Has anyone.... (style related)

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Has anyone.... (style related)

Played Alien: Isolation and fell in love with the late 1970 futurist design and concepts? I was blown away when I started to play this game as it was conceived as though the "sets" and designs were written at the same time the original Alien (1979) movie was created.

I still get great pleasure seeing the future-retro styling while playing and notice new things every area I search that impress me with the attention to detail. The computers and digital watches and monocrome CRT screens look amazing and all fit so well together, like it was natural and normal.

I really hope that this same level of detail is used in this game and I wouldn't even mind if a similar approach of using the concepts of the time of creation were used. I really really hope we get the same experience from this game!
 
Yes, we all do. Certainly the trailer was a good indication.

But, Cyberpunk 2020 isn't a 70s game and 80s tech isn't as distinctive - although ti would stand out in the world of 2077, but mostly as being horribly useless.

Now, some kind of retro-fashion wave turning the 2077 tech into 80s form, that could be quite cool.
 
Cyberpunk isn't a rigid universe, the same way you can buy 80's or 70's clothes, we can imagine some brand selling some retro-looking clothes or tech, sure the game will not be all "retro-future", but I'd be ok with some retro things, the same way there are still a market for old consoles, etc...

But yeah, design wise Alien Isolation was really cool, and I had fun playing it, finally a good Alien game, hopping for a sequel.
 
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definitely agree!

I am more talking about the attention to detail as far as the great commitment used to create that atmosphere. Whatever works is fine by me, but I know that this project deserves that attention and commitment. I also want to see a sequel for this Alien franchise and hope that we get a mirrored response when Cyberpunk 2077 gets released in due time!

As far as 70s versus 80s imagery, I think if you watch any 80s/early 90s Sci-fi movies you can see definite correlations and similarities to that eras depictions. I am not saying that is the route that should be used, but it does bring interesting concepts and thoughts to mind and may be a fun road to traverse or even explore.

In all honesty, I just want an amazing game that drops us into an immersion so deep that we start looking for similar traits in our real lives. IS THAT SO MUCH TO ASK? LOL

I also find that when I get excited, I tend to type fast using enhanced grammar formations.

X_X
 
I still get great pleasure seeing the future-retro styling while playing and notice new things every area I search that impress me with the attention to detail. The computers and digital watches and monocrome CRT screens look amazing and all fit so well together, like it was natural and normal.

I really hope that this same level of detail is used in this game and I wouldn't even mind if a similar approach of using the concepts of the time of creation were used. I really really hope we get the same experience from this game!
I would mind. It's fine for Alien: Isolation, because game is trying to recapture the style of the movies. However, Cyberpunk 2077 is supposed to be about future so designs should be heavily futuristic and not heavily retro. They can exist (Alpha Protocol did this quite nicely), but making retro a major thing in the future would be immersion breaking. What's fine within a defined universe is not fine for something claiming to extrapolate into future. My point is: if they wanted to make a retro game in the future they'd go with Cyberpunk 2020. But they didn't.
 
My point is: if they wanted to make a retro game in the future they'd go with Cyberpunk 2020. But they didn't.

Well, they kinda did, actually, judging from the trailer. Alt's style is very late 80s, so's the Dynalar logo. The bullpup assault rifles are 90s. The hovercar is pure Blade Runner. The Militech Crusher is a 2020 weapon. The 2020 corebooks sit on the designer's desks.

On the other hand, they also horribly murdered Swaggy and have stated they aren't just making Blade Runner again. They are also adding in some post-modern tech.

Lest we forget, Cyberpunk 2020 wasn't that 80s in terms of style. Sure, there was some big hair, but not a lot. Crew cuts were as or more likely if you check the art. The cars illustrated in the books could be from now - slick, rounded edges, very streamlined. Cellphones were absolutely in use and they were the same size as now, roughly a cigarette pack. A cyberdeck could as easily be a tablet or laptop.

Mostly the 80s style is seen in the Rocker illustrations, headbands, silly boots and so forth.

I think, personally, we will see a future style with strong hints of the 80s, corporate logos, cyberware and gear, while remaining slick enough and sharp enough that no one thinks they landed back in 1988.

Of course, it's still a looooong ways off. I imagine lots of artistic choices are still being made.
 


