Gta vs cyberpunk

[sommojames]

if it would be rich story driven RPG with lots of choices and outcomes you would be right, as story would matter. And story in cdpr sucks a lot as well as narrative and execution due to cuts. And most people would ignore bugs, glitches, wooden combat, bad driving, no physics, but cdpr went cash cow route and made gta clone in the future in order to grab tons of cash from mp later. Sadly, they missed one major point, people playing gta mp is because gta is great sandbox game, with lots of customization and things to do.

When you finish gta, there are tons of things to do. When you finish cp there is nothing to do.

Not all people play the same way. After I finish GTA 5 or Red Dead 2 I quit and start from scratch. Wathever is left to do after the story end is boring and shallow to me.

Post automatically merged: Jan 3, 2021

To me it's all important for producing an immersive effect. But I think a point that is being sidestepped here again is that GTA is over 5 years old. Of course certain visuals and animations are going to be better because technology has improved. The core problem is that CP should have been more advanced based on industry standards nearly across the board, but in fact does nearly the exact opposite; only excelling in categories such as graphical fidelity and crowd density which are a result of development tools becoming more advanced and hardware more powerful. But the majority of features that require designer logic and input are subpar.

I will agree on the feel of gunplay though. I'd give CP a point on that one.

GTA 5 has more advanced physic beacuase it integrates the Euphoria engine. It's an external engine that implies licensing cost plus costs for integration. CDPR simply decided to invest in other aspects of the game.

 

[somewherebeyond]

Not all people play the same way. After I finish GTA 5 or Red Dead 2 I quit and start from scratch. Wathever is left to do after the story end is boring and shallow to me.

Post automatically merged: Jan 3, 2021

GTA 5 has more advanced physic beacuase it integrates the Euphoria engine. It's an external engine that implies licensing cost plus costs for integration. CDPR simply decided to invest in other aspects of the game.

i think 314 mil they spent to make this game could be used for engine? instead of marketing.
Look at sleeping dogs, mobile game mentioned here, watch dogs. I am not even speaking about gta and rdr even,

 

[shanersimms11]

GTA 5 has more advanced physic beacuase it integrates the Euphoria engine. It's an external engine that implies licensing cost plus costs for integration. CDPR simply decided to invest in other aspects of the game.

I really don't see what you're arguing. The biggest staple of CP2077 is Night City. It was supposed to be a hyper-realistic metropolis in which the story takes place. Not investing in your physics and AI is hugely problematic. It's what has led to the general consensus you see plastered over all of YouTube, social media, and forums so I'm not sure what these other areas they invested in as you claim that would make up for such awful AI and physics. They didn't have to integrate Euphoria to code decent physics, and it's not like CDPR can't afford licensing fees where needed. No matter how you spin it, CDPR failed in this hugely important aspect.

 

[somewherebeyond]

not to mention night city is not look like overcrowded futuristic megapolis. Any existing big city feels more futuristic than night city: look at Bangkok, Shenzhen, Tokyo, NY. Night city feels colorful but dead, crowd density is very small, no traffic jams, no verticality like planes, avs, come on. I am living in relatively small city around 1mil population and i see lots of planes every day and lots of traffic jams too

And where are buses, trains, heavy duty cargo trucks, bikes, etc.

 

[Hiiraeth.]

I would really like to be wrong. And i would be very happy if they fixed all shit they released and gave free story back. But i know that won't happen as it requires money investment and from what i understand huge one. Believe or not 2 month is probably enough just to fix some really bad issues, do some optimization and that's it. And because this game is NEXT GEN OPEN WORLD Triple - A game i expect to have some basic features like shadows, animation, physics to be present. IF CDPR told me they are selling EARLY ACCESS AA (NOT AAA) LINEAR LIMITED OPEN WORLD ACTION with some narrative i would ignore these problems.

I doubt you are playing the game. The facial animations are there, did you already saw Panam, Evelyn or Rogue? they have microexpressions already and minimal details that make a huge difference. This is why i doubt you are being honest.
Yes, you can complain about shadows, but physics? did you already hit a wall with a car? or punch it? or destroyed it? you can obviously complain about some details like shadows but the physics is definitely there. You already have a mod that change the car handling. I feel that some cars are just better than the others and they still have some space to improve every vehicle.

