly a year. So if someone is really bothered by the "downgrade" then they should have cancelled that preorder a long time ago. Unless you want me to believe that someone watched the SoD trailer got super hyped strictly because of the graphics, preorder the game and then shut themselves off with anything to do with the game for the last 9months? Like I said, that would is willful ignorance and a total violation of "caveat emptor"... meaning, its your own fault.



Yep, that is exactly what I am saying. Sure, there is some slim margin of the market that cares about graphics and will buy anything with pretty pixels attached to it. On the whole, nope. Games do not sell on graphics alone. I don't need to "pretend" those are just the facts and theres decades of sales data to prove it. As far as them "showing one thing for marketing and releasing another"... what exactly do you think all these gameplay demos are for? Why do you think they've been touring all these press conferences and even having their own preview events for? All of this is marketing. If they wanted to fool you or anyone else then why would they even be showing off the game in this way for 9 months straight? I know the current landscape loves conspiracy theories and feeding into the "us vs them" mentality, but this has to make sense, and this just doesn't.

Thats exactly what happen, i remmeber very well, and after the E3 i was the only caliming downgrade, all the other posters here was throwing at me all sorts of things... i have threads about that i can show you, it woul be very funny...

About graphics selling games, im not telling that games are only graphics, but man, its very obvious that today industry the graphics are selling games, a LOT of games are selling throw graphics, specially in the mainstream market...beacuse i don't know practically anybody that buys indie games been a mainstream console gamer. If you don't agree on that then you and me can't talk much more...

---------- Post merged on 09-03-2015 at 12:01 AM ----------

(A) That wasn't really a rebuttal to anything I said. (B) You might want to step away from this thread for a little bit and cool down. You're starting to not make a lot of sense.

Sure cause your statements are plenty of arguments. And if ur refering to my english, yes is no my lenguage and im obviously not very good at explaining things throe the english, im sorry about that. It could make confusion...

About the discussion. Youre argumenting Work in progress but in the other hand theyr saying that the game is looking much btter in Ultra, besides that, thers a lot of content about developers making statements about the level of quality and fidelity of the game, that is advertisement, but ey! we are work in progress, but ey we open preorders with the most espectacular a graphic stuning trailer ur ever seen, but ey we are in WIP, but ey we are making history and all sorts of things.

In one hand theyr in WIP, but in the other thers a lot of advertisment saying the game will be the most spectacular and kickass RPG of history. So we are dumb people or what?

You get my point?

 

[thislsmadness]

Thats exactly what happen, i remmeber very well, and after the E3 i was the only caliming downgrade, all the other posters here was throwing at me all sorts of things... i have threads about that i can show you, it woul be very funny...

What exactly happened? I can't tell if this is in response to anything I said.

About graphics selling games, im not telling that games are only graphics, but man, its very obvious that today industry the graphics are selling games, a LOT of games are selling throw graphics, specially in the mainstream market...beacuse i don't know practically anybody that buys indie games been a mainstream console gamer. If you don't agree on that then you and me can't talk much more...

That is fine, I'm not interested in having the discussion if your only evidence is based on anecdotes from you and whatever people you know.

 

[djmedvedd]

What if i DONT want to cancel my pre-order? What if i love The Witcher series games? And (for example) The Witcher 2 - looks absolutely amazing even in 2015, so i can't expect the same beauty (i mean rly next-gen graphic) from The Witcher 3? Especially if CDPR already show me that beauty? And now, according to the last gameplays - they took this grapics from me!

 

[samplerico]

What if i DONT want to cancel my pre-order? What if i love The Witcher series games? And (for example) The Witcher 2 - looks absolutely amazing even in 2015, so i can't expect the same beauty (i mean rly next-gen graphic) from The Witcher 3? Especially if CDPR already show me that beauty? And now, according to the last gameplays - they took this grapics from me!

At least thers somebody provides the evidence, its no so hard to see things...