Doesn't look either retro or 70/80 for me, if they keep that vibe, with some kind of light design's refreshing, I'm down with it.
Everyone is all "so much retro", well.. If you know "retro" things as cool as this, tell me what it is, I'm damn interested.

Because, unless I'm blind or something, I can't much see this


or this


(Hello Shadow-retro-run)


Now take some modern take on Cyberpunk:

Compare with the original Cyberpunk 2020 : Firestorm artwork up there.
Tell me, who looks retro?
Sure the B&W drawning lacks textures etc... but damn, it's closer to modern cyberpunk than Shadowrun at the same period, you have to choose what you want to call "retro" because, IMO, Cyberpunk 2020 is far from retro, it's still kind of modern, just has it's own style, but as Sard' said, the most "cheesy" part is about the rockers (mulets and all), I don't know what everyone expect from Cyberpunk 2077, but I don't really see it as retro, it just... Cyberpunk :/
Also, remember the trailer was made upon the original artworks and damn... If it's retro for you, then either Cyberpunk isn't for you, or you just don't really get the concept of "soon future" (which is still kind of really advanced, but not enought so it's kind of squeezed between our present and our "future"), or you should stop looking at space opera SciFi taking place in 2567 with ultra advanced tech.
 
By retro, I just mean the vision of the day. I have seen a lot of "retro" in the trailer as well and thought it might be on the plate. If it is, they should definitely take some tips from Alien. I think Alien wears it well. Its realistic and I still felt like it was current Personally, I like the thought of using a different game concept since everything seems to be using the "futurist" look of that modern image. Tron Legacy, x-men costumes, all that.. its all looking the same. Its too clean for me. I need that grimy cyberpunk feel. I need that dirty street violence and tech.

If they go with another design concept, I hope they don't follow today's trends and try to innovate. But that is just me :)

I also wanted to grind some gears here as things have been getting quiet lately

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Also, Rifts was aa early 90s style and I still think some of that design and illustration was quite awesome.

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ugh I just saw the other Alien thread... oops
 
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By retro, I just mean the vision of the day. I have seen a lot of "retro" in the trailer as well and thought it might be on the plate. If it is, they should definitely take some tips from Alien. I think Alien wears it well. Its realistic and I still felt like it was current Personally, I like the thought of using a different game concept since everything seems to be using the "futurist" look of that modern image. Tron Legacy, x-men costumes, all that.. its all looking the same. Its too clean for me. I need that grimy cyberpunk feel. I need that dirty street violence and tech.

If they go with another design concept, I hope they don't follow today's trends and try to innovate. But that is just me :)

I also wanted to grind some gears here as things have been getting quiet lately

Don't worry buddy I totally see where you are going with your idea and I do agree.
I just ranted about the usual "2020 is retro", when honnestly, back then it was way ahead of it's time if you compare to other games of the same time.
It wasn't against you or anyone in the topic, just to make it clear.

I agree too that, if not to the same vibes as Alien Isolation, I'd love that they try to put the same "love" and degree of details in the Cyberpunk's world has they did with Alien.
I think there will be a huge amount of detail tho, since even in the Pnp there are so many details, it's crazy, even sometimes for useless stuff, so if CDPR don't put all of this, it's really that they don't want to more than "we couldn't".

Back on the retro, I think that there are a few different direction about Cyberpunk:

Some people are all "it's retro" because, yeah they're probably pretty young, and grown up on CGI, the last star wars, etc... And find those "Blade Runner" flying car to be hella old (just like we do think that Elvis is cheesy, but back then, everyone was crazy about it), you see what I mean?

They're used to the over lifted and "neutral looking with grey tones" sci-fi like Mass Effect, and most S-F games/movies nowadays (Prometheus was all grey and blue), etc... with neat and clean design, and probably found the Cyberpunk's one a lil messy, ala "old-school". But I'd say, Cyberpunk is Cyberpunk.

It's like star wars, an X-wing will remains an X-wing, Lucas or Disney, it's how it is, it's the same with cyberpunk.

What do you expect from cyberpunk?
I don't expect a "realistic hardcore vision of the future that will, for sure, happens" this is boring.

Ed Boon (MK creator) said something that I think is really true, it was something in the lines of:
"Reality is boring, no one want to pay for reality, you have reality all around you, so if you can't beat a guy and cut his head with your own hands in a video game, where is the fun supposed to be? it has to be over the top at some point, because you play video games to escape your reality and explore new worlds."