Now about GTA V comparisons
They have a HUGE difference in concepts. You can't compare, simply like that. Games are just a different expression of art. Is just like you are comparing classical or renaissance painting with modern abstract painting, or heavy metal with Bethoven or Mozart. You can't do that, yes, they are painting and yes, it's all music, but it's a huge difference in concepts and philosophy.
GTA V is worse than GTA IV. The GTA V try harder to give a cinematic experience while GTA IV have a more immersive background. For all GTA titles the shooting feels like an arcade game. In GTA V you can literally kill someone just by running on their direction!!! i made it many times and was a huge deception. Also, R* try to build a satirical universe of our reality, while Cyberpunk tries to give a realistic vision of a future that is not perfect as we can imagine today. It's like you are comparing Hunger Games and American Pie.

Yes, the game is not complete
When you end it, you'll end with 60% in the second progress bar and 50% in the third one. Clearly they still will have more content and will increase the story, but right now we already have enough to provoke us from a intellectual perspective and we have many rooms to synthesize theories. This game is literally 50% here, we can just wait for the other half. If they made this universe in 3~4 years, they can improve in a few months. Chill. It's their first time building something like that, RED engine is already showing how far they can go.

Details

Gorila Arms

Shotgun

Cottonmouth

Copperhead

Crash

Yes buddy, no physics.

 

[sommojames]

I doubt you are playing the game. The facial animations are there, did you already saw Panam, Evelyn or Rogue? they have microexpressions already and minimal details that make a huge difference. This is why i doubt you are being honest.
Yes, you can complain about shadows, but physics? did you already hit a wall with a car? or punch it? or destroyed it? you can obviously complain about some details like shadows but the physics is definitely there. You already have a mod that change the car handling. I feel that some cars are just better than the others and they still have some space to improve every vehicle.

Now about GTA V comparisons
They have a HUGE difference in concepts. You can't compare, simply like that. Games are just a different expression of art. Is just like you are comparing classical or renaissance painting with modern abstract painting, or heavy metal with Bethoven or Mozart. You can't do that, yes, they are painting and yes, it's all music, but it's a huge difference in concepts and philosophy.
GTA V is worse than GTA IV. The GTA V try harder to give a cinematic experience while GTA IV have a more immersive background. For all GTA titles the shooting feels like an arcade game. In GTA V you can literally kill someone just by running on their direction!!! i made it many times and was a huge deception. Also, R* try to build a satirical universe of our reality, while Cyberpunk tries to give a realistic vision of a future that is not perfect as we can imagine today. It's like you are comparing Hunger Games and American Pie.

Yes, the game is not complete
When you end it, you'll end with 60% in the second progress bar and 50% in the third one. Clearly they still will have more content and will increase the story, but right now we already have enough to provoke us from a intellectual perspective and we have many rooms to synthesize theories. This game is literally 50% here, we can just wait for the other half. If they made this universe in 3~4 years, they can improve in a few months. Chill. It's their first time building something like that, RED engine is already showing how far they can go.

Details
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Gorila Arms
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Shotgun
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Cottonmouth
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Copperhead
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Crash
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Yes buddy, no physics.

Exactly, and is also full of nice details that those comparison video always miss.

 

[shanersimms11]

I doubt you are playing the game. The facial animations are there, did you already saw Panam, Evelyn or Rogue? they have microexpressions already and minimal details that make a huge difference. This is why i doubt you are being honest.
Yes, you can complain about shadows, but physics? did you already hit a wall with a car? or punch it? or destroyed it? you can obviously complain about some details like shadows but the physics is definitely there. You already have a mod that change the car handling. I feel that some cars are just better than the others and they still have some space to improve every vehicle.

Now about GTA V comparisons
They have a HUGE difference in concepts. You can't compare, simply like that. Games are just a different expression of art. Is just like you are comparing classical or renaissance painting with modern abstract painting, or heavy metal with Bethoven or Mozart. You can't do that, yes, they are painting and yes, it's all music, but it's a huge difference in concepts and philosophy.
GTA V is worse than GTA IV. The GTA V try harder to give a cinematic experience while GTA IV have a more immersive background. For all GTA titles the shooting feels like an arcade game. In GTA V you can literally kill someone just by running on their direction!!! i made it many times and was a huge deception. Also, R* try to build a satirical universe of our reality, while Cyberpunk tries to give a realistic vision of a future that is not perfect as we can imagine today. It's like you are comparing Hunger Games and American Pie.