 

[mecha_fish.619]

About the discussion. Youre argumenting Work in progress but in the other hand theyr saying that the game is looking much btter in Ultra, besides that, thers a lot of content about developers making statements about the level of quality and fidelity of the game, that is advertisement, but ey! we are work in progress, but ey we open preorders with the most espectacular a graphic stuning trailer ur ever seen, but ey we are in WIP, but ey we are making history and all sorts of things.

my answer to this whole thread was going to be "MODS" but I don't think you're actually concerned with what the final product is going to look like.

are you accusing CDPR of false advertising? for the last few years the game has been in development and at no point have we been shown 'Ultra' footage, mostly because Ultra *doesn't exist yet*. Only now are they actually optimising the game. Notice I say "optimising" and not "optimised" -- this is a process. This procress involves going forwards and backwards and changing this and that. Finding the perfect balance of particular settings for graphics settings -- SURE, that stuff we saw the other day was supposedly on 'High', but it could very well be tweaked and tampered with before May 19. This is what WORK IN PROGRESS means.

There is nothing else to say on the matter. The trailers were prettier? SoD took 50+ versions before we actually saw it, but the Elder Blood trailer only had a few iterations because the guys making the video only had a few days to a week to make it. Literally, a well crafted video will make that much of a difference, not to mention the changes in optimisation process we are now observing-- they've probably tweaked a few things in between here and there too.

Downgrade has a specific definition and this-- the above that I'm talking about, the reality we are facing right now-- isn't it.

 

[samplerico]

Ok somebody is deleting my posts again with no reason or argument, again this freedom of speech...another example...Byyyee

---------- Updated at 12:29 AM ----------

my answer to this whole thread was going to be "MODS" but I don't think you're actually concerned with what the final product is going to look like.

are you accusing CDPR of false advertising? for the last few years the game has been in development and at no point have we been shown 'Ultra' footage, mostly because Ultra *doesn't exist yet*. Only now are they actually optimising the game. Notice I say "optimising" and not "optimised" -- this is a process. This procress involves going forwards and backwards and changing this and that. Finding the perfect balance of particular settings for graphics settings -- SURE, that stuff we saw the other day was supposedly on 'High', but it could very well be tweaked and tampered with before May 19. This is what WORK IN PROGRESS means.

There is nothing else to say on the matter. The trailers were prettier? SoD took 50+ versions before we actually saw it, but the Elder Blood trailer only had a few iterations because the guys making the video only had a few days to a week to make it. Literally, a well crafted video will make that much of a difference, not to mention the changes in optimisation process we are now observing-- they've probably tweaked a few things in between here and there too.

Downgrade has a specific definition and this-- the above that I'm talking about, the reality we are facing right now-- isn't it.

If you want to justify all its ok for me...you can and its your right.

I dont even know why i keep coming to these forums, theyr the more fanatic i ever faced. so boring...

 

[dragonbird]

Ok somebody is deleting my posts again with no reason or argument, again this freedom of speech...another example...Byyyee

Your post was deleted for:

None are more blind than those who refuse to see... so yeah i cannot argue with you anymore, like many guys around here...

If you're unable to make your point without resorting to insults, then yes, walking away right now might be a good idea. Because "freedom of speech" doesn't, and never has, meant "freedom to insult people without consequences".

Argue the point, don't make ad hominem attacks on the person making it.

 

[thislsmadness]

What if i DONT want to cancel my pre-order? What if i love The Witcher series games? And (for example) The Witcher 2 - looks absolutely amazing even in 2015, so i can't expect the same beauty (i mean rly next-gen graphic) from The Witcher 3? Especially if CDPR already show me that beauty? And now, according to the last gameplays - they took this grapics from me!

There is absolutely nothing wrong with being disappointed. If the game was downgraded then I'm sure the artists and animators and anyone else at CDPR is just as upset that they had to scale things back a bit.. you can't imagine the amount of time and care that goes into game development. The only issue I have with this discussion is the accusation that CDPR is purposely trying to deceive consumers to inflate preorders and that they've become "another EA", that stuff is just completely asinine and there is no evidence to support it.