I do expect some parallel with our world, the setting is our future, but... It's the Cyberpunk universe, so you won't have Google or Apple, you're gonna have Dynatech and Arasaka, and nothing stop them to act just like Apple or Google you know?
Beyond this, you're free to give your corps some cool old-school cyber classy logo, some badass punks in the street (even if it will never be the fashion in 2077, but who cares? it's all about style!), a few neons here and here for the athmosphere (not too much, tho, it's kind of cliché, and I'd like CDPR to try to kind of surprise us with their vision, but staying true to the original style, mostly that Leds are all around now)


handling some ultra-cool bullpup assault rifle that fire armored-explosive bullets that create a whole fuckin mess and blows your enemies limbs after limbs, even if they put guns that are "unrealistic", who care?

Do you think that when I was playing Quake 3 and that I blowed up people with my plasma gun I gave a fuck about "is this weapon realistic?"
Hell no! I was all "Wow! This is soooo fuckin' cool!"

Sure, no plasma gun in Cyberpunk, but you got the idea, the "Holy shit, this is hella fucking awesomely cool" factor, staying true to the vibes.

It's all of this which made Cyberpunk what it is, not the neon or whatever, it's the "Future Shock" the "Holy shit, I'm in the future, and the future make me feel like a badass", just like when you sell drugs on the Pnp and you start a chase with the police, you can't see anything, but just the tone and what you can do, it makes you feel powerfull, and "in control". You have to feel like home, but a home someone would have relooked has you were gone, with flashy colors and lots of cool things to do.

This is what I expect from cyberpunk, CDPR will for sure not reinvent the wheel, but at our current age, with our tech and all, they absolutely can make a decent "Cyberpunk" game wich will take all those "classics things" and put them a level higher, fleshing them out.

It's not the ability to hack which makes the Netrunner so cool, it's that "Holy fuck, I can plug a goddamn cord in my damn brain, this is cool", same for the solo, being the killer for hire filled with cybernetics living at the limits of the cyberpsychosis.

This is what I want from a Cyberpunk media, it can be in 1999 or 2100 or in 3000, cyberpunk stays cyberpunk.
You need to "feel" it more than having a specific design.

Tho, there are things, as I said that are classics, just like the AV, look at the begining of the 5th Elements, the flying cars, the dirty "downtown", etc... It just screams "cyberpunk" even if the movie isn't Cyberpunk in itself, but it's just some touch like this which make it so cool.


Then, back on topic, there are the people who never opened the corebook, searched on the web, looked at some picture, eventualy fall on the worst drawning of Johnny Silverhands and just thought that the whole game was like this


Damn, I'm sure that even when it was released and all fresh, everyone laughed at Johnny Silverhands, also because it's some part of the Cyberpunk flavor, you don't want a "good" rocker, you want a cheesy one, the kind of "over-the-top" rocker who have been in jail, tried every drugs ever and killed more cops than any gangsta around and sing about how fucked up our world is, you want a PUNK, in even more "cooler".


Then, there are the people who don't know what is Cyberpunk (the game) and think it has to do with the genre, but then, most of them have only read Neuromancer and looked at Anime, not that it's bad, but Neuromancer is far from being the best cyberpunk book ever and Japanese Cyberpunk anime are also far from the "vibe" of the Us cyberpunk, it's "softer", it's more "serious", more... Japanese.
Where US, and specificaly Cyberpunk pnp, is more "everyone is crazy".


There are also the people who don't know anything about Cyberpunk and thinks that it's gonna be a Mass Effect clone.

All of this to say (thank you for reading all of this tho!! hahaha), that whatever they'll do with Cyberpunk, it's always keep that "old-school-somewhat-cheesy" mood, just because it's Cyberpunk, the same way you can't remove the laser-saber from star wars or the whip from Indiana Jones, you can't remove the kind of "cheesy-attitude" from Cyberpunk because it's what make it so good.