Yes, the game is not complete
When you end it, you'll end with 60% in the second progress bar and 50% in the third one. Clearly they still will have more content and will increase the story, but right now we already have enough to provoke us from a intellectual perspective and we have many rooms to synthesize theories. This game is literally 50% here, we can just wait for the other half. If they made this universe in 3~4 years, they can improve in a few months. Chill. It's their first time building something like that, RED engine is already showing how far they can go.

I don't think anyone is denying that CP has good textures and animations. Those, along with story aside from the endings, are the three things people seem to universally agree are outstanding. But nearly everything else? Sub-par at best. I'm not sure how you believe the physics are there: constant clipping; vehicles going under or over things unnaturally, NPCs ragdolling in ridiculous ways upon collision, etc.

As for GTA-V comparisons, yes you absolutely can compare just like that because people aren't comparing the games to one another as a whole, they are only comparing the "open world" attribute. No one is comparing GTA V and CP story lines or combat. What they are comparing is simply how immersives the open world is in terms of how realistic the NPCs act, the dialogue, the physics, the AI for both NPC's and vehicles, etc. So the comparison is entirely fair and a great metric in this regard.

Lastly, I believe you are mistaken about what those progress bars mean. The second one is just your relationship with Johnny that increases based on specific choices and missions. A 60% in the relationship meter (which can go higher and 70% is reportedly required to get the secret ending) is really just a measure for how much you and Johnny get along. It's not really a progress meter measuring how much total Johnny content you've done. Same for the third meter, it's an arbitrary number indicating how close you are to death (i.e. how much of your psyche has been overwritten by the relic) that increases after certain missions. It does not in anyway appear to mean that by the end of the current story you are only 50% through the related content.

 

[somewherebeyond]

snip

Yes buddy, no physics.

Mate, i think you're trolling me but i will answer anyway

First you posted screencaps from heavy scripted in game sequences which in other game are treated as movies and yeah graphics are nice i was saying that this is only thing where cp is good (well bad for optimzation). So if you take less major npc and look into lipsync and details it is a joke even if you visit Misty and speak with her not about quest you can see that.

As for other next gen physics:
1. no bike physics they are like truck grab any bike and hit another car physics are wooden
2. if you take a car and hit some wall there are no front deformations or rear depending which way youll hit it. A game from 2005? gta 3 the one before gta vc had that
3. No bullet physics and what you showed on the wall proves that Still there are cool physics in second mission where you're saving sandra dorset, but that is heavy scripted wall too.
4. and many many more.

 

[Mk3rd]

People can call out all the flaws and missing features all day. But what I'm pointing out here is the comparison.
And comparing Cyberpunk to GTA is exactly like comparing The Witcher 3 to RDR.

Both games have horses and the majority of the setting is set in open landscapes with rolling hills, mountains and forests. But that doesn't mean it's immediately the same genre or has the same game direction.

It's funny cause you don't see people constantly grumble about TW3's inferior pedestrian and enemy behavior or Roach's god awful physics, handling and bugs compared to RDR because they know it's doing an entirely different thing than RDR. It's as if that differentiation between game direction suddenly disappeared once the setting changed from landscapes with horses to a metropolis with cars.

 

[somewherebeyond]

People can call out all the flaws and missing features all day. But what I'm pointing out here is the comparison.
And comparing Cyberpunk and GTA is exactly like comparing RDR with The Witcher 3.

Just because both games have horses and the majority of the setting is in open landscapes with rolling hills, mountains and forests don't mean it's immediately the same genre or has the same game direction.

It's funny cause you don't see people constantly grumble about TW3's inferior pedestrian and enemy behaviour or roach's god awful physics because they know it's doing an entirely different thing than RDR. It's as if that differentiation between game direction suddenly disappeared once the setting changed from landscapes with horses to a metropolis with cars.

you have a point. reason why i dont compare witcher with rdr because tw3 story driven rpg with great story, many choices and really good side quests with many outcomes. cp2077 on the other hand linear wannabe gta looter shooter with deus ex like mechanics falling short everywhere

 

[Simpson3000]

Just posting for those who probably won't find it.

smh

Out of curiousity, are those GTA V videos made two weeks after game release, either? So sometime in September 2013?

 

[Mk3rd]

you have a point. reason why i dont compare witcher with rdr because tw3 story driven rpg with great story, many choices and really good side quests with many outcomes. cp2077 on the other hand linear wannabe gta looter shooter with deus ex like mechanics falling short everywhere

CP is a GTA wannabe cause it has cars and is set in a metropolis?
Why not call TW3 an RDR wannabe as well because it also has horses and is set in a similar landscape? Cyberpunk has fewer choices and side-quest outcomes than TW3 but does GTA have more dialogue choices and outcomes than Cyberpunk?

 

[somewherebeyond]

CP is a GTA wannabe cause it has cars and is set in a metropolis?
Why not call TW3 an RDR wannabe as well because it also has horses and is set in a similar landscape? Cyberpunk has fewer choices and side-quest outcomes than TW3 but does GTA have more dialogue choices and outcomes than Cyberpunk?

how many choices you make in cp2077 matters and have huge impact? Ending only? I guess so. Jackie dies no mater what, eve dies no matter what, you kill fingers there will be other, kill dum dum there will be priscilla, well there are maybe couple choices but what they affect is whether you get particular ending or particular mission thats it. It doesnt matter who you will screw? Screw meredith or not no outcomes? Kill royce and dum dum and voila mission with nance dont change anything i expected at least some blazing gunfight. Kill cyberpsychos lethal or non lethal doesnt matter.

While in witcher there are many many outcomes, rdr is just straightforward narrative on rails. I would say rdr has more similar with cp than witcher.

And biggest point of this thread is to show that crowning achievement next gen AAA game is worse in open world features than other bigger, smaller prev gen titles even done by smaller studios

 

[Mk3rd]

how many choices you make in cp2077 matters and have huge impact? Ending only? I guess so. Jackie dies no mater what, eve dies no matter what, you kill fingers there will be other, kill dum dum there will be priscilla, well there are maybe couple choices but what they affect is whether you get particular ending or particular mission thats it. It doesnt matter who you will screw? Screw meredith or not no outcomes? Kill royce and dum dum and voila mission with nance dont change anything i expected at least some blazing gunfight. Kill cyberpsychos lethal or non lethal doesnt matter.

While in witcher there are many many outcomes, while rdr is just straightforward narrative on rails. I would say rdr has more similar with cp than witcher.

I'm pointing out the GTA and Cyberpunk comparison here though. Not TW3 and Cyberpunk.

Because car physics and crowd behaviors here are being compared to GTA as if it has an obligation to be a GTA clone.
Yet TW3's horse physics and ped behaviors compared to RDR is not being talked about as much when really, it's the same comparison.

I'm just wondering why can people differentiate the game direction of 2 games with horses
But not when it has cars as the only similar feature.

 

[somewherebeyond]

I'm pointing out the GTA and Cyberpunk comparison here though. Not TW3 and Cyberpunk.

Because car physics and crowd behaviors here are being compared to GTA as if it has an obligation to be a GTA clone.
Yet TW3's horse physics and ped behaviors compared to RDR is not being talked about as much when it's really the same kind of comparison.

I'm just wondering why can people differentiate the game direction of 2 games with horses
But not when it has cars as the only similar feature.

once again because people were playing witcher for story, consequences, characters and not because of combat and open world elements. While gta and cyberpunk both are linear open world games, both have 3 endings (yeah cp have 4 secret which lead to rogue ending anyway), both have cars, both have police, both are shooters, both games have driving element.

When you play such games where you have guns and police sooner or later you'll want to do mayhem but in cp that is very poorly done. If cp had a lot of different choices, many rpg elements, non linear story nobody would make these jokes. While cp can give you some impression your choices matter it is illusion...and in many case you choose one answer but it doesnt matter you get some outcome just said differently like in me andromeda lol

Funny thing if cp had less features, didnt have police system (that is added for some reason no), had just one car instead of multiple ones, didnt have food, didnt have character creator and tried less things and was not false marketed as best open world non linear rpg with many outcomes, next gen physics, changing environment and best ai and just best game ever done nobody would compare them, but things went otherwise.