So from what I read and everything, I think CDPR really nailed the "mood" and what makes Cyberpunk "Cyberpunk", even Mike Pondsmith were amazed by how they were fans of his work (I doubt he say this "in a marketing way" for a game like this, for the majority of the people, no one really care about Cyberpunk, most people will not care if CDPR know or don't the Cyberpunk background), but yeah, I do believe they'll give us a pure breeded Cyberpunk game, and that it'll kick major ass, if they stay true to the pnp, there are chance it'll be among the best RPG ever.

Same for the design, the trailer was a perfect vision of what I think about when I figure how Night City looks like, they just need to push forward in this direction, filling it with details.
They just need to take what's there, remove the dust and create a whole world out of it, exactly like what Sega did with Alien Isolation, and it'll be perfect design wise.
 
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This is the point i have been trying to make since the beginning. and we are in split camps. some of us want the original Blade Runner 80s retrofuturistic CYBERPUNK style and some here want the supermodern Mass Effect Halo Destiny artstyle (blah). Hopefully CD PR makes the right decision.
 
Not really. Here is your point from the other thread:
the whole cyberpunk thing is so intertwined with the 80s retrofut look that for them not to go in that direction the game would no longer be cyberpunk. just call its something else then. And it wont be dated yes its dated but thats where the charm is.
You say that 80's retrofuture = cyberpunk, while Maelcom says something entirely different:

Cyberpunk 2020 is far from retro, it's still kind of modern, just has it's own style [...]
I just ranted about the usual "2020 is retro", when honnestly, back then it was way ahead of it's time if you compare to other games of the same time
Back then 2020 was ahead of its time. I expect 2077 to be ahead of its time as well. Not to be a 80's retrofuture (or like Alien: Isolation), because the very concept of staying in 80's retrofuture means we're staying in the past and its concepts. It's 2014 already. It has been almost 35 years and we are supposed to have a game that plays in 63 years ahead from now on. I can understand that some connection to 2020 as universe must stay (as 2077 is continuation of 2020), but there is a long way to go from that and to what you're claiming.
 
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That was a crazy long read...

On the topic of "cheesy 80s retro style" I might have to flip-flop on it. Not everything has to be cheesy or a direct link to Mr.T and Alf. I take my cyberpunk seriously. This includes Gibson and other published ideologists whose works have become cringe worthy when translated to other media (Johnny Mnemonic)...

I think to accomplish something I would be happy with (being selfish) the game will need to follow the vision of the past but, surpass and devour the trends we can accept from today. Would a touch screen hand held computer (android/iphone) fit in? I am not so sure. I also want to think of the cyberpunk world as an alternate universe for some reason as to remain in the nostalgia of 2020.

Here is where I flip-flop: If the developers stick to the cheese, then this may not translate well for new-to-cyberpunk players and it may not be a good setup for future developments. The franchise must continue now that we have finally have its footprint. I would love to see a current vision and take on the cyberpunk brand, as well. Just as long as it doesn't follow what other developments have followed. I know CPDR will go all out on whatever they do and from what we've see of w3, they will not opt for the fast and quick option if it will decrease the end value of their product.

All right, that was a long and much interrupted post that lost my original train of thought many times. If I figure out what I was intending to say in the first place, Ill be back! (very hung-over post)

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SPEAKING OF:
http://www.mtv.com/news/2022628/ridley-scott-blade-runner-script/



"It's been more than 30 years, but finally the script for Blade Runner 2 is done. Original interview with Ridley Scott on MTV. Links for those who don't want to watch the interview. If you're worried that the upcoming Blade Runner sequel won't measure up to the 1982 sci-fi cult classic, rest assured. Harrison Ford apparently thinks the script is "the best thing (he's) ever read." Although Scott is debating whether or not he'll direct the sequel, it looks like Ford will most certainly be reprising his role as Rick Deckard." Read more of this story at Slashdot.
 
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On the topic of "cheesy 80s retro style" I might have to flip-flop on it. Not everything has to be cheesy or a direct link to Mr.T and Alf. I take my cyberpunk seriously. This includes Gibson and other published ideologists whose works have become cringe worthy when translated to other media (Johnny Mnemonic)...

Talking about Gibson, his character are pure cyberpunk "cheesiness" (and by this, I mean good)
Case is a hacker-loser, when most of the time, they're depicted as "the rebel for a cause being all badass and know-it-all", when in Neuromancer he's depicted as the guy who don't really know what happens all around him, untill the end of the book when he's all "Oh shit, I'm such a dick -_-", just because he was hypnotised by Molly.

Molly is a cheesy solo type girl, the invincible badass, she's Steeven Seagal with tits.

And I find it really cool, those character have "edge", they're "dark" in a human sense of the word, with good side and bad one.
The same Molly is still somewhat shocked by the death of Johnny Mnemonic and the time she were a prostitute, Case is full on drug and addicted to cyberspace, there is an humanity in them, more than being "all round" hero as we are too much used to see them (tho, the trend now is to make "dark" hero, but still ,they make them so dark it's not always really believable)
 
Talking about Gibson, his character are pure cyberpunk "cheesiness" (and by this, I mean good)
Case is a hacker-loser, when most of the time, they're depicted as "the rebel for a cause being all badass and know-it-all", when in Neuromancer he's depicted as the guy who don't really know what happens all around him, untill the end of the book when he's all "Oh shit, I'm such a dick -_-", just because he was hypnotised by Molly.

Molly is a cheesy solo type girl, the invincible badass, she's Steeven Seagal with tits.

And I find it really cool, those character have "edge", they're "dark" in a human sense of the word, with good side and bad one.
The same Molly is still somewhat shocked by the death of Johnny Mnemonic and the time she were a prostitute, Case is full on drug and addicted to cyberspace, there is an humanity in them, more than being "all round" hero as we are too much used to see them (tho, the trend now is to make "dark" hero, but still ,they make them so dark it's not always really believable)

armitage was the badass in that book. the reggea guys were cool too.
 
Yeah that's why Molly did all the job during the shitstorm at Massbiolabs when they went to take Dixie Flatline's construct, keeping on kicking ass with a broken leg.
The only thing Armitage did the whole book is looking strange and threatning people, sure he did "looked" badass, but he was better at giving order more than doing the job (for reason people having read the book probably knows).
 
Armitage was a badass, absolutely, ex Special Forces killer. Could he have taken Molly? Who knows. He was a bad, bad guy, once.

It's a moot point, because Armitage had been heavily reconditioned to serve his corporate masters and was now merely a badly damaged walking mouthpiece for them.

The most baddest ass guy was Hideo, the vat ninja who put Molly down in a shot and who killed Riviera..AFTER Peter blinded him.

Don't fuck with a vat ninja.

Unless you cultureshock them to death, which is what saved Johnny. For awhile.
 
I agree, but was Armitage still "Armitage" since "you-know-who" took the control of his brain?
During his special force years, and even his whole body is indeed badass, but I don't remember him going much in the action during the book, he was more "ok, you, do this" more than doing it himself, tho, yes he wasn't the kind of dude to piss off.

About the ninja, I agree, he was the top badass of the book, even the Rastafaran Marine couldn't do shit against him (I did laugh btw when Maelcom is all "Let's kick their ass, I'll show them what a Rasta can do", and 5mn later he shut the fuck up, holding his bleeding arm after the ninja kicked his ass)
 
I agree, but was Armitage still "Armitage" since "you-know-who" took the control of his brain?
During his special force years, and even his whole body is indeed badass, but I don't remember him going much in the action during the book, he was more "ok, you, do this" more than doing it himself, tho, yes he wasn't the kind of dude to piss off.

Yeah, he did pretty much zippo. HAd a nervous breakdown or two....I guess that might be bad if he accidentally stabbed himself and bled on you? Ugh! Cool name, though.

About the ninja, I agree, he was the top badass of the book, even the Rastafaran Marine couldn't do shit against him (I did laugh btw when Maelcom is all "Let's kick their ass, I'll show them what a Rasta can do", and 5mn later he shut the fuck up, holding his bleeding arm after the ninja kicked his ass)

Yep. Tech-ninja, baby. All the training, plus the best corp technology. Some of Gibson's genius is that he doesn't go far into the nitty gritty, lets you imagine what "vat grown tech ninja" implies. Oh, so much.
 
So should we say it was Armitage that was the badass... or Willis Corto?
I find it so amusing how the name Armitage then became the go to name for everyone who wanted a protagonist that, just by the name, told audiences "this is cyberpunk".
 
and Armitage is a range of toilet ware ... named after a toilet bowl... I suspect our Mr Gibson was taking a pee while trying to come up with a good name for his fixer.
 
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