 

[Aisar87]

I think people need to keep in mind the very specific things that are being compared. Personally I want the level of detail and realism I have experienced from other games, that's all. I don't care if they are the exact same type of game or not or their similarities, that argument means nothing to me. I want realism and immersion and I am going to look at other games and say why did this game in 2020 not have a comparable experience.

(just to be clear that's a rhetorical, I know why)

 

[INulis]

Gorila Arms
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Cottonmouth
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Copperhead
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Crash
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Yes buddy, no physics.

It's just few examples where physics actually exist, but there are places where you wont find physics at all (like bullet holes in walls or even solid objects etc.)

 

[Mk3rd]

once again because people were playing witcher for story, consequences, characters and not because of combat and open world elements. While gta and cyberpunk both are linear open world games, both have 3 endings (yeah cp have 4 secret which lead to rogue ending anyway), both have cars, both have police, both are shooters, both games have driving element.

But RDR and TW3 has the same elements though? Both have horses, crossbows, knives, landscapes, mountains, towns, guards and criminal consequences.

And aren't we playing CP for the exact same thing? Story and characters are stellar. Consequences, while not as prevalent as TW3 are technically still there with the Maelstrom hideout and Jakie's body quests, and there are countless Black Box missions. Compared to GTA. GTA has none of that. You call Cyberpunk linear because it's less linear than TW3. But compared to GTA? It's technically non-linear.

 

[sommojames]

once again because people were playing witcher for story, consequences, characters and not because of combat and open world elements. While gta and cyberpunk both are linear open world games, both have 3 endings (yeah cp have 4 secret which lead to rogue ending anyway), both have cars, both have police, both are shooters, both games have driving element.

When you play such games where you have guns and police sooner or later you'll want to do mayhem but in cp that is very poorly done. If cp had a lot of different choices, many rpg elements, non linear story nobody would make these jokes. While cp can give you some impression your choices matter it is illusion...and in many case you choose one answer but it doesnt matter you get some outcome just said differently like in me andromeda lol

Funny thing if cp had less features, didnt have police system (that is added for some reason no), had just one car instead of multiple ones, didnt have food, didnt have character creator and tried less things and was not false marketed as best open world non linear rpg with many outcomes, next gen physics, changing environment and best ai and just best game ever done nobody would compare them, but things went otherwise.

I bought Witcher 3 for quality and quantity of quests and writing content, good fantasy elements and solid comabt. Choices and consequences are a secondary aspect. If an RPG is evaluated only on choices and consequences, then Witcher 2 is far a better game than Witcher 3, and it is not.

Post automatically merged: Jan 3, 2021

But RDR and TW3 has the same elements though? Both have horses, crossbows, knives, landscapes, mountains, towns, guards and criminal consequences.

And aren't we playing CP for the exact same thing? Story and characters are stellar. Consequences, while not as prevalent as TW3 are technically still there with the Maelstrom hideout and Jakie's body quests, and there are countless Black Box missions. Compared to GTA. GTA has none of that. You call Cyberpunk linear because it's less linear than TW3. But compared to GTA? It's technically more non-linear.

These games are made for different audicences. GTA is more appealing to young customer that enjoy the road pirate and mass murdering aspects. 20 years ago I used to think GTA Vicy was the best game ever made, now although I recognized value in GTA 5 it is not even in my personal top 10.

 

[Mk3rd]

I think people need to keep in mind the very specific things that are being compared. Personally I want the level of detail and realism I have experienced from other games, that's all. I don't care if they are the exact same type of game or not or their similarities, that argument means nothing to me. I want realism and immersion and I am going to look at other games and say why did this game in 2020 not have a comparable experience.

(just to be clear that's a rhetorical, I know why)

Well not everybody is looking for the same thing in every game. I personally wanted a story written by CDPR's writers 1st and foremost and a really pretty world. Everything else is just extra. So color me pleased, bugs and my police spawning gripe aside.

Games have different purposes despite the similarities. Otherwise, we'd be stuck with what cookie-cutter Ubisoft titles could turn out when it teks it's ultimate form.

I'd go to GTA if I just want to mess around with pedestrians and cops, RDR for hunting and camping, CP2077 and TW3 for involved storytelling, aesthetics with lite RPG and combat, DOOM for fast-paced combat, and Guild Wars 2 for massive co-op.